Abrahamic religions! Holy Land! Of God? Rant!

reply to post by Dasher


Hello Dasher!

I have something for you to ponder on. You talk about judges which brings up a experience that my mother had which caused me to question how it all works.

My mother almost died in 2008. She had 9 hours of visions of which I sat by her bed side while she told me what she was seeing and experiencing.

It seemed that very early in her NDE she recalled all of her life experiences. Even though Michael the angel was with her during this personal recall...there did not seem to be a 'judging' of sorts coming from OUTSIDE of her. It seemed as though she was looking through a divine eye, a 6th sense mabey....and she just knew what was right and wrong in her life at that very moment of reflection. I gained the feeling that no one besides her would be a harsher judge onto what she saw through this divine eye (I dont know how else to describe it). It was like sense she didnt have the flesh attachment of her mind that she was able to judge herself (her own spirit of life within her being that monad of judgment).

Now that is a very general rundown of it all....but what do you think about it?

reply to post by Copperflower


Hi ya Copperflower!

Hope all is well with you!

Just a suggestion of thought about the 'God being affected or unaffected' by what paths man takes.

All paths offer us something...the polarity of paths offer us both that light and the dark.

If God knows that the paths that are not do lead to the paths that are...then I doubt that God is being affected by people 'not knowing' which is and which is not. If both paths are a part of the path to unity....I doubt God is affected by those walking self righteous paths right now or paths that are more works for the flesh then the spirit. We all learn through trial and errors. Some of us NEED to live it us in pride and greed to learn the hard way what seeds this path sows.

I dont think God is affected by it....for Thee already knew what all would happen here through the first offering of life, the Holy Spirit. God would of known all the trial and errors man would have to work through to gain understanding of where it all leads to...which is discovering the path that is.

Even when the ancient worshiped idols of material things....God knew this would happen and knew that is had to happen. God knew man would find glory in the sun and God knew there would of been man that gave 'god-ship' to the sun. It wasnt so much 'wrong' but a trial and error God knew would be and needed to be.

If God knows that worshiping the sun and idols would lead to nothing of spiritual wisdom...there is no reason for God to be effected by it. For God knew...learning would come from these things. Sometimes the opportunity for learning comes much later after the people and their ways. We can look back and much history and see the offering of many things to learn from mans past. This is why I say....we must learn things of Earth first before learning things of heaven. It seems God set it up that it would be done this way.

I welcome your thoughts and feedback on this...

reply to post by LeoVirgo


God breathed the breath of life into mankind, nothing else.

We are special, we are God's greatest creation and were made with a purpose. To have a relationship with our creator. To love and be loved.

The ancient idea of a spirit permeating all creation is not new, it is very old as you said. That doesn't mean it's right.

We are unworthy, because we are imperfect. God has set that unworthiness aside though because of His love for us and accepts us as we are.

God said in His Word that he desired obedience, not sacrifice. Sacrifice was commanded though because sin had to be paid for. Justice had to be made complete. Now, no more sacrifice is needed because of what was done on the cross.

I see God's beauty, majesty, power and glory in His creation. Why should I neglect a book that helps me understand my God and my purpose more accurately?

reply to post by LeoVirgo


Yes, this is a way to understand that judgment from above is both gracious and perfect, and also, most importantly, that reality and it's conclusion is a process in which we become one with Truth who is alive.

If I was to judge my own body inadequate for eternity, would it be accounted evil to me to say so? Or true? Will my body last forever? Obviously not. But I can only judge myself eternally according to Truth, which is eternal, or I am deceived.

If I was to judge the graces in my life to be gifts of eternity, would it be accounted evil to me to say so? Or true? What have I earned that is also apart from Life? Obviously nothing. But I can only judge myself eternally according to Truth, which is eternal, or I am deceived.

OrderCharity is Life and Life expressed, the highest Lord of our realm.
The fullness of Life and Life expressed is beyond comprehension in our realm.

Charity is the inverse of Chaos and the opposite of Pride.
Order is the inverse of Pride and the opposite of Chaos.

Chaos and Pride are not everlasting. This is simply cause and effect when held to the tests of Truth/OrderCharity. The requirements of eternity are not unjust judgment, not hate, not neglect, not condemnation. Pride and Chaos are condemned by themselves. Yes, by the sheer nature of our realm, Pride and Chaos cannot establish and sustain anything forever. The earth, our star, ourselves, these are judged inadequate for eternity. However, do not call unclean what God has made clean. Do not call evil what God has made beautiful. To the Children of God, evil is a forgotten dream.

