Things that affect me as a citizen of South Africa

I hope this is the correct place to post this.If not,please forgive me.
South Africa is known for alot of things.Mainly Apartheid and of course the Soccer World Cup but,this being my first thread,I think i'll post something many of us face currently.

I know no one is really interested in hearing about the crime rate in South Africa.It's a subject I'm tired of.I'm not even interested in the crime in South Africa,but it's a problem many people in South Africa face.It has divided us between hopefulls and skeptics,and I really don't know which side will win the debate but I can atleast understand their points of view.We share a common experience(Skeptic or not),we have all been affected by crime in some way.

Crime in South Africa is voilent as hell.It isn't a matter of having your wallet stolen and getting shot but more a matter of getting shot,your family being raped,chopped to pieces and then having your wallet taken.We even have our own spot on wikipeadia on this subject.

en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...

We are the rape and murder capital of the world.There's probably alot of reasons as to why people here are so voilent.Could be poverty(poverty breeds crime).Could be that we have always been a voilent nation.What ever the reason may be this has to come to an end.

www.news24.com...

Theres an example of it that happened today.Our news papers are always flooded with articles like these.Even though I know the mainstream media will always focus on the worse subjects,fear and paranioa sells,but if you've lived here for long enough you would have been the victim of some crime.Just lucky enough to be alive.Also,if you've lived here long enough,you would have noticed how little value life has in South Africa.Like i said-the crime here is extremely voilent.

It's horrible hearing about a 9 year girl getting raped or even babies(which has happened countless times).It's horrible hearing about your friends mom being shot or some elderly couple being slaughtered in the night.And this is what happens on a daily basis.

(warning to anyone clicking on the links below.Its graphic so if u have a weak stomach,don't click on it)

news.bbc.co.uk...
sharingsome.blogspot.com...
[links to images containing gore and mutilation removed]

Here's some stastics-

www.saps.gov.za...
www.saps.gov.za...
www.saps.gov.za...
www.saps.gov.za...
www.saps.gov.za...
www.saps.gov.za...
www.saps.gov.za...
www.saps.gov.za...
www.saps.gov.za...

(Its been divided between the different provinces in South Africa)

If I have my calculations correct..thats 16834 murders alone from April 2009 to March 2010.Thats alot for a country with a population of +/- 45 million people.If you had to compare that to the number of American soldiers who died since the beginning of the war in Iraq I think it will paint the picture of what we have to face.

antiwar.com...

So lets say every year 16834 people are murder in South Africa and lets compare that to the Americans 7 year war in Iraq.....that will give you 117838 people who are murder in South Africa since 2003.My maths skill aren"t the best but I'm sure if I had to sit down and work it out I'd come to bigger amounts of murder.

So you could basicly say South Africa is a warzone and I don't blame the countless number of people who left South Africa for other countries.
Here's and example of just someone like that.Who tryed getting refugee status in Canada.

news.bbc.co.uk...

So yeh,I don't blame people for leaving and I don't blame people for staying either.This is our country and we were born here and we have just as much right to be here as anyone else.Personally I don't want to move to a different country.I have my reasons for staying just as I'm sure so many others have their reasons for staying or leaving.

Anyway,this is what affects me currently...I welcome anyones comments on this...so feel free to share ur points of view.

i think your current government should start using again those draconian measures apartheid government used to keep peace, hang murderers & rapists etc. of course problem is your police force is too corrupt & useless to do a decent job at the moment so giving it more powers is dangerous too. And your armed forces resemble a joke with their aids level of 60 to 70 percent so no help there either. Too bad for you guys.

reply to post by raivo


Indeed, we have no death penalty. We are not allowed to own guns.

Some things do suck.

VVV

perhaps you should start vigilante groups to take care of criminals, necklacing is an African solution to an African problem?

Yeh,it sucks but who cares.Actually this whole subject is a bit depressing.Think i'm going to stick with the ufo's rather.

