Apple under fire for 'gay conversion' app

What's with all the holy rollers promoting their bigotry on ATS lately?

Anyone know when the cure religion app is due out?

I don't own any Apple products, so I really could care less about the app to begin with. A fad product produces more fad products, and that is what this is for the bigots that will buy it. I'm sure there will be a "convert the Muslims to Christianity" app out there somewhere, too. If it ever exists, I'm also sure it will attract as much anger as this app. Hate always has a market and consumers ready to buy. You can't avoid that. It just depends on what the target of the moment is.

I think it's easier to say existence has varying degrees of weird, rather than normal. 6 billion+ people are too individually and culturally unique to group in to normal/abnormal/whatever groupings anyway. In the end, sex is still just sex. It all ends the same regardless of what gender the partner is. One man's repulsion is another man's kink. One man's kink is another man's fascination, etc. Normalcy is a matter of perception.

For what it's worth, the argument of someone never meeting gays from stable backgrounds I can counter. I can think of no heterosexual person offhand I have known whom had a stable rearing and adult background. Most had abusive upbringings, unstable home lives, drug/alcohol addictions, abusive relationships and combinations of the aforementioned. They all at one point or another strolled down the path of self-destruction. The gay people I've known in my life had stable upbringings, good home lives, no substance abuses, no abusive relationships. They were/are the least self-destructive people I have ever known. That is only my experiences with the subject, and does not represent the whole. Just as the opposite experiences of another do not represent the whole.

Originally posted by THE_PROFESSIONAL

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
reply to post by Christian Voice

 

I remember when my brother told my father he was gay. My father disowned him.... Now That was an unnatural thing.... For a father to disown his child like that....

Your dad should have beat the gay out of him. Serves him right for choosing to be gay. Being gay is a defense mechanism for overpopulation. Nature is taking unnatural measures to keep the population under control. Hopefully your brother will be cured soon.

Oh dear.

I hope one day you'll get through whatever emotional upset that has caused this line of thought. If not, I might beat it out of you.

(in reply to someone back on page 4 or 5 i cant remember and dont want to bother digging it out)
So if someone that is gay tells me it is a choice... its obvious they meant something else and not the obvious topic or question that was being said? Thats just presumptuous of you because it does not fit in your world view.
Start another topic to discuss the gay non gay issues and discuss it there...

Rather than turn this topic into a complete waste because we are no longer talking about the primary topic of the OP - can we turn it back to the OP?

Fact number 1

Apples App judgement can be called into question - for lesser issues than this one.

Fact number 2

Christians are going to come across being judgmental and wrong when trying to help people in such a public manner. This could have been distributed ad hoc.

Opinion 1

There are somethings that just need to be done in a quieter manner and not be put on display for the world to judge. The vocal majority of the world have heard it being said that its not a choice to be gay... so when any organization has a focus and drive to help people that want to change and Choose a different life... it will cause friction with that world view point. Do I agree with the methods of every christian organization trying to help people that want to be helped? No... but I agree that people that want to seek help or change be given the right to do so. If some crappy app can help... let it.

Fact number 3

Crappy apps don't really help. Anything. Period. Angry Birds is the most productive app written yet. (not an advert)

Fact number 4

If you can be offended by anything you will be offended by everything.

Opinion 2

FREE and OPEN society does equate to a permissive society and a kind of social decadence in all things.
Freedom of speech is only really truly freedom of speech... when at the end of your opinion... your opposition gets every bit of a chance to speak as well.
Most freedom of speech issues on hot topics result in shouting and violence because hot heads prevail over common decency.
You have every right to your opinion. So do I. So do people I don't agree with... I have every right to walk away and not listen to them. Its a choice.

Fact number 5

No one will ever get someone to change their opinion by shouting or name calling. It may feed an ego - but no exchange of ideas will ever really truly happen without the ideas being presented calmly and rationally. If you or they descend into arguments then the end result is of no real value.

Opinion 3

Crappy apps like this only win with controversial advertisements like this. It will get downloaded by a load of people just to see what it is all about.