Pride and Chaos were the fear of those who wake.
Pride and Chaos are the nightmare of those who wake.
Pride and Chaos are becoming the dream mostly forgotten by those who have woke.

Whatever Life each person has is a gift, but the gifts of the Children of God are to everlasting. Let no man judge you except that you judge yourself by Truth which is everlasting.

Give to God with all of your heart, understanding, soul, and strength.
Give to your neighbor as you would give to yourself in the same position/disposition.


Digressing, I wish I had more wisdom about Angels.
It has passed my mind that they are the unseen version of us. Not in personage or hierarchy, but in "octave," if anyone can see what I mean. A lot of new-age people seem to refer to this as "higher vibrations," and so it may be in a way, but they, too often, turn these observations into idols.

Nevertheless, the new-age teachings speak many truths, just as every religion does, but how they certainly all end in idols which are lower than the fullness of Life. How did Christ respond to the Jews? How do you think He responds to Christians? The same as to all idolatrous religions. May the compassionate and perfect judgment of God be on all.

Leo, regarding your mother; How did her conduct change? Does she strive for eternal things in general, or did she not learn from her own judgment? As the scripture declares;

(To understand gracious judgment)

Jam 4:11-17
Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of [his] brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge. There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and to destroy: who art thou that judgest another? Go to now, ye that say, To day or to morrow we will go into such a city, and continue there a year, and buy and sell, and get gain: Whereas ye know not what [shall be] on the morrow. For what [is] your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away. For that ye [ought] to say, If the Lord will, we shall live, and do this, or that. But now ye rejoice in your boastings: all such rejoicing is evil.
Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth [it] not, to him it is sin (* This is gracious judgment. Truth and Truth expressed.).

Originally posted by LeoVirgo
Would love your thoughts back on the idea that all things...even the paths that are not....serve a purpose in the end.

Well, Leo, it is certainly true that all paths have SOME truth in them, and I think therein lies the problem with many people today. People are confused.

We have been bombarded by so many theories, ideologies and philosophies over the last hundred years, that no one really knows what to believe anymore. There are both corresponding and contradictory ideas in every ideology and philosophy that you look at. This causes confusion in the mind of man.

Do all of these paths, ideas and philosophies serve a purpose? Surely. Though, I must say that people should beware here because many of these purposes were construed by man, not the creator spirit.

Leo, let me tell you a bit about myself. When I was thirteen years old, I knew that there was much more to life than what I saw here. I had a friend of mine who said that I was intelligent and that he had something that he wanted me to read.It was a little book titled The Life Hereafter by Ruth Montgomery. I never stopped my search after that.

I am now, well, in June I will be, thirty-three years old. I have spent the last twenty years of my life searching and researching the whole meaning of this mundane existence. I have come across so many theories, beliefs,ideologies and theologies that I do not wonder why many live in a constant confusion about what is going on and what to believe. I even posted a thread on this topic quite some time ago on this very topic: Mass Knowledge and the conspiracy to confuse

Leo, I hope that you are right that all paths are leading to a good end, and I see relevancy in many paths. However, unless a person is able to amalgamate a little from each path and not take any one as a whole, then finding the truth is improbable for most.

[edit on 17-3-2010 by SpeakerofTruth]

Originally posted by Mykahel
reply to post by LeoVirgo

 

God breathed the breath of life into mankind, nothing else.

We are special, we are God's greatest creation and were made with a purpose. To have a relationship with our creator. To love and be loved.

The ancient idea of a spirit permeating all creation is not new, it is very old as you said. That doesn't mean it's right.

We are unworthy, because we are imperfect. God has set that unworthiness aside though because of His love for us and accepts us as we are.

God said in His Word that he desired obedience, not sacrifice. Sacrifice was commanded though because sin had to be paid for. Justice had to be made complete. Now, no more sacrifice is needed because of what was done on the cross.

I see God's beauty, majesty, power and glory in His creation. Why should I neglect a book that helps me understand my God and my purpose more accurately?

Hello!

There are things in the Bible that have helped me understand my purpose and the Holy Spirit also. I dont just throw the book out. I do have a more clear perspective though once I started to see that some of the wisdom in the Bible is of man and man learning about things. There are many times the Bible talks only of Earthly wisdom's and these must be discerned to understand what is Holy and Divine.

