UFO in Spain

Lets not forget past reports of UFOs diving into the water... there usually isn't a disturbance of the water... at least not to this extent. My vote is a hoax. Also, there seems to be way too much non-stop action for real life... just like a movie... A thumb up for originality and a thumb down for not taking things serious.

Originally posted by PennyQ
reply to post by Tapped In

 

ok just an idea.....real jets, real helicopter and real splash, possibly caused by the jets target practice or whatever, but if it's fake all they had to add in was the ufo. To me it could go either way.

cheers

I think you are on the right track. You don't need good CGI if you are clever. The boat could have been off shore from an airshow and caught the jets crossing in a demonstration pass.

I myself think the only CGI is the UFO and splash. Easy enough to set that up. But this has lots of problems. timing of the jets if on an intercept for a craft below radar would not approach from different angles. Too much danger of a collision if evasive is needed. That's why I think it was two pair of jets over the water doing a fast-pass and the boat/camera where farther down range from the actual stunt pass, so to explain the delay. 4 jets though. The chopper was shooing them out of the restricted area of the show likely for safety reasons and they would get a citation/violation when they report to port.

Also, every described and observed UFO/OVINI going into water show no indication of water displacement. It is a particular effect of the propulsion and surrounding field that we think is operating in these craft, dampens or negates inertial effects .

The splash was there likely as an afterthought when the cCGI was not visually convincing, or the editor was not very familiar with UFO/USO phenomena not really knowing that UFOs are not usually seen displacing air or water.

ZG

If you pause at .08 you can see 2 objects behing the UFO , HOAX I'm afraid and a Damm Good one at that. S + F .

After carefully analyzing it here is what ive come to realize:

1) most of the video is real. The helicopter is real. The jets are real as well. At first i thought the sound of the jet was a bit off but when taking a closer look they sync up correctly. THe only thing that might hint at CGI is the splash of water. The splash itself looks legit but as it comes back down it seems to fall a bit too fast. If you watch things fall into the ocean the splashes usually dont land back into the water that quickly. Other than that id say everything in the video is without a doubt there.

2) The helicopter. That helicopter was painted black. Assuming they hoaxed it, what the hell would a black helicopter be doing megaphoning a random boat in the middle of the ocean?

3) if you pause it frame by frame there is a little UFO that flies past the one in question very quickly before the one in question dives into the water. It would be odd to place that there if it was CGI.

4) Can anyone please translate? My spanish is very rusty!!! I know how to have a mild convo but nothing great. It would be nice for someone to translate what they are saying. If they are calling out UFO's in the video, im going to say its real.

Otherwise they where just filiming military aircraft and added the UFo in later. Other than the UFO everything in the video is real.

Originally posted by The Savage Khan

Originally posted by game over man

Originally posted by The Savage Khan
FAKE.

It's the audio. The jet sounds are overdubbed.

The men and helicopter are recorded with a MONO standard thin/tinny video camera built in microphone.

The jets sounds are in STEREO and recorded in a wider frequency range.

The video camera would not give you that kind of depth of sound it would just distort.

What did you do to analyze the video?

You guys act like fisherman don't get their cameras wet.

Also there most not be any wind present.

Also uploading videos to youtube doesn't change the quality of the video.

Not convinced.

My only argument if it was real, then why not major news?

However the debunking is not very good, imo.

My questions: Where was this shot? What time of day? What was the weather like? ect. ect.

Also the sound doesn't sound off to me considering it is on youtube and they are fisherman, and they are in a boat on the water.

I used my ears and my 10+ years of audio recording knowledge. This is not a matter of quality its a matter of format. Put on a pair of headphones and listen.

The jet sounds move from left to right to mimic the movement of the planes across the sky but when the helicopter comes close (even though the camera turns away) the sound remains center. If it was stereo you would hear the men and helicopters moving left to right as the camera moves.

Also there are two different sound "scopes" present. One with a thin limited range (men talking, helicopter, ocean, boat) and one (the jets) with a wide deep and articulate range. They are recorded with completely different microphones.

FAKE.

your stereo point is irrelevant because the microphone could have been mono.

The sound scope though might hold some merit ill look into that.

Of course this will land on youtube to make everyone think it is a fake.... The government doesn't want us to know what they really are doing. I am not saying they aren't all fake but common R there that many people out there that R nuts or have nothing better 2 do???? IDK??? Think about it.......♥

[edit on 29-9-2009 by scrtsxcgirl]

Originally posted by AlienEyes
Lets not forget past reports of UFOs diving into the water... there usually isn't a disturbance of the water... at least not to this extent. My vote is a hoax. Also, there seems to be way too much non-stop action for real life... just like a movie... A thumb up for originality and a thumb down for not taking things serious.

