Iain Duncan Smith abolishes the right to appeal ATOS assesments

Hi,

I know that this part of ATS is usually on the most-part about American politics, but it is an internationally used site.

So if you are American, this may not interest you, but hopefully it will, as the similarities between US and UK populace control policies are many!


Anyways...

I read the following today:

IDS is getting fed up with all of the ATOS appeals. So He abolishes the right to appeal.
pic.twitter.com/CaU9iweB3J

twitter.com...

That's Iain Duncan Smith, one of the most hated politicians directly involved in the current government's Austerity Measures. He's also a Liar politician and someone who has tried to use taxpayers money to pay for his own personal expenses.

I couldn't find anything about it online, but who know apart from it being a potential hoax, it could well be a secret op.

Iain Duncan Smith declared unfit for work by Atos:
eveningharold.com...

If you need to know more about this guy, watch these:

reply to post by mrbeardo42


It was taken from Private Eye, which is a satirical publication. Ian Hislop is the editor, he's one of the team captains on Have I Got News for You.

IDS is a piece of crap though and I wouldn't be surprised if he does try to pull something like this off after all the ways he's screwed some of the most vulnerable people in this country. However, I don't see any reasonable judge siding with him when it would inevitably be taken to the highest courts in the land.

At the risk of turning making the anti Duncan Smith ranting even worse, I have to say he is quite a good politician and has been consistent in his views for some time.

The problem with the disability benefits is that under the last Labour administration the number of people claiming the "disability" living allowance was over 3 million. This is 10% of the working population who are unable to work because of a disability. Even the most generous welfare system cannot accept that one in ten of the population cannot do any work. It had become a joke.

The reforms include an assessment to actually see if the recipient is (er) actually really unable to work. Clearly, ATOS has made mistakes, but as a tax payer I think that checking to see if Mr and Mrs X are truly incapable of working is appropriate.

If you research, you will see that people can appeal, but not continuously appealing against the appeal.

Regards

reply to post by paraphi


The fact is that he not only employed an agency, but that he allowed himself and his team to instruct them what medical evaluation decisions to make and how to make judgements on (only) physical work capabilities (ignoring any mental conditions), which is like a mechanic telling an artist how to paint. The assessors were also given a threshold of "disability allowances" to stand by.

These government designed and mandated tests were fraudulent in medical practice and also did not cater for the obvious repetitive physical nature of a workplace, and how it may affect someone who is weak or easily made ill under repetitive strain and demand.

IDS isn't even willing to show in any way how it is viable for anyone to live on £53 a week.

Do you also know that any parent or parents without work will only get child support for up to three children, and before you get all crazy about how many children jobless parents should have, stop to think that many of these parents were working when they conceived these children. Not forgetting that children are our future, and also that unless you have ultra rich parents and you are viewed and treated in a negative light unless you are working, regardless of circumstance, past afflictions, or even location.

To counter that we got paper now claiming things like this to make these vulnerable people feel bad, calling it a "care crisis"

www.independent.co.uk...[ /exnews]



He also has no shame in any mistaken forced transfer from disabled status to work eligible status.

There are also major issues in the UK like bad foods which are the only food the working class can afford to eat, proven to cause illness regardless of fitness regime. Also the fact that allowing excessive job outsourcing, corporate tax avoidance, and allowing foreign companies that operate in the UK to dominate the UK's home grown industries (thus businesses), and suck money out of the economy to other countries, even allowing energy companies from abroad to take and sell our natural resources with no money coming back into the country (Like Cuadrilla, a foreign fracking company, whose site employees I hear are all brought in from their home country, destroying potential jobs for any local UK residents).

Basically the british government has allowed the country to sell itself and it's industries to the rest of the world, and until these government leaders' jobs start being outsourced in the same way.

But Iain Duncan smith is very interested in blaming the economic downfall on the disabled and those who cannot find the work with the pay and skill matching they need.

Most work that is viable for families these days is only available in city areas, but the travel and housing costs are way beyond suitable.

