POLL: Mexican-Americans owe allegiance to MEXICO, NOT the US

Originally posted by jam321
reply to post by TheCoffinman

 

yankee hatred is a pretty rife down there in mexico, im pretty sure mexicans know a thing or too about mexican-american relations.

So basically you hate Mexicans because Mexico hate yanks.

Last time I checked, Mexico had a population of about 99.9% Mexicans. I expect there to be hate towards other races.

However, the US is one big melting pot of different races and different colors.
I expect their to more respect based on the fact that no matter whether we are white, brown, black- we are all Americans.

Guess you don't see it that way.

I see. So you are saying Mexicans have a right to hate others but we in America are held to different standards???? Aren't we all human??? I think your a little biased or slanted in your view. I can tell that from just reading your posts. If I moved to Germany and was wanting to be a citizen or live out my life there illegally and use up their resources and handouts my loyalty might be with them. I mean, I dusted the good ol USA dust off my feet. I'm living off German goodwill. But hey thats just me. If I take advantage of a country I might want to show it a little loyalty. Aren't they always saying how corrupt it is in Mexico? How they live in bad conditions? Why show loyalty to a country that doesn't care about you?? I'm scratching my head about that one.....

Originally posted by jam321
reply to post by TheCoffinman

 

"You would be surprise to know that most Mexicans Americans don't know that La Raza , Aztlan, or for that matter LULAC even exist, much less what they do."

Can you back that up with a scource? A poll? Anything?? That is a pretty broad statement there. You have a finger on the pulse of the ENTIRE Mexican American Population? Hmmmmmmmm.

reply to post by guardstarr

So you are saying Mexicans have a right to hate others but we in America are held to different standards????

Okay, show me where I said they have a right.

I think your a little biased or slanted in your view. I can tell that from just reading your posts.

When somebody tries to connect me with, Mexican American, with Mexicans from Mexico based on a poll done in Mexico, I guess I must be bias.

When the thread title is misleading, I guess I must be bias.

If I moved to Germany and was wanting to be a citizen or live out my life there illegally and use up their resources and handouts my loyalty might be with them.

There's your problem. I'm Mexican American and 100% legal.

I mean, I dusted the good ol USA dust off my feet. I'm living off German goodwill. But hey thats just me. If I take advantage of a country I might want to show it a little loyalty.

I expect everybody coming to the US to do the same. No other place like my America.

Aren't they always saying how corrupt it is in Mexico? How they live in bad conditions? Why show loyalty to a country that doesn't care about you?? I'm scratching my head about that one.....

I/m wondering the same thing. Once again, I am bias but it is toward America. I love America.

But people really need to start distinguishing between illegal Mexicans and Mexican Americans. We IMO are not the same. Yes we cling to heritage and take pride in it as well.

But there is no nation I rather be in than

America.

reply to post by jam321


jam321:
"But people really need to start distinguishing between illegal Mexicans and Mexican Americans. We IMO are not the same. Yes we cling to heritage and take pride in it as well."

I agree with you there. I think as long as you do it legally fine. I'm Athabascan Indian and proud of it. I am also Greek. I am proud of that. But I was born in America and I am loyal to this country. However like I said if I moved to Germany and that was my home my loyalty would be to Germany.

However, you did post this-

jam321:
"Last time I checked, Mexico had a population of about 99.9% Mexicans. I expect there to be hate towards other races.
The US is one big melting pot of different races and different colors.
I expect their to more respect based on the fact that no matter whether we are white, brown, black- we are all Americans.
Guess you don't see it that way. "

While you may not of said they have a right you are saying it is expected and excusable for them to have HATRED. Same difference....




[edit on 15-10-2009 by guardstarr]

reply to post by jam321


No offense, but I am a little confused about why you call yourself "Mexican-American"....

Mexican is not a race, but a citizen of said country.

Why are you (or anyone), a "Mexican-American", when not FROM Mexico and not the least bit interested in living there?

I would say such a person is simply "American".

I feel just as annoyed by the term "African-American". Why do Americans get these labels just because of their skin color, when they have NOTHING to do with said countries?

I think we need to get past these annoying labels. If a legal citizen in America, regardless of what someone looks like, they and everyone around them should refer to these individuals simply as "American".

Seriously, I had family members come from Germany, Ireland, and even Native Americans. That does not make me a German or Irish American, because of my genetics or looks.

