$Two Thousand Dollars$ to spend on supplies -

reply to post by eleven:eleven


It's good that you're thinking about this now and getting things ready. Personally, dogs are incredibly valuable in survival situations because they'll alert you to approaching people much earlier than you'd hear them otherwise. They are fantastic for that. Best wishes.

Originally posted by eleven:eleven
We currently reside 20 miles south of a capital city in the midwest, in a small rural community. Sadly, our neighbors may be our enemy, true. We belive no ammount of long term food and water amounts to squat if you are unarmed.

I would like to create some security system or surveilance. For example I have thought about a system of bells for the fences, but haven't quite found a good enough idea that makes me smile hard.

Here's an idea that I've seen implemented on several different properties and the sooner you get this started, the better. Along the edges of your property, plant the most thorny plants that'll live in your climate zone. We have three walls of blackberry vines around our property that no one will go through, and roses on the inside edge of that. They are fantastic natural defenders and will make sure that you have a secure perimeter (or at least 95% more secure than you currently have).

The members of ATS have been posting some great ideas here. I've been preparing for years so I've gotten things pretty much set. The sooner you start, the sooner you'll meet your goal. Best of luck.

Originally posted by eleven:eleven
The cordless screwdriver is only good for so long. I'm thinking supply of heavy duty long nails for the long haul. I like the trip wires and barb wire, ply wood and such.

I have the dog now, and feel the same way, good and bad...

I'm glad you suggested night vision, what an advantage/edge provided to intruders.

As a prior military NCO, may I caution you on the benefits of night vision. There are a lot of people out there aware of this information, yet some on this thread may not have heard it. Let me break it down for you.

First off, there are essentially two different modes of night vision. There is starlight and IR-Assist. Using starlight mode is by far the safest mode you can use, however your clarity on first and second generation IR drops dramatically when you're near a new moon, or without some illuminating factor (like a campfire, for example).

In most cases, people will automatically default to using the IR light assist that comes with nearly all night vision systems you see online these days. The problem with this is that you can actually see the IR light at night and a trained intruder would be able to spot this IR light easily if pointed in their direction. Try it out yourself. Take it out into the woods where it's dark, turn it on and then walk out in front of it thirty yards. It's easy to see it. The second light you need to worry about is that actual viewing screen itself (which emits a bright green light). If this isn't pressed against your face, it will illuminate your face with a green tint that sticks out like a road flare in the night. Also, if someone is approaching from the rear and you don't have the sight pressed to your face or covered, it'll shine as bright as a flashlight letting them know precisely where you are.

The last two things I'll comment about are grayscale and batteries. Most night vision systems use A123 batteries that are expensive (because they are basically a stack of watch batteries) and difficult to find. If you're going to get one of these things, be sure to stock up on batteries. Some recharge, but if you don't have good access to power, or are just having a lot of cloudy days (with solar) you might be out of luck.

When it comes to grayscale, that's what you'll be seeing with night vision. If someone knows that they'll likely come up against night vision during a raid, they'll use simple profile/outline breakers to throw you off. This can be camo paint, or adding sticks and twigs to your ensemble. Never underestimate the power of camouflage gear these days. With night vision, it all blends together. Get a friend and go out and have some fun with it. See how easy it is to see people and which fabrics don't stick out with it. By knowing this, you'll know how to evade detection if the enemy is using night vision against you.

Unfortunately for several of the enemy, they failed to follow the things I suggested above and they got an express ticket to meet Allah. Please consider my advice. I'd rather we ATS members survive what's coming.

I forgot this, so I'm editing this post to include it:

Many people have spoken about .22 rifles in this thread and the benefits and detriments to them. I'll chime in by saying that strategically, a .22 does far more damage than a higher power rifle. I say this because there's a higher degree of likelihood that the enemy will not be killed, but will be wounded or maimed. In that instance, not only are they out of the fight, but now they will be using additional personnel and resources to attend to that person removing even more potential personnel from the battlefield. Killing is essential when the situation calls for it, but if you can wound them instead (especially when you know they won't have expert medical attention) you take them out of the fight, and support personnel as well that will have to look after them.