I'm sorry, but if IDS wants people to work, he needs to create jobs for families and communities, not jobs for those who can already afford to live with and support their family in the city.

Also another point is that people have now been forced to pay higher utility bills, with even those on benefits having to get loan shark loans, higher rentals, among 40% lowered housing support limits, no affordable housing, a huge rise on taxes which included in food and grocery costs, insuranse costs, clothing costs for school uniforms, keeping children entertained so social services don't end up taking them away due to neglect and even child criminal activity in some areas.

This government's interests no longer seem to be in the average joe general public, it instead goes on an on about a failing company and blaming in on the previous government and public borrowing and lower public spending, and any other such nonsense. It's only the rich and the banks that will thrive from this.

Do I really have to point all the reasons why Austerity actions in this country are so wrong?

Even wages these days are lower in the lat half century in comparisons to living costs.

If you go by the "figures" that these lying politicians spin and keep feeding you, then of course you will support them.

You need to pay attention to independent fact investigators and be sure that they themselves have no hidden agendas, and of the wording used.

That is of course how the world's greatest tyrants and mas--murderers got in to power.

reply to post by Firefly_


I thought it might be something like that...


Thanks

I believe that 50% of their decisions get over turned (ATOS).
I also read on line that when they made their bid for this contract. That they lied in order to get it. Some thing to do with the north west disability group based in Manchester. They are paid out of government funds (our money) So who employs some one, who gets 50% of their job wrong? As for IDS well hes another one of them. Politicians, so hes nothing but a liar and a thief. No doubt claiming every benifit that he can. Duck houses moats second homes fuel porn movies food ect ect. They will claim for anything that they can get. Yet are the first to abuse the unemployed or sick in our society. We have watched the arab spring and I guess its about time, we had our own. Not a spring, more like a british jump. Jump on them lying two faced tw*ts in Downing street.

reply to post by paraphi



Oh yeah and just for the record, I want you to know that I respect your and anyone else's personal views, and am not one to suppress anyone's freedom of expression as a human right!

I always have open ears, but a rather long winded reply on most occasions!

I also I am not always perfect in my assessment and portrayal of facts and figures etc, so do excuse any mistakes or misunderstandings/misconceptions I put out here!

Either way, thanks for replying and participating!

reply to post by illuminnaughty


Thanks for voicing yourself!

I also discovered today that he even lied in his CV about attending a university among other lies, and that he only did two A levels (unspecified subjects).

I severely dislike anyone who does this kind of thing, it causes people who have the real skills and expertise, and knowledge to lose out on jobs that should rightfully be theirs, while people like him end up bluffing and acting their way to the top.

Disgraceful.

Why should anyone obey this man's demands and wishes, or trust a single word he says?

I am skilled in IT, and even after 3 years of hard study at college, I got nothing, and have still yet to get my big break, but at least I have the nobility not to sin and lie about the "experience" these corporate companies have always demand as a requirement for me to work for them.

Thankfully I have made my way by advertising my skills to the public instead of the businesses.

And that's now how this nation's poor and rejected skilled people are staying on their feet. It all started with Thatcher. Yet we still get effectively 40%+ taxed of our income, no matter how much we earn, even if it's benefit money, we are still taxed, seven on what we spend.

Guess everyone forgot about the story of robin hood and why it's so important.

If you are looking to be financially and domestically successful, I would advise you not to expect it by getting a job with a company these days unless it's a small local/family business that you can (help to) grow with.

I am not one who wishes to live under the illusion that my taxes pay for my place in society, for my wonderful ability to use public or private transport, for my "freedom from terror", for my free emergency services, forgetful of excessive and thieving insurance policies, a vote that counts for nothing more than being dictated to unless we shout and scream outside the house of commons...

reply to post by paraphi


Well said

The system was being abused, maybe not intentionally but as you said you cannot have 1/10 people signed off work when most are actually capable of some work.

