Comet Elenin: A news letter from NASA

Originally posted by lestweforget
reply to post by chr0naut

 

A more realistic view would be that NASA is only publishing amateur astronomers that agree, since when do NASA publish anything that they do not agree with? Seriously what a weak post!

I see, so how would NASA prevent me from publishing online my astrometric measurement of Elenin's position the other night had it shown the comet to be out of place? It didn't though, and that can only mean one thing; the comet's not going to hit us.

Originally posted by Logman
I can't wait unt until Elenin passes by and then every doomsdayer can be laughed off this site.

Sss If you try to laugh every dooms dayer off this site. You'll be the only one going anywhere. Straight to the looney bin............... laden.

reply to post by AlwaysStoned


Nightfall (Asimov short story)

If you have not already.......A must read... so very relevant......and quite frightening if you see that scenario as a real possibility.......as in this story, by the master of sci fi, the subjects do not need an actual outside threat yet only a perceived threat to "go insane" kill each other, burn all of their cities to the ground and otherwise create their own mass extinction event.

Imagine if the Sun went black, seemed to burn out completely and this lasted for for ehhh, 24 hours or so......
It might not matter wether it shone brightly the next day or not as there might not be anything left of us to shine light upon...

Shock is just one example of temporary insanity and I have experienced it first hand which occurred right after a real bad car wreck that I was involved in... 120+ miles an hour, we split the car into two pieces, long story......and long after it is gone the PTSD never sleeps.... Once you get to this point you simply must be aware of what your mind is capable of and limit your exposure to billigerent people who will force you to rip their FN heads off otherwise you may end up spending alot of time thinking about your crime behind bars

So, our fear alone, wether justified or not, could be all that it takes... and now simply imagine a brown dwarf star entering our solar system..... do you think it would be on the news? nasa?
_______
changing gears and not talking directly to Always Stoned now

In my opinion, TRULY HONESTLY, both sides of this debate are beneficial and serve a purpose yet the diametrically opposed attitudes of the most fervent believers and deniers is not beneficial.

Keep on creating theories and the other side keep on poking holes in them yet ultimately... do not stop...please as everything might literally depend on our ability to communicate, think critically and otherwise go on, further up or down the spiral......

reply to post by OverMan


Thank you very much for your input,and i don't know what to think of this comet right now...i just see that humanity is going the wrong way,and i believe in God.
Lets all just try to be better people no matter what is going to happen in the future,we have nothing to lose,only a beautiful future to look into

reply to post by AlwaysStoned


I am travelling to the future all the time. I can't stop it!

Seriously, if all available data, verified personally and by many other reputable people, disagrees with your theories, then they need to be reviewed.

I can find no valid data that identifies that this comet is any sort of threat to my life or health, or is likely to become one over the next few years.

Remember those who said that comet Hale-Bopp was going to take them away to the stars and took poison?

What you are espousing is exactly the same as what the Heavens Gate people suicided over.

Read some actual history, do some actual scientific investigation (perhaps shut down your computer and go join an amateur astronomy group) and actually deny ignorance.

The world is full of real, important and sinister conspiracies. This comet isn't one of them.

reply to post by chr0naut


Can people make a planet from nothing?Can they make a man out of nothing?Can they make anything out of nothing for that matter?Do people know everything and see everything?
I think you know answers on those questions...God is the only way,and his children have turned their back on him...
Expect anything in the near future and be true to yourselves and to God,for he is almighty,and read Bible because you will find comfort in his words

Peace

reply to post by lestweforget

You tube hoaxers and doomsday cultists? Really? Is that what you really think? So what term do you have for us regular ATS members who like to discuss the possibility we are not being told the truth or the full story by our illustrious leaders?

That would depend on how they approach a particular topic. If they bring genuine research and critical analysis to an issue, I would call them "intelligent," even if I disagree with their conclusions. If they unquestioningly parrot what they've seen on YouTube I would call them "gullible," even if I agree with their beliefs. If they distort the truth in pursuit of an agenda, I generally call them "liars."

Its obvious why we are regularly here, why are you and Weedwacker and Stereologist and a few other clingons constantly returning as soon as someone recieves some support for a post? Like clockwork!

