Bring on the Gay Boy Scouts

reply to post by bokonon2010


Gay Boy Scouts??? What are they going to do braid hair, paint each others toe nails, have pillow fights and watch Real Housewives of whatever city???

"Mommy/Daddy, I won my pillow fighting badge today"

reply to post by tothetenthpower


Let's just say everything is about money

Does that also mean there's no injustice that exists separately from greed and a lust for power?

We shouldn't ever try to work for something or towards something - because it's all corrupt from the get go?

In a world where money rules I guarantee you there are still things worth fighting for

we don't just roll over and quit because - it's all about money

the unsolvable problem of money

I can see now why you don't understand what made me sad

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


I never stated that people should not pursue the right to marriage equality, not at all. What I'm saying is that the issue is on going because of the money involved.

That's all.

If you address that issue, and make people realize that's what it's about, then those people loose the power to influence this on going issue and the issue eventually gets resolved.

~Tenth

reply to post by FeatherofMaat


Yes the LDS has a large presence in BSA but dont kid yourself. My council alone which is in the heart of Georgia (hardly a LDS stronghold) has about 10,000 registered scouts. Contrast this with CAP which has about 40,000 cadets nation wide.
The organization is just as strong as it ever has been. 100 years and going.

I was surprised it took this thread 5 pages until some jackwagon rolled out the BS about Lord Baden Powell being a closet gay. He was not gay, he was British. Sometimes upper class Brit males are mistaken for gay but it was not the case. Which gets to the next point about the gay agenda. Revisionist history in which gay activists insist on historical figures being outed as closet gays. Conveniently done long after they are dead and cant defend their preference. What childish behavior.

As for the BSA "allowing" gays. No child is ever asked his sexual orientation by a leader. The boys themselves often joke with one another as boys do about something or someone being "gay" meaning "lame" in this context but thats it. If a leader is gay and openly gay and someone complains then something would be done other wise its not an issue. My son was a cub scout for 5 years and we had a Lesbian couple whos son was in his den. No one said anything and no one was kicked out. Why was that? Because THEY didnt make it an issue. They did not hang all over each other and throw it in peoples face to get attention. They acted like a normal couple would act because thats what they were. Contrast this with the behavior of a straight couple who drank on a family camp out and misbehaved. They were asked to leave and not come back to meetings.

The problem occurs when a homosexual seeks to be a leader. BSA is very sensitive to legal issues surrounding abuse of children. Leaders like myself are required to attend Youth Protection training every year and go to great lenghts to make sure that we are not alone with a boy that is not our son. Even to the point of not going into a public bathroom with scouts while on outings. Gay pedophiles seek children and where they gather. BSA is doing what it must do to minimize the threat of child abuse and legal actions by parents whos child was abused. None of these actions will actually stop a gay pedophile form becoming a leader and abusing a boy but it reduces the chance and legally sheilds BSA. Its all about the risk of a lawsuit and much less about the morality.

Originally posted by Believer101
But why should Gay's have to start their own club? Why can't they just be included with everyone else? Why is there a need to SEGREGATE Gays simply because they're gay? Why can't the Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts be inclusive and teach love (like they say they do) and accept everyone, whether straight or gay? Why is it such a problem to be inclusive of everyone?

Just what I said, the same reason we have "Boy Scout" and "Girl Scout" clubs. So sexuality is not present in an environment where it is dangerous.

I never had the impression the Boy Scouts cared much about teaching love and acceptance, it was more about survival and knowledge. General "men stuff" that this society and some old cultures think all boys should know. Sexuality is an instinctual behavior and shouldn't be included in everything. Love does not = Sexuality.

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


Also just to add, marriage is not a Christian institution, it's a civil one. If your church doesn't believe in same sex marriage then they can refuse to perform them. Marriage is basically a civil contract between two consenting adults....I'll have to stop there because it's starting to sway off topic

reply to post by tothetenthpower

If you address that issue, and make people realize that's what it's about, then those people loose the power to influence this on going issue and the issue eventually gets resolved.

:-)

we may just have to agree to disagree

this is about something so basically important to all humans...it's about human rights

and equality

there are parasites in this world that will attach themselves to anything and everything - of course

the fact remains - there is a large percentage of people in this world that feel some people shouldn't be permitted the same rights as they already have

I'm listening - how is this about money?

