ATS, Where Everybody is an Expert

reply to post by Zaxxon


Yeah agreed and i wish they would put the star button on these threads.

If I may address the age part of your post.

Unless a person has been sheltered and kept away from the outside world it is reasonably logical that the older person would have more experience in life than one 40 years her junior.

That being said I will also state that an older person can learn from a much younger person. It's one of those teacher becomes the student and student becomes the teacher situations.

Age, travel and education work together to generally make the older person wise and more experienced.

Anybody can be an expert on a discussion site. Some of our members, including you, have a great command of the English language and are capable of getting your points across very admirably and convincingly.

The rest of us have to struggle to even appear to be intelligent beings.

I looked into programs that assist the writer and when finished editing the persons report will sound like a scholar with several masters degrees wrote it. I wanted to purchase the program but it was nearly $500.00.

That person claiming to be an expert may be badly disabled and trying to live life through this site. Why not allow any of us to feel at least a small amount of pride and importance. It's all some people have.

Live and let live while encouraging others to feel good about themselves.

What I call street smarts and age give a person an edge over a younger person any day of the week. But, as I stated, we can all learn from each other no matter what our ages are.

I do understand how you must feel as I too notice the very few members that exaggerate their knowledge.

Lets look at the simple definition of expert.

Expert |ek-spert| - Thoroughly skilled.

We know that Skill comes with knowledge and experience.

If you are going to become a plumber, you don't simply by a $10. book and expect to become a master plumber after reading the book.

But you apprentice under a master plumber first.

What makes him a Master Plumber vs the trainee ? Experience as a plumber.

When one attends a University, the tenured professor from whom you are an understudy, gained his tenure through his dedication to his field of study over many years which after being reviewed by his peers, and is granted tenure ship.

This is why one studies from one with more experience.
Experience is knowledge and with experience comes skill.

With skill comes expertise.

Everything posted here on ATS has a 50/50 probability of being the honest truth or not.

But if one hasn't the knowledge to prove/disprove their knowledge/expertise then one has the option of rebuking it OR :

1.) Gaining said knowledge in which to disprove the so called expert.
OR
2.) Accept said information as knowledge from the so called expert.


Those who have something to prove strive to satisfy their egos in striving to "Win" arguments or debates.

Those who don't have anything to prove, don't bother.

For if you don't believe what it is they have stated as fact, then look it up for yourself !

Plain and simple....'Nuff Said.

Hmm, now that I've thought about this I don't think I'd like to be an ex-spurt. So inelegant.

Originally posted by kevinunknown
I think to claim to be a expert in anything you have to hold a minimum of a degree in that subject and further to this have experience working in that sector. Now yes this is flexible depending on the subject but I think that’s a good bench mark.

I disagree. And I did spend significant amounts of time and money on a degree.

Some people have life circumstances that prevent them from being able to go to college. Some people do not choose to go to college because they can buy the textbooks used and educate themselves for very little.

Lots of people hold degrees who barely squeaked by, cheated, or politic-ed their way through a program. I hesitate to call them expert, or give them more credibility than a self educated person with real talent and intellectual ability.

A degree is used to get a job or credibility as much as it is to acquire knowledge. It consists of paying your dues to buy your way into some position, or to achieve a minimum of credibility among those who dont know enough about a subject to judge for themselves. In the areas in which I am competent, I dont need to look at a piece of paper to tell if the person I am talking to has any competence in that area. Likewise there is no paper that an idiot could hand me that would convince me otherwise.

Many people who really do value education do go on at some point to get that degree. But it certainly does not mean by any stretch that a self educated person should be written off because they didnt. Many self educated people spend many times the amount of time, study, and effort that someone does in school.

Individuals need to learn not to take credentials (of any kind) as some guarantee, and they need to critically think and evaluate the message on their own, fact check on their own, and get second and third opinions if they are unsure.

Originally posted by yeahright

Originally posted by nh_ee
Everything posted here on ATS has a 50/50 probability of being the honest truth or not.

Well, I dispute that.

Just because there are two possibilities doesn't make them equally likely.

Not that I'm an expert. Just sayin'.

Hmmm

I think there's a 50/50 chance of that being the honest truth

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

Originally posted by yeahright

Well, I dispute that.

Just because there are two possibilities doesn't make them equally likely.

Not that I'm an expert. Just sayin'.

Hmmm

I think there's a 50/50 chance of that being the honest truth

Consider the source.

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

Originally posted by yeahright

Well, I dispute that.

Just because there are two possibilities doesn't make them equally likely.

Not that I'm an expert. Just sayin'.

Hmmm

I think there's a 50/50 chance of that being the honest truth

Consider the source.

If its youtube it must be the honest truth

Im not an expert

reply to post by intrepid


What are you ... the expert expert?

*ducks*

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


Very well stated. I agree and tried to get that point across in my post but you hit the nail on the head.

