Incompetent People Too Ignorant to Know It

news.yahoo.com...

A growing body of psychology research shows that incompetence deprives people of the ability to recognize their own incompetence. To put it bluntly, dumb people are too dumb to know it. Similarly, unfunny people don't have a good enough sense of humor to tell.

This disconnect may be responsible for many of society's problems.

(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
www.lifeslittlemysteries.com

Many of us don't need any kind of special assurances that the title of this particular thread is all too true.

But it seems also, that we must really take a look at what is being reported to us here. In the final analysis, it may be that once the incompetence ball is rolling; we cannot stop it.

We pick leaders who swear their 'severe' competence (to coin a phrase) and we allow ourselves to become their 'followers.' But even if they believe it... it doesn't mean they are correct... and frankly, they wouldn't know either way.

With more than a decade's worth of research, David Dunning, a psychologist at Cornell University, has demonstrated that humans find it "intrinsically difficult to get a sense of what we don't know." Whether an individual lacks competence in logical reasoning, emotional intelligence, humor or even chess abilities, the person still tends to rate his or her skills in that area as being above average.

The results are uniform across all the knowledge domains: People who actually did well on the test tend to feel more confident about their performance than people who didn't do well, but only slightly. Almost everyone thinks they did better than average. "For people at the bottom who are really doing badly — those in the bottom 10th or 15th percentile — they think their work falls in the 60th or 55th percentile, so, above average," Dunning told Life's Little Mysteries. The same pattern emerges in tests of people's ability to rate the funniness of jokes, the correctness of grammar, or even their own performance in a game of chess. "People at the bottom still think they're outperforming other people."

I know a few bosses who I would like to send this too anonymously...except I am not competent enough to figure out how..

The ultimate takeaway of the research is the reminder that you really may not be as great as you think you are. And you might not be right about the things you believe you're right about. And if you try to joke about all this, you might not come off as funny as you think.

(visit the link for the full news article)

oh yes...
Definitely..

I often wonder how to know what it is I don't know,
but I don't know where to start, because I don't know.

Like that quote that goes something like...
"the smartest man knows he knows nothing."

Its also annoying to talk to people in person or on a site like this, and you know they are not getting what you are saying, but its all in the definitions of the words being used not being understood in the same way... So you are not even really having the same conversation the other person is having, and there isnt much way to tell them so...

Reminds me of Idiocracy. My favorite quote from that movie: "I like money."

reply to post by Maxmars


At least I know they aren't talking about me!

The perception of incompetence is based upon the expectations of the perceive. Since motivations of an individual differ not only because of circadian rythem but social/economic status and can be muted through the broad social notion of Group Think (Which explains why even the very competent can perform incompetently), we see incompetence is not the problem but the egoist worldview encouraged by society as the way in which to perceive and interpret the experiences we encounter.

In other words - I can do anything but may be incompetent because everyone else is focused on their own thing...

Interesting study in that it highlights personal perception or the lack there of but completely inadequate in its' follow through and communication. The study, presented as it is, indirectly encourages incompetence.

My two cents...

Good thread and I am wondering if this "No child left behind" or nobody fails and everyone gets a trophy just for being here today has anything to do with these findings.

The results are uniform across all the knowledge domains: People who actually did well on the test tend to feel more confident about their performance than people who didn't do well, but only slightly. Almost everyone thinks they did better than average. "For people at the bottom who are really doing badly — those in the bottom 10th or 15th percentile — they think their work falls in the 60th or 55th percentile, so, above average," Dunning told Life's Little Mysteries. The same pattern emerges in tests of people's ability to rate the funniness of jokes, the correctness of grammar, or even their own performance in a game of chess. "People at the bottom still think they're outperforming other people.


Well if you have never lost a competition and have had to stand by on the sidelines while your Victor is getting praised and awarded for a job well done, then yes I think this might apply.

