The NA and AA program.

It would be nice to get some opinions from people inside and outside the program. I spent almost a year in this program. I had a sponsor. I worked the first three steps with him. I spilled my guts and put an effort into something I felt was my last chance. I started in the program fresh out of jail and homeless on the streets. Times had become desperate for me and it was time to make a change. Throughout my extended stay... I went to over 90 meetings in 90 days. All at the age of 22 I showed a lot of commitment to change. The people I hurt had finally turned there backs. I was alone and looking for a friend. I cannot deny that in my most desperate and lonely times these people where there for me. For that I am grateful. They helped me get off the streets within three months. I had two fairly difficult jobs but no right to complain. I moved into my own one bedroom and started with nothing. Wow the love and support I received was a blessing. Quickly things were turning around for me and I could smile again. As I stayed sober I regained composure and people started coming back into my life. Today I am truly grateful for these things.

This is where I disagree with the program and start to despise it.

Things started looking up for me. Opportunities started to arise. I chose to start drinking occasionally with friends and co-workers. I am young and it was very very difficult to admit that if at some point I was addicted to a substance that destroyed me therefore I was addicted to every mood changing mind altering substance. I at 22 was not about to admit that. I understand the circumstances of people that are 50 and spent thirty years addicted to a substance. I spent two, three years addicted to a particular drug. I also have an extreme family background of drug abuse and violence and so forth. These people who are my biological parents gave birth to me addicted to drugs. From what I have read a lot of drugs. So my thing at first was to blame them. I can't describe to any of you the childhood and adolescence that my sisters and I were subjected to. Today do I blame anything on this? No. So this is what gets me. Because I try and take my relationships very seriously. Why after a year of crying and sharing and just enjoying something beautiful with other people do people still abandon you? I clearly made some decisions to use alcohol and smoke. I open my heart to people and get # on. These people should understand more than anyone the importance of a friendship. Thats all you have in those rooms. To this day I have continued to turn down the drugs I abused. I have no interest. I felt all the pain I needed to feel. Just wish that friendship and love truly would trump everything. I needed a friend bad and through the program I found two people that I will hold dear to me forever. But because I am not apart of the program there is no interest no nothing. So I have become bitter and angry. I have some older friends that experienced this through the program. Today because I have chosen to be something different. I am. Not because of the program. Towards the end it started to feel like a way for people to excuse there actions with a prognosis of addiction.

There are two sides to me.

1. I am grateful for the temporary friendship and guidance.
2. I am in regret for the time and energy I put into the people. Because it no longer exists.

I wanna know about your experience and if you think this program is a waste or productive.

Welcome, and 1st off...please hold with all the exclamation points...it make you appear to be yelling. Good luck to you as well, and looking forward to your postings(please do not YELL!!!!!!!!! so much)
Lazlo

reply to post by LazloFarnsworth


I took it away. It got your attention. No more yelling unless I have something to yell about.

HI, nice to hear your doing well. I spent almost a year in NA and like you i am grateful the program was there. As soon as i quit going any friends i had made there quickly dissolved (even though i still do not use). Maybe they were not real friends anyway.

reply to post by Bokaforo
Welcome, Boka. My grandfather used to say "too soon old, too late smart.' Re-read your first paragraph and that should answer your question. I believe AA to be one of the greatest success stories in modern history, and the men who pioneered the program are a fascinating story in themselves. I applaud your progress and wish you the best of luck in your future endeavors, but as you grow older I think you will better understand why you feel the way you do today. Don't burn your bridges.

reply to post by ProPain



You must admit your addiction to everything to be apart. It is just unfortunate. I put too much effort into worthless things.

reply to post by dillweed


I never had a lot of bridges to burn. But I burned them. I guess if I ever decided to go back those people will still be there. I just believe I can do something different. I know this program has changed peoples lives forever. I have been to huge seminars even contemplated going to the world NA convention this year. But its beyond me. I am living without hurting myself or people that care about me. I stay spiritual. Most important I stay honest.

reply to post by Bokaforo


I wouldnt say it was worthless. ive seen the program do miracles, read your first paragraph again and you might agree. The program isnt for everyone. And i agree having to admit your addicted to everything is hard to accept, the biggest reason i dont go anymore.

reply to post by ProPain


Its just sad to me. Who knows maybe ill indulge in something else that brings me to my bottom but I honestly believe that I can prevent that. I am more upset at the amount of effort I put in. Like I said in a time of desperation they were there when no one was. I just live my life that way. I have been hurt over and over again but I will still open my heart and always be there for someone. Thats all I ask from anyone else. Love in this world is so hard to come by.

