I am a patriot and I love the United States of America

Originally posted by crazyewok
reply to post by nwtrucker

 

Ok why does the OP feel that he is protecting our freedoms by being in Iraq and Afghanistan?

Why does he feel proud of those major F up's?

Because if he wasn't out there, we would all be speaking Iraqi now, living under the flag of the Taliban.

reply to post by woodwardjnr


Yeah I forgot how easy they can reach the west with there Aircraft carriers and troops ships

reply to post by crazyewok

Or perhaps it is because YOUR OPINION is that Iraq and Afghanistan are screw ups.. (Avoiding unnecessary expletives)

You have a right to your opinion.. I fought for it after all

Does NOT mean you are correct

Only that you have an opinion

Originally posted by semperfortis
I fought for it after all

Were you in world war 2? Cause unless you were you havent fought to save my freedom or opinions. You have served to protect them in that your on stand by incase you have to fight for my rights in which I thank you for. But you havent fought. Well you have fought but not for me but for some politician in a office somewere trying to please his buddies in the oil and defence industrys.

Unless of course you can show me WMD Iraq had? Or the Aircraft carriers and its escorts and the 4.5+ Generation aircraft the taliban had that could mount a invasion of the USA and Europe? If you can show me that great! Or show please how fighting in those place has protected me and not just cause more trouble! Please show me! Cause my politician havent! And it my tax money that funding these wars! But if not its not opinion its fact that Afganistan and Iraq are NOT for our benifit.

reply to post by crazyewok


Again

Opinion

Not correct

But an opinion after all

I applaud you for voicing your opinion, wrong or not

Originally posted by semperfortis
reply to post by crazyewok

 

Again

Opinion

Not correct

But an opinion after all

I applaud you for voicing your opinion, wrong or not

Ok a opinion but please can you tell me why its wrong?

As I said I saw no WMD's and no militray capability that could have landed troops in the west?

Our politician are not makeing any case what so ever.


Maybe if you vets actually told us WHY its to our benifit we might understand? Just saying we are is no diffrent than the morons in office that say the same thing without backing it up with any substatinal evidence. IF there is actually any benfit to be in the middle east that outweighs all the problems being there is causing then please share.

reply to post by crazyewok


Why are you so bent on Iraq an Afghan? guess what, its done already, its the past, what's happened has come to past, we certainly are not the first nation and will most certainly be the last nation to do so.
Why do you continue to bring up WW2 and other historical battles? We weren't alive and nobody posting here ever fought in those battles, it actually makes no sense. Yes Semper Fought, no it was not WW2, but he has fought.
Reading the OP's post I totally understand where he is coming from, hell I'm serving right now and trust me, reading everybody's America and Military bashing cracks me up because I'm living it and you peoples views on it are WAYYYYYY OFF!! I go to work and show my plt srgt this hogwash some of you guys post and laugh it off, seriously, you guys need to relax and chill.
I am an American Soldier. I love the United States of America. Everyday I tell my daughter what luck she has being born here.
So have at it, flame me, tell me I'm delusional, brainwashed, go fetch, because honestly, it don't bother me none and I know for a fact it don't bother Semper none either, being military I would say you guys rate on the lowest scale of Sh*t talk and smart asses, because that's all I do sometimes at work, it just slides off our backs, too easy.
Hey Semper, thanks again, brothers in arms need to stick together, I'm a 74D, so these guys complain and whine BLAH BLAH BLAH, yet the moment a persistent chemical agent splashed them, who they gonna run too? one of my jobs is Hazmat responder and I decon soldiers and civilians. I'd like to see them argue this bull while burning and dissolving in front of me, but you know what? I'm not spiteful and only ever would love to help people, I'll just smile as I move them along the decon lane.
I am a guardian of freedom and the American way of life.

reply to post by crazyewok


I can not tell you why your opinion is wrong anymore than you can tell me why you think mine is.

I was not a general.. Just a lonely little Scout Sniper NCO

We can not see the whole issue and likely never will.. I am not of the mindset that the "public" has any right to know everything the military does.. It is called the military secrets act for a reason and there are things that even I can not tell you now without risk of jail

But being in such a small unit I did know many of those in command and I trusted them then and I trust them now..

