"World population must be stabilized and to do that we must eliminate 350,000 people per day!"

He does say "needless consumption" in there somwhere, is that comparable to "Useless eaters" or is just food waste the driving force behind those remarks. Something to think about.

reply to post by Tinkerpeach

That is absurd!!!!! To think the Earth could handle 10 times the current population???????? Fish stocks are rapidly depleting right now with many facing extinction. Forests are disappearing. Just because there is ROOM for many more Mexico Cities or Shanghais doesn't mean these dense population centers that suck the food from outside and are totally dependent on others for food and resources are a good idea or even possible! The amount of pollution and waste of resources caused by the people in America alone is causing dead zones in the ocean, giant islands of plastic in the ocean, top soil depletion, aquifer depletion, and so many other problems, that our very civilization is teetering. Many animals are on the verge of extinction. Including Man.

If right then how do we decide who lives and who dies. ?

reply to post by dollukka


We could set off parts of the ocean and just breed enough fish to supply the current world with food if we needed to, or build fish farms on land. We could easily produce enough fruits and vegetables if we needed to and there is always solar power to tap for energy.

I think there are two separate discussions going on here in this thread.

What is actually possible v. what is actually likely.

If I were put in charge as overlord of the earth with one goal which was to supply everyone with the basic needs to be happy, it would not be an issue. I'd say there is no limit to how many people the earth could sustain.

Given our current state of international affairs though, I would agree that while the population booms, the death tolls will rise because its simply unsustainable. I don't think we need to purposely limit anyone because lack of resources, healthcare, and poor environment will do that work itself.

AthlonSavage
If right then how do we decide who lives and who dies. ?

You wouldn't have to decide if families would limit themselves to having one child for a couple of generations.

Yeah, I know, unrealistic.

Tinkerpeach
The world could easily handle 10x the amount of people we currently have if we were perhaps a bit better organized.

When you look at Tokyo or Mexico city of course it seems overcrowded but then look at Wyoming or Siberia and it certainly isn't. We also have the technology to build underground, on the water and beneath the Sea if we have too. The Earth has so much room its laughable.

We can grow food in any environment, make our own water, raise fish on land.....plenty of methods to feed everyone and house them if we decide to do it.

What Mr. Cousteau is referring to is his desire to see a world remain as it is where the population does not interfere with him. Or at least while he was alive.

It has very little to do with what is sustainable and is actually an extremely selfish point of view held by many people.

This is probably rebuffed already but had to stop and reply. You are seriously saying we could support over 80 billion people. Sorry to burst youth bubble but without doing any math it is still safe to say there probably isn't enough land mass for that many people let alone trying to grow food for them.

I just know that was a typo. Look we can't, again I say can't feed the population we have now. That is why we have millions starving now. Did you catch that number, millions. Food is really only one problem, Yea it is a bigger cus we have them starving already.

Water, believe it or not is a bigger problem than food, lot bigger. You can live a long time without proper nutrition but you can't live without water. Water is a big problem already, there is not enough to sustain the present level of population.

All the other resources are finite too. The effects so many people are having on the planet are also devastating. We are beginning to see die offs in our oceans, whole species, are threatened with extinction. We are seeing huge areas of dead zones, where there is no life at all. If you have ever been to any ocean you know why these are so alarming to scientists. I was raised half on the water and the other in the hill country and the ocean normally teams with life everywhere. It is amazing.

To then see an area dead it is equally amazing only not in a good way.

There are so many things and so many reasons why we really need a good pandemic. We have elected the weather and the climate is changed, the oceans are rising and cities Will be swallowed, the oceans are losing their salinity and becoming piloted to the point where soon they won't be able to support life. The air is getting difficult to breathe in many places and our very atmosphere is losing it's ability to protect us.

Trash and especially toxic waste are piling up everywhere, it will consume us, they are already plans for possibly just shooting it into space. This could go on and on. Just take a gander at some of the thousands of pictures of the pollution in bejing or the slums and mountains of trash some millions live in around the world.

Man I'm sorry but we need to shrink the population and I know that is harsh but it is the truth.

The Bot

reply to post by Tinkerpeach


There is no need to do this in the ocean.

There is no need to use the prime agricultural land that could be used for lots of extra foods and dairy.

There is ample room on earth, for all the population can stand shoulder to shoulder in LA.

Every man, woman and their children can have their own little farm, on decent land, in beauty, and with clean technology, ie. no fossil fuels, and there is very advanced buried, so they could have beam ships in their yards as well as many other goodies/toys. However, with friction heaters and stirling engines, and various other power sources, they can abundantly power their own homes and clean factories.

It could have been done years and years ago, for the most part, except and but for the GREED of the controllers, the Power of the few, and the zombies roped into this system of slavery.

No money is needed for abundance.


