Police respond to 'serious incident' in Woolwich

reply to post by _Phoenix_


Don't get me wrong, but a book is a book, it's the people in the pulpit who interpret the written word and preach to the devout, that's where you see the ideology coming out. Goes for all religions.

Originally posted by theabsolutetruth
reply to post by FOXMULDER147

 

Reportedly the local police were waiting for the armed guys to deal with it. Policies?

20 minutes? Come on...

In 20 minutes, you could commit an armed robbery in London and be over the Atlantic in a private plane on the way to Cuba.

It's not good enough. Armed response should never be more than 5 minutes away.

reply to post by _Phoenix_


Could you explain to me how the following verses are "out-of-context" - I clearly need help, I'm a willing scholar though:-

Quran (3:56)
Quran (3:151)
Quran (2:191-193)
Quran (4:74)

Anyone else, would advise you to look these verses up, and find numerous explanations for them.

Originally posted by IvanAstikov

Originally posted by ipsedixit
I wonder if Piers Morgan will modify his views on gun control now? If that soldier had been packing his sidearm, this would be a much different story.

Arm the Brits!!!

Again, I'll ask you pro-gun mob, how would carrying a firearm have helped this soldier if he was randomly attacked by someone in a vehicle? Keep your silly beliefs on your side of the ocean, thank you.

He probably would only have had to wave the gun at his attackers. There are other steps he could have taken, like shooting at them too. Use your imagination.

And by the way, we're in cyberspace. Ideas without borders. If you don't want to talk about this in an international forum, go down to your local, prop up the bar and jaw with your friends.

reply to post by MidnightTide


lol I have actually read the Quran cover to cover. Multiple times. I've also read the Torah and the New Testament. Multiple Times. There are equally horrifying and barbaric verses in all three books. All three books are purported to be the word of god. Yet people manage to live peaceful productive lives and belong to all three of these religions.

So yes...logical fallacy.

reply to post by _Phoenix_

reply to post by Malynn



www.thereligionofpeace.com...

Go ahead and read, then take a look at the translations from noted Islamic scholars. The site provides the links. But for arguments sake, lets say those interpretations are false.....you still have the problem THAT MILLIONS BELIEVE THOSE INTERPRETATIONS. I am not saying all Muslims are non-believer killing machines, they are not. But there is a sizable proportion that do.

reply to post by _Phoenix_


With all due respect it's pretty much irrelevant what quotes you or anyone else post.
It doesn't matter one little iota how moderate Muslims interpret The Quran but it's how the extremists interpret it that matters.
And those extremist interpretations tend towards the intolerant and can hardly be called 'peace loving'.

And each and every sect / denomination etc firmly believes their interpretation is the one true version.

I guess that's something all organised religions have in common.

reply to post by MidnightTide


Which has been my exact point in this entire thread. PEOPLE are screwed up. People are ignorant barbarians. People do horrible terrible things. These things are not the fault of Islam.

Originally posted by Freeborn
reply to post by _Phoenix_

 

With all due respect it's pretty much irrelevant what quotes you or anyone else post.
It doesn't matter one little iota how moderate Muslims interpret The Quran but it's how the extremists interpret it that matters.
And those extremist interpretations tend towards the intolerant and can hardly be called 'peace loving'.

And each and every sect / denomination etc firmly believes their interpretation is the one true version.

I guess that's something all organised religions have in common.

Right on the money,

In terms of Christian "extremism" - The worst i've seen is The Westboro Baptist Church, and all they do is hold signs up, and rally people's funerals. I say "all they do", it's still despicable, but not a drop in the ocean compared to suicide bombings or large scale terror attacks.

Originally posted by AmberLeaf
Heres the video of the killer!!!

edit on 22-5-2013 by AmberLeaf because: (no reason given)

O.o well, stating the obvious according to the attackers comment "remove your governments, they don't care about you" also note what he says about lands. "I apologize that women had to witness this today, but in our land, our women have to see the same"

Hmm, who is the victim, a soldier? Government worker?
As for the attacker, anyone recongize anything unique in his voice? His dialect? Is his voice typical and consistant for the area? Note his weapons, typical kitchen items.

