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Freemasons linked to u.k murder?

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posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 10:35 AM
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On the 1st july 2000 a girl called Sarah Payne from east-Sussex in the u.k was abducted and killed - her killer was supposedly caught and brought to justice but one vital piece of evidence may have been overlooked - a painting she had done at school may indicate that she had been manipulated by Freemasons..... check out the link which shows her painting ellistaylor.homestead.com...

Not too sure if i believe in "mediums" but i do feel that this evidence has been overlooked which may back-up some of my remarks in an earlier thread on how "masons" practically run the police force and courts of law in the u.k

Any comments? "the Brotherhood" a book by Stephen Knight on Harper Collins is quite a good read and goes into some detail on how the police force in the u.k has been infiltrated by "freemasonary" and how their is tension between masons and non-masons in the force



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 10:37 AM
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I'm getting "Page Not Found" when I click on your link to the image.



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 10:49 AM
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here is the link that seems to workfreespeech.org...



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 10:50 AM
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Originally posted by bluemeanie
On the 1st july 2000 a girl called Sarah Payne from east-Sussex in the u.k was abducted and killed - her killer was supposedly caught and brought to justice but one vital piece of evidence may have been overlooked - a painting she had done at school may indicate that she had been manipulated by Freemasons..... check out the link which shows her painting ellistaylor.homestead.com...


*yawn*
She was killed by a pyscho,
also, anyone who holds a public job must share any links or memberships to secret socities...its nothing new



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 10:55 AM
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Hi bluemeanie

How do feel an 8 year old girls painting could be influenced by ANY group as a means to an end?

I can't get your link up either, but here is some info.
www.sarahpayne.com...
www.sarahpayne.com...

Sanc'.

[edit on 3-10-2004 by sanctum]



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 10:58 AM
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I supose you worked in the forensics dept on the case! why would such a young girl be able to depict with such detail in her painting a blatent freemason setting???? i sincerely hope the guy behind bars is soley responsible for her murder but i do feel this should be looked into - maybe when you have finished yawning on your lunch break then maybe you might reconsider?!



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 11:03 AM
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Originally posted by bluemeanie


Any comments? "the Brotherhood" a book by Stephen Knight on Harper Collins is quite a good read and goes into some detail on how the police force in the u.k has been infiltrated by "freemasonary" and how their is tension between masons and non-masons in the force



The Brotherhood is a crock. Anyone with half a brain can see how full of holes this book is. Stephen Knight did almost no research, offered no proof and filled the pages with mere sensationalism. The book is the equivalent of tabloid newspaper reporting. Vaccuous, inanane, poorly researched pulp.Far more interesting is the sequel "Inside the Brotherhood" (which incidentally he did not write). I don't agree with it's conclusions but at least the author bothered to research his subject.

As for the website claiming masonic involvement in Sarah Paynes death? It's just written by a pervert with as sick a mind as Roy Whiting himself.


BlueMeanie. Blatant? What's blatant about a chequered floor. Kitchen lino is hugely popular in that pattern. Not even that, but before any argument, can you even prove that the picture was painted by Sarah herself?

[edit on 3-10-2004 by Leveller]



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 11:13 AM
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As well as the lilo in your kitchen i suppose you have large ornate pillars and stand chopping cheese with your trouser leg roled up - anyway im not here to argue, just present any ideas i have - a big flaw with all this is too many people discredit any info members put forward and seem to consider themselves experts on all and more - what highly intelligent entities they must be - thanks for the info on the book though as i find that rather insightful.....no bad feeling though



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 11:37 AM
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The article was posted at a website entitled, "Rebellion X" the homepage of which makes the grandiose claim that it is, "The site 'they' have tried to close down on many occasions... and failed."

Bluemeanie, please do tell us who "they" are and why they have tried to shut down what is a very ordinary, even boring, conspiracy website full of rehashed muck that has been written about over and over with no suppression. I allege that bluemeanie is using a sensationalistic pretext of a murder to promote Rebellion X, which leads me ask the following:

1) Bluemeanie: Do you own or have an affiliation with Rebellion X? If so, tell us of your ownership or association. It seemed rather dodgy to post a "broken link" and then immediately and rather "conveniently" post a working link tp Rebellion X. Tell us if your post wasn't just a way to scam the rules against posting links to personal websites? Tell us how you are related to the turgid Rebellion X site, which btw, tells readers to "Enter and seek the truth or # off and stop mithering." This is obviously a site owned and operated by an adolescent mind, and perhaps one in an adult body.

