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posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:06 AM
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reply to post by MrSpad
 


see post just above, it applies to you too




posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:06 AM
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reply to post by RadiationAndCancer
 


Pardon me for asking, but why would you, in particular, be on "the list"?

And I love how you immediately tried to discount those who ask for proof....nice.

So...NDE and OOBE....you should make a ton on the inside teaching everyone else how to "mind escape" to freedom....



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:11 AM
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reply to post by IkNOwSTuff
 


LOL, love your arrogance.

Let me reply to you like this.

SIR, I am no good to you if I don't tell you what I think.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:18 AM
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RadiationAndCancer

ignorant_ape
actually - by being on the list - you have failed
the real heroes are the people who still do their bit - but are not on the list
think about that for a second - while it sinks in


Sorry, faulty logic, you can't expose government lies and crimes without exposing yourself.

If you only expose documents and stuff, people will always ask where did it come from, which person.

Edward Snowden escaped to Russian Federation, we don't all have that option available to us,


Wait....so you are comparing yourself to Snowden? There is a much easier way to take care of someone leaking documents, especially if they are being as careless as you and posting about it online...its called death. Or are you so highly intelligent and well connected that "they" want to keep you around for your brain? So....if the latter is the case then why are you posting online about any of this?



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:19 AM
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Vasa Croe
So...NDE and OOBE....you should make a ton on the inside teaching everyone else how to "mind escape" to freedom....


Funny how those who kill, never ask themselves, "hey since I am not immortal and will die one day too, what if I have to face those I killed one day"

But of course, those who kill, and I am sure US government will eventually get to mass killing people like me, those guys are not capable of asking themselves those kinds of questions, if they were, they wouldn't be doing what they do.

And as a matter of fact, to completely blow your mind on just how smart I am.

Consider this.

If a person is not smart enough to understand the need for moral behavior and justifies immoral behavior. Is that person at fault ? Because intelligence and ability to understand complex issues is not a choice that we can make.

What if, government has become evil due to no fault of their own.

What if, my awakening to what government does is not my choice either.

WHAT IF. No one has any choice at all........in anything.

Mind-blowing stuff.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:23 AM
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Vasa Croe
Wait....so you are comparing yourself to Snowden?


Don't put words in my mouth, don't intentionally misrepresent what I wrote.

If you are not interested in intelligent discourse and instead only want to bicker, take things out of context and so on. Then I won't respond to you.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:25 AM
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RadiationAndCancer

thenotoriousone
Just out of simple curiosity did the government come into YOUR house and modify YOUR firewall and bugged your house while you were away?


What if I say YES.

You then write "well you are just a paranoid crazy person"

And yet.......for all you know government is justified for surveilling me (not saying they are) but what do you know about me.

Seriously, what do you know about me ?

What if I told you I got PhD and am ex government contractor. OR maybe I am just a broke construction worker whose favorite drink is cheap domestic beer.

What do you know about me ?

NOTHING

But hey, go ahead, assume government surveillance of citizens doesn't exist.


What I know about you is that you have come here with wild claims immediately discounting anyone who asks for proof and seem to have an unwarranted arrogance. I CAN say without a doubt that you DON'T have a PhD nor are you an ex government contractor. That is pretty easy to see based on your writing style.

And yes....you do seem to be a very paranoid crazy person....this story has been told countless times on ATS...the only thing that changes are the usernames. I guess everyone the government spies on is a former contractor with a PhD and happen to all be here on ATS....

Sure surveillance of citizens exists on a very large scale...no need to go directly into YOUR home and worry about something as silly and small as your firewall and bugging your house. Much easier ways to go about that such as tapping phone from outside, hacking your computer from outside, listening to your cell phone from outside, etc....no need to go into your house.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:28 AM
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RadiationAndCancer

Vasa Croe
Wait....so you are comparing yourself to Snowden?


Don't put words in my mouth, don't intentionally misrepresent what I wrote.

If you are not interested in intelligent discourse and instead only want to bicker, take things out of context and so on. Then I won't respond to you.


Ha....you directly compared yourself to him. You said :


Edward Snowden escaped to Russian Federation, we don't all have that option available to us,


If not a comparison then who is "we" and "us" in your post? Just random gas station attendants or fast food restaurant employees? You drew a direct comparison from Snowden to yourself in a single sentence...please tell me how that was misinterpreted.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:33 AM
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reply to post by RadiationAndCancer
 


Like the spirit of your post. In truth I know many who would regard it as an insult if they were not on some 'watch-em' list. It means they are not sheep and have the guts to speak out and say what they actually think rather than the mealy-mouthing that so many gush forth with today. The media floods us with the shallow gusherers and its their talentless celeb bods we would love to see float off in fluffy pink clouds to another planet. (Not that I care whether I am on a list or not).