S&F
Regards, Iwinder

reply to post by Maxmars


Star and Flag!!
When I look at my younger self, I believed I had it all figured out.
I look at that dumb kid and say to myself, "how in the hell did you survive"?
Hence my signature, "I used to be young and dumb, I'm not young anymore"!
I realize now that I perceive my younger self as a bafoon, will I look back if I make another 20, 30, 40 years and still say the same about my current self?
I sure hope not.
I am not a rich man, I can afford only one and the other is not for sale, I'm going for wisdom.

Sometimes I just sets an thinks. I think. And sometimes I just sets.

so, stupid people dont realize theyre stupid.no # sherlock.
and the stupidest thing is some university probably got ridiculous funding to figure this out.

I disagree. I think the problem, is that most people simply do no know how to step back and look at themselves honestly and objectively. It is not limited to incompetence, most jerks don't see themselves as jerks for example. They don't see or think about how their remarks might affect others.

I wonder how this applies to different areas of intelligence though. Or say, different groups, societies that value different types of intelligence.

Incompetence in one society may not be in another.

Take someone who was incarcerated, someone who worked in a factory and switch each with people who have intellectual jobs, or switch them with socialites who are considered useful among their own circles.

How about... A city dweller switched with a country person?

Hmm...

Does the formula still apply?

I don't think its so much that people are so stupid they don't know they are stupid, though that's pretty funny all the same. I think it's more in line with the idea that people try to change reality in their mind to suit their interests, much in the same manner that someone would realize they screwed something up then quickly try to find blame in someone else.

I would guess it's a survival mechanism. The wolf that worries about the rabbits suffering dies of starvation later on or never gets strong enough to mate, while the wolf that justifies eating the rabbit or is careless about it goes on to become the alpha male. I would imagine after evolving for 50,000 years if the wolf's offspring became intelligent the subtle trait would still exist and carry over on to other mental processes.

While not a perfect analogy I hope this makes the point, people might just be predisposed to justify almost anything if it serves their interest. Now we have complex things like entitlement and mental competition and such, the brain still thinks it's fighting to survive in the wilderness and that its interests should be met, even if they are trivial or material in reality.

Dumb people don't learn? It took a team of scientists to figure this out? Talk about ignorant.

reply to post by Maxmars

A growing body of psychology research shows that incompetence deprives people of the ability to recognize their own incompetence. To put it bluntly, dumb people are too dumb to know it. Similarly, unfunny people don't have a good enough sense of humor to tell.

Those same people are probably reading this story going, 'Yeah, there shur is a buncha dum moorans owt ther!'

God gave us eyes but he didn't included the looking glass. We have to make an effort to gaze into who and what we are.

Hah brilliant, ''a growing number of psychologists'', what a slow bunch. I mean, hasn't it been clearly visible for I don't know...the past thousands of years?

But it is true though, you have to be relatively smart to understand how stupid you really are. Because, if you're stupid...how would you know you are stupid?

This works on into;

It takes the same amount of skill to know you are bad at something(and why), as it would take to be good at that very same something.

Interesting indeed

Edit:

The saying "A smart man knows he knows nothing'' is a nice saying and works as an example to show, little words of wisdom might hold numerous years worth of research.

The sad thing is
You see the most extreme instances in the most important of places
Like the people we work for
Certainly the people I work for !

Originally posted by lacrimosa
so, stupid people dont realize theyre stupid.no # sherlock.
and the stupidest thing is some university probably got ridiculous funding to figure this out.

hya

its a bit like them getting paid thousands to work out:

how to brew the perfect cup of tea
how to boil an egg perfectly

no wonder my countrys in the shifan
money allocated to crap
yet the homeless go roofless and hungry...
not to mention the amount of empty/abandoned property that could home many
2 fingers to the gov

reply to post by Maxmars


Me thinks that this being published on such a mainstream news site as
Yahoo...is soma for the masses.

They sign out of email, and they see this headline, they click on it,
read it and think "why even try?" . Then, probably they switch on Dancing
with the Stars.

That would be the purpose of the article, at least imo.

And people make quite a bit of money teaching the unteachable.

Good to know these customers wont be jumping off the treadmill of stupidity anytime soon.