2) The Rebellion X comments on to the picture Sarah drew says that there are 13 black and white squares and yet, in fact, there are over 60 black sqaures and over 60 white squares and all of the white squares have red circles or squares inlaid into them. The Rebelion X allegation is not even close to being factual in this regard. Rebellion X can't even count squares! For all we know, Sarah drew a checkerboard because she played checkers.

3) The picture of the person in the drawing I took to be Sarah in a dress and not a man in an apron. A Masonic apron does not go from neck to mid-thigh as does the dress in the picture. Again, the allegation is sloppy in its details.

4) Sarah's killer was not a Freemason. He was a paedophile named Roy Whiting.

I think Bluemeanie is just running a cheap scam on ATS readers to get some traffic for the boring Rebellion X webste. The mods should consider trashing this thread, especially if Bluemeanie doesn't come clean about his or her connection to the Rebellion X website and possible violation of ATS rules!



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 11:45 AM
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Originally posted by bluemeanie
As well as the lilo in your kitchen i suppose you have large ornate pillars and stand chopping cheese with your trouser leg roled up - anyway im not here to argue, just present any ideas i have - a big flaw with all this is too many people discredit any info members put forward and seem to consider themselves experts on all and more


Well actually you have made your own interpretation of the picture. I do not see rolled up trouser legs. I don't see anything that looks like a masonic apron. I don't see masonic pillars. What I do see is a picture that looks like it's been made by a kid and possibly depicts either herself or one of her parents in the kitchen.
What I don't have a problem with is people presenting arguments that are well thought out and have some verifiable basis. What I do have a problem with is somebody who makes disgusting, perverted inferences against other people based merely on a dubious sourced picture found on a hate web-site. So I'm afraid that the "big flaw" is on your side.

On a personal note, I have a family. I am English. I remember the tragedy of Sarah Payne's murder. I remember watching and hoping on the news that this little girl would be found alive. I remember her parent's heart wrenching appeals. I remember the feeling of bitter despair and sadness that I felt when she was found dead. I remember Roy Whiting's arrest. I remember his trial. I remember it all and prayed with a lot of other people. Wondered how our society could produce such a sick pervert that would do such a thing to a little girl. I remember how I felt for her parents and wondered how I would feel and how I would cope if that was my little girl.
I remember all that. And I am a Freemason.
And yet some hate-monger like you walks in here without one shred of evidence and accuses us of involvement in this disgusting, filthy crime without one shred of evidence.

There's a lot that Freemasonry has been accused of. But you have reached a new low. You want sympathy for your argument? You'll get none from me Go take your filth elsewhere.



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 11:48 AM
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bluemeanie,

Children are haunted by many images and such.



Sanc'.



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 11:50 AM
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Originally posted by bluemeanie
On the 1st july 2000 a girl called Sarah Payne from east-Sussex in the u.k was abducted and killed - her killer was supposedly caught and brought to justice but one vital piece of evidence may have been overlooked - a painting she had done at school may indicate that she had been manipulated by Freemasons..... check out the link which shows her painting ellistaylor.homestead.com...

Not too sure if i believe in "mediums" but i do feel that this evidence has been overlooked which may back-up some of my remarks in an earlier thread on how "masons" practically run the police force and courts of law in the u.k

Any comments? "the Brotherhood" a book by Stephen Knight on Harper Collins is quite a good read and goes into some detail on how the police force in the u.k has been infiltrated by "freemasonary" and how their is tension between masons and non-masons in the force


Her killer "supposedly" caught and convicted? What evidence do you have to the contrary?

Timeline summary for Sarah Payne's murder.

I find the painting to be insignificant… maybe they had a black and white tile floor at home? The figure that some attribute to a “naked man in an apron”, looks more like Sarah in a dress (Masonic aprons do not extend above the waist) to me. I am at loss as to why you are compelled to link Freemasonry to this tragic murder… Agenda driven conspiracy theories are just that… Agenda driven conspiracy theories.

Stephen Knight’s “The Brotherhood”. For the record I’ll include this link again.

Stephen Knight's "The Brotherhood".

p.s. Bluemeanie, if you plan to cite this “book” in every thread you participate in, please let be know so I can incorporate this link in my post template. Thanks.



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 11:53 AM
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i am not trying to promote any website and all i asked in my thread was if anyone had any ideas or knowledge about the mentioned case....i must realize how easy it is to upset people who spend all their time on the internet and accuse people who do not of working behind the scenes....never wanted to fall out with anybody....remember Love?