Because it is obvious you are here to exploit the gullible; you sound far too intelligent to believe the claptrap you've posted here.

Does an alarm go off in your office when the word Nibiru is mentioned on ATS?

That would be cool, but then I'd never get any sleep.

What do you bring to these topics other than what you have been told by NASA?

Logic, reason,observation, half a century of life experience and intellectual honesty.

To NASA sceptics such as myself you bring nothing!

Correction, you have firmly closed your mind to anything that challenges your beliefs.

I doubt you believe you are here to provide a necessary service, to help the misguided see the truth. Look at all your posts and stars where are all your flags? Have you ever posted a personal theory? Thats right you bring nothing but textbook material. How do you keep up with NASA and their constant alterations?

What service do you feel that you are providing? Are stars and flags a reflection of what is true, or just strokes for the ego. Why do you ask if I have ever posted a personal theory? Are your research skills so poor that you didn't bother to look? As for presenting textbook material, it's not my fault that so many people seem never to have cracked a textbook in their life; if they had, they would know that a large body like Nibiru would be easily detected. I'm not sure what you mean by "NASA's constant alterations," I've never used their tailoring service. When I do have a problem with NASA's data, or, more usually, with their interpretation of it, I give it some thought. For example, I'm beginning to have some grave doubts about Kepler, but when I work it out, I'll try to publish in a peer reviewed journal where I can get some critical feedback from knowledgeable people, rather than stars and flags.

You will not persuade those here that know we are being lied to constantly by NASA but thats not your intention, its to misguide the curious or new members who find their way here for alternative information.

So at least you admit you are close minded. I assume your intention here is to provide that "alternative information," whether it is true or not.

Originally posted by solargeddon
Small question, as NASA have now announced this in their newsletter (I love the way they say "You might have heard by now" , Why did this not make the mainstream too, like the asteroid YU55, if it is so harmless ?

Actually. YU55 was in the May 2'nd news letter.
Here it is:
- - -

Feature May 2, 2011

Spacecraft Earth to Perform Asteroid 'Flyby' This Fall

The full version of this story with accompanying images is at:
www.jpl.nasa.gov...

Since the dawn of the space age, humanity has sent 16 robotic emissaries to fly by some of the solar system's most intriguing and nomadic occupants -- comets and asteroids. The data and imagery collected on these deep-space missions of exploration have helped redefine our understanding of how Earth and our part of the galaxy came to be. But this fall, Mother Nature is giving scientists around the world a close-up view of one of her good-sized space rocks -- no rocket required.

"On November 8, asteroid 2005 YU55 will fly past Earth and at its closest approach point will be about 325,000 kilometers [201,700 miles] away," said Don Yeomans, manager of NASA's Near-Earth Object Program Office at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, Calif. "This asteroid is about 400 meters [1,300 feet] wide – the largest space rock we have identified that will come this close until 2028."

Despite the relative proximity and size, Yeomans said, "YU55 poses no threat of an Earth collision over, at the very least, the next 100 years. During its closest approach, its gravitational effect on the Earth will be so miniscule as to be immeasurable. It will not affect the tides or anything else."

Then why all the hubbub for a space rock a little bit wider than an aircraft carrier? After all, scientists estimate that asteroids the size of YU55 come this close about every 25 years.

"While near-Earth objects of this size have flown within a lunar distance in the past, we did not have the foreknowledge and technology to take advantage of the opportunity," said Barbara Wilson, a scientist at JPL. "When it flies past, it should be a great opportunity for science instruments on the ground to get a good look."

2005 YU55 was discovered in December 2005 by Robert McMillan, head of the NASA-funded Spacewatch Program at the University of Arizona, Tucson. The space rock has been in astronomers' crosshairs before. In April 2010, Mike Nolan and colleagues at the Arecibo Observatory in Puerto Rico generated some ghostly images of 2005 YU55 when the asteroid was about 2.3 million kilometers (1.5 million miles) from Earth. (See related story: www.jpl.nasa.gov...)

"The best resolution of the radar images was 7.5 meters [25 feet] per pixel," said JPL radar astronomer Lance Benner. "When 2005 YU55 returns this fall, we intend to image it at 4-meter resolution with our recently upgraded equipment at the Deep Space Network at Goldstone, California. Plus, the asteroid will be seven times closer. We're expecting some very detailed radar images."