Yet, in the Pacific ocean the crew of a large freighter reported the wash from one USO, on re-entering the water, nearly swamped the ship... The full report is contained in the History channel documentary on the *Asian Devil's Triangle*

I just want to add,that i live near galicia and yesterday i saw a black helicopter for the first time in my life.
The chopper was flying really low in altitude and speed.
Coincidence?
Someone tell me when this occurred,please.

fake.

No sign of helicopter in opening scene...helo comes out of nowhere within 30 secs? it would have to be really movin...

those jets look as if they are in show formation...in other words it was somesort of air show...normally when they get that low out in the iddle of the ocean like that there is also a sonic boom accompanying the jets...they do these shows when a air craft carrier is on its last leg of its mission before it returns home...

also, ask yourself why...?

why a helo flying up to the boat? why multiple jets flying at the thing? what purpose? visual inspection at 600 mph 150 ft off the ground? the radar blip may have had them doing a visual inspection but most definitely not from that altitude...I believe they have to have special permission to drop that low...how did that helo get out there (presumably in the middle of the ocean) so quickly? that definitely was not a carrier helo... Looked like a black ops kind of helo...so it had to have come from land...

edit to add: maybe some kind of odd cast guard/ anti drug helo, but are they black normally? strikes me as odd it would be on such a mission unless by chance it was in the area, but then what on earth would they have to say to the people in the boat?...if they said anything, then that was exlpicitly the reason they headed in that direction ,considering the quick nature it got there, delivered its message and boned out...what a very odd thing for a helicopter to do...

i would easily give a 99% chance this is fake...

None of it makes any sense...

[edit on 29-9-2009 by open_eyeballs]

Originally posted by FireMoon
That has to be one of the funniest things I've read on this forum... Going that fast eh?? and exactly to within 5knots, say, how fast is it going? You have some mystic ability to determine speed with no frame of reference for size do you? The truth is you don;t have clue how fast the Jets are travelling, so your whole point is completely invalid.

I should have told you, YES I do have the ability to determine their speed just by looking at it. I am very knowledgeable in that field. I would do the calculations for you but I don't need to waste my time, I could just show you examples.

I know they are flying faster than this:


My mind doesn't need to do calculations to see they are going faster than Mach 1, but if I wanted to do the calculations I could.

I would first start by calculating the distance to the horizon. Mostly using Pathagoras.

www.karlscalculus.org...
www.wikihow.com...
boatsafe.com...

That would then give me the ability to use the horizon as a measuring tool. For every inch of horizon they pass in the camera in a second of filming that will give me the speed at which they were traveling IF they were the same distance as the horizon. However, they are NOT flying at the horizon, they are a lot closer. So I could calculate every speed, at every distance until I get to the distance of the horizon, and one of those speeds will be correct. I could then narrow down their exact speed.

It's actually easy to do in my head, by eye. I really don't want to waste my time because I'm not here to prove anything, just give you my expert opinion.

Originally posted by FireMoon
You also make some huge assumptions about the mathematics of the perspective without having a single shred of evidence, vis a vie, the camera lens and its' inherent distortion and parallax effects. In other words you are making exactly the same sort of pseudo science claims skeptics accuse so many others of.

What is your problem? Why are you defending this so much? You don't even know anything about it.

I am actually an expert video analyst. I just have the ability to determine speed of an object VERY WELL. I know not many people have that ability, but I am one of them.

...no where did I ever say any type of pseudo science...

Originally posted by FireMoon
Simply throwing terms like Doppler Effect into your post, might fool a few naive people, i doubt you have a single clue as to how it actually works in relation to, what is in effect, a point source stereo microphone as it is panned with the motion of the object in frame, not a classic static X Y array as used in movies.

It seems YOU don't understand what Doppler effect is. It really is a simple concept.

When an object is moving forward and making a sound, the sound waves in the direction of movement are being compressed together because of the forward movement. This actually makes the sound louder in the front of the jet, but really quiet in the back.

The best example has always been a firetruck siren. When the fire truck is moving towards you with a siren, the siren is really loud. However right when it passes you, the loudness of the siren drops very quickly, and is quiet.

I expect to hear the same Doppler effect from the "UFOs" in the video, but it is non existent. The sound is more dubbed over and fake.

I expect the sound from the UFOs to be really loud when they approach, and way more quiet when leaving.... but you can't hear that.

Anyway, it seems you have no clue what I am talking about. You picked the wrong person to try to debunk, because I will never post something I can't back up, and I'm very knowledgeable in all fields.

Serisouly, watch this confirmed CGI video:
www.youtube.com...

