Okay, so the SHTF, and the Raiders come, so now what?

Here are some basic things to know if you want to survive.

1. Do not intend to stay put. You will need to have several locations that are NOT in obvious plain site.

2. Your supplies for each site should be anywhere from 50 to 100 feet from your actual location.

3. You should have three types of weapons. A gun. A bow. A sling-shot.

4. Each perimeter should have string alarms so that anyone crossing it hits the string and warns you of their approach.

5. Fires should be lit below ground with rock walls to prevent line of sight visual spotting by raiders.

6. You should always have knowledge of what to eat in the woods, so get educated.

It is important to make up your mind if you are willing to kill to live. DO NOT make up your mind when they arrive to take your stuff, rape your women, and kill you. To kill in self defense is NOT murder so get it straight the first time so you can survive by doing what you need to do without hesitation.

In the offense, if you will attacking a site, always remember everything above. Split your team up on at least two fronts, 10 and 2 o'clock so as to not shoot each other in the cross fire. Once defeated, take their stuff and leave right away, others may come. If you won't be killing your captives, tie them up, or take their shoes, or both. I don't suggest killing anyone if they are not trying to kill you first.

reply to post by Gazrok

I would throw out a 6 pack of beer and a boom box. Either they will start to party and forget to attack you, or they will be so confused by the maneuver, that you can overtake them, without too much of a fight

reply to post by Gazrok


All I can say is what happens when they see they have the numbers to take people hostage if you come out to deal. Then what do you do...do what they tell you to to protect those hostage or resign to the fact your a slave to their will and probably lose your women as the hostages. I would take steps to sabotage the gear and garden maybe a last stand trap that takes you all out. Like a way to burn down your house starting at the exits or exterior walls so when you invite them in you know if all else fails you can prevent someone else ending up like you. Those are things that come to mind when I look at that situation. Me personally I've decided a boat is the best option. A sailboat is enough for 2 and can serve as home base with a large moat.

Originally posted by Gazrok
For most preppers, the answer is simply "we'll gun them down to the last man"....

However, I have to feel that eventually, this will not be a practical solution. For one thing, they may have more firepower and manpower.

So, what do you do?

One idea is to broker a deal. If you produce something they need, you could offer tribute or trade for things they may procure on their raids. For example, if you make food, they'd do better dealing for a long term supply vs. a one-hit gathering. Another example is growing/treating tobacco and making your own booze. The raiders aren't going to want to do the toil to keep in supply of these things, but you could use them to purchase not only immunity from the raids, but also trade for things that will need to be scavenged, like medicines, and other less home-grown items.

This way, the raiders take all the risk in getting such items.

If you have a medically trained person, and some good medical supplies, providing this service could also be something more valuable than just raiding you.

Sure, you're dealing with the devil...but if the alternative is having your loved ones raped and killed...well...

Anyhow, just a thought, and something that should at least be considered in your prep plans. Rambo doesn't exist, and there may be a time when such a force (in a SHTF scenario) could pose such a threat to all your well-laid plans.

You're out of your mind. In a perfect world maybe this would work. Anyone who comes looking to take your stuff is going to make you their slave if you offer up something like this. Its better to stay camoflaged, hidden, or fight it out because sometimes death could be sweeter than what could be waiting for you and yours if captured. And btw, not sure how much you know about strategy, or tactics, but the most well-laid plans never survive contact. And in a shtf scenario there will be contact, that much you can count on.

Originally posted by olaru12

Okay, so the SHTF, and the Raiders come, so now what?,

Perhaps being a Raider is strategically a better option than hunkering down waiting for the inevitable.

In a true shtf event; throw all logic, humanity, compassion and reason away because only basic primitive, animalistic defense mechanisms will be in play. Back to the stone age....with guns!

No rules, No limits, No excuses and No mercy!!!!

