Our Troops do NOT Protect Our Freedom and We Should Stop Thanking Them for Doing So

Originally posted by Wyn Hawks

Originally posted by SLAYER69
I've seen and heard all the "Claims about what Depleted Uranium" has supposedly done to them.

Now what part of "Depleted" do people seem not to understand?

...i understand the following...
www.who.int...

The behaviour of DU in the body is identical to that of natural uranium.

Originally posted by wcitizen

This article is written by an American about US troops.but Imo it applies to troops in pretty much all Western countries at the very least.

Like the author, I'm sure I will be flamed for posting this, but I feel I have to.

tvnewslies.org... for-doing-so.html

Let's make one thing crystal clear, no member of the US military contributes in any way whatsoever to protecting the freedoms of the American people. As a matter of fact, they are more likely to turn their weapons on you than they are to defend your Constitutional rights.

The only people on this planet Earth who can affect your freedom are members of Congress, local legislators and the members of enforcement institutions who will blindly follow the rulers who sign their paychecks. And, while your beloved troops are murdering people around the globe, yes, I said murdering, your Congress and local legislators are eliminating your freedoms, en masse, without any intervention by our so-called protectors in the armed forces.

There is no honor in volunteering to go anywhere in the world and kill anybody you are told to, without question, without historical background and without verifying the stated reasons for doing so. In this modern age of information we now know that time and time again our military have been deployed into battle, to kill and be killed, for reasons that in no way shape or form resemble the reasons for which they, or we were told at the time. This is no secret, although many Americans refuse to take off the flag that is wrapped around their eyes and see American history as it really happened. They blindly believe what was told to them by the people who have a vested interest in maintaining myths and misconceptions.

The US military, not once but twice, committed the single largest mass murders in history by dropping nuclear weapons on civilian populations, including of course, on women and children. Say what you want about how it helped end the war....the bottom line is the US could have exploded these devices over uninhabited territory with the same effect of scaring the heck out of the Japanese. But they followed orders that were lies and murdered almost 300,000 people, without question. As a human being I find it hard to honor such “patriotism.”

I realise this will upset many, but if we are to have any chance of being successful in overcoming the criminals in charge and their criminal systems, there are some paradigmatic shifts which must take place .... even if that involves the debunking of a sacred cow.

It's my impression that In the US the military tends to be revered more so than in Europe. I believe this has been encouraged and inculcated by the MSM, politicians and Hollywood, and is all part of the sham they have presented to the public as real.

My intent in posting this is not to offend, but to defend what is true.

edit on 9-8-2011 by wcitizen because: (no reason given)

This is a B.S. article. How many soldiers have families and children of their own? More than half of every branch of the armed forces. Do you literally think these brave men and women with families of their own are going to let other soldiers gun down other familes, even their own? My brother was a combat medic Iraq for 2 years, when i asked him this question, he said that wouldnt happen and if it did then half the military would be fighting the other half. It would be the hugest mutiny in history. He in turn asked that question to his commanding officer who said that the army generals would refuse that order and turn on the government.

No, this is one scneario you DO not have to worry about. They might declare martial law if told to do so, but if commanded to turn against the people and murder them even our highest generals would take command and turn on the government and overthrow it. Despite what many of you think, they know the difference between right and wrong, and they need our moral support and love or they cannot do what they do day in and day out, the pay alone isnt worth it. It takes a tremendous amount of courage to charge into a building not knowing wether or not youre going to die the second you go through that door, and what goes through every soldiers mind is "what happens if these butchers make it home?" They see in their minds eyes their families being murdered and it drives them into a rage to fight it with their last breath and many do.

Don't you even DARE say this B.S. They would take bullets for you, and avenge you if you died. YOU do not have the right to question their loyalties until you put on that uniform, and i can tell you never have been in the military or you wouldnt dare say this. Youre probably a draft dodging coward that ran to canada instead of doing his duty.

reply to post by CivilDisobedience


Really!......During WW2 my Father was in the Navy...on a ship stationed in the waters of Hawaii...when Pearl Harbor got bombed my father was there along with his fellow servicemen to defend the people and our country...my father went through fire...and hell and back....to defend his fellow human beings....he is my Hero....

I think people need to look at military men on an individual basis....what their individual characters and principals are...what is really in their hearts.

reply to post by Wyn Hawks


Sorry about taking so long to respond.
I had to dig through a bunch of Propaganda to get to the meat and potatoes. Interesting read. Well worth the time.