Fact number 6

Long posts like this usually get skipped over and not read by anyone in favor of ranting straight away on your current hot headed topic.

Opinion 4

My opinions are awesome and everyone thinks so even if they say otherwise (why not say this... everyone feels that way about their own opinions)

Fact number 7

I should have stopped posting at fact number 5

Opinion 5

No one understands my avatar.

reply to post by Azp420


Its manually installed. You have to bash some in the head with your phone till the annoying goes away. You will need a new phone at the end of it.

In other news... I am a crappy appy developer... want me to write that one for you? (not the hitting in the head thing)

Is gay a choice?
If being gay was a choice it would be an intelligent choice to be gay.
It's THAT great. I think every people should try both sex and decide
which one they prefer. Basically, even if science discovered that
Gay is a choice, it still would need to be a choice that people respect,
because it would imply heterosexuality to be a choice.

It it natural? Hey, life started as gay. The sexual system came only
later in evolution biology, much later. Men like to have sex times 10 more
than women. Life's method is its hoping that eventually,
a sperm might reach an ovule. In the meantime, it doesn't care
what men do with their penises, and provided him with plenty
of holes to fit them, including the ANUS. Yes, it is just at the right
level and place to fit a penis. It sounds pretty much natural to me,
and women used their anus a lot in prehistory to prevent fertilization (they
secretly put the penis in the other hole, and voila). Oh, and men will
often say that pleasure in the back is better because it squeezes more:
this sends to me the message that, if you're only going to fool around
for pleasure and not make babies, use the back. Finally, why do men
have pleasure from prostate (when they get analed)? Because overall,
men and women are not that much different. We all start female in the
foetus. More arguments that gay is natural, baby.


Is gay repulsive? Frankly, you don't have to play anal
when you are gay. It is a misconception to assume
that gays aren't as much disgusted by anal as most
straight people can be. Other than that, I don't see how
gay sex is repulsive. It's cute to see two penises or
two vaginas mingle. All sex is fun.

Is it pervert?
Well, I'm pretty much against large evils, like people
torturing and killing other people, but a small evil like
perversion can be fun at times. I mean, anything
consensual, like an adult orgy party? It's not really
THAT wrong. It just test your ability to really "love one another"
on a very deep level (not just your lifelong partner, that is
more selfish than people admit).

Are gay men prone to MTS?
Yes, because they are men, and like
to have tons of sex just like straight men,
but because their life is easier on
that level (in some countries), and
they don't need to bother as much
with a long term relation, they
will get too much of different partners
(hence where my ideal of an orgy
above is not always well-advised).
But lesbians don't have that problem.
So it's not a gay problem, it's a man
problem. Men should learn to love
and stick to one person. Oh, and gays
are learning, now. They're aware of
the problem.

Is A Gay Cure App wrong?:
It makes me laugh, but this can
# the mind of a gay teenager.
I'd love to be against censorship,
but then I'd love to punch Eminem
in the nose. Know what I mean?
Hate breeds hate. Sometimes you
need to censor hate before it
leads to a war (thanks for encouraging
hate between anti and pro Gaddaffis,
people. I thought we could do better than
that).

Is gay against God?
I am opposed to the Bible because
it is illogical for me that God would have
wanted a book to be published when
he never asked for it. If you ask me, God
is angry at the Bible. It's like how a rumor
get switched after passing from one person
to the other. There are 1500 years of oral
passing before the Bible is written. When
we found pieces of a bible dating from 100BC.
we found that those extracts were very different from
the Bible we use, which most older texts were
found a couple centuries after Christ. Then again,
it was all changed and assembled in Rome
by imperial tyrans. It is a political product and a false
God. Oh, yeah.. The translations are all #ed up too.
Jesus said something about not insulting
an effeminate man, but that has been translated
to "fool" for centuries. St-Paul said something
against pedos, that was translated as gay men.
Tolerated pedophilia was a major problem in
those times. Obviously an evil that anyone
right would have mentioned. Aside that, I have
a vision of God that ressembles the movie
Teorema by Pasolini. A being that likes everyone
so much that it just wants to have tender sex (not
abuse sex) with you, whatever your gender,
your age, or how you look (just affection (not sex)
if it is a child). I believe sex might be some kind
of conversation with God, so consensual sex
would be beautiful whatever your persuasion.