I absolutely am willing to agree that everything in life is about money - and sex :-)

once you get past this however - you're left with the details

this is a detail that needs to get worked out - and it's getting worked out just like this

people are talking about it now - arguing about it...

this started - between you and I - with you suggesting we not step on the religious folks toes

:-)

Originally posted by RSF77

Originally posted by Believer101
But why should Gay's have to start their own club? Why can't they just be included with everyone else? Why is there a need to SEGREGATE Gays simply because they're gay? Why can't the Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts be inclusive and teach love (like they say they do) and accept everyone, whether straight or gay? Why is it such a problem to be inclusive of everyone?

Just what I said, the same reason we have "Boy Scout" and "Girl Scout" clubs. So sexuality is not present in an environment where it is dangerous.

I never had the impression the Boy Scouts cared much about teaching love and acceptance, it was more about survival and knowledge. General "men stuff" that this society and some old cultures think all boys should know. Sexuality is an instinctual behavior and shouldn't be included in everything. Love does not = Sexuality.

You didn't answer most of my questions. So, I'll ask them again. But why should Gay's have to start their own club? Why can't they just be included with everyone else? Why is there a need to SEGREGATE Gays simply because they're gay? Why is it such a problem to be inclusive of everyone?

And how exactly would being inclusive of everyone, no matter what, be dangerous?? Isn't throwing young boys into the woods with a stranger dangerous? Isn't giving young boys knives and teaching them how to use them dangerous? If you think being inclusive of everyone is dangerous for kids, might as well keep your children in a plastic bubble for their entire lives.

Love may not equal sexuality, but being inclusive and accepting everyone for who they are, not discriminating against them is equal to love. Showing acceptance and including everyone, no matter what, = love.

Originally posted by acuna
reply to post by Spiramirabilis

 

Also just to add, marriage is not a Christian institution, it's a civil one. If your church doesn't believe in same sex marriage then they can refuse to perform them. Marriage is basically a civil contract between two consenting adults....I'll have to stop there because it's starting to sway off topic

Of course it's a Christian institution - but it's not just a Christian institution

The Church can do whatever it wants - in church. But the Church doesn't get to decide for everybody in the country what everybody can or can't do

The Boyscouts can also handle it however they want to - it's their organization

The organization's legal right to have these policies has been upheld repeatedly by both state and federal courts. In Boy Scouts of America v. Dale, the Supreme Court of the United States has affirmed that as a private organization, the BSA can set its own membership standards. The BSA's policies have been legally challenged but have not been found to constitute illegal discrimination; as a private organization in the United States the BSA has the right to freedom of association,[3] as determined in Boy Scouts of America v. Dale.[4] In recent years, the policy disputes have led to litigation over the terms under which the BSA can access governmental resources including public lands.

en.wikipedia.org...

I know people are having a hard time understanding why gay people shouldn't just be happy with being allowed civil unions

Here's a clue - it's because they're being 'allowed' something. They're no different from anyone else - and yet they aren't permitted to marry

But, they're allowed to have civil unions...

And they should just shut up and be happy with this - apparently

I get what you're saying - but it's not fair or right if it's not all the same

and the whole thing is on topic :-)

I know it's not about gay marriage - it's about the Boy Scouts

It always comes back to whether or not we're ready to accept that people are what they are - and if they're gay it shouldn't matter - people are just people

As I've said elsewhere - the Boy Scouts can handle this however they want - I hope someday all kids will be included - and all kinds of troop leaders as well

Originally posted by wiser3
reply to post by Danbones

 

Damn! I lose on most counts: White/Male/Gay AND I smoke!

Note to self "Must put on weight"

Then quit the smoking. The weight will practically blow your front door off its hinges and move into your house.

The western people have too much time to spare on these silly things..lol..
A time will come when everyone will be forced to perform gay sex just to confirm their tolerance i suppose.
just kidding.
Btw, i haven't understood one thing in my life---- why it's okay to discriminate between people based upon money???
Why a system which forces lifelong hunger on millions of children is tolerated??
Are they different from children who are born in rich families???

Don't you guys remember that episode of south park?

BSA is a private organization, so they can do what they want, its noone's right to tell them what to do. Let the scouts do what they want, it doesn't matter if you're for or opposed, fact is its a private organization, end of story.

Originally posted by Britguy


I have been called a homophobe before for expressing this viewpoint, although I must point out that I am not afraid of anyone who is "Gay" - sorry, I meant "LGBT", I am just so old fashioned.

An old fashioned is a cocktail baby, you're just straight up bigoted and hateful and that's ok.

