A fight, a fight, a Muslim and a White

originally posted by: whitewave

originally posted by: AngryCymraeg
Algebra came from the Muslim world, some of the best doctors and surgeons came from the Islamic world, much of our philosophy was influenced by it.

There were many advances by the Persians but all progress seems to have come to a screeching halt when Mohammed showed up.

No madam, As a matter of fact science and technology belongs to humanity. Many nations have had a share in it.
But particularly about Persians, They started their new era after they accepted Islam, This happened to many other nations, of course. This was because Islam insisted on learning science. So a scientific revolution happened in the middle east and it spread to the world and specifically it makes the ice of Medieval to break in Europe.
Islamic world became the relation between ancient sciences to new sciences.
But Islamic world decayed, Because they changed to inheritable monarchies after death of prophet of Islam, soul of Islam died. Their corrupted monarchies focused on conquest of other nations for their power and pretending that it was because of Islam.
West got rid of the reason of their backwardness, which was nothing but the governing of altered Christianity of Vatican. And they grew rapidly. While Islamic world lost the reason of their growth, they lost the soul of Islam. Because of corrupted governments and colonialism, Islamic world remained backward and it decayed.
You can see well known scientists among muslims. And as for Persian muslims you see Zakariya Razi, who is well known in chemistry and found alcohol and Ibn Sina who is well known in medical, Kharazmi in Algebra and astronomy, Mulla Sadra in philosophy, also Khayyam in math and ........
Although Persians had a long civilization history before Islam like Romans, Egypt and ..... But they were under oppression of their own Kingdoms, so Islam was an opportunity of freedom for them. However it decayed the same as all the middle east, because of corrupted governments and colonialism.

You may not believe, if I say who mentioned that earth has two motions, or particles of solids vibrate, or blood has a motion in body, or There are microscopic alive creatures in body. He was Jafar ibn Muhammad (Sadiq).
His knowledge was not because of ordinary experimental science. His science was from his creator ! He was servant of God. There is a book called, """ The Great Muslim Scientist and Philosopher: Imam Jafar ibn Mohammed as-Sadiq """.
For example Zakaria Razi was one of the students of Sadiq.

originally posted by: OpinionatedB

originally posted by: HanzHenry
a reply to: nOraKat

2014 .. here is where we are. treatment of women and equality.?

Stoning people.. where in America

So is someone saying he wants to put to death millions of people for practicing a religion he doesn't like. Funny something like that comes from a Jewish man. Kind of ironic wouldn't you say?

well, I guess genocidal ideology did not die with the nazis. Somebody else inherited it.

originally posted by: HanzHenry
a reply to: nOraKat

2014 .. here is where we are. treatment of women and equality.?

Stoning people.. where in America
Subjugating women in America? not for a looooong time.
Honor rapes? show me some NON MUSLIM examples of gang raping a woman as "punishment" for something including being raped (the logic of this is baffling)
Honor Killing of daughters/sisters? where in America?

these things are each one repulsive.

Google: "Muslim Thursday" and read some of the top results.

Just talk to some feminists and they tell you about the equality of sexes in America or anywhere else for that matter...Women get raped and abused in a a daily basis in the united states,plus a bunch of other horrifying things done to them by a few nut jobs that are equally barbaric and insane as their counterparts in Muslim countries...It is not too hard to find out about the actual criminal records and compare the countries statistics per capita....As I have said before generalizing people based on an act of a few is wrong and when it is done it is only for propaganda purposes.

a reply to: HanzHenry

OMG. You are jewish and raised to hate muslims PERIOD.

I'll make a list in the favor of jewish teachings from the Talmud:

1. Moed Kattan 17a: If a Jew is tempted to do evil he should go to a city where he is not known and do the evil there.(this could mean raping a goy)
2.-From the Talmud: A daughter, commanded the sages, must not be taught Torah, because "the mind of woman is not suited to be taught, but to words of nonsense." Women are light-minded and have little knowledge"(sounds as bad as Muslims, don't it?)
3. Sanhedrin 54b. A Jew may have sex with a child as long as the child is less than nine years old. (not killing but just as bad)
4. The Talmud calls for the killing of all goy:
Tob shebbe goyyim harog - Even the best of the Goyim (Gentiles) should be killed
Extermination of the Christians is a necessary sacrifice.
Kill the Goyim by any means possible.

Pointing these things out IS denying ignorance.

Also, Judaism religion teaches them to LIE to non-jews for gain. It says so right there in the Talmud. Such as this:
A Jew should and must make a false oath when the Goyim asks if our books contain anything against them. Szaaloth-Utszabot, The Book of Jore Dia 17

When a Jew has a Gentile in his clutches, another Jew may go to the same Gentile, lend him money and in turn deceive him, so that the Gentile shall be ruined. For the property of a Gentile, according to our law, belongs to no one, and the first Jew that passes has full right to seize it. Schulchan Aruch, Choszen Hamiszpat 156


Look at what's happened anywhere that Zionism has taken a foothold. You will find barbaric behavior that is only found....hmmm, where? Where Zionists live.

a reply to: Fylgje
there are plenty more where those came from. But such discussions usually end in deleted posts, warnings and account bans.

originally posted by: sk0rpi0n
a reply to: Fylgje
there are plenty more where those came from. But such discussions usually end in deleted posts, warnings and account bans.

Exactly. Sometimes I wonder why I even bother responding to certain poster with an obvious agenda.

What's ironic about all this, it's the fact that I can't even find ONE Muslim on ATS that spreads hate, usually it's the other way around. Maybe I'm wrong. And I'm certainly not claiming all Muslims are good role models because just like any group, there's good and there's bad. I've learned that when I was about 4 years old...