Originally posted by dsm1664

Originally posted by THE_PROFESSIONAL

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
reply to post by Christian Voice

 

I remember when my brother told my father he was gay. My father disowned him.... Now That was an unnatural thing.... For a father to disown his child like that....

Your dad should have beat the gay out of him. Serves him right for choosing to be gay. Being gay is a defense mechanism for overpopulation. Nature is taking unnatural measures to keep the population under control. Hopefully your brother will be cured soon.

Oh dear.

I hope one day you'll get through whatever emotional upset that has caused this line of thought. If not, I might beat it out of you.

edit on 23-3-2011 by dsm1664 because: sp

You won't win, I have a tactical setup, You will be stopped miles even before you see the first hair of my head. Then I will beat the crap out of you.

Originally posted by idonotcollectstamps
reply to post by freedish

 

God creates homosexuals
God bans homosexuals

LOL that ranks right up there with not eating shellfish. Oh wait you probably ignore that little command don't ya?

God did not create homosexuals. That is saying God created sin. Man created sin when he ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil (whatever that may be?). Homosexuality, as well as anger, hate, pain, sadness are all a consequence of that original sin.

God does not ban homosexuals. Some 'organized religions' do though.

Originally posted by meeneecat
reply to post by freedish

 

Like I said, I'm not going to engage in discussion with people who can offer no better than "flat-earther" "it's true because god says so" type arguments. Don't be offended, but it's simply because we are working from two totally different playing fields. I'm citing SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE and FACTS, you are citing statements that, in your opinion, have been made by a magical being in the sky that may or may not exist. Ancient Greeks used to believe in a pantheon of "gods", just because they believed these gods to exist, doesn't make it so. Just because you believe your god thinks homosexuality is "unnatural" doesn't make it so. Learn the difference between FACT and "faith".

You are already stereotyping me as a "flat-earther" because I have faith in God. Do you not put just as much faith in science? How many times has science been wrong?


And just because something is found in nature doesn't mean it is 'natural'. I could say that since father lions often eat their own cubs then it's natural for human fathers to kill their babies. That is basically what you are saying when you are comparing humans to monkeys.

Your argument is invalid.

Oh wait sorry aren't I supposed to be some stupid closed minded socially backwards religious bible thumping flat-earth believing moron...................my bad.

Wait! Does this mean that Christians can be educated and are able to form valid conclusions based of keen observations? Naaaaaaaaaw

"Jesus says it so it must be true!"

Do you even know what Jesus said? I highly doubt it.

Originally posted by THE_PROFESSIONAL

Originally posted by dsm1664

Originally posted by THE_PROFESSIONAL

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
reply to post by Christian Voice

 

I remember when my brother told my father he was gay. My father disowned him.... Now That was an unnatural thing.... For a father to disown his child like that....

Your dad should have beat the gay out of him. Serves him right for choosing to be gay. Being gay is a defense mechanism for overpopulation. Nature is taking unnatural measures to keep the population under control. Hopefully your brother will be cured soon.

Oh dear.

I hope one day you'll get through whatever emotional upset that has caused this line of thought. If not, I might beat it out of you.

edit on 23-3-2011 by dsm1664 because: sp

You won't win, I have a tactical setup, You will be stopped miles even before you see the first hair of my head. Then I will beat the crap out of you.

This conversation reminds me of The Office...Jim vs Dwight.

reply to post by Nightchild

The article on the apes from wiki also states that Man is part of the great ape family.
Have they indeed found the missing link?

Dolphins apes and even dogs and cats are intelligent but they aren't human, human sexuality is apart from any other mammal in so many ways that it's an apples and oranges comparison.