1 MILLION pounds of Food on 3 acres. 10,000 fish 500 yards compost

AND


Fishing in the Phoenix Earthship

FIrst world nations are not overpopulated, and the poor nations need equality, freedom from fascism and theocracies and good health care, to also stop having big families.

We're not in any danger of overpopulation currently, or of destroying the world, if the real solutions that have been here all around are used. That is all a very big lie, and we have to stop buying it.

There is no problem since the solutions have been outpouring for decades. Its a CRIME that the PTB have not implented them, or been forced to by aware and assertive people.

Again, its not a problem, the problems don't exist. They've all been solved for at least many decades, but probably far longer. We aren't facing problems, we're facing CRIMES WITH INTENT TO MURDER AND HARM, by a very small group of insane in the membrane universal freaks running this world.

Again, no problems exist, they've been solved. CRIMES EXIST.

No need to harm anyone, enslave anyone even. Just equalize, make sure all have land and resources and heritage seeds and stop this madness.

reply to post by jaxnmarko


And think about the infrastructure... My god, can you imagine LA or Houston with just double the population!?

Of course I understand the concept (we couldn't sustain 10x population in already settled cities), new cities would be founded, etc.

But just the thought of 80 billion people makes me want to leave. The earth would surely implode

Just want to make it clear

All ideas and comments are more than welcome. The ultimate questions being asked are:

Questions, right or wrong...Is the Earth:
A.) Reaching its' saturation point of population?
B.) Able to sustain ourselves at the current yearly growth rate? How?
C.) Able to survive as people are living longer, Medicine is prolonging life, our Earth has limited resources: What to do?

Also, I'm aware many other related questions, but in an effort to tailor this discussion, was limited to the ones above.

I am not an advocate for an un-natural population depopulation. (meaning a gov't, worldwide (U.N.), scientific) proclamation on who lives, how long etc.

I'm looking for solutions to the facts.....over 7Billion and growing every year (pop. clock right in the OP 1st page.)

Now, radiation is pouring daily into the pacific ocean from fukushima. Drinking water, unpolluted aquifers are dwindling. Droughts, food waste, mass killings of sea life, GMO's (who really knows the full ramifications) and overall, dwindling natural resources.

I do not believe the real question is if we can handle having more people, sure, we can, but more will continue to die, but as of now, there are more births than deaths each year, hence WW populatiion growth increases every day.

Also, it's not just about space/acreage to put people, it's the quality of existence. It's not a matter of just staying alive, but about LIVING.

I'm suggesting a greater worldwide attention and action on helping, developing and implementing resources that not only can support the current population (oh btw, we are not doing such a great job at doing that even right now) but also the projected annual population increase.

I believe there are alternatives to solve some of these problems, energy, pollution, but some seem dire such as drinkable water, nutrition, population/resource balance. As someone noted earlier, I think the tipping point has been reached....the cycle is heading downward.

As technologically advanced as a species can be here on earth, we sure have made a mess of things. And I do not mean to discredit in any way some of the miraculous inventions, medicines and genius ideas that have improved the quality of life for many......but ' that many ' represents a small percentage of the world population. Most live in deplorable conditions and in some areas of the world, in 2013 don't even know what electricity is, phones, or what the internet is......There seems to be a great imbalance....and as said...it is tipping. Can we 'right' it and find solutions that are humane and will change our world our Earth for the better? Peace!!

Unity_99
Again, its not a problem, the problems don't exist. They've all been solved for at least many decades, but probably far longer. We aren't facing problems, we're facing CRIMES WITH INTENT TO MURDER AND HARM, by a very small group of insane in the membrane universal freaks running this world.

Again, no problems exist, they've been solved. CRIMES EXIST.

No need to harm anyone, enslave anyone even. Just equalize, make sure all have land and resources and heritage seeds and stop this madness.

Then, correct me if I'm misinterpreting what you are suggesting, Over population and its drain on resources is NOT a problem? It's some hideous plan by the "They've" have created for a slow, painful and dreadful death to millions? "They" have answers to fix them right now, but don't, because they enjoy the pain and suffering and in the end....fate will just happen?

Is this how you see it? I'm not agreeing or disagreeing, just trying to understand....and who are these "they've" people precisely? Peace!

static.persquaremile.com...

If 6.9 billion people lived as crowded as say Paris France it would take Louisiana, Mississippi, and Arkansas. Since there are 7.2 billion we could throw in Oklahoma...and call it Paris 2...
The population is not as problematic as the pollution and waste IMO. I did a thread not to long ago about the uranium mining which left radioactive mining waste that is today possibly irradiating and poisoning the ground water for an estimated 38 million people. www.abovetopsecret.com...
Japan's nuclear reactors may end up doing what many of the eugenicist have only dreamed of..
Funny how all the people who want to do away with people for their idea of population control always want to start someplace "over there not here"!