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 12:05 PM
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Originally posted by bluemeanie
i am not trying to promote any website and all i asked in my thread was if anyone had any ideas or knowledge about the mentioned case....i must realize how easy it is to upset people who spend all their time on the internet and accuse people who do not of working behind the scenes....never wanted to fall out with anybody....remember Love?



Spending time on the internet has nothing to do with the topic. You could spend days or minutes on the internet. It doesn't matter. If somebody is accusing you of pedophilia and murder what difference does it make? If I met you in the street and unjustly called you a pedophile would it be any more right than if I knew you for years?

I told you that I remember the case. It was massive news here for weeks. There is absolutely no justification for trying to link Freemasonry to this crime.
If you want to "remember Love", don't cast unwarranted accusations that any reasonable person would find abhorrent. There are mysteries and conspiracies in this world, but jump at shadows which have their basis in nothing else but ignorant hatred and you will be branded a hate-monger yourself.



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 12:21 PM
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Originally posted by bluemeanie
i must realize how easy it is to upset people who spend all their time on the internet and accuse people who do not of working behind the scenes


So do you work behind the scenes?

If so, it's your call to provide some cred' regarding your links.
You have to consider the families and friends of all victims when discussing a very sensitive topic.

Sanc'.



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 02:29 PM
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ROFL.

That whole site is dedicated to "exposing the evil machinations of the New World Order and its Minions." Exposing evil, etc., etc.

Wahtever. LOL. Do you even bother to THINK when you find crap on the internet, the world's biggest free-for-all??

Questions you should ask the next time you use the potentially WORST source of information.

Who is the website by?
Who designed it?
Who paid for it?
How is it written?
Does it provide references? Are these references themselves credible? If in doubt, then subject them to these same questions.
Is it biased? If so, in what sense?
What links does it provide (that is, with whom else does the site associate itself?)

Show of hands (lol) . . . . . how many people ACTUALLY took any University courses in science or history?




[edit on 3-10-2004 by LTD602]



posted on Oct, 3 2004 @ 11:10 PM
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Sarah's painting

Sarah's law One million signatures.

masonic link

more masonic links

BBC link

All propaganda?

Seems to me those bones got some meat on them.



posted on Oct, 4 2004 @ 01:21 AM
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Public Gadfly, the links you provide are no more than a non sequitur. It does not logically follow that because you provide links to Sarah and then to Masons that there is any relationship whatsoever. What you have done is to erect a strawman to knock down.

One could easily use your bogus logic to falsely attack Catholics, Islam, Christianity, or any other group. Here is all one would have to do:

Sarah's painting

Sarah's law One million signatures.

Buddhist link

more Buddhist lnks

BBC link

All propaganda?

Seems to me those bones got some meat on them.





It is galling and inexcusable for Public Gadfly and bluemeanie to cheapen the brutal murder and rape of Sarah to promote thier own hatred of masonry, especially by tossing out a few links in place of hard facts. To post a few links in order to condemn the masons is the height of intellectual laziness and bespeaks a personal immorality and hatred so profound that one cannot accord even the slightest bit of legitimacy to their ravings.

bluemeanie and Gadfly's links prove nothing except their fallacious logic. Links do constitute proof. There was a terrible rape and murder of a child and now anti-masonic forces are seeking to link masonry to the crime because these people hate masons. How dare they cheapen Sarah's death in this way to promote their monumental bigotry!



posted on Oct, 4 2004 @ 01:57 AM
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dximage shame on you-
i just re-checked MY links (that you purposefully changed on your supposed quote) and-
EVERY 1 (that means ALL)

Go to links about the poor child's murder linked with masonry.

You are just trying to pass your disinfo off to some search engine.

Scream all you want- what is on the web is on the web.

Next you're going to claim the BBC is biased against masons?

get a g-r-i-p (mason humor)



posted on Oct, 4 2004 @ 05:11 AM
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Gadfly.
In your quest to discredit Freemasonry is there no depth of depravity and shame that you won't plumet to?
Here, in this forum, you have never yet supplied one bit of evidence to back up a single one of your claims. Not one piece of fact amongst your wild innuendo that proves that you right.
It's innuendo after innuendo. Sensationalist headline after sensationalist headline. Vaccuous statement after vaccuous statement. And it never changes. It's always the same boring, repetitive bull#.


Your comments are totally worthless to those here on ATS who "Deny Ignorance".

By the way. DXImage didn't change your links. In the context of this topic they are also worthless. Using the death of an innocent child in your quest of ignorance and hatred only makes you look like more of an ignorant fool.

I hope that everyone here on ATS reads your comments within this post. I hope that everyone sees you for the fraud and the sham that you really are.



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