You also have to consider those that are doing the shooting. A .22 has no recoil and can easily be shot by a younger person. In many cases, the younger people may need to be withheld from a firefight, but if it's necessary for survival, the .22 is a fantastic weapon for them to send rounds downrange. Just be aware that they will likely need to be counseled after they witness a real battle for the first time. Be prepared to have some serious and lengthy discussions. Keeping things bottled in as a kid is destructive.

If TSHTF in epic fashion, be aware of your ammo reserves and do not fire unless you know it's going to hit its target. Personally, I fire a 30-06 using 165-grain boat-tailed composite tipped ammo, though I do have some 180 grain as well. My sidearm came back with me from the Middle East, as it never failed me there, and I am very confident with it. It's a Ruger P-90 .45 semi-auto. They are easy to clean, reliable, and the .45 round is sub-sonic which is better on the hearing but absolutely lethal in combat, putting a hole the size of your fist in the enemy. You'll only need to fire once (provided you aim correctly).

Best of luck to you all.

[edit on 23-1-2010 by bpg131313]

reply to post by eleven:eleven


[edit] Texas
Subject/Law Long guns Handguns Relevant Statutes Notes
State Permit to Purchase? No No None
Firearm registration? No No None
"Assault weapon" law? No No None
Owner license required? No No None
Carry permits issued? No Yes GC Ch. 411 Subch H, PC 46.15 Concealed carry of a handgun requires a "shall-issue" permit. Open carry of a handgun is prohibited with some exceptions (hunting, on one's own property). Open carry of a long gun is not specifically prohibited as PC 46.02 (unlawful carry of weapons) only mentions handguns, however it may be construed as "Disorderly Conduct".
State Preemption of local restrictions? Yes Yes Const. 1.23, PC 1.08 "... the Legislature shall have the power, by law, to regulate the wearing of arms, with a view to prevent crime." In addition (PC 1.08), no lower level of government may pass a law that penalizes any conduct which is specifically covered by the State statutes.
NFA weapons restricted? No No PC 46.01(9), PC 46.05 State law prohibits ownership outside of NFA compliance, calling possession while in compliance "a defense to prosecution."
Peaceable Journey laws? Yes Yes PC 46.02, PC 46.15 A person may carry a concealed, loaded handgun without a permit while in or heading directly to a car they own or control.
Castle Doctrine? Yes Yes PC 9.32 A person is presumed justified in using deadly force to protect themselves against an unlawful, forceful intrusion into their dwelling. There is no duty to retreat from any place where the shooter has a legal right to be.

Texas has no laws regarding possession of "long-barreled firearms" or "long guns" (shotguns, rifles and similar) by persons 18 years or older without felony convictions; 21 years or older for handguns. NFA weapons are also only subject to Federal restrictions; no State regulations exist. Municipal and county ordinances on possession and carry are generally overridden (preempted) due to the wording of the Texas Constitution, which gives the Texas Legislature (and it alone) the power to "regulate the wearing of arms, with a view to prevent crime".[208] Penal Code Section 1.08 also prohibits local jurisdictions from enacting or enforcing any law that conflicts with State statute. Local ordinances restricting discharge of a firearm are generally allowed as State law has little or no specification thereof.

There is no legal statute specifically prohibiting the open (unconcealed) carry of a long-barreled firearm, although there is debate as to whether doing so constitutes "disorderly conduct" (which defines an offense, in part, as "displaying a firearm or other deadly weapon in a public place in a manner calculated to cause alarm"). Concealed carry of a long gun is generally prohibited. Open carry of a handgun in public is generally illegal in Texas; exceptions include when the carrier is on property he/she owns or has lawful control over, while legally hunting, or while participating in some gun-related public event such as a gun show. A permit to carry concealed is thus required to carry a handgun in public. Concealed carry permits are issued on a non-discretionary basis ("shall-issue") to all qualified applicants. In addition, Texas recognizes most out-of-state concealed-carry permits.