Some of the young want to kill the old and the old just want to live in peace or order someone else (the young) to die for some patriotic reason... To me it is simple. The earth will shake mankind off either through some super bug or super volcano or super duper extra solar event or we might do ourselves; terminate in a grand extinction event some government orders thinking they will survive.

In the mean time those who want to cry save mother earth she is dying, the oil is running out, the world is ending etc etc .... move over and let me play though; I have a few more holes (golf) I want to play.

Lassie met up with a wolf. Lassie liked to talk and was really getting on the Wolf's nerves with all the chatter about stuff Lassie said she knew and thought was a big deal.. They came to a river that needed to be crossed on the way home so they both jumped in. The current was swift and Lassie was floundering and about ready to drown. The Wolf grabbed Lassie and drug her to the shore. Motor mouth Lassie could not believe how the Wolf saved her from a horrible death. After a 20 minute time period of thanks and recuperation by Lassie the Wolf spoke.

"While you were learning all the things you have been talking about all day I took 5 minutes when I was a pup and taught myself how to swim. It is true I don't know much about geometry, Don't know much about history,
Don't know much biology, Don't know much about a science book, Don't know much about the French,
But there is one thing I do know and that is for sure, "I know how to swim find food to survive".

Knowledge based priorities work while screaming at the moon to come closer is a waste of breath and time.

“Lord grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.” Pick your fights well grasshopper for there are many battles that require no death just action based knowledge and the will to take the first step.

America just became the biggest oil producer in the world; did you see a cost reduction in a barrel of oil?.

In the 70s the greens were saying at about this time the earth would be out of oil... Doomsday and the rapture is coming you better get ready bubba etc etc and yet here we are; all 7.2 billion souls, making a living, breeding, laughing, and some quite content even though they are poor as dirt. I personally wish all the Eugenicist would lead the way and do themselves in... Lead by example etc etc otherwise if they ever get the power to enact their evil plans many who sang their praises will be some of the first to go.

What a truckload of mule puckey.

We already produce more than enough to feed the planet. It just doesn't get to everybody.

If we dropped the chemical/ gmo/monoculture farming where we have to truck a friggin carrot 1500 miles to sell it and went to localized organic (read, OLD SCHOOL) farming methods then we'd have better and more plentiful food at lower prices.

The world needs less greed and interference, not more ineffective micromanagement.

Of course, all of the depopulationist enthusiasts plan on killing off 6.5 billion OTHER people. Not themselves.

Overpopulation is definitely a problem. People are not like marbles taking up space in a fish tank - can fit this many, etc. I had concerns about population drummed into my head while getting my undergraduate degree in the 90's. We are heavy duty consumers. We don't eat what we need and hibernate for the winter. We are constantly acting on the world around us, and to extreme degrees.

We see problems with wolf populations getting too high, certain insects overrunning areas, etc. Why does this problem not apply to humans? It cannot apply to everything else and only exclude us. To think this way is to not consider the ecosystem and our impact on it. Regardless, people who believe there is no limit will be proven wrong if it does not come back into balance before it grows much further.

I believe nature has a way of returning to equilibrium. But the OP is right - intelligence is an issue with our species. We can override diseases and resist death at every turn. Look at Dr. Kevorkian's struggles to allow one the right to die. I would like to believe our impact is being studied by some other species - to see if we inadvertently bring it back into balance by pushing other species out or.... The earth will find a way one way or another - as it is more "intelligent" than any human - has been around a heck of a lot longer.

badgerprints
What a truckload of mule puckey.

We already produce more than enough to feed the planet. It just doesn't get to everybody.

If we dropped the chemical/ gmo/monoculture farming where we have to truck a friggin carrot 1500 miles to sell it and went to localized organic (read, OLD SCHOOL) farming methods then we'd have better and more plentiful food at lower prices.

The world needs less greed and interference, not more ineffective micromanagement.

Of course, all of the depopulationist enthusiasts plan on killing off 6.5 billion OTHER people. Not themselves.

I understand your point about the fact that food production possibly exceeds the needs of the overall population of the planet. However, as you stated, mis-and-micromanagement is thwarting the efforts to accomplisht this.

However, with that said.....in a world that has a continued growing population and escalating problems such as drought, dried up lake beds, oceans being raped of the aqualife (ultimate affects the entire food chain in the world) massive animal die-offs, bird, dolphins, shrimp, whales, etc.

It is not just a matter of de-population, but how to sustain and ever growing one with limited resources. Is there not a breaking point? A saturation point? Where too many to be fed, taken care of medically, ever increasing grazing lands being depleted for livestock, drinking water.

You and I may not see it/feel it significantly where we are, but trust me.....it is happening and a wave is developing and is growing every day!! Just considerations!! Peace!!!

