Here's a question from Australia to our New Zealand, Canadian and U.S cousins about the EU crisis

Wayne Swan are you for real?

I do not want us as a country to Bail out any other countries debt!! We still have a debt of our own. So what will happen? We borrow some money from someone to let the euro-zone countries borrow from us, just so they can go and default anyway because they cant pay back the money they already owe.

How about this. Australia doesn't borrow any money to let other debt ladden countries borrow that money. Instead the Debt ladden countries go to the stupid idiots who would be willing to lend them money to begin with. Go to them direct, not through Australia.

I can see this shiot already. Australia get ladden up with huge debts by borrowing money from some banker, and lets the auro-zone borrow that money, and they all go bankrupt and fail (which they will), and Australia is holding then a huge debt that wont get repaid by the countries we lent the money to. Future Australians paying increased taxes to pay off a debt that shouldn't be ours to pay.

As far as i'm concerned, if anything like this goes ahead I will spam the net and my local community with your idiocy and get you fired for being a shill of a puppet.

I'm american.

Morally, ethically, I see no reason anyone outside the EU is obligated to help them in any way.

But I also percieve that often, we choose to help bail others out of their troubles when not obligated for our own personal reasons.

One is that it gives you gain of power. The other is now indebted to you. You then can insist they do favors for you when you want them. You can point it out as their duty to you.

Two- How we all are intertwined and our destinies influence each other is more or less obvious to people. Even if someone is very deeply into the "independant island" way of seeign themself, or their nation, that truth about sharing reality always comes crashing home sooner or later. This is a time when it is becoming glaringly obvious all over the globe.

I currently live in France, and if this is true, I really wish it wasn't so. I wish the EU could afford to turn it down. I hate owing others and prefer not to live on credit or with the aid of anyone else.
I have lived my life that way, and have no credit cards, and no loan payments, and have not accepted help with my struggles...... and yet despite all that, look! What others around me are doing, living in a different way, is STILL going to affect me!

I have come to the conclusion that cutting oneself off from the rest of humanity just isn't possible while incarnated on earth.

reply to post by DaRAGE


You honestly do not have a choice in it - as a nation you are in the IMF. The IMF has committed to these actions..........

reply to post by ColCurious

Many Germans, Brits, Greek, French, Spanish etc. would rather see the EU collapse than to give up our national sovereignty.

I second that absolutely!

The centralists are the problem in Europe (and the world).
I think in all my life I have never used the term European to describe myself and I never will.
We're only forced to be european, I never got asked.

Good comment.

i came upon this last night, first i had heard anything about it. then this morning i find this.

BEIJING — Finance Minister Jim Flaherty says Europe should use its own resources to resolve its debt crisis before other countries contribute. His comment during a visit to Beijing adds to the pressure on European leaders to produce a financial rescue plan and resources to support it.

www.cp24.com...

so it seems Canada is expected to pay as well. why?? what part of the problem was caused by us?

this is kinda like being expected (no choice?) to help pay your neighbors rent because he was too busy buying stuff he didn't need, and now can't afford his rent. personally in that case i would have to wonder why i was expected to pay. just as i wonder why countries not in the European union are expected to pay for other countries mismanagement. now i can understand having the rest of the E.U. help out, after all wasn't that part of the point of the E.U. in the first place? to bind those countries together as one financial institution to improve things? so a couple of the countries screwed up, that's the E.U's problem not the rest of the worlds.

it's not like we are doing very well financially ourselves in N.A. ever hear the phrase "charity begins at home"? well before helping other countries we should first deal with our own issues, getting people back to work would be a big help. bringing jobs BACK to N.A. would be better, esp manufacturing. THEN once things get rolling and people are living decent, the economy coming back up, just maybe think about helping out. i remember very clearly the feelings of betrayal at the time of the Sumatra quake back in the early 2000's, when i heard on tv that we were sending huge amounts of money to help out. meanwhile i had been trying to live for a year with $0 income, due to being in an accident and not being able to work, yet i did not qualify for welfare to temporarily help me out. i can't even describe what it felt like to be betrayed like that, to see that your government cares more about other countries then their own citizens. of being told sorry we can't help you, yet just giving money away to another country. and meanwhile you don't have food, you wouldn't believe how tempting it was to steal, i remember one night walking looking for cigarette butts, seeing a stack of fresh bread dropped off in front of a store in the early morning, the urge to grab a loaf or two was almost overpowering, yet while this was going on my government was sending money overseas.

Originally posted by DaRAGE
Wayne Swan are you for real?

I do not want us as a country to Bail out any other countries debt!! We still have a debt of our own. So what will happen? We borrow some money from someone to let the euro-zone countries borrow from us, just so they can go and default anyway because they cant pay back the money they already owe.

