Stupidity -- A film by Albert Nerenberg

Originally posted by djusdjus
reply to post by AboveTopSecret.com

 

I think this films defines americans more so than it defines human behaviours in general.

Americans have a uniqueness about their general stupidity in a broad sweeping sense. This film helps to define it a little more clearly.

You can find stupid people in any country really, but in America, it is frighteningly common place.

As much as I hate to admit it I must say you are correct about American stupidity. But don't think for one moment that it wasn't planned to be that way. The more stupid people are, the more the "leaders" can get away with. It's how Both Bush and the moron that is in the White House now got elected. It is why the country is in the shape it is in.


Edit to add that I do think it is ironic to have Bill Maher in a documentary about stupidity. Considering his past and present antics, who is he to deride other people for being stupid? He needs to take a long hard look in a mirror!

[edit on 3-3-2010 by LiquidMirage]

Wow, just finished the first part. Really really interesting, think im going to bring this topic up in my psychology class tomorrow...see what my teacher has to say on it.

S/F

Gooo ATS!

reply to post by Snarf


I gotta disagree with you there. While I think pro athletes are elevated to a ridiculous level in our society, AND extremely overpaid, I wouldn't compare Steve-O to a professional athlete. Some professional athletes possess skills that border on superhuman. The top level pros are 1 in a million.

Steve-O is a mentally disturbed drug\alcohol abuser with a 'satan' tattoo on his back who has NO talent or skills of any kind, save for the fact that he WAS savvy enough to cash in on it somehow. In the "Stupidity" video, he walks onstage, sticks the microphone in his mouth, and then begins punching himself in the side of the head repeatedly. I once saw him appear on a talk show very drunk (for a big daredevil he-man, he holds his liquor like a girl scout) He trashed the set, and then couldn't believe others weren't amused when he pissed behind a camera rig. We're talking about an adult...a 35-year old !!!

reply to post by ColeYounger

I wouldn't compare Steve-O to a professional athlete. Some professional athletes possess skills that border on superhuman. The top level pros are 1 in a million.

Wow - did you even read what i wrote?

I never said Steve-o *WAS* a professional athelete, i said he became famous FOR THE SAME REASON as a professional athlete.

We watch professional athletes PLAY games, it's entertaining.

We watch Steve-O drink beer thats been up his ass. Its entertaining.....its disgusting, but it's entertaining...in a disgusting kind of way.


They're both entertainers.

One just took a life long dedication to sharpen his physique and hone his skill

the other just drunks some liquor and does stupid crap.


End Result? We all get a small little escape from our every day world watching them.

reply to post by Snarf


My error...I get what you're saying now.
I was reading a little more about him, and just when I thought he couldn't
possibly be a bigger weirdo I read that he flunked out of college and then attended clown college. (If the story's true)
He applied at Ringling Bros circus but "wasn't good enough".

Originally posted by AboveTopSecret.com


Featuring opinions and comments from some of today's most recognizable figures, cultural critics, authors and academics, including John Cleese, Noam Chomsky, Selma Hayek, and Bill Maher, Stupidity reveals that, despite our culture's extensive access to knowledge and information, humans continue to choose stupidity.



[edit on 3-3-2010 by SkepticOverlord]

With such Nobel Laureates as John Cleese, Selma Hayek, and Bill Maher I do not think I will be able to take this video seriously. I know Noam Chomsky is a college teacher at least he has some experience in the field of education. His insights into stupidity might be worth something. And yet, I find the rest of the star stunning line up to be short on intellectual insights. They maybe big name stars however I have negative opinions about every one of those entertainers. Just to start with. They are entertainers. Their job is not comparable to that of the rocket scientist or the garbage man. Their work is light and the intellectual qualifications moot. Their jobs are ones of personality.

I do expect this documentary to be entertaining but with that kind of star power vouching for it, I do not think it will be anything other than entertaining. I may have a different opinion after watching. But not likely with stars like those.

Originally posted by Flakey
They are entertainers. Their job is not comparable to that of the rocket scientist or the garbage man. Their work is light and the intellectual qualifications moot. Their jobs are ones of personality.

Ones job doesnt dictate ones IQ, just so's you know. Nor does ones formal education level.

A bouncer can have an IQ of 195 or better.

en.wikipedia.org...

You may not like them, and their opinions, or their career. But to say "because someone works in this job, we can assume they are not bright enough to have insight into anything not related to their job," is a fallacy.

I have been to college, and I had some very unintelligent professors. I also had some very bright ones. I worked in construction and knew some very intelligent people, and some not so bright ones.

What someone chooses or is fortunate or unfortunate enough to do as a career is one thing. Their innate intelligence is another. And, going to college makes one educated. It doesnt make one more intelligent.

reply to post by ColeYounger

I read that he flunked out of college and then attended clown college. (If the story's true)

Maybe its true, maybe its not

But if it is true - then it gets added to the already millions of examples of why college is pointless, and a degree doesn't really mean a whole lot

Steve-O is a millionaire.