As a case in point, there was a C4 programme called Benefits Britain 1949 on recently and they had 3 people on this episode I watched - two of the people were signed off as disabled, one was a young bloke born with spina bifida who had never worked but was desperate too and another was some grumpy, middle aged woman who was apparently ill with all sorts of ailments, but had no outward signs of any disability.

Anyhoo, they got given work placements as part of the 1949 system and while the young man, despite being quite physically disabled, gave it his all and turned up at the call centre to do the job, the woman, who was placed in a factory that employed disabled people only, some with missing limbs etc, made every excuse under the sun to not do anything, claiming she was "tired" and asking why she should work when she was ill.

They even did home visits and the woman seemed quite capable of mowing the lawn, or driving her car and keeping the house tidy yet maintained an attitude that she couldn't do any work.

In the end, the young man actually got a permanent job in the call centre and literally cried with joy. The woman quit the program claiming she was being discriminated against.

At the end of the day, having a disability or an illness does not automatically mean you cannot do work and certainly shouldn't mean the state fork out tens of thousands a year on benefits, free vehicles etc. Most work in the UK is not very physical, yet people like this woman on the show will not do it, because the state will look after them. The fact that this lad, who could barely walk his spine was that deformed, was not only happy but perfectly capable of sitting at a desk, is evidence that being disabled is not an issue. Aren't we always told to not discriminate against people?

This needs to change.

mrbeardo42
I am skilled in IT, and even after 3 years of hard study at college, I got nothing, and have still yet to get my big break, but at least I have the nobility not to sin and lie about the "experience" these corporate companies have always demand as a requirement for me to work for them.

Off topic, I know, but IT boomed about 15 years ago - if you're hoping for a career in it now, join the rest of the legions of people that also did IT at college. Your problem is you chose a career path millions of others did and the vast majority has now been off shored. My best mate is in the same boat - did IT at College in the early 00's and has spent the past 2 years on the dole pile

reply to post by mrbeardo42


Thank's for bringing this up, as far as I recall was not ATOS a company based in france which is owned or at least run by one of mr Cameron's personal aquaintances, Do you remember how when they set up an assessment centre in the north west there office in st helen's was inaccessable to anyone with mobility difficulty and how the assessment criteria state that if you did not attend (which was physically impossible for those mobillity impared) that you would automatically fail the assessment and be declared fit for work.
This government has no consideration for the right's or dignity of there own disabled citizen's so is it any surprise that knowing full well he will NOT get back into power unless the next election is somehow rigged-
(which I believe the last election with Neil Kinnock as labour leader was, since he was going to reverse the privatisation policy brought in by the Tory's and upset a lot of vested interests - they were celebrating there victory which even the moray poll predicted but then a minor constituancy misteriously swung the vote to the Tory's and Kinnock decided not to contest the outcome though most labour party members wanted to and he later mysteriously was knighted and is now a member of the house of lords and very wealthy so I cry pay off)
-is trying to bring about as much demolishion work on the welfare state as it can and return the country to the pre-war state it was in the 1930's with men begging for work and no worker right's so they can go back to playing lord of the manor like the bunch of Gobs***es they really are.

They of course had to wait until nearly all the war time generation were dead or elderly before they struck like the snakes they are and to prove this just look how cameron goes on and on about how we have too many elderly and they are a burden to the state, did you know there is an effective bounty on the head's of old folk's were by if they are put on the killing method called the liverpool care pathway then the hospital whom have done this to them are payed £4600, so they go for a treatment of lets say a hip replacement and never come out.