Man has been mislead to believe that God is concerned of things of Earth, such as a specific land. This caused seperation amoungst Gods children and led the idea that some are more worthy then others in Gods eyes.

God knows the best way for us to learn is through trial and errors. So its not so much a mistake....but a opportunity for us to learn from.

Gods plan has no part in taking the life out of another being. Sacrifices shed blood...your sins cant be covered by sowing another bad seed, like taking a life. This only sows more bad seeds, it does not make amends.

The law of reaping what you sow was taken in a literal way....through blood sacrifice. It is a Earthly practice and is of man. If you are true in your heart for things you have done and you have understanding of why a different action of you would of been more suitable in that moment....this is all God needs. Thee wants us to learn...to learn, our eyes must be open and we must be aware of how our actions affect others. Looking at others as another self of you, since we are all a part of God, allows us to know we are a unite, a whole, this is the highest test. Its not a test of the individual self...its a test of us as a species, a whole. Its not about waiting on God to come make us join hands....we must find a reason to do this on our own.

Jesus said you must carry your own cross....so how is it that your sins are on his cross if you must carry your own?

It is time to come out of the dark ages...we have been in them far to long. Its time to stand up for the work we are here to do. Accepting our actions and thoughts as OURS is the only way to make amends. God knows a true heart and this is how we grow in spirit as spiritual beings.

God has the highest vision of us....Thee is waiting for us to find this vision for ourselves and bring it here and make it so.

All things are opportunities for learning. The past of Abraham has faults...God will have mercy for the things man still is in need of learning.

In no way is killing of any creature a part of Gods plan. The only way it is a part of the plan is it is a part of the path that is not....and in order to find the path that is...we must no the darkness to see the light.

The Holy Spirit helped me see that by believing another man had to die for me...the blood of that man was on my hands.

Do not kill stands...there are no exceptions. Anywhere in the Bible where man justifies killing another man...you are learning of man and of ways of Earth....not ways of the Spirit.

There is much wisdom in the books...not just the Bible but of many faiths. But you must discern everything through the Holy Spirit. Actions of the Spirit are humble and giving. They are not centered on pride or greed. They are not centered on ways that lead to separation.

The Bible can be the greatest book if one can see it has both the dark and the light within it. The purpose is that the true seeker will discern it. Not just follow and accept it all as things of Spirit.

Our paths as spiritual beings is really just beginning.

reply to post by Dasher


Hello Dasher...

The funny thing is (which really Im not surprised)...mom has forgotten her judgments. She even said in that very moment...that she was told that was she was being shown she would not remember. There were times she also told me there was things she could not tell me.

As she was going through the reflective time of her life and her being...she was very serious and focused on what ever it was she was reflecting. She then said...'I dont know how I forgot all of this...I am relearning everything I once knew'. She still tells me today...that after we die...we relearn things.

It was as if she was sifting out all of her Earthly ways and seeing why they were of her body complex and not of her spirit complex. She was gaining understanding of many things. But the judgments about her life that she reflected on she has never remembered. This shows me...nothing can be given to us....it must be figured out on our own while in the body complex.

She is still very much a Christian lady in that Jesus was sent her as the son of God to lead the way to heaven. She still see's Jesus as God and very much still seeks eternal things.

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth




Confusion is a part of the plan. There is mass confusion yes. If there was not confusion, what would the purpose of seeking then be?

Its not bad that we have this confusion. But like you said...if people are not looking at all of the paths and they decide to only choose one to find knowledge....they will miss what is hiding. To see what is not just given to us...we must look in all the nook and crannies.

This is why I say God has mercy on those that dont discern. In order for this world to work the way it does, some souls will live more for Earthly ways then others will. We need both here at the same time. So as much as I talk against the ways of Earth, like pride and greed....it is all needed just the same.

This has been going on for a long time though....so it could very well be that a new leaf is getting ready to turn here. This is why I speak out to others...we are not in need of others living ways of Earth as much as we were in need of it in our past. We have the past to show us all the ways that led us nowhere in Spirit....we have enough history and experiences as a unit to learn from and discern from. It doesn't have to keep going on this way anymore. I find it 'ok' to awake people from this slumber of being the darkness that was needed for the light to come through. I see the awakening happening...and its not people that have their nose in a book. It is people discerning life itself and learning the humbleness of Gods ways.