SCIENCE OR SCIENCE FICTION?
Facts, Myths and Propaganda In the Debate Over Depleted Uranium Weapons

These facts simultaneously betray the inflated claims about the supremacy of DU rounds and expose the probability that the health hazards of DU were restricted to the locations where DU rounds actually impacted hard targets such as tanks. At the other extreme of the debate, some anti-DU activists, the governments of Iraq and the former-Yugoslavia, Yasser Arafat, and Taliban sympathizers have worked jointly and independently to promote an apocalyptic vision of DU’s effects. Their claims are often based on a mix of fact, fiction and propaganda, and they run the spectrum from the plausible to the absurd. Several of these claims are currently getting an undue amount of media attention:

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by wcitizen
This is what our DU weapons are doing to Afghan babies - same in Iraq.

Yes,

I've seen and heard all the "Claims about what Depleted Uranium" has supposedly done to them.

Now what part of "Depleted" do people seem not to understand?

Apparently more than you do:

From wikipedia:

Most depleted uranium arises as a byproduct of the production of enriched uranium for use in nuclear reactors and in the manufacture of nuclear weapons. Enrichment processes generate from the uranium feed a small fraction of uranium with a higher-than-natural concentration of lower-mass uranium isotopes (in particular U-235, which is the uranium isotope supporting the fission chain reaction) with the bulk of the feed ending up as depleted uranium, in some cases with mass fractions of U-235 and U-234 less than a third of those in natural uranium.[2] U-238 has a much longer halflife than the lighter isotopes, and DU therefore emits less alpha radiation than the same mass of natural uranium: the US Defense Department states DU used in US munitions has 60% the radioactivity of natural uranium.[3]

Let me just repeat part of that last sentence:

the US Defense Department states DU used in US munitions has
60% the radioactivity of natural uranium.[3]

Here's a bit more information on what the 'Depleted' part of 'Depleted Uranium' means:

stgvisie.home.xs4all.nl...

WHAT IS DEPLETED URANIUM?

Depleted uranium is a waste obtained from producing fuel for nuclear
reactors and atomic bombs. The material used in civil and nuclear military
industry is uranium U-235, the isotope which can be fissioned. Since this
isotope is found in very low proportions in nature, the uranium ore has to
be enriched, i.e., its proportion of the U-235 isotope has to be
industrially increased. This pocess produces a large amount of radioactive
depleted uranium waste, thus named because it is mainly formed by the other
non-fissionable uranium isotope, U-238 and a minimum proportion of U-235.
American military industry has been using depleted uranium to coat
conventional weaponry (artillery, tanks and aircraft) since 1977, to
protect its own tanks, as a counterweight in aircraft and Tomahawk missiles
and as a component for navigation instruments. This is due to depleted
uranium having characteristics making it highly attractive for military
technology: firstly, it is extremely dense and heavy (1 cm3 weighs almost
19 grammes), such that projectiles with a depleted uranium head can
penetrate the armoured steel of military vehicles and buildings; secondly,
it is a spontaneous pyrophoric material, i.e., it inflames when reaching
its target generating such heat that it explodes.
After more than 50 years producing atomic weapons and nuclear energy, the
USA has 500,000 tonnes of depleted uranium stored, according to official
data. Depleted uranium is radioactive also and has an average lifetime of
4.5 thousand million years. This is why such waste has to be stored safely
for an indefinite period of time, an extremely costly procedure. In order
to save money and empty their tanks, the Department of Defence and Energy
assigns depleted uranium free of charge to national and foreign armament
companies. Apart from the USA, countries like the United Kingdom, France,
Canada, Russia, Greece, Turkey, Israel, the Gulf monarchies, Taiwan, South
Korea, Pakistan or Japan purchase or manufacture weapons with depleted
uranium.
When a projectile hits a target, 70% of its depleted uranium burns
and oxidizes, bursting into highly toxic, radioactive micro particles.
Being so tiny, these particles can be ingested or inhaled after being
deposited on the ground or carried kilometres away by the wind, the food
chain or water. A 1995 technical report issued by the American Army
indicates that "if depleted uranium enters the body, it has the
potentiality of causing serious medical consequences. The associated risk
is both chemical and radiological". Deposited in the lungs or kidneys,
uranium 238 and products from its decay (thorium 234, protactinium and
other uranium isotopes) give off alpha and beta radiations which cause cell
death and genetic mutations causing cancer in exposed individuals and
genetic abnormalities in their descendents over the years.
In its 110,000 air raids against Iraq, the US A-10 Warthog aircraft
launched 940,000 depleted uranium projectiles, and in the land
offensive, its M60, M1 and M1A1 tanks fired a further 4,000 larger caliber
also uranium projectiles.

