How to end illegal immigration in a month, its incredably simple.

Originally posted by haarvik
Here is what I send to businesses, and specifically to the FF chains:

Due to your compromising of American laws and traditions, I will no longer be patronizing any of your establishments. Until you enforce immigration compliance, and also stop enforcing bi-lingual (spanish) practices I will not spend one more dime with your business. Your business practices hurt Americans looking for work, and you degrade our countries traditions by requiring employees to be bi-lingual. you print and advertize in the US with spanish. We are NOT Mexico! I am encouraging everyone I know to follow suit and hopefully your bottom line will feel this. We Americans are fed up with our country being overrun by illegal immigrants, and more so identify businesses such as your with aiding and abetting this.

We should have done that to your ancestors as well.
Gee, I wonder if that makes you realize that the root problem isn't what you think it is.

If you are fed up with illegals then why aren't you *FED* up with the fed? (no pun intended)
If you are you failed to mention that in your post.

If you aren't: then you should have no business whining about illegals when your ancestors were ALL illegal.

Originally posted by poet1b
As far as legal immigration goes, I think it would be political suicide to increase legal immigration at this time. Once a back issue, immigration is now one of the biggest issues out there.

Question for you.

Let's take the phrase "biggest issues" out of the equation, since, as we all know
the vast majority of Americans are told what to bitch, whine and complain about, k?

I want to ask you directly:

-Do you and why do you pay a federal income tax?
-Do you and why do you have a driver's license and PAY a fee to re-register your car each year?
-Are you aware of the implications doled out towards you by using a SSN as identification as a "person?"


Why you ask, did I ask you these questions?

Because sir.

See, THOSE are *THE* real issues REAL Americans are concerned about.
This is not an opinion and therefore is not debatable, sorry to say.

Illegal immigration is NOTHING compared to what your reps and congressman have done
with YOUR own money....see that?

How did you find out about illegal immigration and the data figures?
Were you spoon fed this information and told about it? I wonder?


If America would just keep focusing on THEIR own damn issues....we wouldn't have to
GO FIGHT useless wars that kill OUR brothers each day, week, month and year!


I wonder what YOU have to say to that?

reply to post by Chinesis


This is not the America it once was! We are trillions of dollars in debt. and our people are being displaced by millions of illegals. The Feds have failed miserably in doing their jobs!

Originally posted by Night Star
reply to post by Chinesis

 

This is not the America it once was! We are trillions of dollars in debt. and our people are being displaced by millions of illegals. The Feds have failed miserably in doing their jobs!

Completely in complete disagreement. Why?

Since the issue at the core is all about "contracts" ask yourself did you agree to be bound under
the 14th amendment, to become a 2nd class of citizen with ONLY granted privileges (instead of right?) Nope.

See full disclosure.

However, since mostly everyone doesn't know that our own government SOLD you out as a baby
and attached a bankruptcy note: indefinitely making YOU liable for a debt you never incurred...

Many people "THINK" *due to perception and what they are told...that this is a NEW AMERICA!


If you beLIEve this, then America as we knew it WILL be gone.
Each time you like a post on facebook, become hungry to eat frozen foods, processed pizzas,
too high in sugar drinks, genetically modified crap, and just REFUSE to treat the CAUSE of all of our problems
(instead just addressing a symptom) we will all be voluntary slaves to a system of greed and horse sh!te...

We all rise up together? Or?
Yes, it's that simple....we all fall down.

Originally posted by Chinesis

Question for you.

I want to ask you directly:

-Do you and why do you pay a federal income tax?

Because we live in cooperative society, and we have a Federal Government that needs money to do it's job. THERE ARE NO DOUBT EXTREME FAILURES IN SPENDING OUR TAX MONEY, and there needs to be extreme fixes and corrections to fix that, and many people are working towards that.
I'll reciprocate with a question 'Why has the United States of America been the leader in productivity, quality of living, efficiency, and the single country everybody in the world dreamed about getting to, for the last century?'

