Followers Of Christ Are Submissive To Big Brother.

This is a quick question for anyone on ATS that is or isn’t a Christian.

Has anyone actually run into a Christian that proclaims the whole Romans 13. verse in the Bible to be a fully legitimate case for standing down to government control?

I have not heard anyone actually say anything about this ever. Not from a Christian, Not from Non-Believers, and not from anyone in government.

So I was curious if anyone else has experienced this ideology from Christians they may have met.

If you are a Christian that believes this please give a reason for this in light of other Christian protests that claim it to be a government scam to assimilate Christian churches.

This isn’t a Christian bashing, because I am a Christian but I would like some feedback nonetheless.

Source:
www.jesus-is-savior.com...

Apostate ministers and even criminals at work in the U.S. government are trying to corrupt the true meaning of Romans 13, in an attempt to brainwash people to OBEY the lawless tyrants who have taken over The White House.

Thanks.

Snow

That only goes so far. The forefathers of the US were by far more religious than the current populace. They knew Romans 13 but could only take so much ya know? No matter what, people have a breaking point, Christians too.

Followers of Christ are not necessarily "Christian." is the part in Romans where we are told to be submissive actually spoken by Christ?

a couple threads you might wanna read
as they seemed relevant to your thread.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Romans 13 actually is a good reference point to see deliberate changes to the text. It has been modified many times. Take a look at the KJV and compare side by side with the NIV. Way different.

reply to post by frozenspark


I was speaking in the general overarching theme of current religious and political views.

Someone who listens to a preacher and goes to church every Sunday may be far from a follower of Christ themselves; however they may still be labeled a christian which in the mainstream sense is Christianity.

Another point is that being made by these churches making Romans 13 type statements which are seemingly used as leverage against the congregation.

That if you do not submit you are not obedient to Christ, therefore you are not a follower of Christ.

reply to post by thehoneycomb


Thanks that's one of the first things I did, it is quite different.

reply to post by boondock-saint


I'm on it, thanks buddy.

be not fooled, for the true words are Romans 13:1"Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers, For there is no power but of God : the powers that be are ordained of God." and if you know the works and the wisdom then this is speaking of Gods power not mans. for man does not have power over your sole, God does, man just has power over the flesh. and man has taken all the flesh from me he can. reference is KJV,1985

[edit on 2-8-2010 by bekod]

reply to post by snowen20

Has anyone actually run into a Christian that proclaims the whole Romans 13.

Yep. My Father is a fundamentalist Christian who believes the Bible is the 100% Word of God and has brought up this scripture to me on numerous occasions. Although I really think that, in practice, he wouldn't obey an overtly tyrannical government but that's the mind of fundamentalism, filled with contradictions.

I'm just glad there aren't Christians who take the Bible verses on slavery seriously anymore. We don't have people selling their daughters into slavery or stoning people for premarital sex, at least not here in America. Even those that proclaim the Bible to be the perfect Word of God don't live their lives by the majority of its precepts and points of view.

It's not surprising in the least bit, Christians have a notorious inclination to be subjected or transfer faith to another if they believe the 'other' is a Christian. See Glenn Beck, mass popularity, but also always speaking of being the vessel of Gods word. Bush telling the Palestinians that God told him to Invade Iraq, Afghanistan, and while he was add it to help the Palestinian state. ( God has also been notorious for his real estate trouble making). We can also look to the extreme side of Africa's poor and see the power and control the church holds over their lives, whether it be covertly spreading AIDS by condemning condoms or other ghastly condemnations, this is a fair example of when you have a 'god' in control of things.

This website you put up here, (I regretfully read through) is anti-establishment, pro-theocracy (sounds nice, but historically wise is a 'god' awful idea!) and a mix of fear tactics.

As to Romans 13, you should also hold highly the vicars, whether you believe them to be pseudo or not I cannot see how it should be handled, I could safely presume a stoning to death would be in order though should they prove heretical.

Apostate ministers and even criminals at work in the U.S. government are trying to corrupt the true meaning of Romans 13, in an attempt to brainwash people to OBEY the lawless tyrants who have taken over The White House.