Ask a child that has no knowledge of a religion if it makes sense to kill and man or animal when we do something wrong. The pure of heart will know...2 wrongs dont make a right.

Sometimes we have to place ourselves in a existence on this world before books were here. There...we will find the pure spirit and ways of God that Thee left for us truly to learn from. Experiences in life fills us with the opportunities we need.

Im not so much preaching to you ya know...for you and I agree on alot. I am just rambling along in my reply to you.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


Well, that is very true. Experience is very important. There is no better teacher than experience. None.

I have had both societal and spiritual experiences in my life. Though, I must say that I turned against societal norms when I was very young. I have always felt like a stranger in a stranger land, really.

I will say this, over the last year I have decided to re-enter the "worldly" world, and it has been rather tumultuous for me.I always knew that the world was screwy. I knew that probably at ten or eleven years of age, and I rejected it. By the time I reached eighteen, I made the conscious decision to exclude myself from social "graces"and to start studying instead. I told myself, "Screw this. I'm going to read my books and everyone else can just leave me out of their affairs and leave me the # alone!!" So it was for a number of years.

When I reached 25, I was forced to re-enter the world that I disdained. Now, for the past 8 years I have been through more than most go through in twenty years.... Most of which hasn't been real good.

However, I suppose that is just the way it is supposed to be for me. They say that life is what you want to make of it.... I'll say this, anything that I lack in this life is my own fault. It certainly wasn't because I haven't been given the opportunities to have it.... It's because I haven't played the "game" right, I suppose.

reply to post by LeoVirgo

I have yo yo'ed back and forth with feelings of who has the rights to the 'Holy' Land and I am concluding that the WORLD has rights to the land.

If any religion claims a land to be Holy....and claims then that a certain group has more rights to it then others....the world should do everything in their powers to not allow such a group to claim ownership of such a place.

Hello LV

Oh, I wish I'd read your thread before starting my last one *no, don't look at it, maybe it'll go away**

It was actually my last ditch effort to reconcile with the Old Testament god, sometimes called Yahweh. I failed. The sad fact is, that a god who existed only for the purpose of establishing an earthly kingdom in a certain geographical spot, has no legitimacy as a universal god, for all people.

That's the god of the book. That's the god who claims to be the only one. That's the god who commands genocide in a "special holy land", and forced tribute from the rest of mankind. He's not worthy. And yet many people think he is, with no rational reason, except they can't imagine seeking a better one.

The very concept of biblical monotheism prevents it. I've heard people sing the praises of monotheism, as if it were some great gift to humanity. It isn't. It forces people to knuckle under to violent commands, with no apparent choice, 'tear down their alters, smash their idols, kill all who resist, no, kill every last one in tribes of people I mark for destruction.'

Any body who worships this god and doesn't recognize this summary of his mandate, either hasn't read the book, or has chosen a path of spending their lives justifying and making excuses for the demands of this god. I know some people are on that path to nowhere. It seems sad, may Thee be kind to them. Now that I've caught up on the thread, I see that even the path to nowhere can be of great spiritual benefit.

I will seek a God who needs no book. I will seek a God who needs no temple of stone. I will seek a God who doesn't require people to die in order for other people to be holy. And you know what? I don't even care if my God claims to be the "One and Only" or not.

This is a rant thread isn't it?

I can think of one good reason to address God as Thee. There is a really cool and discriptive name for Thee that's already been taken by someone else. Bummer.


[edit on 19-3-2010 by pthena]

reply to post by LeoVirgo


I'm sorry, but you said to have moved on from the Bible but you don't even understand it in the first place. You have misused scripture after scripture.

If no sacrifice had to made, than Christ had no reason to die. If he had no reason to die, he wouldn't have since he was the Son of God. If he claims to be the Son of God and still died for no reason, he wasn't really who he claimed to be at all and so everything he taught is subject to scrutiny as being lies and so forth.

Christ died for the purpose of being an atoning sacrifice for our sins. The Bible speaks clearly on this repeatedly throughout the Old and New Testaments.

The command is not as you said "Do not kill" but is actually "Do not Murder." There is a big difference here. If it was not to kill at all, then we should all be vegetarians, wait, they have life too and we shouldn't kill them, we should just starve or eat rocks since killing is never acceptable.