It is estimated that there are 300 tonnes of radioactive waste in the area
which might have already affected 250,000 Iraqis.
After the Gulf War, Iraqi and international epidemiological
investigations have enabled the environmental pollution due to using this
kind of weapon to be associated with the appearance of new, very difficult
to diagnose diseases (serious immunodeficiencies, for instance) and the
spectacular increase in congenital malformations and cancer, both in the
Iraqi population and amongst several thousands of American and British
veterans and in their children, a clinical condition known as Gulf War
Syndrome. Similar symptoms to those of the Gulf War have been described
amongst a thousand children residing in areas of the former Yugoslavia (Bosnia)
where American aviation also used depleted uranium bombs in 1996, the same
as in the NATO intervention against the Yugoslavia in 1999.

I agree with this. There is a flag waving, blind-patriotism culture perpetuated by propaganda movies romanticizing soldiers in glorified scenes of charisma and camaraderie, culminating in a heroic scene of combat fighting for the good of their country. That is not what is happening in reality. In reality, our soldiers are used to further the agenda of corporations, politicians, bankers and fatten their wallets and it has zero to do with protecting our country or fighting for our freedoms. Yet moms and dads gladly send their young sons and daughters off to the military with visions of Tom Cruise in Top Gun, Ben Affleck and Kate Beckinsale in Pearl Harbor, Charlie Sheen in Platoon, etc.
The naivety of earlier wars and their premise should not exist anymore with the advent of the internet in the information age where at your fingertips you can read the REAL history and reasons. Yet that culture and myth still persists and the sheeple chant "support the troops". Troops who are brainwashed and carrying out agendas that pave the path for politicians and bankers to get their hands on more money rather than protecting the citizens back home.

It's really quite simple. The various responses so far reflect the reality. Problem is, even those doing the posting just don't get it.

Any reflection is just that. A reflection cannot in and of itself manipulate the reflection. Only that being reflected can manipulate the reflection.

One must look beyond the reflection, to the thing being reflected, if one wishes to have a true understanding of the reality of any situation.

"Our Troops" are our brothers and sisters, fathers and mothers, uncles and aunts, who are willing to pay the ultimate price in order to maintain our way of life. These are hard working, honest, devoted individuals who wholeheartedly believe in what they are doing. Please do not degrade the memory of those fallen by belittling the effort of their brethren.

It is not our troops who are to be blamed for the atrocity of the wars we commit.

It is not the troops, who suffer daily the inhumanity of the field of battle, that ordered the wars.

It is not the troops, whose families silently grieve the loss of their loved ones and pray for their safe return, that asked to foreign lands for any purpose.

The reality is this...

It was you and me. We did it.

As our elected leaders plundered our wealth we stood by and did nothing.

As our elected leaders lied to us, and continue to lie to us, about the need for continuing warfare, we humbly accept that this is the way it must be.

As the wealthy few left standing, now naked to the entire world for who they are as they have now taken most of the world's wealth, continue to abase us and rape and pillage what wealth is left, we allow it.

It is us. The US. We are the ones to blame because we sat back in our lazy boys, tuned in HBO, opened a fresh can of beer and said, "screw it!" Irresponsibly believing that we can do nothing about it.

The time for rest is over.

The time for lazy summer days is far behind us.

Time to wake up America! We are responsible.

I am responsible.

What am I going to do?



reply to post by wcitizen

reply to post by wcitizen


I feel much better when I see people like you dare to say that Emperor's New Clothes is actually no cloth.

Thank you + S + F + (fire is for the people who conspire)

Very good post. I agree.
as for Japan and the two nuc’s.
did you know they killed more
with fire bombs on all the other cities.

Here's the truth about the gov written long ago and still going strong on youtube...

.

Since the War, the illegal war in Iraq, I have been saying the same thing. I see red each time I see a ribbon bumper sticker on a car that says..."Support Our Troops" Support our troops? It was known relatively early on that Bush and Friends started a War on Lies and Deceit! They Lied!! and we know they lied! What has been done about these lies? It was said that we the American people are hated because of the Wars we're in... again.. the illegal wars we're in.

We the American People know this!!!! But WE American people do nothing about it!!! Instead we glorify the Military.... what about the Iraqie Reporters that were killed and the film was leaked by Wiki-leaks. What the hell people? Where are these guys that murdered these people and then laughed because kids were brought to a gun fight!!! A one sided GUN FIGHT!!! Whose still angry about that? The Iraqie people for one that lost loved ones that day and every day since this illegal war was started....

Military Men and their families are glorified... I seen a report on a Military guy that lost a leg... he and his family got a new house out of the deal! He loses his leg in a very illegal war...and he get's a house!!! There are sooo many people out there that deserve a house...

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one out there that says.... "Quit saying you're fighting for me and my freedoms...you're not! Quit saying you're going after the terrorist that brought hell to us on 911. If you were then you would be here in the US gathering up those responsible!"

I understand, but not all wars were for nothing. WWII was our last justified war IMO.. I think the Japan thing was fine too they would not have surrendered if we did not own them to such an extent.