Again.. Does not make me wrong or right.. Just a different opinion from yours

Dedicated to service does not mean dumb, brainwashed or misinformed.. There are many ways to serve. I chose the one I was best at and have not swerved from that. Nor will I

Originally posted by Arnie123
reply to post by crazyewok

 

Why are you so bent on Iraq an Afghan? guess what, its done already, its the past, what's happened has come to past, we certainly are not the first nation and will most certainly be the last nation to do so.
Why do you continue to bring up WW2 and other historical battles? We weren't alive and nobody posting here ever fought in those battles, it actually makes no sense. Yes Semper Fought, no it was not WW2, but he has fought.

Because Im pointing out no has fought for my freedom since at least the Korean war.
Yes you have served for my freedom (again thanks) by beeing on standby for when something does go down. But the fighting you have been doing (Unless someone can show me evidence otherwise) has not been for me but for the poltician in office to feed there rich buddies and all its down is piss off more muslim and cause more hate as well as drive terroism deeper underground.

Yes fight hell be proud to fight, enjoy doing it cool great. Thats your job and career choice. But dont claim the recent wars have been for "my freedom" or have beem soemhow for me. They are what they are.

The easy answer is

"We fight there so we don't have to fight here"

reply to post by semperfortis


This is a difficult one.

No the public doesnt have to know everything about every little bit of tec or small scale special opp ect

BUT

When a BIG war thats costing our countrys billion and seem to be just fueling hatred towards us in the middle east is happening I want to know WHY my elected politican, the one that are voted in to serve the public are doing what they are doing. If they cant show me why the war is to my benifit then it is to me a imperlistic imoral action.


The fact you trust the ones dircetly above you great. But the fact you are trusting your politicans and the higher ups that are telling you to risk you life without providing you a good reason confuses me. If they had a good reason then why not tell us? Its our right as the public and one paying our taxes to know! To me that blindly serving. If you cant give me a reason why your opinion is why it is then how can I expect to beleive you that its not blind servitude and mindless obeidiance? I have given you pages of my reasons and evidence to back my opinions us. You just give a empty repsonse. Ok that might be good enough for you, great! But dont come on here and rant and moan about people like me that queation things if you are not going to supply some sort of grounding to your reasons.

Originally posted by semperfortis
The easy answer is

"We fight there so we don't have to fight here"

A sound bite! Thats all it is!

How will we fight here? Please tell how Iraq or Afganistan or hell syria which things are going toward will ever be able to land a army on our door step or even get a aircraft over our airspace!

Yes there are terrorists but invadeing a country cant stop them. You can invade a idea. Unless you 100% occuply the middle east you cant stop it.


Infact if we inavded the entire middle east then I might be more sympathetic as that might get somewere

Originally posted by semperfortis
The easy answer is

"We fight there so we don't have to fight here"

A sound bite! Thats all it is!

How will we fight here? Please tell how Iraq or Afganistan or hell syria which things are going toward will ever be able to land a army on our door step or even get a aircraft over our airspace!

Yes there are terrorists but invadeing a country cant stop them. You can invade a idea. Unless you 100% occuply the middle east you cant stop it.


Infact if we inavded the entire middle east then I might be more sympathetic as that might get somewere

Its why im not to fussed on drone strikes in Yemen as thats really the way to fight terrisom not by full out invasions.

Originally posted by crazyewok

Originally posted by Arnie123
reply to post by crazyewok

 

Why are you so bent on Iraq an Afghan? guess what, its done already, its the past, what's happened has come to past, we certainly are not the first nation and will most certainly be the last nation to do so.
Why do you continue to bring up WW2 and other historical battles? We weren't alive and nobody posting here ever fought in those battles, it actually makes no sense. Yes Semper Fought, no it was not WW2, but he has fought.

Because Im pointing out no has fought for my freedom since at least the Korean war.
Yes you have served for my freedom (again thanks) by beeing on standby for when something does go down. But the fighting you have been doing (Unless someone can show me evidence otherwise) has not been for me but for the poltician in office to feed there rich buddies and all its down is piss off more muslim and cause more hate as well as drive terroism deeper underground.

