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Originally posted by michaelwpayton
I wonder if Jeremiah would've been called a fear monger for telling the people of Israel the scary truth of what was open them... Keep up the good work
Originally posted by bogomil
The main problem in this is the usual one. When theists try to 'upgrade' from plain doctrinal answer to a more 'sophisticated' level, e.g. by creating supporting methodologies for doctrines and doctrinal answers, the resulting methods are as circular, faith-based and relying on self-proclaimed 'authority' as the simpler approach of just doctrinal 'answers'.
It really doesn't fool anyone, and just gives the impression of a theist parallel to the reasoning of those building 'perpeteum mobiles' (apologize spelling).
Originally posted by bogomil
Anybody can cling to anything they like. This is very different from pushing it.
Originally posted by bogomil
The main problem in this is the usual one. When theists try to 'upgrade' from plain doctrinal answer to a more 'sophisticated' level, e.g. by creating supporting methodologies for doctrines and doctrinal answers, the resulting methods are as circular, faith-based and relying on self-proclaimed 'authority' as the simpler approach of just doctrinal 'answers'.
It really doesn't fool anyone, and just gives the impression of a theist parallel to the reasoning of those building 'perpeteum mobiles' (apologize spelling).
Originally posted by michaelwpayton
reply to post by XplanetX
your 777th post was one of graditude thought I would point that out. I like those little moments where God speaks through our own words and actions to re-assure us that we hearing Him and He is pleased.
Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
It is true from our perspective, but there will be many that do not believe and be taken unawares as must be done. The Great Deception is that God does not exist, and many will be fooled as they cling to science and only things that can be explained.
Originally posted by michaelwpayton
reply to post by XplanetX
your 777th post was one of graditude thought I would point that out. I like those little moments where God speaks through our own words and actions to re-assure us that we hearing Him and He is pleased.
Originally posted by bogomil
The main problem in this is the usual one. When theists try to 'upgrade' from plain doctrinal answer to a more 'sophisticated' level, e.g. by creating supporting methodologies for doctrines and doctrinal answers, the resulting methods are as circular, faith-based and relying on self-proclaimed 'authority' as the simpler approach of just doctrinal 'answers'.
It really doesn't fool anyone, and just gives the impression of a theist parallel to the reasoning of those building 'perpeteum mobiles' (apologize spelling).
Considering we believe in a God who has self-proclaimed authority, this shouldn't be a surprise to you. So we're trying to use the education provided us. It's not an attempt to fool you, it's to show you that we don't follow blindly something that can't be proven. I am one of the most technical people I know. I love Physics and you can frequently find me in fringe science threads and research projects. But it doesn't detract from my faith, nor the Truth of God's word. You don't have to believe it. No one is making you. We are willing to die before we compromise our faith and our faith compels us to speak. It's love that pushes past all the hate we get for doing so. Wouldn't you tell someone if they we're driving off a cliff?edit on 2011/9/9 by michaelwpayton because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by bogomil
Anybody can cling to anything they like. This is very different from pushing it.
hmmm, never thought of myself as a pusher...edit on 2011/9/9 by michaelwpayton because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by bogomil
Juuuuust as I said..... they 'examined'....but on what criteria was this 'examination' performed.
'Holy spirits', Paulus' own chestbeatings, circle-arguments, references to 'signs and wonders', 'divine authority' such as contemporary christian missionaries do?
Or were these people some 2.000 years ago somehow 'wiser', in possession of secret talents or lore now forgotten?
Originally posted by bogomil
reply to post by XplanetX
You wrote:
["AC 17:10 As soon as it was night, the brothers sent Paul and Silas away to Berea. On arriving there, they went to the Jewish synagogue. Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. Many of the Jews believed, as did also a number of prominent Greek women and many Greek men."]
Juuuuust as I said..... they 'examined'....but on what criteria was this 'examination' performed.
'Holy spirits', Paulus' own chestbeatings, circle-arguments, references to 'signs and wonders', 'divine authority' such as contemporary christian missionaries do?
Or were these people some 2.000 years ago somehow 'wiser', in possession of secret talents or lore now forgotten?
Originally posted by bogomil
All this sounded very straight and respectable, but you completely destroyed the good impression, when you ended with....
Originally posted by michaelwpayton Wouldn't you tell someone if they we're driving off a cliff?
.......in capital letters demonstrating, that you have very little idea of the difference between faith and facts.
If you use such an approach in your participation on fringe-science subjects, I've seen such too often to consider it valid.
Originally posted by michaelwpayton
Originally posted by bogomil
All this sounded very straight and respectable, but you completely destroyed the good impression, when you ended with....
Quote: ["Wouldn't you tell someone if they we're driving off a cliff?"]
.......in capital letters demonstrating, that you have very little idea of the difference between faith and facts.
If you use such an approach in your participation on fringe-science subjects, I've seen such too often to consider it valid.
Yeah, my writing style isn't always consistent at 4 AM Would you really throw out every bit because of the last line?edit on 2011/9/9 by michaelwpayton because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by bogomil
As you appear to sensible (I can't pinpoint that)...no, I wouldn't reject everything out of hand because of a single line.
IF you (at your convenience, in your tomorrow maybe) can give a better presentation of your overall fact-faith procedure/attitude.
I've known many excellent theists, who can keep these concepts apart or in a functional balance, without messing it up into half-baked hybrids.
Originally posted by michaelwpayton
reply to post by bogomil
I could give you examples of paul and his secular knowledge within thirty minutes... have to find the scripture where he was debating the philosophers. but you mentioned you wanted extra-biblical sources which I've never researched personally but I could get you the info by tomorrow night.