Corporations are a bigger threat to you than the gov...

(Mods, if in the wrong place, please place where it belongs)

Here's why corps, and their ceos, are worse than the gov.

The corps write the laws, and give themselves nifty loopholes, then get their lobbyists to convince a politician (bribed by way of campaign contributions) to get it passed. They rig the game, and you lose. "Bank lobbyists are not leaving it to lawmakers to draft legislation that softens financial regulations. Instead, the lobbyists are helping to write it themselves." dealbook.nytimes.com...

Ceos that do major layoffs get bigger bonuses. "A new report concludes that chief executives of the 50 firms that have laid off the most workers since the onset of the economic crisis in 2008 took home 42 percent more pay in 2009 than their peers at other large U.S. companies." www.nbcnews.com... So you get fired, and the ceo takes your pay, all in the name of saving money. Yet no money is saved, cause the ceo just took it.

You are now the figurative slave to the corp. For example, Walmart put out an ad saying "over 60% of Americans shop" there. Here's what they don't tell you. In some states Walmart is the largest employer. Walmart employees are also the largest collectors of Medicaid. "In Missouri, where Wal-Mart is the largest employer behind state government, the state’s social services department determined Walmart employees outnumbered all others with employees and family members enrolled in MO HealthNet, the state’s Medicaid plan, in the first quarter of 2011." www.politifact.com... So here's how it works. You have to work there, because they have the most jobs. They have cheap goods because they pay so little. You're forced to shop there because you cant afford to shop elsewhere. So really, they are just loaning you the money they will get back.

If ceo pay and minimum wage had remained parallel since Reagan, minimum wage would be $33 an hour. "Dube [Dr. Arindrajit Dube, a University of Massachusetts Amherst professor] went on to note that if minimum wage incomes had grown over that period at the same pace as it had for the top 1 percent of income earners, the minimum wage would actually be closer to $33 an hour than the current $7.25." www.huffingtonpost.com... If a company is willing to pay minimum wage to begin with, how much less would they pay you if they could?

Let us not forget the banking scandal, libor, and the new one "Granted Bail" (www.abovetopsecret.com...) just posted up. None of them go to jail, and we give them huge amounts of money.

Just a few examples, so how do we fix it.

1. We cancel "Citizens United" and reform finance laws. Corps aren't people.
2. Bring back Glass-Stegall and break up the banks and mega-corps like Walmart.
3. Raise taxes on the rich. Before Reagan, taxes were over 50% and there were tons of rich people, and people getting rich, a strong middle class, and the econ grew steadily (not boom and bust like now). Higher taxes forces those at the top to make a choice, reinvest the money or take it and pay out the nose. Most reinvest, giving the corp enough money to afford little things like raises, healthcare, and other benefits that they are cutting left and right in order to pay for the outrageous ceo pay and bonuses.

Just a few ideas. What say you?

I fully agree with most of what you have presented.
The problem right now is, the bankers and lobbyists control everything. Even the government agencies created to regulate the bankers and corporations get staffed with execs from the very organizations they are supposed to regulate and, where necessary, prosecute! Hence, the "too big to fail" BS and bailouts and bonuses for failure, while the rest of us get hit with the tab and austerity measures.

Some say that this is capitalism. It most definitely is NOT capitalism, but rather corporate fascism. In a capitalist system, failure means those banks or corporations die off and get replaced, they DO NOT get bailed out with taxpayer money!
What we need then is a replacement of the whole political system, with independent oversight by people with zero connections to the organizations they are overseeing, as well as the politicians, who WILL be held accountable for every penny spent and every decision made, with stiff financial and jail penalties for those caught acting in any way illegally. Anything less is just going to be business as usual.

reply to post by stormson


The big corporations ARE the government.
I'm fairly sure Mussolini said something about that...
"Fascism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power." - Benito Mussolini. And this gem "The truth is that men are tired of liberty."

reply to post by pirhanna


im not quite tired of liberty yet, but i am tired of corps and the gov joining forces.