Originally posted by Bokaforo
reply to post by dillweed

 

I never had a lot of bridges to burn. But I burned them. I guess if I ever decided to go back those people will still be there. I just believe I can do something different. I know this program has changed peoples lives forever. I have been to huge seminars even contemplated going to the world NA convention this year. But its beyond me. I am living without hurting myself or people that care about me. I stay spiritual. Most important I stay honest.

I congratulate you for your desire to seek life again as it was the hardest thing I ever did.

However, you are totally delusional and obviously do not understand the power of an addicted mind.

#1. Alcohol lowers inhibitions in EVERYBODY...Including YOU!!!

It only takes a moment of weakness to fall down again.

#2. You have to understand, it is very difficult for someone who loves you let go and turn their back on a loved one.

Just because your currently not on whatever is not enough of an apology.

#3. Famous last words are those similar to yours that you just want a few drinks as that is not what you were addicted to previously. You can handle it right?

#4. I would guess that your "I know better than you.." mentality and denial that the problem is you shows that you have an addiction prone brain chemistry.

#5. Have you sat down completely sober and asked any of these friend, family and loved ones why there is conflict?

Your search here of random unknown people to support your beliefs is a serious cry for help.

You already know that you had a problem, now you must understand that the recovery is long, hard and never enjoyable. i.e. you still have a problem

You need to talk to your loved ones and seek additional professional help or just drink it up and watch it all dissipate (or you may never see it because your to #'d up to realize).

Final words, you will find very very very few that will still be friends & loved one after you fall off the wagon again.

There Is So Much More To Life Than Being Numb...SEEK

My sister was in AA, took it very seriously and was all about the meetings and whatnot. She did AA instead of NA because NA wasn't really available in her area.

The problem was, then all of her friends were drug addicts. At one point or another, most of them relapsed - and when one would, a few more would go down, like dominoes. Her sponsor even relapsed, and she had to find another one.

She eventually relapsed also, and it was two years in prison that got her clean. The best part was, she didn't go to jail for something she had done - she was high and wasn't paying attention to what the people around her were doing. So she finally learned that bad acquaintances can ruin you. She is so terrified of having to return that she won't touch anything, and she is rebuilding her life.

And in her case also, it was all built around AA. Once you weren't really participating anymore, you were out.

It's very similar to any church you might join, in that respect.

I'm sure it works great for some people, but it hasn't worked for anyone I know. Not long term.

i had to do 90 meetings in 90 days by court order after my second dui.
it was the biggest waste of time. sitting in that room listening to how many others that happen to be there at the time, crying about this that or the other. just made me want to drink more. had the sponsor, got the chips and it still made no difference. did my 90 and never went back. i had to stay sober for at least a year to get my license back. and also realized that if i got one more no more license and jail time, that was enough for me. here in florida
it makes on difference how long in between the dui's come. 1st one was age 26, second at 34, i'm now 48.
been clean and sober 14 years on my on.

both sides of my family have a addiction problem, it is passed on. although my mother nor my father, have ever been drinkers or drug users, many of their siblings, their father or mother, aunts uncles or grandparents did. now i guess that if i look at some of their other habits it might be considered to be addiction. addiction come in many forms and some people don't realize that they are addicts.

you don't have to sit and listen to others cry and wine about being addicted, to a substance or behavior in order to give it up. you just have to want to and do it. and as far as having support, yes some people will be there for you, but in the end it is you who has to do it. people will not always be there and you have to live with your self.

also i forgot to tell you you have to stay away from those that you used to party with, your gonna want to party to, just like the good ol days. you can't, many of the friend were life long and had a hard time understanding why i couldn't hang out with them. that sucked, but it's you who will suffer if you don't stay away and it will drive you to the point of picking up that drink or firing on that fatty.

stay away from slippery places and you won't fall

reply to post by EyeHeartBigfoot


I agree with some of this. I don't enjoy drinking. I do it occasionally. I would never find myself drinking away problems or else I would have already turned to it. I may have some addictive traits but why must I live my life walking on eggshells waiting to relapse hard. Or maybe it becomes important enough to someone to just choose that there are more important things to hold on to. I was always scared to be honest. Two times I have packed my bags and moved to the streets. Each time I have persevered. By learning. The only person teaching me is me. Stay honest.

