EU to bug every car in UK with tracker chips – and Ministers admit they are powerless to stop the

Under EU plans, every new car sold in UK will have a 'black box' device

Gadget contains a phone-like SIM card which tracks drivers' movements

Designed to help emergency services find vehicles in the event of crash

Government believes the device will add at least £100 to the cost of cars

Officials also fear it could be used by police to monitor motorists' moves

But ministers admit they are powerless to stop Big Brother technology

All new car models will have to include 'eCall' device from October 2015

Despite serious concerns about privacy and cost, UK ministers admit they are powerless to stop the Big Brother technology being forced on motorists and car makers.

EU to bug every car in UK with tracker chips – and Ministers admit they are powerless to stop the Big Brother technology

Although coming from the Daily Fail....there are other sources too!

Well who can say they seen this coming eh? I for one did and by the looks of it, it will not only be used for emergency services but other agency's will get a grip on it too. If and when this goes ahead it will not just stop at emergency services, it could and would be passed on to " Big Brother " .

As if the 1 million camera in the UK are not enough eh?



I remember this story being brought up a year or two a go because the picture looks familiar. If that is the case then it appears " Big Brother " have got there way. I wonder if they will insist on every used car being fitted too? Only time will tell I suppose.

Officials also fear the scheme, known as eCall, could be used by police or insurance companies to monitor motorists’ every move.

^ That part is scary!

And it appears MP's are having a hard time blocking it >

‘Unfortunately, there is very little support for the UK position and no possibility of blocking this legislation. We are working with other member states to minimize the potential burdens on manufacturers and the potential cost to consumers.

Over 1 million cameras, cars being tracked......all 24/7 = Disturbing!!!

I can see both the pro's and cons for this. The pro's is obvious but the cons could lead to complete control of your car, for example?

Your thoughts guys?

I'm moving to Canada


Ps, I wasn't sure were to post this. I used the headline in the search and came up empty. Sorry if wrong on both counts.

a reply to: Spiro

To point out our government has about 30 thousand CCTVs and the rest of the 970 thousand are owned by private hands..I have one and caught my neighbour stealing my garden gnomes lol.
I think it is a good idea to be fair it will help stop the dangerous drivers, give better information towards planning future roads.
I don't drive though but it appears to me this is the manufacturers doing this and our government attempting to stop it so isn't our government doing the right thing for once?.

As advertised it only turns on after you have crashed the car. Sounds good to me, help arrives faster and at times like this we need that help, unless you are under the influence and crash into a tree.

I think there are enough people out there to keep the system honest.

The real question is "What is next."

P

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: Spiro
I think it is a good idea to be fair it will help stop the dangerous drivers, give better information towards planning future roads.

That I don't disagree with. But, I for one would rather not be " officially " monitored 24/7. IMO there is to much control going on and I don't like it

I don't drive though

but it appears to me this is the manufacturers doing this and our government attempting to stop it so isn't our government doing the right thing for once?.

Well one part of the Government is trying to stop it and yes they are doing a good thing, hats off to them and I hope they succeed in stopping this.

I don't personally believe its the manufacturers that are pushing this, what would be their gain? More money? Money for who, TPTB that want to track our every move more so than just cameras?

Something doesn't sit right with me on this

a reply to: pheonix358

Ah even better then..I see this as a tool that can save lives then.
If they want to track us they already can do with our phones anyhow...just takes a warrant and a nod from a judge.

originally posted by: pheonix358
As advertised it only turns on after you have crashed the car. Sounds good to me, help arrives faster and at times like this we need that help, unless you are under the influence and crash into a tree.

I think there are enough people out there to keep the system honest.

The real question is "What is next."

P

I completely agree with you. It will have its uses. But what happens if it gets into the wrong hands? Like you said, what next

I would think that this would be an opportunity to good for them to allow to go to waste. The 'black box' may indeed be a tracker for the car, but who knows what else it may be doing?

Perhaps, they could have it picking up the signal going to and from your phone? Perhaps it may even record conversations between passengers? Now that would justify paranoia! Hell, I suppose if they really wanted to they could attack you accurately with a drone if you were a high level target...such as a whistleblower?

originally posted by: Spiro

originally posted by: pheonix358
As advertised it only turns on after you have crashed the car. Sounds good to me, help arrives faster and at times like this we need that help, unless you are under the influence and crash into a tree.

I think there are enough people out there to keep the system honest.

The real question is "What is next."

P

I completely agree with you. It will have its uses. But what happens if it gets into the wrong hands? Like you said, what next

As I stated, there are enough of us around so that we can tell pretty damn quickly if these things transmit 24/7. It is not rocket science and would remain a secret for about one minute.

It is only powered after the car crashes sooo... if it is transmitting other than in a crash then I would modify it so it would not. The internet would be full of cheap add ons to defeat any nefarious problems.

We are getting to be good at this, just look at the encryption wars, the people win every time within a window of only a few weeks.

We can handle this one!

P

Yhea I'm already tracked and although its supposed to be used for 'insurance purposes' the guys in the office are on it all the time for fits and giggles, its just factor into my driving now it's fair enough in one way considering the job I do could be handy to find out where a van is with an urgent phone call but its still a drag not knowing who is monitoring my movements.

a reply to: Now_Then

That is just your bosses making sure you can't skive off lol. Also helps If the van is stolen doesn't it?.
plus cheaper insurance for your company and I bet since you have had the tracker in you drive much better .

a reply to: Spiro

I am by nature suspicious of all attempts to monitor and observe us.