Yes fight hell be proud to fight, enjoy doing it cool great. Thats your job and career choice. But dont claim the recent wars have been for "my freedom" or have beem soemhow for me. They are what they are.

---
Okay.
You know what? I agree with you. I see where you are coming from.
But you have to also understand that yes, the hornets nest has been rattled in the ME, an even though whatever may have been the reasoning behind the initial response, we have to now continue to fight that actually now threatens some freedoms. Like redneck posted himself, blame the clerk for raising the prices?
Purpose, Direction and Motivation. Soldiers have to understand these concepts in the military at some point in time of there career. Aside from the worlds views and those who never served, have any of these guys been downrange? an RPG fly's past you and sh*t just got REAL. its an experience that you can't experience anywhere else and I think that's one fundamental that's being tried to convey here. One day when bullets fly past you and the seconds of life come to a stand still, YOU HAVE LIVED. I think this in itself is a major aspect as to why maybe we have a right to say what we can, actually! the native world in its tribal settings, your not a man unless you have fought, been in war and proclaimed a warrior and that's not opinion but a worldly fact.
Yes the times have changed but war is still a very real aspect in ones decisions. You really haven't lived unless you skirted that line of life and death, its surreal.
But yes I know where you are coming from and you know what? that's your opinion and its very much respected.

Trot The Trot

Originally posted by semperfortis

Have you earned the right to criticize me?

No, but I do reserve the right to blame you.*

Of course you know I very much respect you and what you have accomplished, so I hope that's never in question. I'm also a veteran and love our country very much, so no beef there -- and major props, brother.

It takes courage to stand up for what you believe in, do the work you do, walk tall and speak out, and that it comes naturally to you is something to be proud of. However, there's one test of courage I'm not sure you're ready for.

As expected, you're catching a lot of grief for saying what you've said, but if you're ever ready to move up to the big leagues, try publicly admitting you're a fan of My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic on a popular conspiracy-oriented discussion board.

Only then will you know true courage.






* Inside joke.

reply to post by woodwardjnr


Speaking Iraqi, under the flag of the Taliban??? Preferable to the Union Jack

reply to post by tgidkp


The Founding Fathers "Believed" that Freedom was endowed by The Creator.

That does not mean that all men inherently believe this.

In fact, Many do not believe this at all, and will fight for control at all costs.

The current Egyptian situation would be a case study worth exploring.

Historically, Freedoms have been awarded following a "Good Fight".

Even though the fighters may be imperfect as individuals, in their ways, methods, and direction.

Thanks for sharing your viewpoint, and enticing me to focus mine.

Respects to your Freedom of Speech ...S A V V Y ?

reply to post by crazyewok


Your just silly.
Thanks for the laugh Ewok, I needed it.

reply to post by semperfortis


I just want to let you know that I, as an American citizen, am deeply insulted by both your original post and the way that you've conducted yourself throughout this entire thread. The military does not teach you to sit here and beg people to worship you just because you served nor does it instill the idea that because you served that you are somehow better than the average citizen. In my opinion, you are a disgrace to the service and the uniform.

You know how I EARNED the right to criticize you? Because my tax dollars FUNDED the past 33 years of your life. In short? GET OVER YOURSELF!

I wonder if anyone else sees a correlation between this individual's myopic and excessive love of his country, and the grovelling professions of love North Koreans offer their leader.

I certainly do.
I put it down to successful brainwashing from childhood, and I think America is more efficient in this regard.
I say this because I believe Koreans tow the line through simple fear of retribution, whereas many Americans actually believe the propaganda.

Professing love for a huge country that you can only ever see a very small percentage of in one lifetime, is a good indication of the quality of the rest of your thinking.
Having proper reverence instead, for the principles upon which a country is supposedly based, is less likely to blind us to the mendacity of our politicians and the fiscal interests which control them, should they transgress.

And finally, if anyone is seeking to learn about honour and duty, you could do better than asking someone whose job it is to sneak up on people and shoot them.
That is simply the action of a coward.

mistersmith.