Lol.I don't know.I'm not sure if I have the stomach to become a vigilanty.I don't know anyone who does.But I'm sure there are some people who have been taking the law into their own hands.But that only starts a whole new set of problems,doesn't it?

Originally posted by SlovenlyGhost
But that only starts a whole new set of problems,doesn't it?

sure it does but it's better be proactive than a victim. If government doesn't give a sh*t about you then you should not give a sh*t about government and it's rules.

That's true,I suppose.But I just think it's more complex than taking up a machete,some pertol and a tire,and burning people you think is guilty.Maybe people will be so afraid that they stop commiting crime.You have a point there.
I geuss if you give it enough thought you could come up with police force thats run by the citizens of South Africa.Start an independent goverment.For the people by the people type of thing.

reply to post by SlovenlyGhost


Hey SlovenlyGhost, I am very glad to see a fellow SA citizen on ATS! Anyway all I can say is "Ignorance is Bliss" what I mean by this is that negativity breeds negativity and you should try and focus on the other half of South Africa which aint all murder and rape but rather togetherness, accomplishment and success.

He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you - Friedrich Nietzche

I'm not going to agrue with that.After I posted this thread I felt sick.I understand focusing on the negative only gives you more of it and as a person who lives in a very negative society you really don't need this.I was merely just highlighting the fact that even though some of us turn a blind eye to this there are people who are affected by this.Usually the victims of these crimes.Its a great injustice.

reply to post by Crymouth


Hi Crymouth.

Also good to see another SA guy on here!! We are popping out of the woodwork, lol

Good post man, star.

Anyway, your post is totally true. People always focus on the negative. Look at all the good things here, and then focus on that. I rarely even read the paper, except watch the news in the evenings.
Live of your own experiences, don't follow the hype the media creates.


VVV

The country not improved much since the soccer world cup? ..it was promised that crime would be lower and a better economy.

I went there before the world cup, i loved it there. I feel more of a free spirit and safe there then back in the UK despite you guys having bars on all the windows and super high fencing with barbed wire it was a nice place.

reply to post by AlphaANDOmega


Glad you enjoyed it here.It's true everything has a double side to it.South Africa is no exception.You have people who see the good and others who don't.Geuss it depends on you as an individual which side of it u'd like to be part of.SA is full of good things.It's these things thats kept people staying here and other people who saw the bad things,well they left.So,yeh.Cime,in the end,has been on the minds of alot of South Africans.
I think it has gone down compared to previous years.South Africa might actually getting better.Only time will tell,but I have faith in us.Never say die,right?

reply to post by SlovenlyGhost


Hi there, good thread.

As mentioned in another post of mine, let me cut 'n paste a bit what I've said:

I feel that the rest of the world is not really informed of the plight of the ordinary citizens of SA. This is not a race issue, allthough everybody wants to play the race card. It is a political and criminal issue and sometimes I get the feeling that these two are so intertweened, that you sometimes cannot distinguish between the two.

The rest of the world is so obsessed with the USA, Iraq, Israel, etc. that SA does not even feature anywhere. I believe the world should take note what is happening in the crime capital of the world. What is the difference between 100's of innocent people dying at the hands of terrorists and 100's of innocent people dying at the hands of criminals. In any event, what is the difference between terrorists and criminals? In SA the criminals are terrorizing the ordinary citizens and it seems that certain groups of citizens are specifically targeted. What is this different to terrorist acts elsewhere in the world?

Even reading the couple of responses on this thread, I get the feeling that people are not really interested in South Africa. If similar things would have happened in the middle east or USA or UK, then ATS would have been buzzing with activity. The whole world assisted to rid SA from apartheid, but now have lost interest in the country. The autrocities occuring there now is just as bad as apartheid, but the loss of human life is way more than under apartheid. This is something I cannot understand.

Originally posted by AlphaANDOmega
The country not improved much since the soccer world cup? ..it was promised that crime would be lower and a better economy.
.

To answer your question see this newspaper report: Increase in crime after World Cup

Johannesburg – In the week following the 2010 Soccer World Cup, violent crime increased sharply, with a farm attack, home robbery and two murders on July 11, a murder on the 13th and two murders and three home robberies on July 15.