We've been paying taxes all along!
AGAIN, nobody questions there are some fixes that need to happen (for the same reasons, exploitation of a system designed for honest people and corporations.)..

-Do you and why do you have a driver's license and PAY a fee to re-register your car each year?

Of course, I know there is this movement to try to convince you we don't need any of that (read *anarchy*), but there are roadway costs, and if you don't have some kind of system set-up, people take advantage of it or are just so 'stupid' that they endanger others on the road.
There has to be some kind of regulation; although, that too can be overdone, and we as citizens have to keep those lines clear to our leaders.

-Are you aware of the implications doled out towards you by using a SSN as identification as a "person?"

That's a gray area, I understand your point, but have you ever had to keep track of say 100 people, or a 1000 with many of the same name? How as a finance person are going to do that?
a good memory, a good handle on this John smith is from here and that John Smith is from there, there had to be an enumerated system, no way around it...
I'm not entirely thrilled that it has turned into a universal ID system (in fact it is/was LAW that it couldn't beyond the government's usage), and there has been an aggressive push to not use it as a universal ID... I don't have to use it for Medical services any more, they ask for it, I say no, here is my insurance number, and they say OK, good enough...
It's just a readily available identifier, if you want to operate in our modern society, you have to be uniquely identified (or else some one will take your stuff, (identify theft) another BIG issue to be addressed.)

Why you ask, did I ask you these questions?

Well, based on the questions, you only have a very shallow understanding of the issue, and are trying to throw out emotionally charged issues to deflect the issue of ILLEGAL aliens..
surprised you didn't throw abortion in there too...


So, there are many many issues that USA citizens need to work on and address.
Illegal Aliens is an issue that has been building, and now with the economy and job situation, is very close to home. Something we have to see every day we go to the grocery store, library, and hospitals.
An issue that is long over due to address, and now is the right time.

reply to post by querious


Saying we live in a cooperative society DOES NOT answer the question, you have already failed
at interjecting with an unsuccessful answer not originally directed towards you, but thanks for trying.

2nd, we have a government, who is supposed to be for the people, and actually governed by the people.
I could care less how far we've fallen (if that would be your basis for a retort) because despite your (failed) attempt
to answer the question(s) posed: you are nowhere NEAR the truth.

See, the FEDERAL income tax does NOT (read it again) DOES NOT get apportioned and divided amongst the
people. In fact: it DOES get used towards the national debt with not a SINGLE cent spent on:

-our military
-roads and highways
-infrastructure
-schools nor ANY other service you have presumed to be supported by said tax.

You lose again sir.

The system is broken and has been thanks first in part to Abraham Lincoln...
If you don't know, you might want to research our REAL American his-story and not
the accepted consensus that he somehow freed the slaves when in fact he told them
to shove it and GTFO of America UNLESS they stayed to work (hence the term voluntary servitude)


Regulation? It's pretty simple.
Common law is all the regulation "people" need.
Your country has to keep lowering the bar because it contributes to the mass dumbing down of America period.

Since you don't understand how things work (and you don't) allow me:

-We all have the RIGHT to travel.
-If it's proficiency you seek, that would have nothing to do with the right to travel but it would have more
to do with a license to drive (a privilege) and since the obviousness of the matter pertains to:

-being respectful towards other people and their property, recompensing damage caused is in order.

Do you even know which taxes pay for our roads?
(hint: it is NOT the federal income tax) and 2nd, there is NO LAW compelling the average American to pay.

(another hint: the IRS tax code isn't law) it only has the force of law, but I take it this is news to you?


The government needs not to keep track of its people. That is the point.
The right to privacy is at the heart of the matter. I don't need "papers" and this isn't Nazi Germany. Is it?

The only news you know is the news you're told and provided. Right?
K, then...so what do you suppose is the purpose here when ALL major carriers provide the SAME
news??? It couldn't be a conflict of interest, could it?


The fact you provide an insurance number is a testament that you are a person of the eState, and
that you are a slave by definition, a corporate instrument that is used to conduct business with other corporations. You were born bankrupt. Your registrar seal on your birth cert confirms this.