Jesus said pick up your cross. This is no way inferring that we are to pay for our own sins. The Bible is quite clear about that too. He is saying very clearly in Matthew 16:24-27 that you have to be willing to give up everything, your possessions and your very life, if you want to follow Jesus. Not to atone for your sins, but because the world will hate you and you have to be willing to put these earthly things behind you that, as you have said, God does not care about.

We are Holy because the Holy Spirit is within us, but he can also designate a place as holy.

reply to post by pthena


Hello pthena!

I would like to say that I do support Monotheism. My reason is that there is a Spirit of life within all things. Im not a supporter of Pantheism...but I dont judge those that have found wisdom in this path either. It harms no one to follow this path and I can not say there is not a wisdom of Spirit within that path. To me, the wisdom would be though....that all things of life contain the offering of a ONE...which to me, is the Holy Spirit.

Each vessel is a archetype. To understand all the archetypes is a deep path that I dont dare try to say I understand. I can say though....I believe the trees can sing...I believe the stars are aware....I believe that the Universe is a being in itself. I believe the grass is a humble archetype, providing itself over all of the Earth. I should not talk about things I am not sure of....but I have connected deeply with life that is not a human being and have learned spiritual things through them. To me, it all connects to a ONE spirit....instead of a many. For me, the many is only the vessels (ever heard of the story about the breaking of the vessels?)

Not sure if my posts makes any sense to you but that is where I am at on my path right now.

Originally posted by Mykahel
reply to post by LeoVirgo

 

I'm sorry, but you said to have moved on from the Bible but you don't even understand it in the first place. You have misused scripture after scripture.

If no sacrifice had to made, than Christ had no reason to die. If he had no reason to die, he wouldn't have since he was the Son of God. If he claims to be the Son of God and still died for no reason, he wasn't really who he claimed to be at all and so everything he taught is subject to scrutiny as being lies and so forth.

Christ died for the purpose of being an atoning sacrifice for our sins. The Bible speaks clearly on this repeatedly throughout the Old and New Testaments.

The command is not as you said "Do not kill" but is actually "Do not Murder." There is a big difference here. If it was not to kill at all, then we should all be vegetarians, wait, they have life too and we shouldn't kill them, we should just starve or eat rocks since killing is never acceptable.

Jesus said pick up your cross. This is no way inferring that we are to pay for our own sins. The Bible is quite clear about that too. He is saying very clearly in Matthew 16:24-27 that you have to be willing to give up everything, your possessions and your very life, if you want to follow Jesus. Not to atone for your sins, but because the world will hate you and you have to be willing to put these earthly things behind you that, as you have said, God does not care about.

We are Holy because the Holy Spirit is within us, but he can also designate a place as holy.

I did understand the path you now walk...I walked it myself.

I dont believe that Jesus was a supporter of the OT sacrifices at all. I think this was one reason that the Jews did not listen to him. I believe the reason Jesus was so upset at the Temple was the selling of animals for sacrifices.

We all have reason to die at some point. Jesus not only talked his talked....but he walked the walk. He showed that he was not going to fight for this life here....he showed that he truly was willing to give back to Earth what is of Earth. He taught how to truly live for his life of Spirit. Jesus made the same offering the Holy Spirit has made. He offered himself.

By offering ourselves for the love and will of Spirit....we become an instrument for the Spirit to speak to mankind. By understanding every form of life you consume exist also through the offering of the Spirit...you gain Spiritual wisdom.

Rome had an agenda....it was to unite the Jews, the Gentiles, and the Pagans. Blood sacrifices were a part of mans ways for a long time.

Gods cycles of life should be respected and it should humble us that to live a life of Earth...we must consume life itself. The teaching of the Spirit being within life has always been here, even before the books. It has though been mis used.

The offering of life is a key. The Holy Spirit offered us life. The cycle and orders continues the offering of life in that we must consume life to live a Earthly life. Jesus offered his life....for the true life of Spirit.

When eating life...the lesson is to be thankful and humble. But we should remember...the food only fills us with the life of Earth unless we are aware that the Spirit within is what made this offering for us.

We are reminded that to have a Earthly life...we must consume Earthly life. The food for the life of Spirit are things unseen...just as God is the 'unseen'. These are the things of Spirit that will fill us and help us learn things not of this world.

Jesus showed us that when living for the life of Spirit....we must remain sure footed. If Jesus would of fought for this life....what life would he of been living for?