Something I cannot understand is that the president asked the criminals to behave themselves for the duration of the world cup and they have done exactly that. The following week after the final, all hell broke loose again. My question is: why would criminals listen to the president, unless government is somehow involved. Are these criminal attacks or are they "terrorist" or political motivated attacks?

See this report: Zuma calls on South Africans to behave during World Cup

“In this time, we need good South Africans. Let them just for four weeks be good. Just for four weeks,”

So he asked for 4 weeks and he got it.
Things just do not make sense.

During the World Cup, which ran from June 11 to July 11, there were reports about 12 such incidents and afterwards, from July 12 to the end of August, there were reports about 42 incidents. There was a marked increase in murders – from four in June to 14 in July and 18 in August.

reply to post by Ysterlong


Never got that bit.I've been wondering about the voilent nature of the crimes being commited.Sometimes seems like hate crimes if you ask me.
I've also heard about Uhuru.What better way to kill of a race then by posing as petty criminals.Veiling it as ordinary crimes,like house robberies,ect.They were also quick to shut us up after Eugene Terre'Blanche got murdered.Not that I'm a supporter of the AWB but all of that seemed a bit sketchy if you ask me.Maybe there is some conspiracy behind all this.Think alot of people are trying to avoid the subject.No one wants to deliver an opinion on it.Afraid they might be labeled racists,neo-nazis or just victims to the media hype.Think only time will tell which side is right.Personally I find myself in the middle.I'm not sure which side the scales will tip.

It is worldwide race wars.
There is a secondary agenda of ageism and sexism as well.
Babies are not immune to the promotion of evil.
Breaks my heart, but I can't stop it.
It was promoted by the controllers.
Absolutely useless hate.
In the US, we care, but we don't speak out,
because we are conditioned to ignore that which we fear.
Ignoring won't work here too much longer, then
you will hear our stories of wanton violence.
Now, they are disguised
as "robbery gone bad," or else not mentioned whatsoever.
Break your conditioning.
Love one another.
Fight the prejudice and bigotry you were taught.
I did, and it was hard, my Father was mad at me for a while.
He got over it.
So did I.
So can you.
peace.

These crimes that are committed in South Africa, are not all caused by poverty. Most of them are hate crimes...the raping ad murdering of anyone who is different or better off, or of a lighter skin color. And you better know they don't feel bad or sorry for committing them either. It all comes down to laziness and hate. I mean, just look at all the different companies striking one right after the other- medical, education etc...they do not care, and have no pride in their work whatsoever! Countless people were turned away who needed medical care- and the people who volunteered to help them, were threatened by those striking... The education workers striked just before the exams, and threatened even the students who were coming to school. Can you believe that some of them said on national news, that they want the students to come and strike with them in the streets... I mean really!!!

Point is- South Africa is dangerous, and when the # hits the fan, and there is no governmental power left to run the people- you better not be anywhere near a location.

South Africa is the picture postcard of the NWO. We are what you will become.

We are now a typically western democracy which means total corruption on all levels of govt, police state laws coupled with complete freedom of the criminal elements in society. Crippling taxes contrast no services, schools are breeding grounds of hate and violence and ignorance.

Glad you poms feel safe behind burglarbars and high electric fences, i don't.

The SWC was most sickening thing i have ever witnessed. The boot, on the face. Forever. And all the rich people going "jolly good show, almost like home hey?"

Now we have strikes, even the homeless / jobless unwashed masses are "striking" ... give us money or we will kill you. Maybe we should send them GENERAAL CELE ... since he has so much spare change.

Don't be distracted. What's coming IS coming.
Funny how "uhuru" is always laughed at, but NEVER discussed or denied.

reply to post by harryhaller


Indeed, Die nag van die lang messe, Uhuru, has always been a myth in South Africa.

Does anyway actually know anything about it? The truth behind it? Or is it just a myth?

Of course the far right people will use this as propoganda to further their course. But is it true?

VVV