What is a registrar for? (Property)

Since you are content with having your rights taken there isn't really much to say here.


EACH and every person has the right to CHOOSE what they wish to do with their bodies. PERIOD.
I don't give 2 sh$ts if you don't "think so." Because if you believe in God: let him judge, and go about your business. The same with gays. A man being with another man doesn't marginalize your faith anymore than a woman who chooses to keep or "kill" her unborn child ruin your experience with your beliefs.


The issue with people is that it's widely known that you can easily create a conflict by
dividing them based on stupid/trivial things like: religion, politics or anything where one might believe differently than another. Too easy to manipulate, just as you are being manipulated by our very own government and your excuse is:

we need roads, and we enjoy being @1 in productivity, quality of living and being the center piece of the known galaxy!!!


You want a Rolex.
An Ethiopian wants food/water.
You want roads.
A little African kid would love a 20ounce soda or two for new sandals.

Doesn't it sting just a little?

reply to post by Chinesis


Actually no it doesn't. These people have the same opportunity to change their country the same as our forefathers did. But it takes some big nads to do it. It won't happen on it's own. If they don't change their country, then that is their fault, not mine. I have no sympathy for them, the same as I have no sympathy for those in our country who sit back and complain but do nothing. If these people wanted a better life they would change the status quot in their country. But no, it's much easier to exploit another nation.

reply to post by Chinesis

If you aren't: then you should have no business whining about illegals when your ancestors were ALL illegal.

I am so sick of hearing this racist lie thrown up, along with the whole claim that our ancestors just got lucky. It is nothing but a pathetic excuse for immigrants to walk all over the people of the U.S. who founded this great country.

Sorry pal, but when my ancestors came to the new world, there was no U.S.. The world was completely controlled by kings and emperors and brutal war lords. Slavery and other savagery was common everywhere. My ancestors helped create the U.S. and build this great nation, the first nation to recognize individual rights, and promote opportunity for all. My ancestors were never illegal immigrants, because there was no nation to migrate to, and the whole world wasn't beating a path to get into the promise land, because there was no promise land of milk and honey.

The U.S. was viewed as a wilderness with violent savages and harsh winters. South America was considered far better, with the tropical climates, and the native populations completely enslaved. Still, Spanish women for the most part refused to go to the new world. After it became known that the world's oceans could be crossed, many nations came to the new world, but very few succeeded in establishing colonies. Survival in the U.S. was very difficult, and a very hard way of life.

Stop trashing my ancestors because your ancestors failed to establish a civilization that respected individual rights.

reply to post by Chinesis


Sorry, but I have been hearing this nonsense probably before you were a twinkle in your daddy's eye. Considering this has been used as propaganda since Christ was a corporal, I can only assume that you think you are making some kind of revelation, because you don't know how old this stuff is. Let me add, that the people who fed you this line of crappola did not have good intentions.

-Do you and why do you pay a federal income tax?
-Do you and why do you have a driver's license and PAY a fee to re-register your car each year?
-Are you aware of the implications doled out towards you by using a SSN as identification as a "person?"

I will give you the short version.

Income tax was only supposed to be paid for by the wealthy, because wealth tax is too difficult to enforce. The reason is that most of what the fed does is for the benefit of the wealthy, especially back in the day when most people were completely independent on their farms. The system has been badly badly abused since then.

We have drivers licenses in order to use public roads, but lets face it, the taxes we pay to maintain our roads have been misappropriated for decades. This issue falls into the category above, where working class people and small business owners have slowly been forced to subsidize corporations.

The whole SSN issue is nothing but pure nonsense, not even worth discussing. Considering DNA id, really a joke.

My relationship with illegal immigration is far more up front and close. You are the one who doesn't know squat.

Ever hear of the Monroe doctrine?

The U.S. used to be quite isolationist. Then people from around the world began asking us for help. You will probably choose to ignore that reality, but it is what it is. Now we play the worlds policeman, and have gotten screwed in the process.