Its important to be aware what life you are feeding and when. Its not wrong to feed your Earthly vessel...for it is the vessel you have been giving to learn through. But know, when consuming your dinner tonight...this only feeds your Earthly life...your vessel. But knowing this, and being aware of it, you show discernment. Give thanks to the Spirit to the cycles of life and the offering the Spirit has made within all things. Then you will also feed your soul.

It is important to be aware what life you are feeding and when. When learning of love in its hardest times of practice, when learning of forgiving in its hardest times of being, when learning of being humble and being patient, when learning of compassion for others, when learning why to be thankful for every breath....know you are feeding your life of Spirit. The Bible gives some pretty good descriptions between what is of flesh and what is of Spirit.

We do have to feed both...some only choose to feed one though, the life of Earth. Not seeing the inner offering that supports us here to exists. Respect all forms of life, for they are filled with the same offering that fills our being...the offering of Spirit. There is very good reason that we have to consume life to have life.

Just as though, to have a Spiritual life...we have to consume Spiritual things.

Just know what actions support which body...is it supporting your Earthly body or your Spiritual body. If it is of your Earthly body....give thanks, give honor, give respect...for the Spirit of life has offered this unto you. Without giving thanks, honor, and respect...only the Earthly body will be fed.

The key is awareness of both and discerning between the two. We all eventually have to offer back to Earth what is of Earth....and offer back to the Spirit what is of Spirit.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


Rome's agenda was to keep the peace and maintain power, just as any other empire. As soon as they figured out Christians weren't just a branch of the Jews, they started slaughtering them wholesale because they viewed them as a threat to their power. Killing the man people called the Son of God is not the best way tio get on their good side and unite the people.

You claim to have walked the path I now tread, but if you did you did so with blurry vision. I have yet to see any semblance to the true message of God's word in what you have said. You have misused scripture over and over, and even claim things directly contrary to what God and Jesus (Yeshua) themselves said.

Believe what you want, but do not claim to understand something that you clearly do not. You are only setting yourself up as a false teacher (heretic in some circles). The Bible clearly speaks of the type of destiny in waiting for those people.

reply to post by LeoVirgo

I would like to say that I do support Monotheism. My reason is that there is a Spirit of life within all things. Im not a supporter of Pantheism...but I dont judge those that have found wisdom in this path either. It harms no one to follow this path and I can not say there is not a wisdom of Spirit within that path. To me, the wisdom would be though....that all things of life contain the offering of a ONE...which to me, is the Holy Spirit.

Of course from the outside all is One. But I'm not on the outside. From inside, yes, there is a Spirit witnessing to and offering One. Inside, though is where delusion is strong. Not humans alone are effected, even some lesser deities are too, though some have passed on, retired.

Since this is your thread, it should be safe to say, though I sound done with Yahweh, that's not true. Not that I lied, just wrong. As long as there are people joined to him, I can't let him go. I have reason to believe more will be added soon.

Each vessel is a archetype. To understand all the archetypes is a deep path that I dont dare try to say I understand. I can say though....I believe the trees can sing...I believe the stars are aware....I believe that the Universe is a being in itself. I believe the grass is a humble archetype, providing itself over all of the Earth. I should not talk about things I am not sure of....but I have connected deeply with life that is not a human being and have learned spiritual things through them. To me, it all connects to a ONE spirit....instead of a many. For me, the many is only the vessels (ever heard of the story about the breaking of the vessels?)

Some people would call you a Pantheist based on the above paragraph, no matter, labels are not always accurate, or even used properly.

I don't know which story you refer too, unless that's a Gideon reference. Or is it the Kabbalistic story of "the breaking of the vessels," ? I'll see if I can find it somewhere.

Not sure if my posts makes any sense to you but that is where I am at on my path right now.

Thank you,
pthena



[edit on 19-3-2010 by pthena]

[edit on 19-3-2010 by pthena]

Originally posted by Mykahel
reply to post by LeoVirgo

 

Rome's agenda was to keep the peace and maintain power, just as any other empire. As soon as they figured out Christians weren't just a branch of the Jews, they started slaughtering them wholesale because they viewed them as a threat to their power. Killing the man people called the Son of God is not the best way tio get on their good side and unite the people.

You claim to have walked the path I now tread, but if you did you did so with blurry vision. I have yet to see any semblance to the true message of God's word in what you have said. You have misused scripture over and over, and even claim things directly contrary to what God and Jesus (Yeshua) themselves said.