Clear picture of the other attacker.




That picture was Tweeted by the proud daughter of the fair haired woman standing there, presumably questioning him on his motives.

reply to post by seabhac-rua


Religions are the method of control favoured throughout history, some are worse than others, some have good ethics, some do not, all have been / are used as a method of controlling populations and restricting freedom, as well as a veil for tribalism. Obviously there are varying levels of belief as well as varying levels of control. It could be said the more fervent the followers the more it succeeded in it's aims. Extermination of those that aren't in the same gang as a policy was obviously a stealth maneuver, it has billions of believers, let's hope the whole world wakes up to the man created sham that is religion.

If there is a god or absolute power, ultimate force etc then now would be the time to speak up and open the eyes of those blinkered to reality. Now is the time for humanity to awaken to the truth.

Originally posted by Malynn
reply to post by MidnightTide

 

Which has been my exact point in this entire thread. PEOPLE are screwed up. People are ignorant barbarians. People do horrible terrible things. These things are not the fault of Islam.

We shouldn't hate Hitler, The Nazis or their ideology then? it's the people acting upon it? It's individual people's faults? Nonsense, The only one spewing fallacies is yourself.

reply to post by Malynn


and these horrible people are waging war (in my opinion) on the basis of extremist view of Islam. Now do I feel bad for the moderates, sure. But what they need to do is to "fix the issue" in their community. I don't want to hear how bad Christianity is, or any other religion.

The problem is in the extremist part of Islam. You can't sugar coat it, the problem is extremist Islam and the current tolerance of it is to blame.

I have been watching the news on this attack, and wow its shocking to say the least
i've got a link here if anyone wants to see. I don't understand why these ppl would do such a thing.

news.ninemsn.com.au..." target="_blank" class="postlink">news.ninemsn.com.au... soldier-beheaded-london-street-attack

reply to post by Malynn


A Godwin moment here, but, saying that an ideology, interpreted, preached and enacted by extremists is not the fault of the ideology is like saying National Socialism was not to blame for the rise of the Third Reich. I'm not saying that Islam is to blame for this atrocity but I am saying that to ignore the ideology that these people adhere to is irresponsible.

reply to post by FOXMULDER147


It isn't good enough, rapid response should have been there in 5, easily done, perhaps they didn't see it as priority, given the crime stats of London, who knows, hopefully answers will surface soon.

The whole video skip to 00:19 :

www.itv.com...

Originally posted by NeverForget
reply to post by _Phoenix_

 

Could you explain to me how the following verses are "out-of-context" - I clearly need help, I'm a willing scholar though:-

Quran (3:56)
Quran (3:151)
Quran (2:191-193)
Quran (4:74)

Anyone else, would advise you to look these verses up, and find numerous explanations for them.

edit on 22/5/2013 by NeverForget because: (no reason given)

3:56: Talks about hellfire, that's god's judgment, that's not a human's Job.
3:151: Similar to 3:51
2:191-193: Is missing a vital part and that is the part right before it 2:190
[2:190] You may fight in the cause of GOD against those who attack you, but do not aggress. GOD does not love the aggressors.
4:74Is about a time in war when you are fighting in self defence. If you die you go to heaven.


Any muslim reading anything about war and battles in the Quran should take this into consideration:
[60:8] GOD does not enjoin you from befriending those who do not fight you because of religion, and do not evict you from your homes. You may befriend them and be equitable towards them. GOD loves the equitable.

[60:9] GOD enjoins you only from befriending those who fight you because of religion, evict you from your homes, and band together with others to banish you. You shall not befriend them. Those who befriend them are the transgressors.

A disturbing video.

A disgusting outcome.

My prayers to the family of the man who suffered under the attack of two sick people.