What a surprise we want to close our borders and isolate ourselves from the world.

Here is a reality they didn't teach you about in propaganda school.

If we didn't have immigrants to the U.S., there would not have been Saudis on our planes to hijack them (or take the blame for hijacking them) and crash them into the WTC, giving the PTB the excuse to start another war.

So YEAH, immigration is possibly our biggest problem. I would say step one in untangling ourselves from the mess that is the third world. Why should we allow ourselves to continue to be the destination point for the world's problems (refugees). We were far better off before we allowed our nation to become over ran with immigrants.

What do we get for it? Lots of people telling us how terrible our ancestors were, and how everything we got is because we just got lucky. No good deed goes unpunished.

reply to post by poet1b


No doubt, I'm tired of the constantly regurgitated argument about how we took this land.

There was no civilization, just various nomadic tribes; as you pointed out our ancestors/settlers of the USA brought individual rights, and formed this great country.

There is no doubt, if we hadn't, it would have VERY soon after words by another already established nation, like England/Spain/France or a combination -- the continent and the world was lucky to have had our nation subjugate these lands, to provide balance in the world from the global aspirations of those nations at the time.

reply to post by Chinesis

Since the issue at the core is all about "contracts" ask yourself did you agree to be bound under
the 14th amendment, to become a 2nd class of citizen with ONLY granted privileges (instead of right?) Nope.

That is another trojan horse, BS argument, spread to send people on snipe hunts.

States and local governments are the authorities far more likely to abuse your rights. They are the people who want to tell you what you can or can not do with your partner in bed. That local judge has so much authority over you, and you are clueless to the reality. The people who feed you this 14th amendment manure want to give that local judge ( to whom they are probably related) even more authority over your life, by making the fed the bogey man. Last thing they want is some outsider interfering with how they abuse the local population.

reply to post by querious


Yepper. While there were many atrocities committed against the tribes of North America by the pioneers (and atrocities committed by tribes against pioneers and other tribes), the truth is that those tribes were treated better than most third world nations treat their own populations to this very day.

The native tribes of the U.S. now live in the country where everyone else on the planet wishes they lived, while most of those other conquered tribes, AROUND THE GLOBE, still live in horrible conditions.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by Chinesis

 

Since the issue at the core is all about "contracts" ask yourself did you agree to be bound under
the 14th amendment, to become a 2nd class of citizen with ONLY granted privileges (instead of right?) Nope.

That is another trojan horse, BS argument, spread to send people on snipe hunts.

States and local governments are the authorities far more likely to abuse your rights. They are the people who want to tell you what you can or can not do with your partner in bed. That local judge has so much authority over you, and you are clueless to the reality. The people who feed you this 14th amendment manure want to give that local judge ( to whom they are probably related) even more authority over your life, by making the fed the bogey man. Last thing they want is some outsider interfering with how they abuse the local population.

I'm not tracking you guys on this one. I don't see the granting of rights from the 14th amendment (I read protection of rights):
Can you explain please?

---------

The US Constitution: 14th Amendment
Fourteenth Amendment to the US Constitution - Rights Guaranteed Privileges and Immunities of Citizenship, Due Process and Equal Protection
AMENDMENT XIV of the UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION

Passed by Congress June 13, 1866. Ratified July 9, 1868.

Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
continued
-------------------

No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States;
I read that as only in positive direction, meaning if the USA has law allowing freedom for something (say buy/sell goods) a State can't make law to prevent it.
But if USA makes law saying you can't do something, like say smoke tobacco, a State can still pass law to allow it.

So, need some clarification, on my Constitutional Law understanding.

reply to post by Chinesis


This propaganda nonsense is sooo old, it almost isn't worth replying to, but to hit on some major points.

First, you know nothing about U.S. history, and clearly almost everything you have been told is a lie.

Lincoln did in fact free the slaves, and to succeed in America, like everywhere else on the planet, you either have to work, or find someone willing to support you.

The U.S. has enjoyed the highest standard of living on the planet almost consistently, since before Lincoln, and after, so your argument that Lincoln screwed everything up is absurd to the point of nonsense.