And I'll never swoop as low as some haters here on ATS. The fact is, I have many Jewish and Christian friends, so I do respect and love all three Abrahamic religion, which for me is just "one" religion.

originally posted by: samsamm9

originally posted by: sk0rpi0n
a reply to: Fylgje
there are plenty more where those came from. But such discussions usually end in deleted posts, warnings and account bans.

Exactly. Sometimes I wonder why I even bother responding to certain poster with an obvious agenda.

people are given free reign to attack one group, but not their cousins. You frequently see threads attacking one set of scripture, but in YEARS there hasn't been a thread criticizing the other set of scriptures. I wonder why.

a reply to: samsamm9

From my point of view.

Some Muslims on this forum have issues with the Homosexual/bi sexual preference issue and spread duality there because of fear of the unknown and use scripture as a defense of those views.

But I do think there is a need of more Muslims on this forum to give a more equal view of what is going on in the world and ability to look past propaganda that we are bombarded by.

I would like more examination on other religions also like Buddhism, Hinduism, Sikhism to question the logic behind several of their claim/beliefs in the religions but since the demographics here is probably most Christians, threads like that are not appearing.

thank you Fylgje for that list from the Talmud....

thats very interesting....some Jewish people like to pretend that they are much better than everyone else..

thanks again... a reply to: Fylgje

a reply to: sk0rpi0n

I'm not trying to piss anyone off or ruffle feathers, I'm just making a point to this person on how racist they are being, and that it's 'the pot calling the kettle black' syndrome, nothing more.

originally posted by: shapur
...As I have said before generalizing people based on an act of a few is wrong and when it is done it is only for propaganda purposes.

..And this is the result of countries like the United States that implement propaganda to govern.

On one hand, you may accomplish your goals, but then you are left with dysfunctional subjects with distorted views (like this guy).


Just one example of the negligence exercised by these particular governments.

a reply to: Dimithae


Only until they get hit by a bully again and call us in.Before Desert Storm the Saudis were VERY pleased to have American knuckle draggers amongst themselves and told us so.Iraq was probing them.

WE ARE NOT hated our government is hated,only the less intelligent can't tell the difference and thus are redundant to me. American Veteran.

originally posted by: sk0rpi0n

"people are given free reign to attack one group, but not their cousins. You frequently see threads attacking one set of scripture, but in YEARS there hasn't been a thread criticizing the other set of scriptures. I wonder why."

I don't know what part of ATS you've been reading but in the many years I've been here there have been innumerable threads about Christian scriptures.

And to the poster who quoted the Talmud, the Talmud is not the Torah, much like the hadith is not the Koran.

a reply to: cavtrooper7

We are supposed to be our government,therefore by default we are held accountable by the world.


Like it or not,if you travel outside of the states you need to be vigilant to attacks due to what our government has done in other countries.

travel.state.gov...

a reply to: Dimithae


If they don't get it ,it's their problem when they come after our civilians for what our corrupt system does,it IS going to STILL be their problem. I don't really feel the need to be accepted by anyone accept my wife,she gets sick of me AND DOESN'T LISTEN EITHER.Just like the government.
And ME without a fan club.

a reply to: cavtrooper7

lol....

Sorry... laughing so hard cannot make any of my own point. That was too funny.

a reply to: Fylgje

I have heard these claims before. Usually the cited material is from antisemitic websites. As far as I know, the version of the talmud at sacredtexts.com is a proper english translation. I've been thinking about reading it in it's entirety recently, but haven't done so yet. Could you point out where these passages are? I can't seem to find them:

www.sacred-texts.com...

I know there are extremist Jews, as I've seen some pretty nasty videos on youtube from Israel. But I'd like to know if these often cited passages are really in Jewish religious literature or if they are fabrications.

originally posted by: sk0rpi0n

originally posted by: OpinionatedB

originally posted by: HanzHenry
a reply to: nOraKat

2014 .. here is where we are. treatment of women and equality.?

Stoning people.. where in America

So is someone saying he wants to put to death millions of people for practicing a religion he doesn't like. Funny something like that comes from a Jewish man. Kind of ironic wouldn't you say?

well, I guess genocidal ideology did not die with the nazis. Somebody else inherited it.

Well the Muslims sure like Hitler for the most part. Now that's a fact. does someone want to say that one side or another here has the right to hate and seek genocide? The hard Muslims over there preach out loud the genocide of the Jews.

I think it's getting a bit fantastical to say that Islamism is justified because of what Israel or the United States did.
Islamists planted bombs in Cape Town long before 9/11.
For now they are quiet and using us more as a transit point as the influx grows, but for how long?

This Islamist movement has people who openly say they want world domination!
How confusing can that message be?
It is straightforward!

My fear is that the West has been too cowardly to interfere or take a strong conceptual position, and the constant Islamist factionalism and strife will come to all of Africa.
There won't be another US/UK intervention to save Muslims, like in the Yugoslavian War.

I sometimes think the first line of defense will not be the West anymore.
It will be black African Christians.
The view of Islam as anti-Imperialist has changed very fast, and Africa doesn't like outside oppressors.
When Islamists threaten to steal people's daughters and sell them as slaves, people feel they must fight for their very lives.
And that's when things can get very nasty.

Mark my words, the growing anti-Islamist sentiment in Europe is nothing compared to what will happen in Africa if Islamism doesn't stop its nonsense.
Stop the lies and evasions, and deal with the real issues that are festering.

I don't wish harm on anybody, I'm just predicting by my experience, and I hope I'm wrong.

Oddly enough there was a particularly interesting article in the Guardian today about many of the issues being debated - here.