Okay, So we're in big trouble... what now?

reply to post by ProfessorChaos


The media, the politicians divide us.

I am just as guilty at being divisive as they were, though. (

reply to post by beezzer


We're all guilty of being divisive, just read through just about any thread on this site for proof of that.

Originally posted by ProfessorChaos
reply to post by beezzer

 

We're all guilty of being divisive, just read through just about any thread on this site for proof of that.

I know. Maybe that's what "they" want.

Kinda sad to see us (enlightened) folks being manipulated so easily.

Originally posted by ProfessorChaos
reply to post by benrl

 

While I agree with your assessment of I.Q. in a personal sense, someone with a low I.Q. would certainly have an issue understanding complex issues. (I.E. it isn't an 'all bad' means of measurement).

Either way, I don't think I.Q. would necessarily help in the running of government, I feel that experience with real world problems would far exceed I.Q. in application where determining which laws should be passed and how.

As far as government goes, lawyers are good for one thing, finding loopholes in the legalese, and exploiting them. I would imagine that a common man would put forth a law that is straightforward and easy to understand and would require little to no further 'interpretation'.

You know at one point I would of said the best leader would be a constitutional scholar... Thanks Obama for making me look like an idiot.

Serving in the Legislative, Executive, or any other public office should be done by lottery, thereby eliminating career politicians, their entourages/staff, premium lifetime healthcare, retirement, and most of all: the leaches, I mean lobbyists that buy their votes and own them outright. Our 'new' lottery winning representatives serve one term, 4 or 6 years; and then go home and resume their lives. Compensation for serving their country will be based on need, and personal sacrifice, etc. Details will be worked out and voted on. Removing the lobbyists money will also demand that corporations and their money also be reigned in, stripped of the so called 'person' title, and forced to be good neighbors that pay taxes once again...or be dismantled. That would be a great start. Very soon technology will enable a move from representative democracy towards a truer 'one man, one vote' direct participation form of democracy. We can keep this democratic experiment healthy or let it wither, it's our choice. Our vote. Our public assembly. Our very participation that matters. Tinkering with modern updates to the Constitution will always be necessary. The framers of the Constitution gave some thought to that very possibility; so should we. Revolution may be needed, but it needn't be violent. If we can get it right, it will be so much easier to do the rest of the stuff we need to do to save our planet, all the really important stuff.

I would like every person, who can in America, vote in local and national elections.

I would like voter IDs required..... and voter fraud to be done away with with harsh punishments for those who manipulate vote counts. In America you need to present a photo ID driver's license to cash a check or buy alcohol and several other things, but not to vote.

I really would like a block that says "None of the Above" on the ballots....

I would like equal justice for all and anyone or thing that thinks they are to big to jail be directed to a nice cell someplace..

To many people realize/think the system is rigged and in it's present form they have a point...However if we do not exercise the right to vote and insure the vote is honest then those who complain about the way the system has fallen really have no point and allow the better financed to win every time. Fix these points first and then we can work on getting the corrupt people out of government who prosper at the nations expense..

Just some stuff off the top of my head and probably could have been better thought through and explained, but I do not feel like writing a book this morning....By not having a real vote or not voting....and if there is a directed NWO by some puppet masters... then we play right into their hands and allow them to direct their pawns on the world stage. Even if there are no puppet masters there were 12 million (by some estimates) Ron Paul supports who sat out the last election...would it have made a difference in the outcome...it might, if there had been a none of the above block IMO.....

When we are successful, and we will be.. There will be International Peace throughout the world. We have to become one with all if we were to ever withstand a threat from outside of this world.

reply to post by ProfessorChaos


Great thread...No Problems, Just Solutions.

I will remind us all of one, Ban Lobbying of The United States Congress.

Once that has been addressed, we can help all the other "Dominoes" fall into place.

Your thread reminded me of this great song

www.youtube.com... Max out the Volume

S&F

Originally posted by ProfessorChaos
reply to post by Serdgiam

 

I would agree except for the "massive scale" point that you made. There is a force imposing its will on the United States at the moment that, if you look at it honestly, isn't really that large. So, if a relatively small portion of the country is able to take the reigns over a few decades and change the entire philosophy of this nation, why would it take a massive movement to counter it?

Because the entire nations philosophy is set on celebrity reality tv, and always will be.

Don't try to change this great nations philosophy, what's wrong with tv, beer and hot dogs?

reply to post by ProfessorChaos

As long as their lives are not dramatically interrupted, they will hardly take notice of the events around them.

When dramatically interrupted, they look even less. Usually their lives are reduced to survival by that time. They care even less about bigger pictures.

In my own experience, I heard little things over the course of my life that added up to changing the way I looked at the world overall. I didn't experience this change until much later after I had time to reflect and add things up.

Older people will tell you they needed a lifetime of experience to see the reality and how they had been fooled so many times.

So grow old...

Originally posted by 727Sky
I would like every person, who can in America, vote in local and national elections.

I would like voter IDs required..... and voter fraud to be done away with with harsh punishments for those who manipulate vote counts. In America you need to present a photo ID driver's license to cash a check or buy alcohol and several other things, but not to vote.