It is true that we were doing far better prior to Reagan and Bush sneaking into the white house, but obviously these problems were created long after Lincoln established his legacy.

This following statement really puts things into perspective.

The fact you provide an insurance number is a testament that you are a person of the eState, and
that you are a slave by definition, a corporate instrument that is used to conduct business with other corporations.

Who convinced you that you were a slave?

If you have a SSN, then this is exactly what you are saying.

If you think you are a slave, then you are a slave, so someone convinced you to be a slave, which is probably why you believe all this nonsense. That person is either fooled by the same people who have fooled you, or is not your friend.

If you are a U.S. citizen, even if you have a SSN, you have more freedom than anyone in any other country in the world, if you know how to take advantage of it.

If you are convinced that you are a slave, then you aren't going to be capable of exercising the freedoms at your disposal.

I hope this information wakes you up.

reply to post by querious


Somebody, somewhere, are some point in time, came up with this line of bull that the 14th amendment takes away your U.S. citizenship, and makes you a citizen of the District of Colombia, and therefore eliminates your rights, and makes everyone a slave. This nonsense probably goes back to the post civil war era.

I don't know why people buy into this, because basically, they are telling themselves that they are slaves.

I imagine you could find quite a bit about this myth by searching on the internet.

Originally posted by querious

Originally posted by drock905
The idea sounds good on paper and I'm for it but it wouldn't work
Americans like cheap food more then they are willing to admit. Eliminating the immigrant work force would have a dramatic effect on the cost of food.

Until the country is willing to pay 4x the price for bread nothing will change. America is built on the exploitation of the lower classes which isn't going to change anytime soon..

Sorry, that is just utter B.S.

While I agree there is much exploitation going on, and things need to be fixed, in terms of profit sharing and wages.

But using legal American workers will not dramatically increase the cost of our food, vast majority is done by machinery; plucking the product from the field is just a small part of the cost.

A business paying someone 2 or 3 times more then what they currently paying thier workforce to get a job done won't affect the prices we pay you say? So you think those farmers are just going to suckup the cost increase in thier labor force?

Originally posted by Procession101
A business paying someone 2 or 3 times more then what they currently paying thier workforce to get a job done won't affect the prices we pay you say? So you think those farmers are just going to suckup the cost increase in thier labor force?

edit on 9-6-2011 by Procession101 because: (no reason given)

First, it's probably not 2to3 times more, I'm curious to see what the actual rate is for illegal Ag workers. Especially now, people are desperate for jobs at any rate (it has to be at least legal minimum though), so I'm sure it will be more, but how much more in today's climate?

Second, the Ag sector is *extremely* regulated, and the amounts produced per field product picker is great, so cost averaging the cost will only increase the amounts a bit.
So, the regulation can be adjusted to allow fallow fields (to maintain costs/supply on market) to be activated, lowering the overall cost for the product.

Our system works well, when everybody follows the rules/laws.

edit to add:
I think the main point is the hidden costs and impact on our social system (welfare, schools, hospitals, .. infrastructure) that they use and over saturate without paying into.

When you put that aspect into the cost of wages and product, it far exceeds the savings of 'cheap labor'... only 1 person (the hiring) company saves money, the rest of us get screwed.

reply to post by Procession101


Gee, how did we ever survive before large numbers of illegals came into our country?

I guess nobody could afford to buy fruits and vegetables back in the day before illegal immigration was ignored.

reply to post by querious


Let me give you an example. A news story was done on the migrant farm workers in NC. According to WRAL, they are GUARANTEED 40 hours per week at $10/hr. The farmer must also provide their housing. Now tell me someone who is homeless would not kill for this deal!

reply to post by openminded2011


Imho the US tacitly allows illegal immigration from the south as a quid pro quo arrangement with the govts down there so they carry on the immensely destabilizing war on drugs and stay in the US sphere of influence, the folk who leave the South and the money they send back is a huge cash boost to the Mexican and other Latin govts.