Labeling a group or individuals (without names, sources, examples, etc..) for not being religious enough, than boldly and without examples, evidence, etc. saying a mutiny has occurred in the highest governmental office, whilst brainwashing a country. Extraordinary claims we have here, but besides a solid proof of evidence, and other than riding on the wave of basic human emotions, this site is the ramblings of paranoid god freak. Schizoid holding a bible in a basement, comes to mind.

reply to post by snowen20

AS far as I'm concerned, the passage is a reference to the criminal justice system, which was the major function of government in those days.
"Executing wrath upon the wrong-doer"= arresting thieves and murderers and putting them in prison.
That is the sense in which the ruler is supposed to be God's agent.

Labeling a group or individuals (without names, sources, examples, etc..) for not being religious enough, than boldly and without examples, evidence, etc. saying a mutiny has occurred in the highest governmental office, whilst brainwashing a country. Extraordinary claims we have here, but besides a solid proof of evidence, and other than riding on the wave of basic human emotions, this site is the ramblings of paranoid god freak. Schizoid holding a bible in a basement, comes to mind.

Quite possible, this is the ranting of a deranged fanatic.

I agree that it is rather irresponsible if not amateurish to have your own website bashing illusory groups for their practices.

Having an agenda is one thing, but not siting sources for comparison of your agenda is outrageous.

I know some people on ATS may claim that my next statement is a result of me being one of those, "HYPOCRITICAL" Christians because I talk about the word of God yet am not overly familiar with every passage.

In any case I distinctly remember last week reading such a passage in a chapter and book I don't remember (go figure) that said something along the lines of the following.

Paraphrased

It is Gods will to fight a corrupt system, and or tyranny.

I'm not pulling that out of my backside either.

Like wise I'm not trying to quote the Benjamen Franklin. "Resistance to tyranny is obedience to God."

[edit on 2-8-2010 by snowen20]

Yes, I would say that the modern evangelicals, ie Jehovah's Witnesses etc ARE very much at risk of blindly agreeing with government
.

The JWs for instance believe that they MUST obey everything the government say except where it contradicts their orders to go round preaching and going to meetings, medical treatments etc.

They would never protest, object or complain at any government orders, as an organization though I have heard my JW relatives complain about how government even wants to control how people think these days so I notice they do seem 'aware' that not all is well in 'paradise'!

The 'Christians' also seem to be unable to tell the difference between the 'directions' given by Christ and the 'direction' given by Paul and seem to be Paulists rather than Christians.

If it is in the Bible, they believe and follow it, unable to tell the idfference in why it matters who is 'speaking'.

Sad, really!



[edit on 2-8-2010 by Elliot]

[edit on 2-8-2010 by Elliot]

reply to post by snowen20


As a Christian, I am discovering every day that the bible is full of lies.

Much as we find every day our government is full of lies.

So I am staying a Christian and forgetting the establishment lies.

Being a Christian is simple - it means helping your fellowman, not standing in judgement, and loving and caring for the world.

Easy.

reply to post by Elliot
[more

At the risk of being an ass.......That reminds me of the Three laws of Robots by Isaac Asimov.

Agree unless it goes against one of the other three laws.

Most people if not all people IMO are completely at a loss for what to do or what direction to go, even if they seem sure of it.

All I can assume is that as a person we just do the best we can and try to make away everyday to move on, and eventually everything will be sorted out in the end for better or worse.

To be honest I don't know where other Christian based groups stand in place of what they allow government to do to them. Be they J.W. Or Mormon or fundamentalist. That's something that may make a good thread. Hint....Hint.. to whoever reads this.

reply to post by catwhoknows


While I haven't necessarily found lies per se, I have found an abundance of non practical advice that barely relates to the current era we live.

That being said, I would rather use my Faith in God as a Christian to give my life a frame work. Caring about others, loving others, and sacrifice for others is the tenet of my faith second only to believing what is said about Christ.

To some that makes me appear weak...Oh well, It's my faith nonetheless.

[edit on 2-8-2010 by snowen20]

reply to post by snowen20


I take it to read as god is the law we are allsubject to. Not the law is god. Just my $0.02

reply to post by snowen20


What is so sad is that Jesus was reviled in His lifetime and that He is still reviled.

So what!

Yes for Jesus!!!

Hey, guess what, what people think does not matter.