Im gonna take that merger quote if you dont mind. it sums up most of my "big picture" fears.

stared!

reply to post by stormson



The guy who said corporations are the government nailed it. Right and left paradigms don't make sense anymore, as its the 'private sector' who gets the taxpayer money. The centrists took the worst of the left (high taxes) and the worst of the right (inequality favoring the rich) and combined them. They took the best of each (aid for the helpless, and liberty) and threw them out the window. But the right left BS keeps people too divided to act.

reply to post by stormson

I dont see how they can be a bigger threat since people like me have known for quite some time that governments in the west is basically run by big corp/banks.
The politicians are just their puppies that they funded.

your right, and being left of center, this is the one thing that pisses me off about the democrats, they are becoming a corportist arm of the government, to the detriment of the millions and millions of hard working wage earners.

The government act on behalf of corporations. They're practically inseparable. So it's an error to ask which is worse as it presupposes they're two distinct entities.

Corporations and industry influence to the point of controlling the media and the government. Politicians are pawns for private interests.

Originally posted by tridentblue
reply to post by stormson

 

The guy who said corporations are the government nailed it. Right and left paradigms don't make sense anymore, as its the 'private sector' who gets the taxpayer money. The centrists took the worst of the left (high taxes) and the worst of the right (inequality favoring the rich) and combined them. They took the best of each (aid for the helpless, and liberty) and threw them out the window. But the right left BS keeps people too divided to act.

this should be the "glue" that republicans and democrats need, to work together with each other. there is a out an out assault on this very way of thinking, they want us divided, and billions are being spent in the media world to keep us polarized.

How can one be a bigger threat than the other if they are one and the same?

You don't say much stormson but when you do Wow!
Good topic!

I absolutely agree.
Corps are way spookier than the Gov.
Which is why so many corps put out crazy "stories"
about the government by getting their shills to scare
people half to death on AM radio.

And Corps are just as capable of pulling off
False Flag attacks.

Corporations write the laws? ok

So who inforces the laws? government!

corporations pay off congress men and woman to pass laws in the corporations favor. These "loop holes" are easy to fix, all congress has to do is pass a bill to fix them but they wont, there in bed with corporations.

Government is actually the biggest threat. They pass laws like Obamacare and force you to buy insurance. The government is now forcing you to buy goods and services under the threat of penalty and imprisonment. Corporations can’t force you to buy anything.

corporations cant spy on you, government can.

reply to post by stormson

1. We cancel "Citizens United" and reform finance laws. Corps aren't people.

If people would actually bother to read about Citizen's united instead of push hyperbole 'Corporations were never given the all the rights of people.

But hey it makes for some good double dramatic dogma.

So how about some real facts?

Like:

Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission, 558 U.S. 310 (2010), is a US constitutional law case, in which the United States Supreme Court held that the First Amendment prohibits the government from restricting political independent expenditures by corporations, associations, or labor unions.

en.wikipedia.org...

Labor Unions anyone?

2. Bring back Glass-Stegall and break up the banks and mega-corps like Walmart.

Why? Considering they all use fiat currency

3. Raise taxes on the rich. Before Reagan, taxes were over 50% and there were tons of rich people, and people getting rich,

And no primarily because it is a violation of constitutional rights(4th and 5th) and their civil rights. Guess some people think it's ok for a minority to pay for a majority based on nothing but 'they can afford is BS'.

But no one not even government has the right to make that determination.

How about looking up those bonuses at Fanny and Freddy, and IRS and yet Government is 'suppose to make it ok';

Corporations are a bigger threat to you than the government NO simple fact that everything government does to 'help' people makes them worse off.

Originally posted by camaro68ss
Corporations write the laws? ok

So who inforces the laws? government!

corporations pay off congress men and woman to pass laws in the corporations favor. These "loop holes" are easy to fix, all congress has to do is pass a bill to fix them but they wont, there in bed with corporations.

Government is actually the biggest threat. They pass laws like Obamacare and force you to buy insurance. The government is now forcing you to buy goods and services under the threat of penalty and imprisonment. Corporations can’t force you to buy anything.

corporations cant spy on you, government can.

obamacare is the best of a bad situation. we couldnt go all the way to a single payer, so this is the result.

google et. al. track every site you click on and reads (through algorithums and key word searches) your email. private corps know more about you than the gov does.

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by stormson

 

1. We cancel "Citizens United" and reform finance laws. Corps aren't people.

If people would actually bother to read about Citizen's united instead of push hyperbole 'Corporations were never given the all the rights of people.

But hey it makes for some good double dramatic dogma.

So how about some real facts?

Like:

Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission, 558 U.S. 310 (2010), is a US constitutional law case, in which the United States Supreme Court held that the First Amendment prohibits the government from restricting political independent expenditures by corporations, associations, or labor unions.

en.wikipedia.org...