[edit on 29-9-2009 by EyeSeeAll]

reply to post by Tapped In


Their were three objects in the frames 2 of the objects flew away at high speed and the other object went straight into the water how cool is that providing that this is a real sitiuation here????

lol fake all the way. Nice FX's do.
Definitely not what we are looking for

[edit on 29-9-2009 by NIGHTRID3R]

reply to post by Tapped In


I think this is totally cool.
I wish i knew what they where saying?
I think the helicopter was telling them to return to port.
I spent 10 years in the navy.
I have seen many F-14s and F-18s fly over my FFG-48
USS Vandegrift.
This is exactly what it looks like and sounds like.
I say this is 100% real !!!
That looked like a Gray Top Hat Spacecraft diving into the ocean.
That's one of the many advantages of warp drive spacecraft.
They can travel underwater, on the water, through the air or
through space.
So......instead of spending $$$ on submarines, destroyers, F-18s
and NASA Space Shuttle just build cool scout class spacecraft
like the one you saw dive into the ocean.
--------------------------------------------------
It looks like the Grays dove into the ocean to evade the fighters.
Smart move.

Honesty, anyone who thinks this video is real is missing some very important judgment skills.

hmm... it double posted without me double clicking. Odd.

...

I might as well add; I'm pretty sure this will be one of those videos that will be confirmed fake by the creators, and then everyone who thought it was real will feel real dumb.

[edit on 29-9-2009 by EyeSeeAll]

i didn't read all 12 pages, but this def' looks cgi.
the splash looks like an animated tween and the motion of the craft diving into the ocean looks "animated".

fun stuff though.

reply to post by GenLo


Neat video. A bit off topic, but did you notice what was in front of that jet? Looked like something small... lawn chair, dingy... person maybe...

You see the little object just before the jet comes screaming into view...

Probably never know what it was.... Hey I guess that makes it a UFO... ;-)

Why? Because in your mind, UFOs do not exist?

So far, I've heard a lot of rubbish theories about why it is fake, without anything seriously substantial to back it up. The ONLY debunker so far, that has actually provided some solid fact into their idea was the one who suggested that because of the stereo versus non-stereo aspects, there had to be two sources for the sound.

My question for that: could be it tested with software? Right now, saying "it sounds like" is hardly scientific. It would be nice if there was a piece of software that could break those sounds down.

There are plenty of aspects of this that are so off, that it makes it more realistic, not less so. Would low flying jets accompany a helicopter in the same airspace? Probably not, unless something serious was going down. Why would a chopper get that close to any boat? That alone makes any theory that is a hoax suspect. I doubt any sane pilot would agree to that.

If was a training exercise, why was the boat there? It was a fishing trawler. They probably have fished the same spots for the last 10 years. I doubt they would accidentally wander into restricted um... waterspace?

Airshow? There are airshows all the time over water, where ships and boats are plentiful. I've seen a few shows like that in San Francisco, where the Bay was littered with boats, it certainly wasn't illegal. And honestly.. how many airshows do you think they have in that part of that country?

Water is too fake? I don't think so at all. I remember watching the viral marketing stuff for Cloverfield, and the fake water to me, was very noticeable. This is magnitudes better than that. And it's not even for a movie? It's just a hoax?

I hear many folks talk about how "easy" it is to make something like this. Care to replicate it? I get weary of the "omg this is so easy to fake" comments, from people who probably couldn't do it in 20 years if they had the equipment to do so. It's really that easy? Why don't see see stuff of this quality all the time?

CGI chopper? You are kidding me, right? I don't see CGI vehicles in movies that cost millions to make that are that good. Who are you people, seriously, that make suggestions like the chopper is CGI?

If this were a video of the military intercepting a boat in the wrong location, why the verbage and the excitement of the crew? I rule out this theory for that reason. Even with jets, I don't see people acting this way. People are almost numb from the normal activities of normal life now. People film disasters as they are happening, without excitement or even apparently concern. Just had a guy here in Colorado treated for injury a couple months ago, for trying to get close to a tornado so he could film it. And you think these guys are getting that excited over a helicopter and jets?

It COULD be a hoax, but if so, it has production quality about it. I'd still think it's viral marketing for an upcoming movie, if that's the case. That makes much more sense than a costly hoax with no real point than to get hits on youtube.

But bottom line: imo, if there was a very real UFO that was filmed flying over a farmhouse in Wisconsin, I'd GUARANTEE than half the posts here would be people explaining all the ways it was CGI.

Originally posted by defiler
reply to post by impaired

 

I totally agree if this is real the government will take every possible step
to find that memory card or camera. So I don't believe that this is true.
And why do they stop filming, if Im there I would film much more maybe
the ufo will appear again but they seem to know that in advance

One more thing. The UFO takes off or dives ?

Yeah, and another thing that I've come to realize:

If you see a UFO video and it's really short and looks too good to be true, it's probably CGI. The reason why I suggest this is because creating CGI and compositing into a video takes alot of work.

Now, if you see something over the minute (or even 2 minute mark), then (IMO) it adds validity.

Of course my hyposthesis doesn't count for all of the UFO videos... There are people with a lot of time on their hands, but still. It takes alot of work to put it all together. Not so much the CGI itself (I mean, it CAN take alot to create a CGI object), but it's the compositing that takes the longest.

one thing that the human brain is very well at doing is distinguishing "natural movement". this movement was not natural. and by natural i don't mean biological.