Sorry to interrupt this debate but I can't put much stock in that data off wiki or the "animals do it" line of reason.

As someone else said here earlier dogs eat poo... and I've seen apes do other things I wouldn't do.
Reminds me of that song "You and me ain't nothing but mammal lets do it like they do the discovery channel"
lol

Originally posted by THE_PROFESSIONAL
reply to post by KILL_DOGG

 

Actually being gay does harm your health. It is an unhealthy lifestyle choice and people are more prone to HIV/AIDS. It is a lifestyle choice, and an unhealthy one. The people who made the app are doing the right thing.

Not true. A perfectly straight man has just as much chance depending on the lifestyle he lives. Of the people that I know, the ones that go to bars, pickup strangers, etc. are the ones that usually get some health risks. The others that date like normal people, find a same sexed partner that is healthy and they have a good relationship. You should seriously use the graymatter that is supposed to be in your skull. But I suppose it's what I saw floating down the gutter in the rain today.

reply to post by furzball


Homosexuality is high risk, and unhealthy behavior. This is from Harrison's Principle of Internal Medicine and the CDC. Homosexuals are at higher risk of developing HIV/AIDS due to their unhealthy behavior. Maybe you out to use that gray matter..

reply to post by freedish




Your false God that is the Bible, actually considers sexuality a sin. In the Bible eye, it is as much debased for Adam and Eve to have to have sex to procreate.





As you can see, Professional, gays are aware of their risks, and incidents are decreasing, while heteros are increasing. Alas this table is not for Africa.

I've written above that I agree gay men are more at risks
for diseases. Sex is too easy for gay men, and they
have these sex paradises called saunas, *SNIP* like
it's nothing in the world. If it was like this for straight
men, open hetero orgy houses, you would just be all into
it and get diseases just as fast. Well, I think
it's happening more and more, straights doing sex
parties, hence the heterosexual increase. It's mostly
women who are not into it. It's like porn. Who watch
porn? Mostly men. Men are just sexual beasts.






Mod Note: Terms & Conditions Of Use – Please Review This Link.

I don't see a problem with the app being available because no one is forced to download it or use it. Apple is a private corporation so therefore they could ban it if they want to and the 1st Amendment wouldn't apply. However, by doing that they might face accusations of religious discrimination; basically they will attract some derision either way.

But the whole "conversion" part is indeed a misnomer, regardless of how the app's creators have it labeled. I've not seen it so I can't speak from their point of view but my guess is that it is designed as a sort of support for those gay people aren't happy being gay and wish to try and subvert their orientation in favor of heterosexuality. Someone mentioned this being compared to an app that might help a person with a weight loss plan. In some ways there are similarities, though not in the way most people would think. An app for weight loss would target those who are unhappy with their weight, and might help some people lose a few pounds. But, like the "gay conversion" app, it will never change the genetics of the overweight person. That person will always have the genetic makeup and tenancy to gain excess weight until the day he/she dies, regardless of how well he/she is able to stifle the urge to overeat and eat the wrong foods. Same thing with the gay person; he/she will always be gay, regardless of how well the urge to couple up with a same-sex partner is curbed (or not curbed).

Basically it is a personal choice - and this is something that many seem to touch on in various posts but never quite articulate fully. I suppose either myself or someone else could start a whole other thread on nature vs nurture and personal choice and responsibility. In other words, if a person has a genetic disposition towards something (becoming overweight, for example, or a substance abuser) or genetically IS something (and yes I do think that most homosexuality is genetic) - (exclusive of behavior; being a redhead or black for example is a state of being and requires no action, same with being gay but going further and acting on that and having gay relationships is a state of doing), then should they then act based on that tendency?

So a person could be gay (and there's really nothing that can change that) and not act on those feelings, and in lieu of that attempt to live as a heterosexual or simply be celibate. I saw a tv show on that Exodus group and I think that is perhaps what they are aiming at. But of course most gays I imagine would choose not to do that (nor would most heteros choose to do just the opposite - try to be gay or celibate instead).