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:34 AM
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RadiationAndCancer

Vasa Croe
So...NDE and OOBE....you should make a ton on the inside teaching everyone else how to "mind escape" to freedom....


Funny how those who kill, never ask themselves, "hey since I am not immortal and will die one day too, what if I have to face those I killed one day"

But of course, those who kill, and I am sure US government will eventually get to mass killing people like me, those guys are not capable of asking themselves those kinds of questions, if they were, they wouldn't be doing what they do.

And as a matter of fact, to completely blow your mind on just how smart I am.

Consider this.

If a person is not smart enough to understand the need for moral behavior and justifies immoral behavior. Is that person at fault ? Because intelligence and ability to understand complex issues is not a choice that we can make.

What if, government has become evil due to no fault of their own.

What if, my awakening to what government does is not my choice either.

WHAT IF. No one has any choice at all........in anything.

Mind-blowing stuff.


Anyone can ask themselves that question. All you have here is simply a belief, just like any religion in the world. There are plenty that have those thoughts. It is much nicer to think there is a better place when you die versus there being just black nothingness. The trick with religion is to get people to continue living....if the other side is SO great then why are people not committing mass suicide daily?

No....mind = not blown. Moral behavior is mostly learned. There are those that would say a woman is immoral for wearing a short skirt...has nothing to do with intelligence but a lot to do with learned behavior. So tell me, how does God in your world justify killing millions in floods and famine and whatnot....does that make God unintelligent? Plenty of innocent people die in the world EVERY day....are you immoral for not caring or being able to do anything for those souls?



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:36 AM
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reply to post by Vasa Croe
 


You and me are done friend.

You said your piece, I said mine. You can believe whatever you want, I won't lose sleep over what you think of me.

Shake hands, and I won't respond to a person who in my opinion is just a crazy internet bickerer (hey you called me crazy first)

Have a nice day, and perhaps you shouldn't be on Conspiracy site, if you think surveillance of citizens is not going on in their homes too.

bye

edit on 17-4-2014 by RadiationAndCancer because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:43 AM
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Shiloh7
Like the spirit of your post. In truth I know many who would regard it as an insult if they were not on some 'watch-em' list. It means they are not sheep and have the guts to speak out and say what they actually think rather than the mealy-mouthing that so many gush forth with today. The media floods us with the shallow gusherers and its their talentless celeb bods we would love to see float off in fluffy pink clouds to another planet. (Not that I care whether I am on a list or not).


Thanks, and yeah of course you are right, take for example people like Alex Jones, or people like Abby Martin of Russia Today and so on.

If people like that were NOT on a surveillance list, then that indeed would be an insult



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:45 AM
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RadiationAndCancer
And as a matter of fact, to completely blow your mind on just how smart I am.

Consider this.

If a person is not smart enough to understand the need for moral behavior and justifies immoral behavior. Is that person at fault ? Because intelligence and ability to understand complex issues is not a choice that we can make.

What if, government has become evil due to no fault of their own.

What if, my awakening to what government does is not my choice either.

WHAT IF. No one has any choice at all........in anything.

Mind-blowing stuff.


I don't think your three questions are relevant because you've shot yourself in the foot with your hypothetical situation. The person you describe wasn't helpless, that person had to have engaged in some sort of internal debate in order to be able to justify their beliefs. If what they ended up believing resulted in acts that violated the law of their land or puts them outside of social norms then yes, they are responsible for what happens to them.

A higher IQ means that you are capable of making connections earlier than most but doesn't mean you're correct. How many issues discussed in public are really so complicated that a high IQ is required to understand them? It's not IQ that matters here, it's willingness to apply yourself to the debate and some people take longer but they still get there.

There's a one word response to the situation you outlined earlier in that post about government goons...Nuremburg.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 09:56 AM
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Goteborg
A higher IQ means that you are capable of making connections earlier than most but doesn't mean you're correct. How many issues discussed in public are really so complicated that a high IQ is required to understand them? It's not IQ that matters here, it's willingness to apply yourself to the debate and some people take longer but they still get there.

There's a one word response to the situation you outlined earlier in that post about government goons...Nuremburg.


I am glad you wanted to go into details of this.

Let me present my argument in detail. A smart person is a person who thinks about cause and effect. If immoral acts, cause damage, regardless of circumstances, a smart person will not engage in them.

A truly smart person, can not willfully blind themselves with cheap justification.

And to top it off with one hell of an icing. We know for a fact, that intelligence of a person is NOT A CHOICE.

Person of 100 IQ can not simply will himself to 150. It is not a choice.

And since it is not a choice, is person of inadequate intelligence to understand cause and effect of immoral and moral acts, is that person not a prisoner.

Does that person really have a choice ?

Can that person ultimately really be blamed ?

This is scary stuff, I fully admit this is scary, it would mean that there is no punishment for evil "on the other side"

It would mean that evil, is as much part of the plan, as the "good".