Hope we can someday get rid of those incorrect labels for people. It will help us come together better, when we see each other only as fellow "Americans".

[edit on 15-10-2009 by LostNemesis]

reply to post by guardstarr

While you may not of said they have a right you are saying it is expected and excusable for them to have HATRED. Same difference....

Maybe I could have worded it better. But I do not excuse it, I just expect it.

You see, even I as a Mexican American get targeted and hated on in Mexico. My spanish is not 100% like theirs. A lot of mine includes slang and Tex Mex.
On top of that many of them view us as stuck up. They feel that we have an easy life an everything is given to us for free.

When in reality, Most Americans work hard for what they have.

As far as the source you asked for. I have none. All I have to offer is the 30+ years I have lived as a Mexican. I have never heard of Lulac, la raza, or aztlan until the past few years. Still don't pay them much attention. Most Mexicans I have asked are unaware of these organizations and feel that these organizations really don't help Hispanics.


I feel they are the same as the NAACP.IMO, some of their views are good to help Mexican Americans. On the other hand some of their views are just too demanding and radical.

reply to post by LostNemesis


no offense taken. Like I said before, I was labeled at birth. Personally, I agree with you that it should be American...Period.

I don't like the word Latino or Hispanic either.

I am an American.

All I know is that if I tell people American, they correct me or ask if I am Mexican, Latino, or Hispanic.

About the only time I can say I am American and be accepted with just saying American is when I cross the border.

Of course, i have to prove I am an American first.

reply to post by jam321


Thank you for clarifying. I appreciate a good ol conversation and debate to a war of words and hate. But as I like to say we are all human beings. We are all different and we each have a right to exist. It is how we conduct ourselves and treat others that speaks of who we are not our skin color or nation of birth. I am a citizen of Earth. Our goal should be the progress of the planet not just our small corner of it. However, on the same token supporting where you live and being loyal to it will help ensure better lives for all around you. And help towards making a better Earth.

reply to post by jam321


i have to agree with you. Being a Mexican-American myself, i hadn't even heard of groups such as MECHA, La Raza, etc. until i heard them on Lou Dobbs (i was bored and i had nothing to do so i tuned in to CNN and watched 5 minutes of his xenophobic garbage) 3-ish years ago. So how on earth can anyone honestly assume that all or even a majority of Mexican-Americans have an allegiance to any other entity other than the U.S.? I can honestly tell you that while having about 50% of my Family born, raised, and still residing in Mexico wouldn't deter my allegiance to the U.S., not one bit!

[edit on 10/16/2009 by Daedalus24]

Fellow Texan here and I agree with what Jam said. I know a lot of "Mexican-Americans" that think those racial groups are more of a hinderance and obstacle to the progress of their race. I know a lot of "Mexican-Americans" that do not like "Mexico-Mexicans" and think that illegals should go back home.

I think the hyphenated American labels need to be dropped and never used. An American is an American, reguardless of race, color, creed, or religion.

By the way .. I am Cuacasian-American!

Mexicans can think and say whatever they damned well please in their own county.

They do not however speak for Americans of Mexican descent. Just like Italy cannot speak for Italian Americans or Germany, France [fill in your blood here] etc. Cannot speak for any of those Americans of that descent. I say they are trying to claim something that those who chose to live a better life and left Mexico and work hard obtaining. This seems to be a touchy situation. I know many Americans with Hispanic blood who are 5th and 6th generation Americans who people automatically assume are Mexicans.

At first that also tricked me.


Who cares what Mexicans in Mexico say anyway!

[edit on 16-10-2009 by SLAYER69]

It's a wonder what 160 years do to our country's memory. The same arguments tossed around that would have us believe that Mexicans/Hispanics will never integrate into our society were the same used to alienate the Irish in the 1840s.

Name one reason that argues they wont integrate, and you will find one made in the 1840s. With over 2 million Irish immigrating (keep in mind, immigration to the U.S. in those times had less restrictions as immigration post late 18th century) to the US in a 15 year period due to economic/social reasons from ireland *roughly equivalent in now-number terms of Mexicans/hispanics immigrating legally/illegally*, the "natural-born" citizens and previous immigrant groups went on a xenophobic campaign against he Irish.