If this is what you want; that's what you will get.

edit on 9-5-2013 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)

Star for you, another post forged with logic, and realism.
2

Just make it look as if everyone has some super bad skin eating disease and noone will want your food. You may be the victim of a mercy killing though, don't overplay the part:

Originally posted by Doc Gator
Rambo may not exist, but that doesn't mean you should give up on a good defensive plan. With some forethought and planning it is not difficult to design a position that is impervious to any weapon system that raiders are likely to be toting around. The key is to make the cost of conquest too high.

And to this guy who thinks he can have an impervious position . All I gotta say is "Yeah, sure,....... whatever "

reply to post by blkcwbyhat




I can see maybe a few thousand people migrating to the selected areas, but you have to realize the MASS casualties that will be occurring when panic hits the fan. A solid 60%(far from being generous) of the population will still be relying on store-bought goods. These people are as good as dead.

Another 20% will bet he described militants, which will immediately run into problems with the military. This is where all hell breaks loose and those whom look towards pilgrimage are more than likely going to end up as casualties as well.

The property I am going to be residing on will be next to one of these mountainous regions I've outlined, and given traffic is unacceptable I will simply be able to pack out from the property.

Also, I don't intend on waiting around for the traffic to get bad. I'm already close enough to snapping, and if # doesn't start getting better I'm not going to wait for it to get to bad to bug out. I am preemptively arranging an attack plan, if SHTF in the next 3 months yeah I'd probably have a lot rougher time, but 90 days from today I will be 95% prepared, because no matter what, you can never be 100% prepared for a situation like what has been mentioned.

reply to post by Gazrok


Respectfully, Gazrok, in a hypothetical situation where I'm faced with overwhelming firepower, I'd sneak away, if the circumstances allowed it. Become a master of the disappearing act. With no proper medical services, any sort of wound could become fatal. I'd live alone too, less likelihood of detection, because by then, I would have had enough of people. It is all conjecture, of course, who knows what it would really be like ?
I don't want to contemplate the savagery that is likely to ensue...

Well, depends on what you are willing to do to survive.

If you are 'nuts' you should display dismembered 'raiders' around your perimeter that came previously. Heads on a pike will usually make people think twice about what they will be getting into. Pikes through their entire naked bodies will usually make them forget why they wanted to raid your group. (If you pike an older guy, shave their facial hair and trim their hair to give the impression of a younger guy, old people on a pike would have the opposite effect)

If you are business minded and wanted to use trade as a violence deterrent...do what most post apocalypse TV shows do and open a barter town. Hire some muscle. Make it a no weapon zone...except for your muscle. Collect a percentage to pay overhead. Sell people for profit...but only allow your group to sell people. You can omit the people selling of course. Should allow your muscle to get out of hand every now and then...keep it fun for them or they'll revolt.

If you are a timid person and didn't want much violence, when they ask about your wife, just tell them that she is your sister. Hopefully they'll try and get on your good side so you'll put in a good word on their behalf. If the raiders turn out to be a good group, just get on their good side. As for your 'sister' just let the interested fella know that she was already promised to guy X. Hopefully they throttle back their advances and still remain kind to you in case guy X doesn't come through. (If your wife is obviously a different race, the sister thing may not work...but you get the idea).

I'd probably never do any of the above. Just tossing out thoughts on the subject. The team concept and valuable skill sets would probably be way better and more benefiting towards rebuilding a stable society.

Force multiplier advice.

If the raiders are attacking in a column formation, set your guys out along the column. Have each guy assigned a set of numbers. Example, if there are 9 guys coming and you have 3 to defend...defender number one takes out attacker 1-3, two takes out 4-6, three 7-9. If the attackers don't attack in a column, make them. Pits filled with spikes aside established walking paths will encourage the attackers to follow the path. Hidden troops should have little issues. If you don't have enough guns but plenty of folk, stick them with the defenders...they'll get what they need from the dead attackers. If the attackers are very high in numbers...booby trap their dead. Use their explosives if possible.

If they attack in separate groups, odds are when you take out a group, another will investigate what happened. The remaining group(s) will press onto the objective. The curious group should be maimed and not dispatched. Allow their yelps to further entice the nearest attacking group. Force multiply their curious bodies and end the maimed. You should be able to flank the remaining attacking group. Those who surrender...pike them. The remaining attackers who have no idea what is going on should flee and try to regroup. When/if they come back, they'll see the piked and lose the will to carry on.