This scares me MORE then the government.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 10:03 AM
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RadiationAndCancer

Trueman
In the moment you joined ATS, you became part of the list. Worse thing can happen to you is 3 meals a day and free room and medical attention. Not bad.


If prison is not bad, why I suggest you go and admit yourself in there


You don't seem to understand, happens when people make pseudo-rebel posts without a clue what are the concequences.

Imprision is one of the most frequent consequences faced by rebels against a system/government. Read history.

Remember Mandela, Martin Luther King.....list is huge.

Then we have what people call Martyrs.

Deny Ignorance, you are not a romantic rebel, just a scared guy posting on ATS.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 10:11 AM
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reply to post by RadiationAndCancer
 

they're gonna love you in the underground sugar caves, smart guy


How will you handle your life as a human, will you fold. Or stand for what is right.


the whole thing is a trap.
if a person does what you're suggesting (simply doing what is right as a human being)
the system cannot encroach legitimately on that person..
but they've made it impossible to avoid it
it's all about making us transgress in some way so we can be punished
"natural urges are always manipulated" /creepy german ww2 scientist voice

"no playing" "no being human"
the whole thing is a trap.

How will you handle your life as a human, will you fold. Or stand for what is right.




posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 10:16 AM
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Trueman
Deny Ignorance, you are not a romantic rebel, just a scared guy posting on ATS.


I am one of the bravest people you can hope to ever meet. In fact I am the kinda guy who emails CIA and lately NSA over what I think of their policies.

Now be honest, and admit, you don't often hear or read of someone saying they do that.

I don't know the meaning of the word Scared.

What scares me is the fact that universal justice may be far more complicated than I thought, that is what truly scares me.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 10:18 AM
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UNIT76
it's all about making us transgress in some way so we can be punished


Kinda like that Quote by Joseph Stalin, show me a man, and I'll show you a law he broke.

The landmark of tyrannical government.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 10:20 AM
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RadiationAndCancer
reply to post by Vasa Croe
 


You and me are done friend.

You said your piece, I said mine. You can believe whatever you want, I won't lose sleep over what you think of me.

Shake hands, and I won't respond to a person who in my opinion is just a crazy internet bickerer (hey you called me crazy first)

Have a nice day, and perhaps you shouldn't be on Conspiracy site, if you think surveillance of citizens is not going on in their homes too.

bye

edit on 17-4-2014 by RadiationAndCancer because: (no reason given)


So are you saying you only wanted to come here to tell us you are under surveillance, but will only respond to those who take you at your word and only those who agree with what you are saying without questioning legitimacy, accuracy or honesty?

Like I said before, why you? And why ATS? And sure...most people want proof. If you have something for them to "watch" you for then why not come out and say it instead of beating around the bush telling people you are being watched. You compared yourself to Snowden, so you must have some highly classified government details to spill.

These types of posts, on a conspiracy site, are in the thousands. These are what muck up true conspiracies that are being discussed. The "I know something and am being watched by TPTB" posts without ever saying what you know always result in the OP actually knowing nothing. Why even post that you know something, why not post with some substance about what you know?

Perhaps it is you who should not be on a Conspiracy site because at this point all you have done is tell us you know something and are under surveillance....big whoop....you and a couple hundred others on here have the exact same claim.



posted on Apr, 17 2014 @ 10:27 AM
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Kandinsky
reply to post by RadiationAndCancer
 

We're all on government lists!

Taxes, social security, driving licences, passports, police databases etc.



Yes we all are in more than one the list.




The Official List – Using these words online will put you in the crosshairs Big Brother’s multi-billion dollar spy machine

Domestic Security
Assassination
Attack
Domestic security
Drill
Exercise
Cops
Law enforcement
Authorities
Disaster assistance
Disaster management
DNDO (Domestic Nuclear
Detection Office)
National preparedness
Mitigation
Prevention
Response
Recovery
Dirty bomb
Domestic nuclear detection Emergency management
Emergency response
First responder
Homeland security
Maritime domain awareness
(MDA)
National preparedness
initiative
Militia
Shooting
Shots fired
Evacuation
Deaths
Hostage
Explosion (explosive)
Police
Disaster medical assistance
team (DMAT)
Organized crime Gangs
National security
State of emergency
Security
Breach
Threat
Standoff
SWAT
Screening
Lockdown
Bomb (squad or threat)
Crash
Looting
Riot
Emergency Landing
Pipe bomb
Incident
Facility


HAZMAT & Nuclear
Hazmat
Nuclear
Chemical spill
Suspicious package/device
Toxic
National laboratory
Nuclear facility
Nuclear threat
Cloud
Plume
Radiation
Radioactive Leak
Biological infection (or
event)
Chemical
Chemical burn
Biological
Epidemic
Hazardous
Hazardous material incident
Industrial spill
Infection
Powder (white) Gas
Spillover
Anthrax
Blister agent
Chemical agent
Exposure
Burn
Nerve agent
Ricin
Sarin
North Korea