All this business in the middle east is f-in stupid though, but I do not see constant peaceful protesting and or destroying D.C. and other government buildings etc to stop it. You must control your government or your government will do what they want.

One more thing: A lot of people go into the .mil because they do not have any other "reasonable" choice. Being poor sucks.

My heart is broken...I can only pray that our incredible men and women in the military serving here and overseas right now are not on this thread. It is sufficiently sad to me there are vets on this thread right now.

I am horrified by the horrific use of language against our military. I felt some kind of pain and then nausea and my hands are shaking right now.

My father flew B-52s in Korea and still suffers PTSD..., my Grandfather infantry in WWII...and I am a Jew whose family lost members in the camps. Oh wait, you are probably the same people that are cool with that. So why would we need the United States military to help us. I owe my life, literally, to the US military. I would not be here. God Bless them all.

"You are fools and beggars to your own demise. We can tell you now, you will need all this military and many more, trained to fight outside earth's atmosphere. God help you all and have mercy on your souls." -Earth Command

Originally posted by whyamIhere
I see your point.

However, I believe you have to distinguish to man from his government.

These very brave men do what they are told.

This is an extremely slippery slope.

edit on 9-8-2011 by whyamIhere because: spelling

Loving and respecting the men and women in uniform, is NOT the same thing as supporting the entity that dictates their action. Let's be clear.

Most of these people joined because they either had no choice (financially, career-wise, etc.) or really believed that they were going to do something honorable and right. Not their fault.

No slippery slope, at all - just a comprehension and association issue. Carry on.


Furthermore...
The hillbillies that live out in the sticks and sing 'God Bless America' on command and worship Toby Keith 'raghead ass-kicking' songs are the people we should watch out for - they perpetuate the illusion that this is the image/resolve of every soldier - I think people would be surprised regarding how many troops are actually, finally waking up to the same realization that this OP/author did.

On the other hand, another way to look at this is, we (our #ty government, and pawns of the government gods) are protecting our WAY OF LIFE (among other things - drug trade, oil, basically resources)... not our 'freedom' - we are the big bully on the block and we need to play this card for as long as we can, 'cause we are no longer the richest, the best looking, or the smartest. A necessary 'evil' whether most of us would like to admit it, or not (*sigh* double edged sword).

reply to post by wcitizen

Q. Can anyone explain in simple english why there are so many wars and so much debt in the world? A. Because wars create debt and debt is desirable and profitable to the super-rich. The interest on your personal debt and on your nation's debt is what makes the super-rich super-rich.

What you are talking about is truth and the people on ATS aren't buying it these days. Most of them like to change things by two different strategies :

1. Giving flowers to politicians and asking them if they could stop TPTB.
2.Lying on the couch , with a cigaret on their lips and claiming : lets change !!!

Generally they are hypnotized and tranquilized , IMHO.

peace-justice-freedom

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by Wyn Hawks

 

Sorry about taking so long to respond.
I had to dig through a bunch of Propaganda to get to the meat and potatoes. Interesting read. Well worth the time.

SCIENCE OR SCIENCE FICTION?
Facts, Myths and Propaganda In the Debate Over Depleted Uranium Weapons

..."wise"?... interesting what you consider not propaganda...

www.wise-uranium.org...

WISE Uranium Project is part of World Information Service on Energy. It covers the health and environmental impacts of uranium mining and nuclear fuel production.

www10.antenna.nl...

WHO IS WISE?

We're small. We're powerful. We're anti-nuclear. We are grass-root oriented. And we are proud of what we have achieved. We are anxious to go on, serving people with important information and skills. We have existed since 1978, in a small office with seven people working at WISE Amsterdam.

We do research. On request. Mostly paid, but also for free, depending on the organization which commissions the research.

...emphasis above is mine... wise mostly produces research via contract... interesting, huh?... doesnt it make you wonder who their contract clients are?...

reply to post by wcitizen


And we have a B I N G O!!!!!!!

The military is the mercenary arms of corporations. Of course just about everyone who fights in the military does so for the best of reasons, and I admire them. But we are the bully in the world, and the world is finally fighting back.

Semper fi, right? Always faithful to what/who? The constitution? The nation? With all the evidence, facts and leaked info (noting that there is vast suppression of war reports) how can anyone defend the reason and enforcement of these wars. At this point in the game if you are still following orders to kill for the overlords for blood money (whatever reason, ie no jobs or whatever) then you are part of the problem. One thing is to be misinformed, but to be that willfully blind at this stage is not believable. Some posters on this thread reek of an agenda, specially with their post history relentlessly defending the plutocracy vs the working class.

reply to post by angelchanneller

I am horrified by the horrific use of language against our military. I felt some kind of pain and then nausea and my hands are shaking right now.

I think it is better to be horrified in this world than the other world that your hands are tied