Exclusive! First hand Witness: Trayvon Martin attacked Zimmerman Zimmerman Innocent Smoking Gun

reply to post by SmArTbEaTz


I agree totally with your theory....just wanted to add....that most likely after zimmerman grabbed Treyvon, Treyvon started to scream for help....not Zimmerman, Zimmerman had not reason to scream.

the screams are important, they are on the 911 and it helps piece the scene together....probably pretty close to what you described.

Originally posted by yeti101
reply to post by pizzanazi75

 

If I was on the phone with 911 dispatch following someone and they ask me 'are you following him' and i say 'yes' and they say 'we don't need you to do that'....what else would I possibly think they meant?

it could be interpreted as the dispatcher saying they dont need me to do it but if I want to be extra helpful to police i can continue if i want.

OMG... You have GOT to be kidding me...

Extra help? From an untrained civilian?

That has to be the lamest thing I have heard so far... you're reaching a bit too far...

reply to post by SmArTbEaTz


i think that's exactly how zimmerman interpreted those words. I bet they look at that aspect and tell dispatchers to be more forcefull & clear in what they want the person to do.

reply to post by yeti101


It would only be interpreted that way to someone with some sort of personality disorder or some other psychological issues.

Your explanation is not another way of how to interpret those words, they are actually just something you made up to fit an extreme point you are trying to make. There is only one way to interpret 'we don't need you to do that'....dont do that.....any other interpretation is simple lack of understanding of the english language or mental disorders.

Originally posted by pizzanazi75
reply to post by SmArTbEaTz

 

I agree totally with your theory....just wanted to add....that most likely after zimmerman grabbed Treyvon, Treyvon started to scream for help....not Zimmerman, Zimmerman had not reason to scream.

the screams are important, they are on the 911 and it helps piece the scene together....probably pretty close to what you described.

edit on 30-3-2012 by pizzanazi75 because: (no reason given)

Thanks... I have been following this since day one because it's in my backyard... I have not watched the news as I do not frequent tv much, but I have read several articles online and seen many different scenarios. What I posted it what I feel happened.

I will be the first to admit I could be wrong, but then again no public civilian has all the details. So everything is an assumption at this point. I personally have taken all the bits and pieces and put it together on my own using logic and common sense. My family was pretty much all officers and I was going to be a P.I. so I know a little. The way this guy was following the teen should of been inconspicuous so not to startle the suspect. Even PI's are never to approach anyone, and are held liable if they do so.

reply to post by pizzanazi75


well we know zimmermans was very keen on phoning the police about suspicious persons in his neighbourhood. I think he took it upon himself to do more than he needed. Probably thinking he's helping and doing good when really it was stupid.

reply to post by pizzanazi75


Even my 6yr old knows that when I tell her "I do not need you to that", it means don't...

There is no other way it can mean anything different... this guy keeps ranting and not realizing the facts outweigh the if's...

If they meant something different, then they would of said something different. Besides when does a negative equal a positive in proper English? BTW DO NOT is a negative...

Originally posted by SmArTbEaTz
Knowing IMO they used bad judgement, wouldn't you expect someone that comes from a law enforcing home and morals know better? The kid (TM) was a average teen by the looks, and I'm sure not too many teens are that mature...

It boils down to this people,
can you prove zimmerman knew how to bait someone into
hitting him so he could kill them legally?
That is what the victims side wants you to believe.

If you can not prove that with REAL evidence
you can not prove murder.

Last other night they release a leaked* video
on abc. appearing to be in treyvons favor.
the next night they prance around treyvons
parents the next zimmermans, tom. it will be the uncle
sisters, baby mamma who knew treyvon that saw somone
who knew zimmerman.
Do not buy into this media circus.
they know everything there is
on the story and decide to *release
it drip by drip and get the people so angry
they want to go kill someone, and right when
they are about to do it, so they can not be blamed
for instigating it THE MEDIA is finally forced to put up
the truth or shut up. We are at that point.

Originally posted by SmArTbEaTz
reply to post by spacedog1973

 

On the ground facing down? So how was it that TM was the aggressor if he was face down when Zimmer got up?

So does that mean TM was shot in the back? Last I heard the medical examiner said that he saw ZERO marks on TM's hands (meaning he was not fighting anyone), and the only injury was the shot wound...

I dont even know the point of this post. I am not suggesting TM was the aggressor.

Originally posted by yeti101
reply to post by pizzanazi75

 

well we know zimmermans was very keen on phoning the police about suspicious persons in his neighbourhood. I think he took it upon himself to do more than he needed. Probably thinking he's helping and doing good when really it was stupid.

By George I think he has it!

I'm really not trying to put you down and offend you but you have to use logic when trying to come to a conclusion, and not be biased when stating them.

Originally posted by SmArTbEaTz

Originally posted by pizzanazi75
reply to post by SmArTbEaTz

 

I agree totally with your theory....just wanted to add....that most likely after zimmerman grabbed Treyvon, Treyvon started to scream for help....not Zimmerman, Zimmerman had not reason to scream.

the screams are important, they are on the 911 and it helps piece the scene together....probably pretty close to what you described.

edit on 30-3-2012 by pizzanazi75 because: (no reason given)

Thanks... I have been following this since day one because it's in my backyard... I have not watched the news as I do not frequent tv much, but I have read several articles online and seen many different scenarios. What I posted it what I feel happened.