Amazingly as this chart shows, just about 11 countries make up close to 6.5 Billion of the Worlds Total population. Of approximately 7.2M
Source

ItDepends
Amazingly as this chart shows, just about 11 countries make up close to 6.5 Billion of the Worlds Total population. Of approximately 7.2M
Source

I checked out your source and that is about the coolest thing I've seen. A real time count of population growth. Are they hooked into every hospital and morgue? I have to keep that source just because it truly shows how far technology has come - if it is as accurate as it seems.

727Sky
static.persquaremile.com...

If 6.9 billion people lived as crowded as say Paris France it would take Louisiana, Mississippi, and Arkansas. Since there are 7.2 billion we could throw in Oklahoma...and call it Paris 2...
The population is not as problematic as the pollution and waste IMO. I did a thread not to long ago about the uranium mining which left radioactive mining waste that is today possibly irradiating and poisoning the ground water for an estimated 38 million people. www.abovetopsecret.com...
Japan's nuclear reactors may end up doing what many of the eugenicist have only dreamed of..
Funny how all the people who want to do away with people for their idea of population control always want to start someplace "over there not here"!

Some of the young want to kill the old and the old just want to live in peace or order someone else (the young) to die for some patriotic reason... To me it is simple. The earth will shake mankind off either through some super bug or super volcano or super duper extra solar event or we might do ourselves; terminate in a grand extinction event some government orders thinking they will survive.

In the mean time those who want to cry save mother earth she is dying, the oil is running out, the world is ending etc etc .... move over and let me play though; I have a few more holes (golf) I want to play.

Lassie met up with a wolf. Lassie liked to talk and was really getting on the Wolf's nerves with all the chatter about stuff Lassie said she knew and thought was a big deal.. They came to a river that needed to be crossed on the way home so they both jumped in. The current was swift and Lassie was floundering and about ready to drown. The Wolf grabbed Lassie and drug her to the shore. Motor mouth Lassie could not believe how the Wolf saved her from a horrible death. After a 20 minute time period of thanks and recuperation by Lassie the Wolf spoke.

"While you were learning all the things you have been talking about all day I took 5 minutes when I was a pup and taught myself how to swim. It is true I don't know much about geometry, Don't know much about history,
Don't know much biology, Don't know much about a science book, Don't know much about the French,
But there is one thing I do know and that is for sure, "I know how to swim find food to survive".

Knowledge based priorities work while screaming at the moon to come closer is a waste of breath and time.

“Lord grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.” Pick your fights well grasshopper for there are many battles that require no death just action based knowledge and the will to take the first step.

America just became the biggest oil producer in the world; did you see a cost reduction in a barrel of oil?.

In the 70s the greens were saying at about this time the earth would be out of oil... Doomsday and the rapture is coming you better get ready bubba etc etc and yet here we are; all 7.2 billion souls, making a living, breeding, laughing, and some quite content even though they are poor as dirt. I personally wish all the Eugenicist would lead the way and do themselves in... Lead by example etc etc otherwise if they ever get the power to enact their evil plans many who sang their praises will be some of the first to go.

I actually like most of your post and your analogy of lassie and the wolf.....or some may say "you better get yourself together brother, pretty soon you're gonna be dead....."

The serenity prayer works for some day to day struggles, get that, but, can also be a cop out for many...."....accept the things i cannot change....." Many choose to say, I can't do anything to change things....so let me move on to more about me" Tha't not criticism, just an observation. Some are to afraid to really step up to the 'Courage' part. But fair enough.

This thread is not meant to focus or dwell on 'Doomsday Porn', no it is more of a reality check. In a society where more and more people DO have the oppty to be educated, use their curiosity to pursue, learn, double check the facts......0h yeah, that Courage thing to stand up and say, hey something is wrong...I don't agree with certain facts, and they have the facts to back them up.

Succinctly, We have the best oppty than ever before to look around, study and see something is wrong...things are not healthy, and for some of us, IMHO, are starting to speak up. Will it do anygood? I dunno, but I know for sure if I sit back and just 'Accept' without challenging things, then I know 100% nothing will get changed and only get worse. More of philosophical statement. But, I like your effort and presentation. Peace!!!!

reply to post by Dianec


Thanks Dianec, yes, I believe it is a very reliable source and is something that I use frequently for curiousity sake and other means. Glad you found it helpful. And, thank you for your participatiion and quality responses not only here, but in other threads as well. Peace!!

There is plenty of land and the entire ocean still for us to populate

God no, we've already destroyed so much of the land, most of what's left is desert. And why the hell would you want to fill the ocean with people after we've almost destroyed all the life in it already?

As you a sadistic lunatic? That's really the only thing I can believe about people who still want to overpopulate the planet after everything we've learned.