This serves the vested interests of a group of CBI members whom have a callous and nazi like disregard for the public and the members of parliement whom though they may have had to transferre ownership of there shares for the duration of there political carreer have vast investment's in the equity groups such as Carlisle and G4S, as well as others whom suffered a massive loss when the private pension schemes failed and there members opted back into serp's as amongst the other very SELF SERVING lies of the cammeron mafia is the claim that the government can not sustain the state pension so they have forced company's to bring in work based pension schemes which those same companys have had to go the the same pension providers that those same equity firms that the government ministers have very large investments in and so there shares have sky rocketed, now in 20 to 25 years when these same workers retire they are in for a rude awakening as those equity groups will have sold the pension schemes before they crash and the payouts will be minimul and well below what the same state pension they are now destroying would have paid, this is because we have no industry to maintain the inertia and only a Socialist industrial government can fix this, we have no socialist partys as labour is merely another puppet of the CBI, notice how the CBI has taken over from the chancellor for trade and industy even though it is not a government body or even democratic.

This is truth though lets' see how the fascist pull this down eh.


There is a difference between a Tory (cameron, thatcher) and a conservative and that is best described by looking up the meaning of those two word's in the oxford dictionary.

reply to post by stumason


I left college 15 years ago

reply to post by stumason


Also yeah same happened to me, but that's was in another more generic industry. had a good job, my local branch had to be closed thanks to land owner wanting to extend and buldoze, and had to choose voluntary redundancy as other branches paid less (just above minimum wage) and cost more for travel, minus the monthly location bonus I was receiving.

That was two years of frustration, feelings of self blame, inadequacy for my (newly wedded in to) family.

Worst two years of my life apart from my marriage.

Suffice to say my wife did (and still does) an incredible job in supporting me! If anyone deserved a noble peace prize it's here LOL!

reply to post by LABTECH767


I am printing out your post! Excellent info!

The funny thing is to be on ESA to begin with you need to hand in doctors lines, that state your doctor has declared you unfit for work until some "trained Atos health care professional " (absolute bollocks) overwrites what your doctor says only to have to appeal it and win, with one group of people saying you are fit to work and the other group (Atos) saying there is absolutely nothing wrong because you can life a box, and in the end a doctor a lawyer and a witness all have to say you are unfit, and all of this takes months and months and no doubt costs a helluva lot and is a complete waste, if your doctor says your unfit why don't they trust the doctors. Money just bleeds from this country because of this kind of bureaucracy.

reply to post by LABTECH767


Speaking of Pensions,

I was recently informed that is was a scam from the very beginning in 1930s UK, as they had no money to back it up when it was forst offered to workers, and thus the domino effect begun, and also the fact that any money that was reserved for Pensions ended up in the same post as the "spending" money did.

Makes me think about all those worthless overseas investments and pyramid pension schemes that only benefited their creators and initial corporate investors.

I would just like to mention a couple of points I have picked up in the above comments.

ESA is available for those with mental health problems, but only if those mental health problems actually make you unfit for work.

Not everyone is wrongly assessed, I suspect that the quality of assessments varies hugely, meaning far too big a percentage are wrongly assessed, but some of the ATOS staff are actually fair and decent.

Yes we are having a hard time financially here in the uk, but I know for instance of a single parent with two children of school age who copes on her ESA, she is struggling due to the eco hot water and heating systems being incorrectly installed in her home, therefore causing them to not function properly and in the winter it is costing £80 per week to run if she heats her home as she should. But she is careful with her money, her home is reasonable inside, the children are well fed and reasonably dressed.

I know other single parents who are in huge amounts of debt, in the main because they insist on feeding their children on crisps, providing squash, sweets and various other junk.

Whatever you may have read in the paper, the bedroom tax does not apply to those on middle and higher rate disability.

My parents needed a four bed house when we were growing up, but as my father worked 18 hour days 7 days per week for many years to pay a mortgage, we lived in a 3 bed property, other families in council housing put up two sets of bunkbeds in one room to accommodate their children, they were just happy to be housed.

The system stinks, I could explain some of what is wrong with it, but that is for a different thread.

Ian Duncan Smith..The man who committed benefit fraud by letting his then working girlfriend stay with him rent free in a bedsit payed for by the tax payer when he was an Unemployed Layabout.