I really would like a block that says "None of the Above" on the ballots....

I would like equal justice for all and anyone or thing that thinks they are to big to jail be directed to a nice cell someplace..

To many people realize/think the system is rigged and in it's present form they have a point...However if we do not exercise the right to vote and insure the vote is honest then those who complain about the way the system has fallen really have no point and allow the better financed to win every time. Fix these points first and then we can work on getting the corrupt people out of government who prosper at the nations expense..

Just some stuff off the top of my head and probably could have been better thought through and explained, but I do not feel like writing a book this morning....By not having a real vote or not voting....and if there is a directed NWO by some puppet masters... then we play right into their hands and allow them to direct their pawns on the world stage. Even if there are no puppet masters there were 12 million (by some estimates) Ron Paul supports who sat out the last election...would it have made a difference in the outcome...it might, if there had been a none of the above block IMO.....

edit on 27-7-2013 by 727Sky because: ....

I would like every person, who can in America, vote in International elections.

I would like to have the "Verichip Act" enacted. It would make everything so much easier. Solving a lot of our problems, including voter fraud. If you got pulled over, you wouldn't even need to reach into your back pocket to get out a plastic ID, all you'd have to do is "Raise the Roof" you know, cool.

P.S. It would have made no difference if everyone voted for Ron Paul, because the elections are rigged.

Ohhh Im not touchin this one. I think I'll just sit back and poke at it with a stick.

Originally posted by ProfessorChaos
Throughout my time here on ATS, I have seen an extremely vast amount of "Our government is doings this to us now" threads, especially from American citizens.

These threads could pertain to politicians overstepping their authority, bypassing the constitution or brainwashing of the public-at-large; the content of each post isn't overly important with regard to this particular thread.

Instead of complaints, whining or alarm sounding, I would like to ask people to put forth their issue regarding the state of things here in the U.S. and then provide what they personally feel is the solution to that issue.

I'm curious as to how many people can actually come up with rational ideas to solve the perceived problems of this country.

So, what's your beef, and how would you like to see it fixed?

First I would like to say thank you for bringing up this topic and S&F for same. There are too many people in the U.S. (and the world for that matter) who constantly complain about the way things are, but offer no suggestions or solutions or how they can be fixed. As others have pointed out, it is very much a "me" time in our history. Others have mentioned that it is too late to solve anything, that time is long past to which I disagree. There is always time to fix, reform or eliminate problems that exist in our society. It does help however when bringing up a topic such as this to at least give the persons who may care to respond a starting point for discussion on specific issues. All together they might seem overwhelming, whereas on a point by point basis, someone may have a specific suggestion that would be effective. I would start by making a list of the top ten problems facing America today and go from there.
Here's what my list would look like:

1. Economic Stimulus Ideas/Recovery
2. Jobs Creation/Retention
3. Defense/Conflicts/Wars
4. Politics/Political Reform
5. Immigration Reform
6. Energy Reform
7. Education Reform
8. Crime Issues/Drugs
9. Tax Reform
10. Health Care Reform

I would then start looking for ideas and suggestions in all areas, looking at what programs have worked in the past and what is working successfully now in various parts of the country. Believe it or not there are solutions to all the problems above if we as Americans can decide to make it happen and then DO IT. For example here's a recent article that addresses at least 3 of the issues above and how that state is making it work for them:

North Dakota Grows Five Times Faster Than Nation

NEW YORK (CNNMoney)

Propelled by a massive energy boom, North Dakota once again captured the title of the nation's hottest economy, with a growth rate five times the national average. North Dakota's economy posted a 13.4% growth rate in 2012, according to a report released Thursday by the Bureau of Economic Analysis. That's nearly three times as fast as the number two state, Texas, and trounces the national average of 2.5%. The boom has attracted workers from all over the country and rippled out to incorporate not only the oil and gas drilling sectors but also other industries that supply them, including wholesale goods and transportation.

"There's nothing like an oil boom to get things rolling," North Dakota Governor Jack Dalrymple told CNNMoney.

Unlike some other states, North Dakota has a tax specifically targeting oil and gas production. That tax has allowed the state government to cover 80% of the cost of public schools, greatly reducing property taxes on the local level, Dalrymple said. It also allowed for a reduction in state income taxes, and covered the cost of building roads and other infrastructure to accommodate the influx of workers.

source: money.cnn.com...

Now obviously not all states have oil/gas capacity or reserves, but they do all have one thing in common which is people, a lot of people and many with good ideas if you just ask or the people feel that their input counts.

One idea in use in both the private and government sectors is to offer cash rewards for ideas that save money, create jobs, stimulate the economy increase efficiency, etc. but not limit those rewards strictly to those working in particular government agencies, military, or a particular company in the private sector. I personally am aware of a relative of mine whose idea for a particular part to improve the efficiency of the B-52 was not only approved but was eventually placed in each B-52 many years ago (don't ask which part as I don't know, and would not say if I did). I have seen similiar ideas presented by government workers financially rewarded for increasing the efficiency of their particular agency, and have definitely seen it occur many times in the private sector.

Anyways, food for thought........