Never counter-attack a retreating force. Odds are, they are making you fight on their terms. Always make them fight on your terms.

Be on alert during dawn and dusk. Also during times of heavy fog.

If it is the dry season, try to burn your area so others can't force you from your hold using wild fire.

If a group upstream dams and blocks your water supply...send a group upstream to them to poison the water. Odds are, they are using your water without thinking...and mainly to get at you. Ensure you have the means and/or cure to counter the poison...or you are able to wait out the poison.

If your group is small, trap animals instead of hunting them. Hunting usually drives game away from you.

If your group is big, farm and get domesticated animals. Hunting only to break up boredom.

-CN

reply to post by Gazrok


Last week I joined the Bearkillers, so I have no fear of raiders nor niners.

But really, there is strength in numbers.

Without reading anything but the OP:

I'd feed them. Food is what I do. Gardening, cooking, processing. Just because there are monkshood flowers in their salads and monkshood root paste in their gravy...

Perhaps I wouldn't be so quick about it. Maybe I'd give them some lovely rye bread loaves to take back to where they're staying or along with them. Darn it, wouldn't you know, that rye had fungus that causes ergotism. Good luck with that dry gangrene, lads.

There are so many options....

This kind of goes back to the whole "sabotaging the supplies" route. But yeah, welcoming, then literally killing them with kindness (and poison) is certainly a valid strategy.

I may be "nuts" in thinking I could deal with such raiders, it's true...but sneaking away and returning, hidden caches, etc. are certainly some excellent additional strategies that have been suggested. While bugging out completely is an option, that would really be my LAST resort, as life on the road would suck pretty bad.

the SHTF so now what?

I`ll get s*hitfaced.

and the Raiders come

One mans raider is another mans liberator.

reply to post by seinfeld


Or you could just say,"hey,the guy over the hill has 10 times what I have,and man,you ought to see all those women!".

reply to post by blkcwbyhat


Yeah, but if you are wrong....then when he comes back, he's pretty ticked....

To be honest, I think we'd be hidden for a while, and since there is only one road leading here from any well populated area...blocking it off, if it looks like an accident...should keep out people for a while. If nothing else, scouts, and the efforts of clearing such blockage should at least give us a good heads up.

We're also working on relations with the neighbors, which are also country folk, so some similar mindsets.

The only disaster I ever HOPE for is some kind of minor one that actually has us pull together and help each other, just to establish that bond, prior to anything bigger possibly happening. Something like a hurricane doing some minor damage I can help clear with a tractor, etc.

1)-Size the Raiders up
2)If Raiders are in a larger force and/or more heavily armed than you, join the Raiders
3)Challenge Raider leader to bare fisted combat for leadership
4)????
5) Profit.
EDIT/Add- All raider leaders have to give up leadership if bested in bare fisted combat. I have seen all the Movies and it is so. Reading many of these comments I see many of you also watch alot of Movies and we know that all the information gleaned from these films is true and real.

reply to post by Halekoch


I recall something about a few drops of visine in a drink,makes you sick as a dog..Rather than waste ammo,take the desire out of the enemy! You have pointed me in a new direction of self defense! Leave a water bottle on the trail,bad guys find it.......

reply to post by blkcwbyhat


Nice application of the technique!

Leave it out for the raiders to find before they even get to you...nice... Of course, this is pretty indiscriminate. You never know who you'll get with this tactic.

To another...

As for movies, well, this is all hypothetical. But, no matter what the SHTF scenario....groups of raiders are going to be a given. Would you disagree?

reply to post by Gazrok


True,it is indiscrimanate,but my plan is to avoid any contact if possible.Setting up a roadblock is a sign to the bad guys that your hiding something,unless it truly looks like an accident.Cutting down trees or power poles is a welcome mat to them! I've seen some ideas for ied's,booby traps,whatever...could get bad guys,could get good guys just passing thru.Just making them sick is semi humane.At least you have time to assess the threat level.