Believe what you want, but do not claim to understand something that you clearly do not. You are only setting yourself up as a false teacher (heretic in some circles). The Bible clearly speaks of the type of destiny in waiting for those people.

Rome was clearly not the only ones who killed people in those days.

You follow what man has told you...I only advise that we are to follow what is perfect, which is the Holy Spirit. All things in the Bible are not ways of God but you are free to believe it is so.

I can tell you things the Bible says...just as you and others are doing. But I have experienced differently. God had no reason to leave mankind a material book....but you are free to believe Thee did. Man is the one that left us the book....so it must be discerned.

Of course the Bible warns against using your own mind and seeking within your own self for the Holy Spirit to guide you....the powers and leaders would not be needed if you knew that all the wisdom you will ever need can be found without a priest, without a book, without the churches.

My path has prepared me to be called a false teacher...just as they did to Jesus. I was prepared for everything I will have to endure...and I wouldnt change a thing about my path....even when I walked the path as you are today....I needed to experience that way in order to see the path I know now.

Just because I dont preach what you will find in the churches, does not mean I have no understanding of why man believed what they did. It makes perfect sense why they believed what they did according to Earthly ways.

Im not trying to use scripture...Im trying to use what is known as the living word...the way of the Holy Spirit when you allow Thee to lead the way instead of man.

Blessings always to you and yours
LV

Originally posted by LeoVirgo
reply to post by Mykahel

 

Everything that holds life holds the Holy Spirit. Nothing of life can exists without the Holy Spirit within it. This was the true offering of self of God for this experience and existence.

Its understanding that without the Holy Spirit...no life would exists.

God never required a sacrifice....God made this world here with a purpose...that purpose is us to Seek the life force within us.

The Life Force and the Holy Spirit are not the same thing.

In this life and on this Earth, fauna and flora are both embued with the life force but only humanity can choose to invite the Holy Spirit into the heart and thereby enter into a personal relationship with God.

Here is a true story about the effects of facism and its written records.

A ten year old boy held a secret,he wouldnt know until years later that he would not be held in account for this thing that occurred to him.
But he was racked by shame as a ten year old he felt unclean.
Finally months later he stumbled across the Old testament, he scoured the pages for the words of a God that would forgive and love him.

But page after page only referred to the chosen few and how the unchosen the "gentiles " were second class, unworthy, not of Gods attention.
This is what Facism is, evil, exclusive,false and uncaring.
I was twenty eight when I first realised God was love and his only commandment was to "love for no reward".
The darkness that enveloped me whilst reading the Old teastament and its Facist inclusions by the elite chosen prophets is still feared.
If God so loves the israelis and ridicules us the unclean, then I say beware that which you worship,lest Hitler is in heaven unredeemed.

reply to post by Mykahel

Rome's agenda was to keep the peace and maintain power, just as any other empire. As soon as they figured out Christians weren't just a branch of the Jews, they started slaughtering them wholesale because they viewed them as a threat to their power. Killing the man people called the Son of God is not the best way tio get on their good side and unite the people.

The Christians were persecuted and killed for resembling the Jews, in refusing to acknowledge the self proclaimed godness of the Emperor or even acknowledge any typical national Roman temple worship. They were in it together and suffered together whether they recognized each other or not. No one group has a monopoly on being persecuted.

Now, and in the future many suffer for not being 'patriotic' enough. Just like Rome. National religion plays a major role in sifting the patriotic from the unpatriotic. If all were heretics, there could be no executioner. Unfortunately, persecutors have a way of favoring one group long enough for them to persecute for them then turn on the favored group, and persecute them in turn.


[edit on 19-3-2010 by pthena]

Originally posted by LeoVirgo
Gods plan has no part in taking the life out of another being. Sacrifices shed blood...your sins cant be covered by sowing another bad seed, like taking a life. This only sows more bad seeds, it does not make amends.

Jesus's death was necessary. God's 'plan' required it.

Jesus said you must carry your own cross....so how is it that your sins are on his cross if you must carry your own?

The sacrifices of God are a broken heart and a broken spirit. That Jesus was aware from the start that his death was inevitable, did not protect him from the heart breaking experience of watching people that God had sent him to redeem, condemn him to death and kill him.

The Holy Spirit helped me see that by believing another man had to die for me...the blood of that man was on my hands.

This was revealed to me also. But I accepted the truth of it. And the shame.

I may not have been there in person, but I nailed my god to a tree and there he bled and pleaded for me.