Throughout my time here on ATS, I have seen an extremely vast amount of "Our government is doings this to us now" threads, especially from American citizens.

reply to post by ProfessorChaos

Remember that ATS is an extremely small percentage of the voting American public. The reason that things aren't changing is that the majority of the voting public keep voting the same crooks into office. In addition, it seems that the vast majority of THOSE voters either:
1.) Are getting free government "goodies", and they don't want it to stop, especially since the minority are paying for their free "stuff".
OR
2.) Are rich as heck, and are gaining their riches from the corrupt system that the elected officials are continuing to support.

Thus, unless the minority somehow become the majority or those that don't bother voting decide to vote, then the only other way that I know of, is to revolt, and it seems that not many are willing to do that. That revolt can take different forms. For instance, if people boycotted the MSM organizations that are perpetuating this corruption, then they would cease to exist. Will that happen? I doubt it. They could demonstrate, but oh, the ballgame is on. Maybe tomorrow. They could boycott products of companies that support the current system, but wait, we like their products. They could write their senators and representatives, but wait a minute....I've done that so many times, and I always get the same reply, a form letter telling me that they "will keep my views in mind when they vote on a bill"-wow, that's a useless statement. You get the point.
We have the troubles we have because we either have let them happen, or because we really don't give a damn.

reply to post by ProfEmeritus


You mean the vast majority of voters as in the roughly 58.7% that turned out to vote for the 2012 presidential elections (Obama was voted in based on the votes of only 26% of the voting age population). Or how about the 37.8% of the voting age population that turned out to vote for something as fundamental as our Congressmen in the 2010 midterm elections? Majority opinion voting in whom? The majority apparently only cares about the executive branch office when what they should be most active in is the legislative branch as Congress are the ones that actually craft/pass laws (well, when they are not being given pre-crafted bills from lobbies and other entities such as ALEC). Apparently, the majority of the voting age population doesn't give one squat for politics unless they can perceive a direct effect on them and have been thoroughly convinced by the media that the absolutely essential election is for the executive office, which is traditionally the non-law making body equipped with the power of veto (and occasional executive orders).

In a sense, what you say may be true--the structure of our political body may very well be dependent on the opinions of welfare recipients and the monetary elite but that would most likely be due to those two groups being most poignantly aware that what Congress and the executive branch does will have a meaningful effect on them. The actual majority doesn't really care until they think it affects them. It's a total dissociation of the individual's awareness of their being a part of society and that society actually affects them. It's really a psychological issue.

reply to post by spartacus699


I think that avoiding a panic in the streets is probably job #1 for some department. It is kind of like that old analogy about turning up the heat slowly when boiling a frog. So, do we have it worse than a 3 rd world country? No. However, this does not change the fact that our system and the country have been taken over by people that only have their own interests in mind.

Originally posted by Wildmanimal
reply to post by ProfessorChaos

 

Great thread...No Problems, Just Solutions.

I will remind us all of one, Ban Lobbying of The United States Congress.

Once that has been addressed, we can help all the other "Dominoes" fall into place.

Your thread reminded me of this great song

www.youtube.com... Max out the Volume

S&F

Not quoting you to pick on you. I agree we need to ban lobbying and we need term limits and in my opinion the salary and benefits should be greatly reduced.

My question is this, how do we accomplish that when those that would have to institute it are the ones that will lose out on the "goodies" they now have? How do you get a corrupt Congress to vote themselves out of the food trough?

Ban all advertising! This idea never hits home with anyone really. But wait and watch. In a few twenty years or so, people will realise that it only leads to confusion and the consumption of things we do not need. These two things are our biggest enemy in moving towards a more healthy and clean future for all... Ban it on all levels, when one needs to find something in his life he can go out and look for it, as opposed to having things he does not need jammed down his throat on an almost constant basis. It should free up our minds and memories for a little solid education as well.

reply to post by WhiteAlice

I guess you didn't read my entire post, where I said:

Thus, unless the minority somehow become the majority or those that don't bother voting decide to vote,

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
reply to post by WhiteAlice

 

I guess you didn't read my entire post, where I said:

Thus, unless the minority somehow become the majority or those that don't bother voting decide to vote,

Yep, you're right. I missed that part. Sorry!

I think that's the key part though right there though, isn't it? I really do think the problem is that people are more interested in politician's shenanigans (he said WHAT?! moments) than the actual legislation. Trying to get them to just look, let alone actually care, is a hell of a task especially up against what are essentially cookie cutter ideas that exist in voters within both political parties. Best way to expand a minority is to appeal to them in an open arms kind of way. I see a lot of people on these forums talk about "waking people up". That's a bad phrase to use because it has so many negative implications from implying that the speaker believes that the majority is brainwashed (and everybody loves their sense of free will) to a loss of individualization. In a way, if there is anything to be done, it is to find that way to appeal and address the majority that is sitting on the fence while skirting around all the verbal landmines that the parties have laid out that create an instant "us v. them" dependent on which side of the aisle an individual affiliates with.

Now to apologize for rambling, too, but your comment that I missed actually is the big problem "it". That's the group that I'm trying to fathom, too, and how to get them to care. Most of the time I see what doesn't work than what works though.