How about this. Australia doesn't borrow any money to let other debt ladden countries borrow that money. Instead the Debt ladden countries go to the stupid idiots who would be willing to lend them money to begin with. Go to them direct, not through Australia.

I can see this shiot already. Australia get ladden up with huge debts by borrowing money from some banker, and lets the auro-zone borrow that money, and they all go bankrupt and fail (which they will), and Australia is holding then a huge debt that wont get repaid by the countries we lent the money to. Future Australians paying increased taxes to pay off a debt that shouldn't be ours to pay.

As far as i'm concerned, if anything like this goes ahead I will spam the net and my local community with your idiocy and get you fired for being a shill of a puppet.

edit on 14-11-2011 by DaRAGE because: (no reason given)

That's the way it's done and all the lending countries do it. And as you said it's all well and fine as long as those paying money back to the IMF don't default and I'm not sure the EU can say that won't happen. From what I"ve read it's only a few of their countries causing it but it appears to be a money hole that they're all falling into (and the EU was about them becoming stronger than the rest and it's backfired) and I don't like the idea of us playing around the edge of that hole. I don't care how our government spins it at the end of the day we'll notice it when our weekly shopping can be carried to the car in one hand,

That tool Swan has let the pats on the back for our economic survival go to his head and started to believe labors own spin. It was due to Strategies put in place before labor got into office that made us survive the GEM. Now he and Gillard are flying around on someone elses magic carpet and though they'll land on soft cushy jobs when the magic ends the avergae joe is screwed.

Originally posted by Bluesma
I'm american.

Morally, ethically, I see no reason anyone outside the EU is obligated to help them in any way.

But I also percieve that often, we choose to help bail others out of their troubles when not obligated for our own personal reasons.

One is that it gives you gain of power. The other is now indebted to you. You then can insist they do favors for you when you want them. You can point it out as their duty to you.

Two- How we all are intertwined and our destinies influence each other is more or less obvious to people. Even if someone is very deeply into the "independant island" way of seeign themself, or their nation, that truth about sharing reality always comes crashing home sooner or later. This is a time when it is becoming glaringly obvious all over the globe.

I currently live in France, and if this is true, I really wish it wasn't so. I wish the EU could afford to turn it down. I hate owing others and prefer not to live on credit or with the aid of anyone else.
I have lived my life that way, and have no credit cards, and no loan payments, and have not accepted help with my struggles...... and yet despite all that, look! What others around me are doing, living in a different way, is STILL going to affect me!

I have come to the conclusion that cutting oneself off from the rest of humanity just isn't possible while incarnated on earth.

I honestly think that if either country I mentioned in the thread heading needed this kind of help that the answer would be a big no and people can shoot me down if they want but I believe that France would have the loudest no voice. We all know what they think of the english speaking world.

Originally posted by generik
i came upon this last night, first i had heard anything about it. then this morning i find this.

BEIJING — Finance Minister Jim Flaherty says Europe should use its own resources to resolve its debt crisis before other countries contribute. His comment during a visit to Beijing adds to the pressure on European leaders to produce a financial rescue plan and resources to support it.

www.cp24.com...

so it seems Canada is expected to pay as well. why?? what part of the problem was caused by us?

this is kinda like being expected (no choice?) to help pay your neighbors rent because he was too busy buying stuff he didn't need, and now can't afford his rent. personally in that case i would have to wonder why i was expected to pay. just as i wonder why countries not in the European union are expected to pay for other countries mismanagement. now i can understand having the rest of the E.U. help out, after all wasn't that part of the point of the E.U. in the first place? to bind those countries together as one financial institution to improve things? so a couple of the countries screwed up, that's the E.U's problem not the rest of the worlds.

it's not like we are doing very well financially ourselves in N.A. ever hear the phrase "charity begins at home"? well before helping other countries we should first deal with our own issues, getting people back to work would be a big help. bringing jobs BACK to N.A. would be better, esp manufacturing. THEN once things get rolling and people are living decent, the economy coming back up, just maybe think about helping out. i remember very clearly the feelings of betrayal at the time of the Sumatra quake back in the early 2000's, when i heard on tv that we were sending huge amounts of money to help out. meanwhile i had been trying to live for a year with $0 income, due to being in an accident and not being able to work, yet i did not qualify for welfare to temporarily help me out. i can't even describe what it felt like to be betrayed like that, to see that your government cares more about other countries then their own citizens. of being told sorry we can't help you, yet just giving money away to another country. and meanwhile you don't have food, you wouldn't believe how tempting it was to steal, i remember one night walking looking for cigarette butts, seeing a stack of fresh bread dropped off in front of a store in the early morning, the urge to grab a loaf or two was almost overpowering, yet while this was going on my government was sending money overseas.