The concealed handgun law sets out the eligibility criteria that must be met. For example, an applicant must be qualified to purchase a handgun under the state and federal laws. Additionally, a number of factors may make a person ineligible (temporarily or permanently) to obtain a license, including: felony convictions (permanent) and Class A or B misdemeanors (5 years, permanent in cases of domestic violence), including charges that resulted in probation or deferred adjudication; pending criminal charges (indefinite until resolved); chemical or alcohol dependency (defined as 2 convictions for substance-related offenses; 10-year ban from the date of the first conviction); certain types of psychological diagnoses (indefinite until the condition is testified by a medical professional as being in remission); protective or restraining orders (indefinite until rescinded); or defaults on taxes, governmental fees, student loans or child support (indefinite until resolved).[209] This last category, though having little to do with a person's ability to own a firearm, is in keeping with Texas policy for any licensing; those who are delinquent or in default on State-regulated debts are generally barred from obtaining or renewing any State-issued license (including driver licenses), as an incentive to settle those debts.

A person wishing to obtain a CHL must also take a State-set instruction course covering topics such as applicable laws, conflict resolution, criminal/civil liability, and handgun safety, and pass a practical qualification at a firing range with a weapon of the type they wish to use (revolver or semi-automatic) and of a caliber greater than .32". They may then apply, providing a picture, fingerprints and other documentation, to the DPS, which processes the application, runs a federal background check, and if all is well, issues the permit.

On March 27, 2007, Governor Rick Perry signed Senate Bill 378 into law, making Texas a "Castle Doctrine" state which came into effect September 1, 2007.[210] Residents lawfully occupying a dwelling may shoot a person who "unlawfully, and with force, enters or attempts to enter the dwelling", or who removes or attempts to remove someone from that dwelling, or who commits or attempts to commit a "qualifying" felony such as burglary, arson, rape, aggravated assault, robbery or murder. In addition, a shooter who has a legal right to be wherever he/she is at the time of a defensive shooting has no "duty to retreat" before being justified in shooting; the "trier of fact" may not consider whether the person retreated when deciding whether the person was justified in shooting.

Gov. Perry also signed H.B. 1815, a bill that allows any Texas resident to carry a concealed handgun in the resident's motor vehicle without a CHL or other permit.[211] Chapter 46, Section 2 of the Penal Code states that it is in fact not "Unlawful Carry of a Weapon" for a person to carry a weapon while in a motor vehicle they own or control, or to carry while heading directly from the person's home to that car. However, lawful carry while in a vehicle requires these three critical qualifiers: (1) the gun must be concealed; (2) the carrier cannot be involved in criminal activities; and (3) the carrier cannot be a member of a criminal gang.[212][213]

Possession of automatic firearms, short-barreled shotguns or rifles, or silencers is permitted, if the weapons have been federally registered in accordance with the National Firearms Act.[208]

en.wikipedia.org...(by_state)#Wisconsin

[edit on 24-1-2010 by TriggerFish]

I would skip the fire arm.
Get a good backpack you will be thankful you did don't just get any old thing. Stockup on rice that stuff is cheap. Get a small gas stove and stock up on Gas! get a really good portable filler and a first aid kit. then just keep everything read you may also want to include some toothpaste condoms and keep rolling over fresh food.

If you stay put...
Rabbits, chickens, heirloom seeds, water filtration, snares, fishing gear (including a cast-net), first-aid kit, hi-power pellet gun (quiet) w/ ammo, and a couple of firearms. A bolt-action or single shot .22 for simplicity and durability, and a rifle for defense, a .223 or more preferably a .308.
A .22 caliber pistol would be good too.

I have read all the posts for this thread and agree that it all depends on whatever situation you are in at the time, so all good advice. However, I have not seen anyone mention having a good Compound or Recurve Bow. They can be used for hunting, and can retrieve arrows (less ammunition used) and there are/will be times when SILENCE matters. (if this has been mentioned - sorry for the repeat!)

Also, as for perimeter alarms, we make "Flash Bang" that produce a lot of smoke using fireworks we buy twice a year and scavenge the black powder. There is a two-fold benefit, it can partialy blind whatever intruder stupid enough to tresspass and the smoke alerts us to where we either release the dogs / or shoot. (We do have lines of site to key areas of the property)

Dogs, we have several (11), and we will use them for several purposes. We have a "wagon" of sorts (made with bicycle wheels) with harnesses for the dogs to pull, if our spring runs dry we are about 1/2 to 1 mile from a lake to be able to get more water. We have stockpiles of beans and rice to feed them using the water as explained below.

We are in the process of retrofitting the house to catch all rainwater and store the water in any and all containers we can find (broken waterheater tanks - rain barrels, etc) May not want to drink some of it, but good for watering garden and washing clothes. Also setting up a gravity tank so can utilize the toilets on the house.