Originally posted by yeahright
You don't need to know everything about a topic to know when someone is pulling your chain.

Well, it sure would help in some cases

Originally posted by kevinunknown
reply to post by Zaxxon

 

Yeah agreed and i wish they would put the star button on these threads.

Take my expert advice and trust me when I say...No you don't!

By the way monkeys don't wear Armani they wear Ralph Lauren!

Originally posted by yeahright

reply to post by OzWeatherman

 

People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do.

That would make a killer signature....and its so right

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Don’t tell my monkey what to were.

And be nice, my monkey has a gun.

Originally posted by dizziedame


The rest of us have to struggle to even appear to be intelligent beings.

I posted before getting to this page, but I did want to comment on this too.

I worked in construction before going to college, and I met many people who were absolute masters at their trade, and intelligent as all hell, who had less than a high school education. Some of them could not form elegant sentences, some of them wrote like 5th graders, but we are talking about people who were doing some pretty complex math on a daily basis, not to mention making field changes for the mistakes the educated engineers had made.

Being well spoken is only one type of talent. I think its a shame that those who have never been "out in the field" and learned to appreciate other types of intelligence tend to look down upon those who lack formal education. I met just as many bone heads in college as I did in the trades. If not more.

And as you bring up, physical disability can make someone appear to be, through no fault of their own, less intelligent than they are. Consider what Stephen Hawkings life would have been like had he been a peasant child in an earlier time frame. His brilliance might have gone completely unnoticed, and he might have died the town idiot or something. Or what his life would be like today if stripped of everyone who knew him and transplanted somewhere among strangers with no technology to help him communicate.

People need to be less elitist, and a little more open to looking, listening, and thinking for themselves. Its not hard to recognize intelligence even through language barriers or lack of education if you are willing to look at another human being and listen to them, to and try to follow their thinking despite some awkwardness of phrasing.

Noam Chomsky made a nice little rant in one of his works on language that, paraphrased and summed up said,

"Many people use flowery language and technical jargon to explain things in elaborate ways to confuse the listener so that the listener doesnt realize the "expert" has no idea what they are talking about. Someone who truly understands a thing should be able to explain it simply and concisely."

I agree. I dont judge someones intelligence by the carrier, (the words they use) I judge another persons intelligence by the underlying message or thought process they are trying to convey.

Originally posted by kevinunknown
reply to post by wigit

 

Well done what a way to take something out of contest when you look at it in contest i was effectively agreeing with you by saying that

Quite interesting how you think of this as me having a moan, yes in some ways it is

ummm i may not be the sharpest tool in the shed...
but i think..ummm maybe....
it should in context or out of context....but then the "s key" is close to the "x key"

but more on topic...the old saying i've been doing this for 20yrs might not hold water anymore as things do change...

and throughout history many many...knowledgable experts have had their theories thrown out the window as new proofs come into play.

just as E=mC2 might come into question soon.

now stating something from ones own experience that cannot be proven does not make it any less real to that individual.

now if you are talking politics...then saying you have travel the world is somewhat helpful if the person your talking to only has limited knowledge concerning how things operate in other countries.

now sometimes a child has more of a perspective on some issues as they see things from a differnet level (literally)
now kevin i have had comments from you personally with....things ...and if you do not have a UFO or Alien experience yourself then it does not happen.

so not having a open mind to others experiences even though one may not experience it themselves does not make it less real.

i have bungee jumped....it was not jerky....the elastic stretched slowly...and i decelrated gently.

but watching it one would think a different picture.

i used to work in inuvik in northern canada...the temperature would many times go to minus 50.

now to explain that to someone from a tropical oasis can be difficult...but that has nothing to do with degrees in science...it is to do with downright experience.

now if ou ask me for proof....hmmmm....i have none but my own experience.

now a inteligent being goes that is interesting...

now i have seen some intelligent people on here and some whom just want to jump down the throats of others for sharing.

and yes just grabbing stuff off the net as your only source of info is not the greatest...but just participating...adding...contributing ..information is a good thing...and being human we are not infalible...and we do make mistakes.

IF your jumping into any Religious or Political debate....you know it will always be a circular argument....but i think you just need to try to analyze the info objectivly from both sides of the debate.

now all this is coming from someone who has lived...not just traveled all over the world.

and from my experience i think most people want the same...to live their lives without fear and not worrying how to take care of their families.

the more people talk openly in forums the more i think it will all contribute to leading people down a path where we can learn to get along in a more peaceful fashion.

So thanks ATS for providing a fairly open platform.

reply to post by Copernicus


Intelligence is not what you know ...
It is how you think.
A Mensa test is a mixture of many things, designed to see how you think.
You could shine in one area, and not another, or both.

A nuclear scientist can have an IQ of 130 but no common sense...
Therefore his usefulness will be only in the area of his expertise.