Health Concern + H1N1
Outbreak
Contamination
Exposure
Virus
Evacuation
Bacteria
Recall
Ebola
Food Poisoning
Foot and Mouth (FMD)
H5N1
Avian
Flu
Strain
Quarantine
H1N1
Vaccine Salmonella
Small Pox
Plague
Human to human
Human to Animal
Influenza
Center for Disease Control
(CDC)
Drug Administration (FDA)
Public Health
Toxic
Agro Terror
Tuberculosis (TB)
Tamiflu
Norvo Virus
Epidemic Agriculture
Listeria
Symptoms
Mutation
Resistant
Antiviral
Wave
Pandemic
Infection
Water/air borne
Sick
Swine
Pork World Health Organization
(WHO) (and components)
Viral Hemorrhagic Fever
E. Coli

Infrastructure Security
Infrastructure security
Airport
CIKR (Critical Infrastructure
& Key Resources)
AMTRAK
Collapse
Computer infrastructure
Communications
infrastructure
Telecommunications
Critical infrastructure
National infrastructure
Metro
WMATA Airplane (and derivatives)
Chemical fire
Subway
BART
MARTA
Port Authority
NBIC (National
Biosurveillance Integration
Center)
Transportation security
Grid
Power
Smart
Body scanner Electric
Failure or outage
Black out
Brown out
Port
Dock
Bridge
Cancelled
Delays
Service disruption
Power lines

Southwest Border Violence
Drug cartel
Violence
Gang
Drug
Narcotics
Cocaine
Marijuana
Heroin
Border
Mexico
Cartel
Southwest
Juarez
Sinaloa
Tijuana
Torreon
Yuma
Tucson
Decapitated
U.S. Consulate
Consular
El Paso Fort Hancock
San Diego
Ciudad Juarez
Nogales
Sonora
Colombia
Mara salvatrucha
MS13 or MS-13
Drug war
Mexican army
Methamphetamine
Cartel de Golfo
Gulf Cartel
La Familia
Reynosa
Nuevo Leon
Narcos
Narco banners (Spanish
equivalents)
Los Zetas
Shootout
Execution Gunfight
Trafficking
Kidnap
Calderon
Reyosa
Bust
Tamaulipas
Meth Lab
Drug trade
Illegal immigrants
Smuggling (smugglers)
Matamoros
Michoacana
Guzman
Arellano-Felix
Beltran-Leyva
Barrio Azteca
Artistic Assassins
Mexicles
New Federation


Terrorism
Terrorism
Al Qaeda (all spellings)
Terror
Attack
Iraq
Afghanistan
Iran
Pakistan
Agro
Environmental terrorist
Eco terrorism
Conventional weapon
Target
Weapons grade
Dirty bomb
Enriched
Nuclear
Chemical weapon
Biological weapon
Ammonium nitrate
Improvised explosive device IED (Improvised Explosive
Device)
Abu Sayyaf
Hamas
FARC (Armed Revolutionary
Forces Colombia)
IRA (Irish Republican Army)
ETA (Euskadi ta Askatasuna)
Basque Separatists
Hezbollah
Tamil Tigers
PLF (Palestine Liberation
Front)
PLO (Palestine Liberation
Organization
Car bomb
Jihad
Taliban
Weapons cache
Suicide bomber
Suicide attack Suspicious substance
AQAP (AL Qaeda Arabian
Peninsula)
AQIM (Al Qaeda in the
Islamic Maghreb)
TTP (Tehrik-i-Taliban
Pakistan)
Yemen
Pirates
Extremism
Somalia
Nigeria
Radicals
Al-Shabaab
Home grown
Plot
Nationalist
Recruitment
Fundamentalism
Islamist

Weather/Disaster/Emergency
Emergency
Hurricane
Tornado
Twister
Tsunami
Earthquake
Tremor
Flood
Storm
Crest
Temblor
Extreme weather
Forest fire
Brush fire Ice
Stranded/Stuck
Help
Hail
Wildfire
Tsunami Warning Center
Magnitude
Avalanche
Typhoon
Shelter-in-place
Disaster
Snow
Blizzard
Sleet Mud slide or Mudslide
Erosion
Power outage
Brown out
Warning
Watch
Lightening
Aid
Relief
Closure
Interstate
Burst
Emergency Broadcast System

Cyber Security
Cyber security
Botnet
DDOS (dedicated denial of
service)
Denial of service
Malware
Virus
Trojan
Keylogger
Cyber Command 2600
Spammer
Phishing
Rootkit
Phreaking
Cain and abel
Brute forcing
Mysql injection
Cyber attack
Cyber terror Hacker
China
Conficker
Worm
Scammers
Social media


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