Catholic Bishops angered by loss of federal funding!

The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops has added another item to their list of grievances with the Obama administration. The group recently lost millions of federal dollars for their relief program for victims of human trafficking because they refused to refer victims for contraceptives or abortion. Three other groups were awarded the grants instead.

The Washington Post reports:

The American Civil Liberties Union sued, and [Health and Human Services] officials said they made a policy decision to award the grants to agencies that would refer women for those services.

The bishops conference is threatening legal action and accusing the administration of anti-Catholic bias, which HHS officials deny.

The fight further sours an already difficult relationship between the government and some Catholics over several issues. The bishops fiercely oppose the administration’s decision in February to no longer defend the federal law barring the recognition of same-sex marriage. Dozens of Catholic groups also have objected in recent weeks to a proposed HHS mandate — issued under the health-care law — that would require private insurers to provide women with contraceptives without charge.

Last week, a Catholic political action committee released an ad asking President Obama to “meet with Catholic leaders to discuss compromise” on religious conscience laws. The ad accused the president of not seeking “common ground” with religious groups.

Catholic groups have asked to be exempt from federal mandates non-religious groups have to follow, particularly when it comes to birth control and abortion services. They are only asked to these follow mandates when they receive taxpayer funding.

For years, powerful groups such as the Conference of Bishops have won their fights for exclusion — but lately the feds are reconsidering some programs.

floridaindependent.com...

Bias Warning: I'm Catholic

So I have to say that I am saddened by the government's decision here. This was a good program and just because Catholics refuse to offer abortion services shouldn't be grounds to not fund the program that helps people. I guess saying that I'm interested in what you guys think of this story.

Churches shouldnt be taking any federal funding. For anything. I dont care what it's used for.

A big reason why so much tyranny is tolerated is because of the hypocrisy all around us. So many people and groups are so quick to snap at the government then they turn around and cash those checks as if there's nothing wrong with it.

Every dollar that comes from (laundered through) the government is soaked in blood. Violence put it in the governments hands and spineless greed lines fools up to beg for handouts.

Instead of bitching about it the Catholics should stand tall and say "fine, we didnt want your blood money anyway."

They'd really like it if I was in charge and taxed them. Just their property tax alone would do miracles!

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
Churches shouldnt be taking any federal funding. For anything. I dont care what it's used for.

Agreed and seconded.

I dont care what religion it is, they should not be getting any taxpayer money, federal or otherwise. If they want money, they can certainly petition the Vatican, which is richer than many second or third world countries.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


Interesting view. I just don't feel like it's bad though for the government to fund humanitarian programs. You say that Catholics should stand up and say "Hey we don't need your money". Funnily in my own Dioceses we're begging for a federal grant right now. (Humanitarian groups of our own.)

Like I said, I'm biased on this issue.

I'm glad they did this, the church was being selective with where the money went...which is not what they're supposed to do. Raped? Not helping you. Gay? Not helping you. Want an abortion? Not helping you. Use condoms? Not helping you.

If they want to help people, they should help all people. Not just the ones they feel are worthy of help. Excluding economic variances of course...

now the government needs to start taxing them.. Make them cough up all the money they fleeced from the people in between molesting children. Disgusting the government funding the catholic church when the catholic church has more money than most countries do ..

The federal government can give grants to who it pleases. They chose those who represent a greater number of people.

Religious groups are not above the law.....if you want to live in a backwards society go to the Vatican. You'll be safe there (Nothing is directed at the OP specifically)

SCREEEECH ...............


Why are churches receiving any of our hard earned coin that is stripped away from my check with out my permission....

I mean seriously... they get funding for human trafficking prevention, obviously they arent doing a very good job because there are probably more slaves today then any other time in history...

WTF

Churches need to be taxed, just like every other business.

reply to post by links234

Raped? Not helping you. Gay? Not helping you. Want an abortion? Not helping you. Use condoms? Not helping you.

Would love to see some proof here. Thanks in advance. I'm not calling you a liar but I don't see this as being true.

While many of the religious organizations do a lot of good for the different communities around the country, providing help and relief to those in need, they are still religious in nature and often bias what help and relief that they are willing to give. The problem is that they are expecting for the federal government to assist them in this endeavor, while not adhering to the guidelines that are attached to all funds that are given out.

Any who deal with the federal government or any governmental agency knows that by accepting the money that is provided, that organization also has to accept all of the bureaucracy that goes along with it and the government also will dictate how said funds are to be used, what they find is and is not acceptable. They have to follow the laws that are set out and approved by congress, not by those in a religious nature or service.

The current President, while he may not be friendly to the religious masses or the organizations that are supported by the religious masses, it is a fair balance, as there can not be an exception to giving out the money to help people, yet the rules and mandates are not followed. That means in the case of healthcare for women, that abortion and contraceptives be discussed as part of family planning, not simply ignored or put to the side. Those are the guidelines and the proverbial strings attached to any and all funding that is given out.

Now the alternative, though they may not like it, but they can choose not to accept any money from the government and still continue on with the services that they provide, though some will have to be cut. But as they are not accepting any money from the federal government, then the federal government would have no basis or means to influence or even dictate how said services are to be offered or what they can do, as long as it is within the confines of the law. Remember while the laws may seem to work against Catholic Charities and other organizations that the Catholic church runs, it also will work for them in this case.

reply to post by drew1749

So I have to say that I am saddened by the government's decision here. This was a good program and just because Catholics refuse to offer abortion services shouldn't be grounds to not fund the program that helps people.

Good program or not, why should our (taxpayer) dollars go to any church for any reason while the church is tax exempt?