People have the same view here. Our failure of a PM is spending billions on sending money over seas and on boat people arriving in Aus but giving the people here who do need the most help a good slap in the face.

It really doesn't matter because were all going down in the same boat. It's game over and the only way to fix it is to start the game over again with new rules. No country is going to want to accept unimaginable hardships and the rioting in the streets when it happens. The world as a whole has no other choice.

The reason is the same NWO pricks run Australia as they do the EU. Do you think its by chance the carbon tax being passed and the destruction of our farms by miners and dick governements. No its because they want no single country to strong or too self sufficient, but they will get a fight on their hands thats for sure. Think about it clearly, Australia is the mining king, US makes IT, China makes good they like it like this.

The EU basically said "your problem, not mine" during the Lehman fiasco a few years back. I say "your problem, not mine" now. Tit for tat.

No, you absolutely shouldn't help the European Union out here.
It is a bad system and no matter how much money you spend trying to help, it will stay a bad system and eventually collapse or be dissolved.

They checked out the smaller economies and regulated them to be in balance before beeing approved into the EU, but many of the bigger economies that founded the Union apparently thought they were too big and important to fail themselves, so the regulation and checking on these economies has been poor for years.

Thats why countries like Italy, Greece and Spain are in trouble now - they lived the good life with borrowed money for years. Now they have to take the consequences of it. Dont help them out!
You are wasting your money.
Germany alone can't keep this wheel spinning and the bigger economies that fails cant be regulated enough in time to solve the problems, without people in those countries rioting and protesting.

What national politicians will commit political suicide by regulating their own economy and making their own peoples life hard just to compensate for prior politicians bad judgement?
The answer is - they won't.
They will just do what is needed to "calm the market" on shortterm, but the underlying problems will still be there for years and years to come.
The Euro is pretty much doomed and every outside attempt to "save" it is just wasted money.
They save it themselves by actually solving their own problems and living poor for several years to come, or they (most likely) fail and start over on their own again. Thats the alternatives.

This is said by an European by the way. Keep your money to your own countries, spend them on your own hardworking people and do not "save" the ones that have been living over their standards for years and years...they simply don't deserve your help and money...!

I dont know much about economics, but I do know that the banksters will get their way regardless of who "bails out" who, we are heading straight into a #### storm my friends and the only solution they will offer will be war, and then the solution they will offer when we have had enough of killing eachother will be global governance to "make sure nuclear war never happens again" or some bs like that. I dont know about you, but Im sick of the lot of them, soon as tshtf and I have an excuse to grab my kid my bags and head for the hills, there will be no stopping me. Id rather take my chances with aus's unforgiving wilderness than rely on the government during a global war. Plus I dont like my job very much

reply to post by steveknows


It looks like the IMF and the world bank sold a bond to Canada with a value of 1.8 billion in 2010 to be repayed in 2012 and a another one was done recently fpr 2.5 billion to be repayed in 2013. Those funds goto into the world bank general funds which they use to loan to various countries for various economic program. Canada has no say in who the world bank then loans the money to.

In 2010 the world bank loaned 10 trillion (the report said 10,100,000 millions) to the various EU and non EU european nations in the second half of 2010. No data is available for 2011 yet.

Originally posted by Tollon
No, you absolutely shouldn't help the European Union out here.
It is a bad system and no matter how much money you spend trying to help, it will stay a bad system and eventually collapse or be dissolved.

They checked out the smaller economies and regulated them to be in balance before beeing approved into the EU, but many of the bigger economies that founded the Union apparently thought they were too big and important to fail themselves, so the regulation and checking on these economies has been poor for years.

Thats why countries like Italy, Greece and Spain are in trouble now - they lived the good life with borrowed money for years. Now they have to take the consequences of it. Dont help them out!
You are wasting your money.
Germany alone can't keep this wheel spinning and the bigger economies that fails cant be regulated enough in time to solve the problems, without people in those countries rioting and protesting.

What national politicians will commit political suicide by regulating their own economy and making their own peoples life hard just to compensate for prior politicians bad judgement?
The answer is - they won't.
They will just do what is needed to "calm the market" on shortterm, but the underlying problems will still be there for years and years to come.
The Euro is pretty much doomed and every outside attempt to "save" it is just wasted money.
They save it themselves by actually solving their own problems and living poor for several years to come, or they (most likely) fail and start over on their own again. Thats the alternatives.

This is said by an European by the way. Keep your money to your own countries, spend them on your own hardworking people and do not "save" the ones that have been living over their standards for years and years...they simply don't deserve your help and money...!

Well said. So many of words of logic in one post.