Radar astronomy employs the world's most massive dish-shaped antennas. The antennas beam directed microwave signals at their celestial targets -- which can be as close as our moon and as far away as the moons of Saturn. These signals bounce off the target, and the resulting "echo" is collected and precisely collated to create radar images, which can be used to reconstruct detailed three-dimensional models of the object. This defines its rotation precisely and gives scientists a good idea of the object's surface roughness. They can even make out surface features.

"Using the Goldstone radar operating with the software and hardware upgrades, the resulting images of YU55 could come in with resolution as fine as 4 meters per pixel," said Benner. "We're talking about getting down to the kind of surface detail you dream of when you have a spacecraft fly by one of these targets."

At that resolution, JPL astronomers can see boulders and craters on the surfaces of some asteroids, and establish if an asteroid has a moon or two of its own. (Note: the 2010 Arecibo imaging of YU55 did not show any moons). But beyond the visually intriguing surface, the data collected from Goldstone, Arecibo, and ground-based optical and infrared telescopes are expected to detail the mineral composition of the asteroid.

"This is a C-type asteroid, and those are thought to be representative of the primordial materials from which our solar system was formed," said Wilson. "This flyby will be an excellent opportunity to test how we study, document and quantify which asteroids would be most appropriate for a future human mission."

Yeomans reiterated Wilson's view that the upcoming pass of asteroid 2005 YU55 will be a positive event, which he describes as an "opportunity for scientific discovery." Yeomans adds, "So stay tuned. This is going to be fun."

The 70-meter (230-foot) Goldstone antenna in California's Mojave Desert, part of NASA's Deep Space Network, is one of only two facilities capable of imaging asteroids with radar. The other is the National Science Foundation's 1,000-foot-diameter (305 meters) Arecibo Observatory in Puerto Rico. The capabilities of the two instruments are complementary. The Arecibo radar is about 20 times more sensitive and can detect asteroids about twice as far away, but because the main dish is stationary it can only see about one-third of the sky. Goldstone is fully steerable and can see about 80 percent of the accessible sky, so it can track objects several times longer per day and can image asteroids at finer spatial resolution. To date, Goldstone and Arecibo have observed 272 near-Earth asteroids and 14 comets with radar. JPL manages the Goldstone Solar System Radar and the Deep Space Network for NASA.

NASA detects, tracks and characterizes asteroids and comets passing close to Earth using both ground- and space-based telescopes. The Near-Earth Object Observations Program, commonly called "Spaceguard," discovers these objects, characterizes a subset of them, and plots their orbits to determine if any could be potentially hazardous to our planet.

JPL manages the Near-Earth Object Program Office for NASA's Science Mission Directorate in Washington. JPL is a division of the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena.

More information about asteroids and near-Earth objects is at: www.jpl.nasa.gov... .

More information about asteroid radar research is at: echo.jpl.nasa.gov... .

More information about the Deep Space Network is at: deepspace.jpl.nasa.gov... .

DC Agle (818) 393-9011
Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif.
[email protected]

- end -

reply to post by AlwaysStoned


I can do the same thing to "GOD" that I did to "bacon and eggs", if you wish?

Since this thread deals with NASA then I will add a juicy tidbit for your further consideration, please...

Wernher von Braun

A former member of the Nazi party, commissioned Sturmbannführer of the paramilitary SS and decorated Nazi war hero, von Braun would later be regarded as the preeminent rocket engineer of the 20th century in his role with the United States civilian space agency NASA

In his 20s and early 30s, von Braun was the central figure in Germany's rocket development program, responsible for the design and realization of the deadly V-2 combat rocket during World War II. After the war, he and some of his rocket team were taken to the U.S. as part of the then-secret Operation Paperclip

NASA career
The U.S. Navy had been tasked with building a rocket to lift satellites into orbit, but the resulting Vanguard rocket launch system was unreliable. In 1957, with the launch of Sputnik 1, there was a growing belief within the United States that America lagged behind the Soviet Union in the emerging Space Race. American authorities then chose to utilize von Braun and his German team's experience with missiles to create an orbital launch vehicle, something von Braun had originally proposed in 1954 but had been denied.[48]

Good stuff, no?