The man who lives rent free in his father-in-laws multi million pound mansion,

The man who claimed for underpants on his expenses,

The man who lied about being a Captain in the Army, He served as major General Sir John Acland's Boot Boy..
The man who lied about having a degree on his CV. "His claim that he studied at the University of Perugia was later found to be false after an investigation by the BBC.
His office subsequently admitted that he attended the Italian Università per Stranieri in Perugia for a year but he did not obtain any qualifications or finish his exams....Failure.
In 1975 he attended the Royal Military Academy Sandhurst and was subsequently commissioned into the Scots Guards....ie, Not good enough for the RM Commando's..Another Failure
Duncan-Smith's biography, on the Conservative Party website, claimed he was "educated at Dunchurch College of Management" but following questioning by the BBC his office confirmed that he did not get any qualifications there either, stating that he completed six separate courses lasting a few days each, adding up to about a month in total....oh dear, another Lie and Failure.

Dunchurch was the former staff college for GEC Marconi, for whom Duncan-Smith worked in the 1980s."...who BTW helped fund his political career...Now i wonder why they did that.
Whilst working for Marconi...The defence arm of The General Electric Company ( en.wikipedia.org... )

The list goes on of Ian's incompetence and failures.

Yeah, he's a smashing lad is our Ian..or should we call him by his proper name.. George. He's a Rat Bag,a Spook and a Killer of the sick and disabled.

reply to post by Soloprotocol


Thank you for that post of good info. I didnt know any of it, but as I said he is a politician. It goes without saying that he is nothing but a thief and a liar. As are the rest of them good decent honest upright respectable so called gentlemen who work along side him. They now want a 11% increase on their wages. Whilst every one else is getting their wages and benefits cut.
My grand dad fought in the trenches, `lions led by donkeys`. My father spent 4 years fighting in china then returned for a 5 year fight against the evil nazi`s. Some people got a country as a reward Israel/ pakistan. We brits were rewarded with homes fit to live in. Our own gas water and electric companies. Owned by the people until that evil slapper maggy the milk snatcher, stole it from the people and sold it off to her cronies.
ian dumbc*nt smith should be strung up by the neck from a lamp post.

Crikey, you're a bitter one and bloody judgemental too.... Let's just go over some of your bile ..

Soloprotocol
The man who lied about being a Captain in the Army, He served as major General Sir John Acland's Boot Boy..

He was a Captain - when he was AdC, he was promoted to acting Captain, as is normal. You can check his service records, or even Army veterans forums of those who served under him, those that did seem to agree he was quite a Good officer.

Soloprotocol
The man who lied about having a degree on his CV. "His claim that he studied at the University of Perugia was later found to be false after an investigation by the BBC.
His office subsequently admitted that he attended the Italian Università per Stranieri in Perugia for a year but he did not obtain any qualifications or finish his exams....Failure.

That's harsh - so he didn't finish his exams, so what? A lot of people don't, it's hardly fair to call them "failures" -what a bitter little person you are.

Soloprotocol
In 1975 he attended the Royal Military Academy Sandhurst and was subsequently commissioned into the Scots Guards....ie, Not good enough for the RM Commando's..Another Failure

Again, that's a bit harsh. The failure rate for those even selected for Marine basic training is 40% - only the best of the best even stand a chance. I assume, of course,you were selected for and passed the Basic training and have your Green beret, as you seem to judge him for it.

Soloprotocol
Duncan-Smith's biography, on the Conservative Party website, claimed he was "educated at Dunchurch College of Management" but following questioning by the BBC his office confirmed that he did not get any qualifications there either, stating that he completed six separate courses lasting a few days each, adding up to about a month in total....oh dear, another Lie and Failure.

You really should use the correct quotation marks when plagiarising another site to vent your spleen.. You have copied whole sections of text from Wikipedia and framed them as your own, not just in the above paragraph, but in your entire post.

You seem to judge him as a failure, but by any measure he's not done that bad in life - I assume of course that you've achieved more?

All you're doing is the lowest form of political smearing and character assassination, usually the reserve of those who cannot eloquently defeat an argument using logic and reason, so resort to the personal attack instead.