From the foundation of the Populist Know Nothing Party to the labeling of the Irish as the "Blacks of the 18th century," the racist arguments that fueled such hate were exactly the ones we hear from the reactionary-right of today. "They wont integrate into American society, they're criminals, vandals, drunks, murderers, they have a different culture, they speak a different language *yes, a vast number of the Irish that came here spoke mainly Gaelic*, they're taking the jobs we don't want to do ourselves but we don't care because they're still taking jobs away from Americans." The same exact arguments we have heard time and again for almost 2 centuries are now being used against the new waves of Immigrants. How can anyone not see this? Is it possible that the vast majority of you who openly scream *INVASION* when you hear Mexican and immigrant in the same sentence have completely glossed over a historical trend proven by massive quantities of primary sources and statistics? Shame on you all.

I think JAM and SLAYER69 are right simply becuase somebody in another country say that Americans of that heritage should do this or that doesn't mean squat.


Mexican/American

Mek.


[edit on 16-10-2009 by Mek-Tech]

reply to post by fleetlord


Good catch.

I completely missed it.

But I've known a lot of mexican-american kids when I went to high school... And a lot of them claimed loyalty to Mexico, and said that the US was terrible. But that represents the punks.

I'm sure there are plenty of Mexican Americans (and Mexicans) that love this country. It's OK to love both countries.. But if someone is a natural born citizen, they should swear loyalty to the ideals of the country, and if they don't like that option, they should pick a place where they can swear loyalty to, and stay there.

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www.mexica-movement.org...

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www.geocities.com/chicanohistory/index.html

www.aztlan.net...

reply to post by TheCoffinman



Whoa chief that poll is nothing like what you posted. I googled it and it brought up this page
CNSNews.com POLL . Now since this site has the whole article let me highlight on the damn article contradicts itself.

Now first we have the opening paragraph and first, it's pertinent to my view..

Nearly 70 percent of Mexicans surveyed said that Mexican-Americans – including those born in the United States – owe their primary loyalty to Mexico, not the U.S., according to a Zogby poll commissioned by the Center for Immigration Studies.

The in-person poll, taken during August and September, sampled 1,004 Mexicans across the country on subjects related to illegal immigration and amnesty in the United States.

Alright you read that? Good! Now here comes the kicker...you may want to sit down for it..here is how they got this so called 70%

When asked “Should the primary loyalty of Mexican-Americans be to Mexico or to the U.S.?” 68.8 percent of respondents in Mexico said that it should be to Mexico, while only 19.7 percent said it should be to the United States. Another 11.5 percent of respondents said they were not sure.

Don't laugh, that's what it says...now here comes the punch line!

Camarota also told CNSNews.com that just over one-third of respondents (36 percent) said that they would come to the U.S., if they could. Of that group, 68 percent said they think that Mexican-Americans owe loyalty to Mexico over the United States.

Now correct me if i'm wrong but didn't they say they interviewed 1004 Mexican Americans...in America? Where are those "poll" results? What questions did they ask them? They interview (supposedly) 1004 Mexican Americans (in America, supposedly) but they are hinging there results on what Mexicans said rather than the Mexican Americans. So my question becomes why in the hell did you interview the Mexicans Americans?

OP, this article is nothing like what you have put in the Headline. Its forgiveable i've done it myself.

So folks on ATS are getting heated about some supposed research that is...quite frankly it's stupid and moronic. I wouldn't be surprised to find out this is fabricated.

[edit on 20-10-2009 by cenpuppie]

OK, imagine that the illegals are offered a quick path to citizenship. Majority will take is and get new shiny US passports.

Now, they are still same people that carried these Mexican banners in all those rallies and where many of them said that the land belongs to them by birthright.

Bottomline, the OP is correct (maybe without much finesse) that a large part of the US population now, and moreso in near future, will have allegiance to Mexico and not the US.

Geez, why wasn't I included in this survey?
Please excuse "my's people's" for they know not what they do.

We can argue all day about the so called "land swindle" but if you really think about it, in the long run it was probably the best thing that ever happened to Mexico.
I mean heck, if they would have kept the great American Southwest, we would all be migrating to Canada right about now.

What would Texas and California be like today if they still belonged to Mexico?

* Jack Kilby would not have been able to invent the integrated circuit in the labs of Texas Instruments.
* I can tell you Silicon Valley alone would not be what is today, which means the rest of the world would look a lot different.

reply to post by Alxandro

* Jack Kilby would not have been able to invent the integrated circuit in the labs of Texas Instruments

I always thought the integrated circuit was the result of reverse engineering alien technology?