Originally posted by SLAYER69

I have no issues with the Scouts allowing gays. How about a compromise? Say the Boys or Girls scouts should offer "Gay troops" If one chooses to be open about their orientation at that stage of their life then why not?

edit on 11-6-2012 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)

Personally I find it amusing that the topic is even discussed or considered by parents since the age limit to be part of a boy scout is less than 18 (below the legal age of becoming an adult) and above 10. Anything below 10 is the Cub Scout. Being open about their sexuality below 18 can also be psychological if not physiological (genetic defects and/or hormonal problem). How to address that 'can of worms' if someone psychologically identifies as being a gay? Surely there are medical and/or psychological treatments for those who do not wish to remain gay. But where do we draw the line? It seems every single fabric of the society is being questioned at this stage by the LGBT groups and activists. More like a LGBT revolution just the way there were several in the past.

Originally posted by doom27
BSA is a private organization, so they can do what they want, its noone's right to tell them what to do. Let the scouts do what they want, it doesn't matter if you're for or opposed, fact is its a private organization, end of story.

Absolutely agree with you.

LGBT should open their own private organization and resolve the issue instead of attempting to bend the rules and stirring controversies of long standing successful organizations.

Yes, the GLBT hordes are under your bed and in your closet...watching...waiting...to get you in your sleepies! We'll take your womens and mens and convert the kiddies! Our agenda is clear, world domination and beyond of straighty...

Seriously though, the subject of this thread isn't new news...I have to wonder what this thread is really all about. These types of threads (and there are alot of them) come in all innocent like but then you begin to see what they really are...

So let's say you get a gay scout leader, so what, do you honestly believe a gay scout leader is going to sit there and teach the kiddies how to be gay? Or that a gay scout leader is going to have a gay orgy in front of the kiddies? Do you realize how stupid these fears are in the first place?

Originally posted by navy_vet_stg3
If the Boy Scouts don't want to allow gays, it's their choice. They are a PRIVATE organization. Period. Last time I checked, I don't have to allow anyone into my own home without my permission. Just because it's a large organization doesn't make it any different than 4 of 5 guys getting together for a poker party on a Saturday night. It's EXCLUSIVE! They set the rules, as it's THEIR organiztion.

Now, that being said, I think America's "fear" of homosexuals is out of line. They're just people, who happen to be wired differently. They're NOT serial killers, and "gay" is NOT contagious. Personally, I'd like to see the Scouts bring in gay members. I think it would be great for the both straight and gay youth to learn to accept each other. I really don't see any harm in it whatsoever. However, this is something the Scouts will have to open up to over time, I suppose.

Gays, smokers and fat people. The 3 groups that can openly be discriminated against.

My thoughts exactly. Granted I can understand why they want them to allow gays, but at the same time I can understand that the Boy Scouts is a private organization, and as such means they're allowed to let in/keep out whomever they want.

Originally posted by jhn7537
reply to post by bokonon2010

 

Gay Boy Scouts??? What are they going to do braid hair, paint each others toe nails, have pillow fights and watch Real Housewives of whatever city???

"Mommy/Daddy, I won my pillow fighting badge today"

edit on 12-6-2012 by jhn7537 because: (no reason given)

So I'm guessing you've never met a gay person based on your idiotic post.

reply to post by ollncasino


You seem to have missed the correlation there on "Equal but separate".
You also don't seem to understand the point of the pride parades. They are meant to be outrageous because it desensitizes. Now in many places same sex couples can hold hands without being attacked and more over-many people don't even blink twice.

reply to post by technical difficulties


They may be privately run, but receive public benefits such as 1 dollar leases and governmental grants.
The moment you accept public funds you are held to public standards.

Cautious here on my post.

If same gender couples want to marry ,so be it.
But find a church that approves it, some faiths/churchs will NOT, do not sue them if they dont.(PERIOD)

To me our society is getting a tad more filthy.
Some college back was having a porn lesbian star called jizz lee to give gender speech there,beyond sick on the films she has made!
She thinks she's a god ,and her whole life is dedicated to shoving it down our throats!

A VAST majority dont want to marry anyways!
(The 5% want to marry for insurance reasons and to adpot?)

We'd see a few thousand weddings BANG,,but it would dismal quite quick after.

And one cant just marry and lets adopt kids!

The pride parades are discusting also!
300 lb butch motor cycle parades,,come on!!!!

They already have rights!