There are many, many ideas out there, you have to look at them all and KNOW if you yourself can pull it off. Whatever you do or purchase or whatever, PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE. Especially as you have a 2 year old. Train him NOW on what he needs to do if he gets scared - no you dont have to go into details and scar him for life, but make him a "safe area" that he MUST go to if anything happens.

Example: we live in a meth neighborhood (yes, we have been in a war zone for many years now) a "neighbor" down the street had a "bad trip" I guess (dont know and dont really care) however once the guns started going off in the house I found her 3 year old daughter crawling out in the front yard trying to hide. Her other two were hiding under a bed. You do not want that for your child.

If you can afford a cast iron bathtub put it in a safe room - have him go there. And train him just like they would at school, drill, drill, drill. I would blindfold my kids and get pots and pans or bang on the washer, whatever I could to make lots of noise, and the kids would crawl to the safe zone blinded. We made it a game so as not to scare them. (we had also reinforced the walls where their beds are) It may seem extreme, but for us, as we have shut down many of those "labs" it is/was necessary.

First off, this is a great thread. Thank you for starting it. I do not have the resources to spend the amount you do at one time, but I will give you a few suggestions if I may. Since you have an acre to play with, I would plant a few fruit trees. Build a compost bin and learn how to properly compost, then use this on your garden and around your fruit trees. If you use chemicals on your present garden, stop now and get your soil prepared through natural means...i.e. burn leaves etc. on the garden area, put animal waste in the garden area, human waste can also be used in limited quantities. Get a hand crank meat grinder and learn how to dehydrate meat naturally...this will provide a lot of protein, and allow your meat to stretch further. Game will become scarce quickly in bad times. Pick your weapons and become proficient with them because you very well may have to defend your family and your food sources with deadly force....kill or be killed? I have seen many great ideas on here so far with other great suggestions from fellow ATSers.

I am relatively new here although I have been reading threads on this sight for a few years now. I do not have enough posts to start a new thread so I would like to use this thread to ask others a question of my own. This question may be beneficial to you and I both...I hope you don't mind.

Who do you trust when it gets down to survive or die? Friends, neighbors, community ? Or do you go it alone with family ? I believe many will turn on each other regardless of the consequences to the ones who are turned against. This saddens me greatly because I hate the thought of turning anyone away in the time need. But, by the same token, I must do everything I can to ensure the survival of my family...it's not that I don't love others, but that I love my family more. In example, I drove 14 hours one way, and used my vacation time from work to go distribute food and water in southern Mississippi after hurricane Katrina. It was the most difficult yet rewarding experience in my life. But if that would have nation wide, I would used all that energy for my family and no one else. Is it wrong to be that way, or is it a smart choice ? Any way, forgive me for the hijack, hopefully, we can get some good answers from others here. Good luck on your choices, and blessings to you and your family.....THEPAPA

[edit on 19-2-2010 by Gregarious]

Originally posted by eleven:eleven
reply to post by Gregarious

 

I am not informed on the gun laws in texas, are they more lenient? If I do drive my behind to the great state of Texas, do you suggest gun show or local store? My fear would be do take the time off work, invest the money in the trip, and wind up there leaving without a gun. Thanks in advance.

I wouldn't say lenient, I'd say freedom based. Personally, I usually try to avoid buying anything new when I can get it used for half that price. Except I only want new bullet cartridges. They almost never misfire. You can find announcements of gun shows in given cities online, and there is a wider selection. Fun, too.
Get yourself involved with Frontsight.com as it will teach you how to come out alive in a firefight, or any dangerous situation. There is a wealth of info for free, and a bunch of great stuff you can pay for, in training. Do some reading there and decide exactly what it is you are looking for, with a couple alternatives maybe.
Personally, I'd recommend trying San Antonio. What a gem of a place!

reply to post by Romans 10:9
Just so you know, if you graze someone with a 22, you just have made an enemy very angry. If you graze someone with a .45, he is passed out if he is still alive. When you train with it, do not fire live rounds. You train yourself that way, to anticipate the strong backlash. You want to be surprised by it, for proper aiming. You get that from dry shooting. AND, it is 'cheaper'! But you do need other training for proper aiming.