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


Some people are smart enough to choose the reality they desire to live in and some people are not as smart and must suffer as victims of circumstance in life. This applies to entertainers as well as rocket scientists. The list of entertainers offered does not strike me as a list of intellectuals but people how have over inflated senses of themselves. They maybe entertaining but I find them to be a little stupid. Maybe in this manner it is befitting of them to be in a documentary about stupidity.

reply to post by Flakey


to an extent, i'll agree with you, but over all, i disagree.

Its easy to say "any dumb ass with a camera can do what Steve-O did"

and thats just purely not true.

Yes, a lot of Steve-O's comedy is derived from self-mutilation...but in a very twisted way, you have to admit that it *IS* creative.

When i was in High School, our Art teacher let us create our own toned-down version of "Jack Ass" for an independent studies project.

My friends and me staged a scene at Burger King in Tuscola where we hid some of our leftover meal inside the garbage can on top of the other refuse.

We waited and waited, and finally, a man & wife walk in with their kid and set down in the adjacent table, in full view of the trash can.

The classroom erupted with laughter as they watched the reactions of the peoples faces as they watched my buddy - who dressed up as a very authentic looking homeless guy - rummaged through the garbage and started eating what appeared to be already eaten/chewed up food.




The next "best" video was a few guys had tied themselves to a tree in the woods behind the school and whipped each other with switches.


I tell you this as proof that not any idiot with a camera can get laughs.
Only the idiots who put some thought behind the madness before hand.


[edit on 3-3-2010 by Snarf]

reply to post by surfer_soul


what you've posted appears to be the same film, but a different edit. Or perhaps an unedited version. It has the moments from the original film, plus a lot more.
Also I'd like to point out for our other members that it isn't honest to review something you haven't seen all of.

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


I think you are quite right on the fear element. Art is imitating life, life is imitating art, etc. on a grand scale here in America. Except the art is degrading and almost seeks a goal of pure animal bliss, being the best fed cow around. Many (I will not label a number or percentage) are riding a distinct downward spiral pattern. They believe in all the images and soundbites they see (not all, but enough to reach critical mass) and as such, they fear releasing from this well-fed cow matrix of sorts. And this art imitating life pattern goes way back in America, so one has to do quite a lengthy, seemingly infinite regress of perspective in order to somewhat grasp how these interconnected interactions work.

Interestingly enough, from my view, the Golem, cattle, puppet type are in all walks of life. The "important" professions have no lack of them. This problem can be solved, however, by love and care and counter metaprogramming. Not even counter really, but transcendent. You make people aware of the unraveling nature of the pattern, along with certain key changes that occur along the way, and you can transcend this. We can sort of dissolve the programming and allow people to return to a more natural, healthful state. Strangely enough, I think, when people threw away religion, they forgot the importance of faith, in general. The concepts in which we have faith are the very things that drive us. And we can choose them per our experience. However, many just get sucked into the demiurge of a zeitgeist, because they have faith in no more than the stimulation of television and tasty food and whatever material item will reinforce an image, when, of course, the image is just a planned out illusion and a reflection of a sort of half reptile/half ape creature stuck in duality slinging poo. One can easily see that many are at least acting essentially as products of the synthesis from the dialogue of popular culture. Having a mind is unpopular in many circles. Blindly following an ideology, and I am talking about all ideologies, which are essentially language viruses, is the order of the day in many circles. There are, by the way, many I have seen who are beyond this sort of thing, and that is a hopeful sign.

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


Absolutely, you hit a key point. Perceive the message without prejudice. The belief that a monkey in a suit is somehow more valid in his or her view is a reflection of the ignorance and pride of the listener. Many want to fit in with the whole image thing, and they do not want to appear ignorant, so if somebody deemed of high status in this highly troubled culture says something, they latch onto the particular language virus they intuit and spit it out as if it were some original creation. In the game of idiot telephone, it becomes more foolish with each iteration. Many people seek the power of ideology rather than the wisdom of honest and humble reflection. The problem is, these ideologies are demigods that are fast dying and morphing. What is left of these people when the veil is lifted, so to speak? Hopefully more than a fearful, rabid zombie. I personally believe it is our duty to plant seeds which will allow those who want to get out to get out and safely transition into having a genuine but peaceful self-view.

I found this to be a disturbing film targetted at, what appears to be, American culture and people. To add a conspiratorial angle, it seems as if they are preparing the propaganda machine to dehumanize Americans. You can't kill/murder people enmasse, without the considered support of your peers. And that is not likely, until you have convinced those peers, that such a proposal is for the good of humankind. We're all pretty much aware of how that works, given things like the War on Terror, Stalin's 40 million and Hitler's death camps.

reply to post by AboveTopSecret.com


No, humans do not "choose" stupidity.
Just search John Taylor Gatto
How easy it is to say "people are like that, nothing to do, we are doomed". People are not like that. People are - as you grow them. We are farmed, and domesticated. We have laws that replace our natural instincts. We learn not to trust ourselves. We are so much modified that when we are free we don;t know what to do and ask to be put back in the cage.

www.spinninglobe.net...