I feel uneasy about the potential for this system to be abused.
But the idea is undoubtedly a good one.
If the system remains inactive under normal conditions and only goes live when the airbags are activated then that's fine.
I also like the idea that a 'panic button' can be fitted to manually turn the signal on - that could prevent rapes, assaults, car-jackings etc.

But as acknowledged in the report the 'potential intrusiveness' needs to be legislated against.

Slightly off tack and surprisingly something that hasn't really been touched on yet in this thread is the worrying situation that the EU can dictate to the UK Parliament and other constituent countries elected bodies.
This transferal of power and sovereignty is illegal under UK Law.

originally posted by: pheonix358
We are getting to be good at this, just look at the encryption wars, the people win every time within a window of only a few weeks.

We can handle this one!

P

Well, that I can't disagree with. Well said

a reply to: Freeborn

I agree with you that the EU are making laws and that shouldn't happen.
While i know it will be a protest vote I will vote Ukip and hopefully whoever gets in gives us a referendum about being in the EU.
I saw a report by some business analyst saying If we left we wouldn't lose out at all...money wise.

a reply to: Freeborn

I never thought of that, with regards to the EU stronghold over the UK. Now, that is more worrying than this tracker.

To have a black box such as this installed has many good purposes as you and Phoenix pointed out. My observation lies with the people behind it and their agenda. Call me paranoid but nothing is ever come forward from such companies for the benefit of mankind. There has to be more to this, but what?

Perhaps this is just the beginning. Perhaps they may in the future be able to directly send info to the sin card without us knowing. What kind of info is yet to be discussed but I will keep in mind the fact that it could very well be turned into a surveillance tool.

But then again, as P says, it wouldn't be long before someone over rides it and shares with the rest of the UK on disabling it, providing it turns out intrusive of course

Like most the replies here I think it can only be a good thing. If I crash out on the moors in the middle of nowhere at three in the morning, i'm pretty screwed. But if a signal is sent out, someone can find me pretty quickly.

It also begs the question, who's listening an tracking what we're saying?

What about old cars? I've only had my current car about seven months and won't be buying anything else for at least another three years. If I then buy an older car, does it have the chip? Are only cars made from 2015 only going to have it? In that case I wouldn't have the chip for at least another seven years.

So many questions but interesting.

a reply to: Spiro

Ah the old safety excuse , "we want to track you for your own good"
All I see this benefiting is used car salesmen as un-chipped cars will sell at a premium , of course there will be little incentives like cheaper insurance but that's a high price to pay for more loss of liberty. How long until we ourselves are chipped at birth in case we get lost somewhere or because the chip can report medical problems and save our lives

Our European overlords are out of control and I too will be voting Ukip in the euro elections not in the hope they win but that it will send a message to the main parties that they are on the wrong side of the argument , if there is pain to be had from leaving the EU I think it's a pain worth suffering to reclaim our sovereignty.

a reply to: rhynouk

When new cars have new requirements old cars do not need them. There are many old cars without airbags or many, many other safety items. It can take decades to penetrate the marketplace and even then, there is never a 100% coverage.

This in itself puts a dampener on any nefarious plans. It could be simply someones good idea to prevent deaths and have responders get to a scene very quickly. Could also stop car thieves if it activates along with the alarm system.

As I have said, nefarious use would soon be identifies and the hue and cry would be amazing. Governments could fall over it. Governments do not enjoy falling from the public's grace.

The thing is in the body of a car, it needs an aerial clear of the cars body and aerials are very easy to disable.

I don't see a big problem here, it could in fact be a huge win for us in the long run, the final straw that brakes the back of Government interfering in our daily lives. This sort of thing could well be that one straw if it is ever used for ID tracking or if they try to use it for issuing speeding fines. The public would not stand for it.

The pressure against tracking is gaining ground almost daily as it is.

I would welcome such a straw. I would like to see this camel's back torn asunder.

P

a reply to: gortex

It is our liberty that is in question as we get spied on more and more. We got a parking ticket at 10 pm in a backstreet of Exeter one evening. We were sat in the Chinese eating and a car shot round the corner and came back papst us again within only a few minuts. Wnen we got back we had been hanging a bit over a double yellow line - which in the quiet of the evening in the backwaters shouldn't have cost £60. They had used the security camera to let the parking section know we had parked.

So the level of spying and probably the benefit of the information e.g. £60 is a benefit imagine what that box could tell - perhaps even using a mobile phone and can it either film or record conversations, were one smoking? having sex even the list goes on and on plus of course, our illegal parking, etc etc.

In 40 years of driving I have only ever had one car stolen so I don't see the reason for such a big brother usage and I hope other countries also feel the same - state spying is disgusting unless its targeted to catch criminals.

a reply to: Freeborn

It's essentially a distress beacon. All the fear-mongering in the Mail article is typical 'sky is falling' tripe to get the readers chicken-swallowing and shaking their fists at Europe.

'Capable of tracking' motorists' every move? It isn't an accelerometer to judge driving, doesn't have GPS and isn't like a flight-cabin recorder that stores audio. I drive around with my smartphone and it does all those things.

Should it be compulsory in all new cars? GTFO. No way. Faster, better paid, increased numbers of emergency services would be more constructive. No doubt someone, somewhere stands to profit benefit from the production and perpetual supply of these devices with an iron-clad patent lol

a reply to: Kandinsky

Should it be compulsory in all new cars? GTFO.

Exactly , if it is just a safety feature then fine make it an optional extra for those that want it , according to the article that's already the case with certain manufacturers so why not offer tax breaks to widen the uptake of the tech from other manufacturers, I don't see the need to make it compulsory.

Time to go back to motorcycling I think