I will be the first to admit I could be wrong, but then again no public civilian has all the details. So everything is an assumption at this point. I personally have taken all the bits and pieces and put it together on my own using logic and common sense. My family was pretty much all officers and I was going to be a P.I. so I know a little. The way this guy was following the teen should of been inconspicuous so not to startle the suspect. Even PI's are never to approach anyone, and are held liable if they do so.

I dont watch much TV either. But I have been watching all the youtube videos of the talk shows covering this online though....you should too. There is alot being talked about in the interviews with lawyers and other officials and witness that is not being written about. Such as the witness reports, its been written and reported, especially on here that eye witness saw Zimmerman being beaten by Treyvon, and identified him, but those people say that they never told police that. The 13 year old boys mom was on tv last night or night before and she said that the lead investigator told he flat out he wanted to charge zimmerman that night but was shot down and told to hold off. Her interview is very interesting and telling about what was happening behind the scenes. Her son was basic lead to give certain answers that aren't actually what he saw, they filled in the blanks for him.

Not to mention when you add in Zimmermans past run ins with the law they have involved violence. And his obsession with law enforcement ... like you said.... he was getting the collar that night.....'these a'holes always get away'.....that statement says alot to me. That shows his intent to not let Treyvon get away at all cost if he could help it. That is what supports that he started the confrontation and not Treyvon.

reply to post by SmArTbEaTz


Ive been sitting here thinking, just how much more clear could they have been? I can't come up with anything else they could have said that could be any more clear. STOP!!!!! ........... for the love of god .... STOP 'we dont need you to do that' ....

reply to post by SmArTbEaTz


"need" is not the same as "want"

reply to post by yeti101


And for doing 'more than he needed to' ... you know that pesky killing and all ... you dont think he deserves any punishment? He was studying criminal justice, he had conceal permit, that alone shows that he should have acted in the total opposite of how he acted instead of doing 'more than he needed to'....

reply to post by pizzanazi75


Because evidence suggest Zimmerman is telling the truth.
Past run ins really don't matter, but if you want to bring them in there was also a story about the school catching him with 20 some pieces of women's jewelry and a screwdriver in class. So it could be argued that he may have been casing the houses.

If you wanna play the if game.
Really what matters isn't their pasts as much as the witness, police, and paramedic statements and physical evidence (Martin shot in front from extremely close range, etc).

reply to post by pizzanazi75


this is the contentious part for me because while his actions in following TM were stupid he didn't do anything illegal.

how did they end up close enough to fight? who approached who , what was said? and who struck first? these are key questions

Originally posted by yeti101
reply to post by SmArTbEaTz

 

"need" is not the same as "want"

It doesn't really matter if the dispatcher told him that they ORDER him not to do that as they have no authority. So this is essentially a red herring.

The issue here is that GZ decided to purse TM despite experienced advice and as a consequence, is fully responsible for his actions. It calls into question his judgement. There was no immediate need for him to pursue as the dispatcher made it clear it was unnecessary. Police were already on route. Thats as much as can be obtained from this.

reply to post by popsmayhem

It boils down to this people, can you prove zimmerman knew how to bait someone into hitting him so he could kill them legally?

That doesn't even make any sense.
Zimmerman was over-zealous and tried to do the job of the police. He either went too far or it backfired on him. When you cut out all the BS, it comes down to the decision he made to get out of his truck. He made his own bed from the start and he'll have to live with it the rest of his life.

That doesn't make him a murderer because as far as legal action against him is concerned, they're going to look at what happened in those missing minutes. His claim is self-defense. I'd bet you a million dollars that's what Martin's defense would be, so it comes down to who made first physical contact.

reply to post by pizzanazi75


Dude.. well you need to think some more, because they never said stop. They said "we don't need you to do that" and shortly thereafter he complied. He was still on the phone with them when he gave up looking for Martin. Remember? During the call he says he lost sight of him and sounds as though he is getting back to his car and is discussing where to meet police. If he lost sight of Martin than rather than Martin taking that chance to run home, why did he end up back with Zimmerman confronting him? You are thinking about it without an open mind. Sometimes I wonder if people have listened to the whole call because that is what changed my mind about the case.

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by MrWendal

 

How can you ignore witness testimony and corroboration by police and paramedics? Moments after it happened? Those things are more important than the manipulated stories several weeks later.

It doesn't matter if you set a chain of events in motion. Then you could blame it on Zimmerman's wife who asked him to go to the store, or Martin for ever being suspended from school. Honestly in the chain of events walking through the yards of a neighborhood at night could easily be considered suspicious enough to observe especially when you have had multiple robberies, burglaries, thefts, and a past shooting. Zimmerman had actually caught a thief in the past. Following someone, no matter how creepy, isn't crime and I don't think Zimmerman followed Martin much.

when you call 911 as many times as zimmerman did i would hope at least one of the times it was actually called for. even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while!