Labor Unions anyone?

2. Bring back Glass-Stegall and break up the banks and mega-corps like Walmart.

Why? Considering they all use fiat currency

3. Raise taxes on the rich. Before Reagan, taxes were over 50% and there were tons of rich people, and people getting rich,

And no primarily because it is a violation of constitutional rights(4th and 5th) and their civil rights. Guess some people think it's ok for a minority to pay for a majority based on nothing but 'they can afford is BS'.

But no one not even government has the right to make that determination.

How about looking up those bonuses at Fanny and Freddy, and IRS and yet Government is 'suppose to make it ok';

Corporations are a bigger threat to you than the government NO simple fact that everything government does to 'help' people makes them worse off.

edit on 20-6-2013 by neo96 because: (no reason given)

labor unions act on behalf of the people in the unions. corps act on behalf of the bottom line and the ceos pocket. labor unions are people coming together for a purpose. a corp is a machine. labor unions have limited funds. corps have multi-million dollar accounts. unions work for us, corps work for themselves.

didnt get 2

congress can tax people. even thomas jefferson was for progressive taxation. when the people making the most rig the game to keep the poor poor and growing, then yes, they have to pay more.

right now, 6 people in the walmart family control more wealth than 93,000,000 americans combined. did they earn it? no! they stole it by reducing pay and benefits for the poor! they got rich and the poor got left behind. 50% of americans control only 2% of national wealth. the top 1% control over 30% and the top 10% control over 70%. that leaves the "middle class" fighting for only 26% of national wealth. thinkprogress.org...

before Reagans great tax cut, the debt decreased. after, it increased 186% just under him alone. ceos made 30x average pay, now its over 300x.

history shows that higher taxes on the rich is a good thing. it prevents massive wealth disparagement and "floats all ships".

we need to go back to the post-depression days and bust the corporate leeches that are crippling the people and killing this country.

reply to post by stormson

labor unions act on behalf of the people in the unions. corps act on behalf of the bottom line and the ceos pocket. labor unions are people coming together for a purpose. a corp is a machine. labor unions have limited funds. corps have multi-million dollar accounts. unions work for us, corps work for themselves.

That was hilarious thanks for the laugh.

congress can tax people. even thomas jefferson was for progressive taxation. when the people making the most rig the game to keep the poor poor and growing, then yes, they have to pay more.

Congress was given the power of taxation to fund ITSELF not the whims of the I want it all, I want it now, and sure the hell don't give an eff how crowd.

right now, 6 people in the walmart family control more wealth than 93,000,000 americans combined. did they earn it?

So? of the current 2.2 trillion dollars of federal spending on social engineering not a single person earns it.

Not 1.

before Reagans great tax cut, the debt decreased. after, it increased 186% just under him alone. ceos made 30x average pay, now its over 300x.

Don't care what a ceo makes

history shows that higher taxes on the rich is a good thing. it prevents massive wealth disparagement and "floats all ships"

Yeah alright then please feel free fighting over fiat currency that is backed by nothing, and has no value other than what people place on it.

we need to go back to the post-depression days and bust the corporate leeches that are crippling the people and killing this country.

Which corporate leeches would that be?

The ones saying tax the rich so the poor can go out and buy more corporate products?

The leeches say make someone else pay for their healthcare

reply to post by neo96


people pay for all those social programs thru taxes.

want the 47% that pay no fed taxes to pay? give them a raise!
want the 47% to get off welfare? give them a raise!

btw, corporations take far more money from the gov than the poor people do in the form of tax breaks and bailouts.

when the corps cut your pay, how much do they ask for? 25%, 15%, 10%?

if the top 400 ceo took just a 0.8%, less than 1%, pay cut, they could employ 200,000 people at $50k a year.

just saying.

Originally posted by sealing
You don't say much stormson but when you do Wow!
Good topic!

thank you.

Originally posted by stormson
reply to post by neo96

 

people pay for all those social programs thru taxes.

want the 47% that pay no fed taxes to pay? give them a raise!
want the 47% to get off welfare? give them a raise!

btw, corporations take far more money from the gov than the poor people do in the form of tax breaks and bailouts.

Read what you wrote there?

47% have zero tax liabiilty that means that are getting tax breaks, and credits, and BAILOUTS.

Want people to get off welfare?

Stop vilifying corporations that employ people.