Why do the naysayers ignore these teeny tiny little "Issues" ?

I do not expect them to confront me directly as they are "outmanned" plus such a task would be well above most of their "pay grades"

Nothing to say but to repeat the Official Lines minus the "N".

And again, this is from WIKI which few should trust and which may be "altered" soon yet it must make one wonder what could be found if they dug deeper?

Seek: Von Braun Deathbed Confession and the deeper truth may be revealed to you although it will depend upon the ability of your mind to process and then accept such information.

One last thing, to clarify, to DENY IGNORANCE is to stop ignoring relevant issues that pertain to the subject matter.

If anyone of these ATSers truly Denied Ignorance then I would not have to come on here and remind all of them of NASA's NAZI origins etc et al.

Originally posted by OverMan
reply to post by AlwaysStoned

 

I can do the same thing to "GOD" that I did to "bacon and eggs", if you wish?

Since this thread deals with NASA then I will add a juicy tidbit for your further consideration, please...

This thread is about a comet. Discussion about the NAZI origins of a NASA rocket scientist is not relevant to the subject at hand. Wernher von Braun, controversial though he may be, is not representative of NASA or even NASA's manned spaceflight programs as a whole and has absolutely nothing to do with Elenin whatsoever.

Originally posted by ngchunter

Originally posted by OverMan
reply to post by AlwaysStoned

 

I can do the same thing to "GOD" that I did to "bacon and eggs", if you wish?

Since this thread deals with NASA then I will add a juicy tidbit for your further consideration, please...

This thread is about a comet. Discussion about the NAZI origins of a NASA rocket scientist is not relevant to the subject at hand. Wernher von Braun, controversial though he may be, is not representative of NASA or even NASA's manned spaceflight programs as a whole and has absolutely nothing to do with Elenin whatsoever.

Yes, IGNORE NASA' origins as that is irrelevant.
Yes, IGNORE the fact that NASA is literally filled with Nazi's and is MOST DEFINATELY an arm of the MILITARY INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX.

Yes, we must also IGNORE Von Brauns supposed deathbed confessions that our government will use ALIEN INVASION as a way to manipulate the masses.

Afterall, we are not using statements from Nasa to disprove or prove anything now are we?

It was a russian that spotted Elenin and you dont trust the russians do you?

Not very uhm "intuitive" are you?

So much for Denying Ignorance!

Originally posted by OverMan
Yes, IGNORE NASA' origins as that is irrelevant.
Yes, IGNORE the fact that NASA is literally filled with Nazi's and is MOST DEFINATELY an arm of the MILITARY INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX.

Your personal hatred for NASA is not relevant to the comet this thread is about. I will not allow you to drag me into an off-topic discussion about the origins of NASA, so I'm just going to leave it there.

It was a russian that spotted Elenin and you dont trust the russians do you?

It was spotted by a russian amateur astronomer. I trust amateur astronomers, particularly when so many other amateurs confirmed his discovery, including me!

Not very uhm "intuitive" are you?

So much for Denying Ignorance!

Excuse me? I've seen the comet for myself. Not on NASA TV, not through a NASA satellite, for myself, with my own telescope and my own camera. I measured its position and its right where it should be according to the orbital elements.

reply to post by ngchunter


I do not HATE Nasa, nice strawman attempt....... yet I am aware that the Origins of NASA and that it is an arm of the Military Industrial Complex and that they are not to be trusted...... thus I REFUSE to IGNORE these FACTS especially when people (maybe not you) use NASA as some sort of AUTHORITY.

The title of this thread is "Comet Elenin: A news letter from NASA" so I have every right to question the Source.

Actually Questioning the Source should be a Duty of all those who believe that they are truly Denying Ignorance.

Go now and EMBRACE IGNORANCE as you have shown yourself perfectly capable of doing so here...