Originally posted by steveknows

I honestly think that if either country I mentioned in the thread heading needed this kind of help that the answer would be a big no and people can shoot me down if they want but I believe that France would have the loudest no voice. We all know what they think of the english speaking world.

Uh.....yeah I have seen Americans make this claim that France hates them over and over. Interesting. I have been here for 20 years and have yet to witness any anti-American sentiment. It still boggles my mind that it can be such a commonly held idea there, that one can find no evidence of here.
There was a moment in time when the french did not like Bush- and considered the American peoples as being victims of him, but never saw anyone ever express anything but admiration of America and the American peoples.

Sure do witness a LOT of anti-french sentiment on the part of the Americans though. Maybe it's a case of just assuming "we hate and bash them, so they MUST dislike us just as much"?
But in general, most french people aren't aware of your hating them. I surely don't tell anyone here about it. I see no reason to spread such hatred- especially since it was propaganda spread by the Bush administration for a specific purpose at a specific time, that no longer serves anything. But sometimes people can't get off a propaganda train.

Originally posted by Bluesma

Originally posted by steveknows

I honestly think that if either country I mentioned in the thread heading needed this kind of help that the answer would be a big no and people can shoot me down if they want but I believe that France would have the loudest no voice. We all know what they think of the english speaking world.

Uh.....yeah I have seen Americans make this claim that France hates them over and over. Interesting. I have been here for 20 years and have yet to witness any anti-American sentiment. It still boggles my mind that it can be such a commonly held idea there, that one can find no evidence of here.
There was a moment in time when the french did not like Bush- and considered the American peoples as being victims of him, but never saw anyone ever express anything but admiration of America and the American peoples.

Sure do witness a LOT of anti-french sentiment on the part of the Americans though. Maybe it's a case of just assuming "we hate and bash them, so they MUST dislike us just as much"?
But in general, most french people aren't aware of your hating them. I surely don't tell anyone here about it. I see no reason to spread such hatred- especially since it was propaganda spread by the Bush administration for a specific purpose at a specific time, that no longer serves anything. But sometimes people can't get off a propaganda train.

Ive seen first hand how snooty they are to Aussies and I've got plenty of Brit friends who say it's the same to them. French schools might have signs saying remember Australia but it doesn't stop Aussies getting alot of unnecessary crap when going through French customs. A big act for a country with a history of marching backward.

Originally posted by steveknows

Ive seen first hand how snooty they are to Aussies and I've got plenty of Brit friends who say it's the same to them. French schools might have signs saying remember Australia but it doesn't stop Aussies getting alot of unnecessary crap when going through French customs. A big act for a country with a history of marching backward.

I've definately never heard any anti-australian sentiment.
I think that cultural differences make people misunderstand and misinterpret a LOT. Many of the attitudes and gestures that are polite, respectful and express care in other cultures are the exact opposite in France.

Just for example- to critisize someone is to show how much you like and care about them.
If you don't, you don't care.

There are many things like that which perhaps are the root of the the "anglo-saxon -hating french" myth.
We are almost the opposite of the latin based cultures that way. At least this exchange gave me another idea to research on where that myth of ours originates!

That's probably why the french aren't AWARE they are hated by the Americans either!! The more the americans critisize them, the more they think they are loved.

reply to post by homeslice


Hi home,

It is strange how people are always into lost animals, while still hating each other and leaving each other to starve.

What can you do?

Australia, UK, Europe, USA, Canada, New Zealand, Scandanavia etc
What do all of these countries have in common overall?
Predominantly Caucasian, Christian, affluent, democratic and traditionally the helpers of the less fortunate.
What has been the path that our leaders have placed us on over the past two generations?
War
Debt
Removing God
Massive forced immigration of different cultures into our societies
Increase of laws dictating every single aspect of our daily lives
Removal of the great work ethic that built our coubtries into beacons of light
Destruction of morals and values that helped to build the character of our countries.

If one cannot see that a force is determined to destroy each of our countries from within, to destroy the very God given blessings that have we have enjoyed, to destroy each of us in the same manner - then we are hopelessly lost as nations. We are so brainwashed by this force into believing it's lies that we can no longer stand up for the Truth - that our nations were blessed by God all of these years and that we are now being run over by Satan's influence. There will come a time that many of will wake up to the fact of our true identity - that we are Israelites and that we were some of God's chosen people from Jacob's children. Until that time however, we will stay blinded to the fact of who we are - whilst we watch, in dismay and bewilderment, the ever so blatant attacks on
our countries as a whole. Watch whilst the pharisaical Jews, those that call themselves Jews but are not, systematically destroy God's own children from within - taking them down financially, morally and religiously. Why do you think that the exact same thing is being done to each of our countries?