Can I ask a question for clarification?

Are you blaming the program for the loss of friends and family? I guess I don't understand.

Also, I think that if friends and family left again because you had a drink, it was out of fear of them being hurt again.....

Addiction sucks, you know this... and you know that it hurts far more than just you. I am thinking that if people left again, it was out of fear that you were going back to how you used to be.

Originally posted by Bokaforo
reply to post by EyeHeartBigfoot

 

I agree with some of this. I don't enjoy drinking. I do it occasionally. I would never find myself drinking away problems or else I would have already turned to it. I may have some addictive traits but why must I live my life walking on eggshells waiting to relapse hard. Or maybe it becomes important enough to someone to just choose that there are more important things to hold on to. I was always scared to be honest. Two times I have packed my bags and moved to the streets. Each time I have persevered. By learning. The only person teaching me is me. Stay honest.

WoW!

did you read this before posting?

Only you believe you are walking on eggshells.

Homeless by choice???

my friend, you need help.

Making excuses and placing blame will never help you find happiness.

Do you have any life goals or objectives other than denial?

Your not looking for answers here, your looking for sympathy.

Honestly, best of luck...you will need it

reply to post by EyeHeartBigfoot


You seem to be confused. I place no blame on anyone. Sympathy?!?! I don't need or want sympathy. I was simply stating my decisions consequences. And my choice to not make the same decisions because I realize the importance of people that care about you. When I left the program I had a lot of peoples doubts and even people going far out enough to say that I will see you again in a year. Now thats not positive and made me walk away in fear that I could relapse at any point. If you only knew what you were talking about. I have no excuses to give anyone. I have dealt with my decisions like a man. I expect not sympathy. I was homeless because of my choices. What if I told you that I have a deep appreciation for the people that showed me tough love. I could not be more grateful for this. A deep appreciation. You are lost in your assumptions about what I was looking for in this post.

reply to post by gimme_some_truth


I am only talking about my sponsor family. Not anybody outside of that group. I just developed a bond with a couple of them. When I made my decision to do something different I was dropped as a friend. I only wish I had there general support in life. But I only received negative support and a shunning from most of the people in the group. I'm gonna be ok either way. Just wish I could have stayed friends with some of them. When it was explained to me....They could not have a relationship with me because of their fear of relapse. When i was apart of that circle that was your only circle.

I worked the three steps

It's a 12 step program buddy.

reply to post by rom12345


I am not in jail or living on the streets buddy. I am aware that there are twelve steps. Thanks.

I was never a member of AA, but I did attend several meetings. I was active in Al-Anon (a spin off of AA for the families of alcholics). I went to the AA meetings to see the other side of the coin. All being said, here are my conclusions.

1) The people in Al-Anon were more screwed up than those in AA. At least the people in AA knew they were screwed up. Most people in Al-Anon were in denial.
2) The books (either, both) are great. Read them. Even if you don't attend AA meetings, the books will help you out, both with regards to substance abuse, work relationships, and family relationships.
3) A great deal of members ignore what is in the book and start preaching their own messages. I have seen some seriously screwed up people talking about how great they are, how well they are, how much they are living life... and all because they go to 14 (or more) meetings a week. (How exactly is this living life?)
4) Take note, some of the Al-Anon stories don't seem to match the message in the book. Do not take every story as literal.
5) If you spend more time at meetings than you do living your life, you are not following what the message in the books are about.

I ended up dropping out of Al-Anon because of the stupidity of the groups (I tried several out). For example, my very first day, I was assigned a sponser. (Think, real life Eeyore). All I heard was him complaining about how difficult it was to get out of bed and make the kids breakfast, and it talked in a monotone. (Why bother.... ) UGH!

I found out around my third meeting (took me time to read the book), that the gangleaders of the group (who expressed they have been members for ooooh so very long, and therefore they areright about everything) bullied people into doing their interpretation of the book - that distinctly contradicted what was written. What happened was a great deal of broken hearts and miserable members who felt they had to attend meetings to be well - when, in my opinion, the meetings themselves made them sicker.

Take what you can from AA. Learn from it. There are valuable lessons in that book. However, remember - every single person in that room is mentally ill (by definition), and as such, you shouldn't listen to the people in the room unless you want to. Keep an open mind. Keep that book on hand. And understand that what works for one person may not work for you. AA is supposed to be about teaching you to live your life, not controlling your life through meetings.