Really...... it is very evident and so is your level of pseudo intelligence.

reply to post by OverMan


I absolutely agree that Isaac Asimov's Nightfall is well worth a read and deserves a place of honor as part of any Sci-Fi fans personal collection

It is considered by many to be a Canonical work and was voted the best science fiction short story prior to 1965 (prior to creation of Nebula award) by the Science Fiction and Fantasy Writers of America

Nightfall

reply to post by tomten

Might thoughts are like this....
example..If I know of someone who has lied possibly (or better) ..doctored images for years ...added static to delayed live images..etc..why??? would I Ever...Ever believe them when they tell me something that is of this potential magnitude..not to worry???
Its Hard enough getting the truth in this day and age..and yes Ive lived some years (pushing 50).
I hope all will be fine.. but I will not dumb down into sheeple mode...sorry.

reply to post by ngchunter

Originally posted by ngchunter
Over short time scales associated with this apparition there's no need to account for it; it's too small an effect. If it weren't, astrometric measurement of the comet's position would be inconsistent with its orbit and make it impossible to compute valid Keplerian elements for the comet. My measurement of the comet's position just a couple nights ago showed it to be exactly where the orbit said it should be.

Thank you for the answer, but I still dont quite understand.
This burst is supposed to set in as Elenin gets nearer and passes the sun, so it would not have any large effect on simulations YET, correct?
Or has Elenin already passed the sun?

What worries me is Mr. Yeomans choice of words. He claim that the outburst are "NOT AT ALL uniform or regular."
And it can be seen in the safety-minded OP that he chooses his word carefully.

Furthermore, if NASA finds it "very difficult" to simulate the movement, because the comet is "chaotically moving", how can anyone be SO certain that their simulations are correct?

- FL

Think Overman hit nail on head. But there's more :
Why NOW for this news? There's a lot coming out just recently, keep the masses distracted and/or reassured, such as royal wedding, canonization of last pope, today the giant asteroid not to be worried about, Bin Laden no longer to be worried about, and of course the REPETITIVENESS of calls for Ghaddafi to leave - a daily prayer by the elite.
It's all to do with timing. I find it puerile. I don't fall for this crap. I use my intelligence, not quoting tailor-made facts which are probably doctored. The truth has always been here in front of our eyes all along.
NASA has a BAD record, umpteen instances of fiddling data, can NEVER be trusted except by the feeble-minded.

mclinking

Originally posted by OverMan
reply to post by ngchunter

 

I do not HATE Nasa, nice strawman attempt.......

Your vitriol says otherwise. Actions speak louder than words

The title of this thread is "Comet Elenin: A news letter from NASA" so I have every right to question the Source.

Actually Questioning the Source should be a Duty of all those who believe that they are truly Denying Ignorance.

Go now and EMBRACE IGNORANCE as you have shown yourself perfectly capable of doing so here...

Really...... it is very evident and so is your level of pseudo intelligence.

If you're going to just degenerate into insults I'll simply start reporting your posts and be done with this discussion. I've confirmed for myself that Elenin is just a dim comet and that it's following its stated orbit exactly. That is the opposite of ignorance, I've actually put NASA to the test and guess what? NASA is telling the truth. Your idea of "ignorance" is anyone who disagrees with you no matter what they've done to confirm what they say... and then you have the gall to accuse me of being pseudo intellectual.

Originally posted by Flawless Logic
Thank you for the answer, but I still dont quite understand.
This burst is supposed to set in as Elenin gets nearer and passes the sun, so it would not have any large effect on simulations YET, correct?

Elenin is outgassing even now. Yes it will outgas more as it approaches the sun, but the thrust being imparted is miniscule. The main effect we can observe of this thrust is in angular momentum. The comet's momentum in orbit around the sun is huge and is not detectably affected during a single apparition, which is why the Keplerian elements are working so precisely. Its angular momentum, however, is not nearly so large and is dictated largely by the outgassing.

Furthermore, if NASA finds it "very difficult" to simulate the movement, because the comet is "chaotically moving", how can anyone be SO certain that their simulations are correct?

You're confusing its movement around the sun with its rotational movement. Those are two separate matters. It is hard to simulate its rotational movement due to the thrust imparted by outgassing.

Comet outgassing also can be chaotic, here is one of only 5 known comets we (NASA) has imaged the core of. On November 4, 2010 NASA space probe Deep Impact flew within 435 miles of comet Hartley 2. It's only the fifth time that a comet's core has been viewed up close.

"It's hyperactive, small and feisty," said mission scientist Don Yeomans of the NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory.

Roughly 1½ miles long, Hartley 2 is the smallest comet to be photographed up close.