I think the Vatican should be footing any and all bills for any and all programs associated with the church.

Our tax money is misappropriated enough as it is, and has no business going to the coffers of the largest, tax-exempt business/cartel on the planet.

My $.02

Originally posted by drew1749
Would love to see some proof here. Thanks in advance. I'm not calling you a liar but I don't see this as being true.

The group recently lost millions of federal dollars for their relief program for victims of human trafficking because they refused to refer victims for contraceptives or abortion.

The Catholic church has also had a very hard-line stance opposing homosexuality.

I really don't think the church would want their books audited as to where they spend the donations they received . yet the still want to stick their noses into government business . The separation between church and state ( the Pot calling the Kettle black ) , having the cake and eating it too works both ways .

Blood money is exactly what they have been receiving , not much of a conscience they have for that do they . The church preaches so much that they have themselves been guilty of , who then are the false prophets really ?

reply to post by drew1749


I am also a Catholic. My experience has been that the help for the poor and unfortunate is guided, if not dictated,by the state. I don't think it is a good idea to allow an outside party to tell the Church that they cannot help the poor unless they have been refered by a government agency. My first thought was, "Oh, so the seperation of church and state only works one way, cool". I was truely disapointed that the Church would let the government tell it what to do with money that had not come from the government.The reason for this, I was told was that some people went from church to church getting assistance from all of them.
The other problem is that if you examine the Annual Diocean Financial Report, you will find that a large portion of the Church's money goes to something called "self insurance". That flies in the face of most of the teachings of self denial and altruism that are supposed to be held up as God's desire.
After seeing all of this, and the actual poor still being treated like unwanted beggars, I decided to just bypass all the ignortisim and help the people without depending on anyone else to do it for me. It works.

reply to post by drew1749


I don't think churches or any religion should receive funding for anything.. But I cannot think of anything more traumatic than being taken into a Human trafficking ring then told to have an abortion (which is very traumatic) .. I hope they offer some kind of counseling with these services..

reply to post by drew1749


Why is the US taxpayer giving money to the Catholics. Why not ask the Vatican since it is the richest place on the planet. I doubt if the the leadership there could care less about this issue. They are mired up to their necks in scandals about children and the treatment there of.

Originally posted by drew1749
reply to post by thisguyrighthere

 

Interesting view. I just don't feel like it's bad though for the government to fund humanitarian programs. You say that Catholics should stand up and say "Hey we don't need your money". Funnily in my own Dioceses we're begging for a federal grant right now. (Humanitarian groups of our own.)

Like I said, I'm biased on this issue.

Government does not fund "humanitarian programs" the People do, and do so without any recourse for oversight, or opting out of such funding.

Government has no business "funding" anything other than what they have been mandated to do. Too often, those defending this dubious form of "welfare" have to point to a clause in the Preamble of the Constitution for the United States of America in order to "prove" that government has been authorized to "fund humanitarian" endeavors.

The Preamble serves solely as an introduction, and does not assign powers to the federal government,[1] nor does it provide specific limitations on government action. Due to the Preamble's limited nature, no court has ever used it as a decisive factor in case adjudication,[2] except as regards frivolous litigation.[3]

en.wikipedia.org...

Churches should not be demanding "funding" from government, and government has no business "funding" anything other than government.

It seems that a lot of issues pop up in certain threads, it's tough to keep up with them. May I add a little information about some of them?

1.) Tax the Churches. Churches are exempt from taxation under section 501c of the tax code. Eliminating exemptions under that section would mean starting to tax: Charities, non-profits, educational organizations, labor unions, social and recreational clubs, teachers' retirement funds, black lung benefit trusts and more. Tax exempt organizations. If you only removed church exemptions there would be court battles centering on hostility to religion.

2.) Abortion and contraceptives. Here, I don't know the statistics involved, but I would wager that everyone who is a victim of human trafficking is referred to a doctor, if for no other reason than to check for injuries and diseases. Discuss medical problems there.

3.) The process.

On the trafficking contract, senior political appointees at HHS awarded the new grants to the bishops’ competitors despite a recommendation from career staffers that the bishops be funded based on scores by an independent review board, according to federal officials and internal HHS documents.

That prompted a protest from some HHS staffers, who said the process was unfair and politicized, individuals familiar with the matter said. Their concerns have been reported to the HHS inspector general’s office.

Under HHS policies, career officials usually oversee grant competitions, and priority consideration is given to the review board’s judgment.

(From the Washington Post article referenced in the OP's source.) emphasis added.


4.) The Vatican is wealthy.

-- The Holy See, which depends largely on investments for its annual income, had income of about $326 million and expenses of about $313 million. The number of Holy See employees in 2010 was 2,806, up slightly from 2009.
-- Vatican City State had income of about $340 million and expenses of about $312 million. The Vatican said a major factor in the surplus was a boom in visitors to the Vatican Museums, which occurred despite a general crisis in the tourism industry.

The Vatican also underlined that the Vatican City State not only pays 1,876 employees but also spends a considerable amount each year in maintenance and restoration of its artistic and architectural treasures, which it said can rightly be described as "one of the most important historical and artistic patrimonies of humanity."

Total income of less than a billion dollars, and you think they're fabulously wealthy? Why not ask the US government to sell the Washington monument and the White House to raise money for a stimulus package?

Say what?

Christians are butt hurt because the Government won't provide federal funding? Don't you all have separation of church and state?

What tax exempt status isn't enough, so you have to take tax payer money as well?

That's just amazing. Perhaps they should ask for money from the Pope, considering the hundreds of millions of dollars they are hoarding.

~Keeper