I guess what I think bothers some people (and some of whom are wrongly labeled IMO as homophobes) is that there is a belief out there that people can rise above these default settings if they want to, but not necessarily that they should always do so. Sort of like a person who has a strong genetic tendency towards alcoholism - should they imbibe willy-nilly because their genes have set them on that path or should they do everything they can to resist and live a fully sober life? And even if they do live a tee-totaler's life, that person will still, genetically speaking, always be an alcoholic. Again, as long as they aren't doing anything illegal, it is a personal choice, as is whether or not to practice homosexual behavior. The urges and drives are there and seldom ever go away, but I think the true debate is more about whether or not (and which ones) should be acted upon and which should be stifled.

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL


Your Chart is Ironic, given M2M cases of HIV have decreased over the years and hetro cases have increased.......

LMAO at homosexuality being compared to alcoholism!!


Frankly, I'm sort of glad Apple removed the app, because it
pisses off people who wave the flag of free speech but clearly
have other agendas. Free speech? Are you kidding me?
Neo-nazis sites are being shut down. There is no such
thing as free speech. You can't just say whatever you
want: you are at the mercy of social reaction.
In the case here, that reaction was a nice big petition.
You are not happy? Go for it, start a petition.
California reversed gay marriage rights afterall (not
for long, mostly the old people were against it).
But Apple might have a final say if they decide,
for example, that they want to protect their gay
employees.

I think this passed on because the employees
saw a boring App called Exodus and didn't
figure what it was about. It'd be interesting
to know the story behind what happened.
I don't think it's ok to tell a child "you can
cure Gay". It's hell paved with good intentions,
leading to trauma and suicide. Some people
here might think gay = wrong and unhappy.
They just have no idea what they are talking
about. Why waste time with people just
interested in pain and causing trouble?
See the party over there? That's where
I'm going.

ALL YOU HOMOFOBES NEED TO RELAX AND LET YOUR HATERED LEAVE YOU ONCE AND FOR ALL.. THERE IS NO DOUBT THAT BEING GAY HAS BEEN WITH US SINCE THE DAWN OF MAN. THERE IS MORE CASES OF BEING GAY NOW DO TO TECHNOLOGY BEING SUCH A VITAL ROLE IN ALL OF OUR LIVES.. BEING GAY IS NATURAL AS HAVING BLUE EYES OR BEING BORN WITH A LEARNING DISSABILITY,, THERE IS NOTHING WRONG PARENTS OF THE SAME SEX ADPOTING CHILDREN OR HAVING CHILDREN...THERE IS NO PROOF THAT IT IS BAD FOR THE CHILD AND FRANKLY IF SOMETHING HAPPEDED TO ME AND MY WIFE AND THE NEXT BEST OPTION TO TAKE CARE OFMY KIDS WERE A GAY COUPLE THEN AS LONG AS THOSE TWO PEOPLE HAVE THE SAME MORALS AS I ,,I WOULD DIE PEACFULLY..... YOU PEOPLE NEED TO STOP ,EVENTUALLY YOU WILL EITHER BE LEFT ALONE OUT IN THE SUN CAUSE SOCIETY WILL MOVE ON WITH OR WITH OUT YOU OR SOCIETY WILL EVENTUALLY FORCE YOU TO ACT LIKE A NORMAL PERSON CONSTANTLY WHICH YOU WILL BE CONSISTANTLY TORTURED.IS THAT WHAT YOU WANT...........THIS MESSAGE IS ALSO FOR ALL THOSE HATERS IN THE OTHER GAY BASHING THREAD THAT WAS CLOSED RECENTLY...JUST LET IT GO

Originally posted by downunder666
reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL

 

Your Chart is Ironic, given M2M cases of HIV have decreased over the years and hetro cases have increased.......

There are more heteros that's is why there are more cases. It is not showing risk per individual but rather overall diagnosis. If you compare risk of HIV compared to sexual orientation, the chart will be more dramatic.

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL


mm well for both hetro and gay there are preventative measures such as this

www.aids.org...