Now dumb people aren't just ignorant; they're the victims of the non-thought of secondhand ideas. Dumb people are now well-informed about the opinions of Time magazine and CBS, The New York Times and the President; their job is to choose which pre-thought thoughts, which received opinions, they like best. The élite in this new empire of ignorance are those who know the most pre-thought thoughts.

Mass dumbness is vital to modem society. The dumb person is wonderfully flexible clay for psychological shaping by market research, government policymakers; public-opinion leaders, and any other interest group. The more pre-thought thoughts a person has memorized, the easier it is to predict what choices he or she will make. What dumb people cannot do is think for themselves or ever be alone for very long without feeling crazy. That is the whole point of national forced schooling; we aren't supposed to be able to think for ourselves because independent thinking gets in the way of "professional" think-ing, which is believed to follow rules of scientific precision.

Modern scientific stupidity masquerades as intellectual knowledge - which it is not. Real knowledge has to be earned by hard and painful thinking; it can't be generated in group discussions or group therapies but only in lonely sessions with yourself. Real knowledge is earned only by ceaseless questioning of yourself and others, and by the labor of independent verification; you can't buy it from a government agent, a social worker, a psychologist, a licensed specialist, or a schoolteacher. There isn't a public school in this country set up to allow the discovery of real knowledge - not even the best ones - although here and there individual teachers, like guerrilla fighters, sabotage the system and work toward this ideal. But since schools are set up to classify people rather than to see them as unique, even the best schoolteachers are strictly limited in the amount of questioning they can tolerate.

www.primitivism.com...

The trauma or inescapable terror of civilization is responsible for the derangement of reason. That inner dialogue in the human mind that is the hallmark of self-consciousness has ceased, because the depth-dimension of reflective thought, which is the primitive mind, has been silenced.

I still haven't watched the whole movie(and don't feel the need to) but I wanted to make a couple comments...

There are some people saying the movie is focusing on american stupidity, of which there is much, but it's not to say that americans are more stupid then other countries citizens. It would be interesting to cover many different cultures and find out what makes someone stupid. Could you imagine some tribe in the Amazon's take on this? I agree with whoever said it earlier that this is more about people being lazy, bored, and desensitized.

I was in a place called Coramandle Town(spelling?) in New zealand one time, and I ended up talking to an idiot at their local bar. Had it not been for his accent, he would have sounded exactly like all the imbecile backwoods american rednecks that I have met in my life. And that's saying a lot when you consider someone in my old home town died a couple days ago from peeing on a downed power line. True stories. both of em.

I'll disagree with the poster that can't handle hearing from smart celebs. Not every brilliant person ends up being a rocket scientist. Just because one isn't involved in education it doesn't make him dumb. There are brilliant people in all lines of work. A man considered to have the highest IQ ever, is a bouncer at a bar!!!

Here...want to see a much better video about intelligence...check him out.
video.google.com...#

Celebs can be brilliant, no bodies can be brilliant, even bartenders can....

I pulled the ultimate bone of "stupidity and bought this trash years ago. I never really expected it to be a documentary style video.

This video is more or less just king of pointing out the obvious in a very dry and boring manner. Sorry to shoot your thread down, feel free to reciprocate when i make a thread.

This is an awesome film - everyone should see it. For those who can not access ATS media file - here is another link (just in case) video.google.co.uk...#

Originally posted by undo
I found this to be a disturbing film targetted at, what appears to be, American culture and people. To add a conspiratorial angle, it seems as if they are preparing the propaganda machine to dehumanize Americans. You can't kill/murder people enmasse, without the considered support of your peers. And that is not likely, until you have convinced those peers, that such a proposal is for the good of humankind. We're all pretty much aware of how that works, given things like the War on Terror, Stalin's 40 million and Hitler's death camps.

What's it like living in a state of paranoia every day?
Must be horrible.

reply to post by djusdjus


ATS is inundated with people discussing the demise of the USA and its people and they are doing so with relish and anticipation, saying things like "karma is a bitch". there's even a thread with many many stars, celebrating the pilot who crashed his plane into the IRS building, and suggesting a revolution in the usa should naturally require the deaths of anyone who works in or for the government at any level. some are even justifying the deaths of innocent people as acceptable casualties.

the tv news broadcasters are constantly reminding us that at least half the citizenry of the usa, are stupid redneck hillbillies, a way of dehumanizing people who don't typically vote for socialist policies. and now hollywood has decided to use its political muscle to not just ostracize people who don't vote socialist, but to characterize the entire caucasian, western way of life, as the lifestyle of an idiot.


[edit on 4-3-2010 by undo]