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simply for being in the military
So if your brother kills innocent people, you being uninvolved in those killings are innocent. But if a soldier kills an innocent person, another soldier being uninvolved in that killing is guilty anyway. This is why your logic makes no sense.
Originally posted by Jenna
reply to post by NatureBoy
Read that already. I'm taking that to mean that you don't actually have proof since you've resorted to repeating yourself. Especially in light of the fact that you continue to ignore that not every soldier has been in a fire-fight and that many of those innocent people have been killed by insurgents not our military.
As sectarian violence drove the number of civilian deaths in Iraq to thousands per month in 2006 and 2007, many Iraqi ministries, morgues and hospitals were under government order not to release the embarrassing figures, and the prime minister’s office generally disputed the ones that did leak out.
American forces in Iraq were no more helpful, often refusing to release figures or claiming that they did not exist. Obtaining information on the deaths was an exhausting, grisly and often clandestine affair, and — Iraq being Iraq — no two sets of figures ever seemed to match exactly.
MOSUL, Iraq, Sept 25 (Reuters) - Eleven Iraqi soldiers were killed on Friday in a roadside bomb disposal accident in northern Iraq, Iraqi security officials said.
BAGHDAD — Two bombs exploded moments apart near the tomb of a revered Shiite religious figure in central Baghdad on Saturday, killing three people and wounding 22, police and hospital officials said.
The first bomb went off next to the tomb of the ninth-century sheik, Othman al-Omari, where a number of people were praying. A few minutes later, a car bomb exploded in a nearby parking lot as crowds were gathering. The shrine was damaged.
BAGHDAD, Sept 1 (Reuters) - The number of civilians recorded killed in violence in Iraq shot up to 393 in August, its highest level since April, after a spate of huge bombings caused carnage in Baghdad and northern Iraq.
Figures from the ministry of health showed a big increase on last month's 224 violent deaths in Iraq. The figure was also slightly higher than the 382 killed in August last year.
BAGHDAD — Violent deaths in Iraq hit a 13-month high in August, official figures showed on Tuesday, raising fresh concerns about the country's stability after the government admitted that security is worsening.
Statistics compiled by the defence, interior and health ministries showed that 456 people -- 393 civilians, 48 police and 15 Iraqi soldiers -- were killed, the highest toll since July last year when 465 died in unrest.
There were also 1,592 civilians, 129 police and 20 soldiers wounded.
A total of 456 Iraqi civilians and security personnel were killed in attacks in August, the government figures show. It was the deadliest month since July 2008, when 465 Iraqis died violently, though the tally was far lower than at the height of the civil war in 2006 and 2007 when monthly tolls sometimes soared past 2,000.
He had a point. The Shia-led government has overseen a ballooning of the country’s security apparatus. Human-rights violations are becoming more common. In private many Iraqis, especially educated ones, are asking if their country may go back to being a police state.
Sneeky, actually i said #JUST# for invading someone and trying to kill them, i've been quite clear on this - defending armys deserve to live and win and be happy.
if they signed up to fight then i'm glad they're dead.
If you are willing to sign up to fight to protect anglo-american dominance of the middle eastern oil pipelines just because you're unwilling to educate yourself and do something worthwhile then quiet frankly the world is better off without those people.
Well done for guessing i've never been in the army, did u get that from when i said anyone stupid enough to join the army deserves to die?
oh my lord please are you crazy?
Also i'm not just talking about innocent people
All those people are responceable for the unlawful deaths of dozerns of innocent people - thus they are murderers.
they are willing to kill or be involved in the killing of innocent people
Originally posted by NatureBoy
why don't you rather than smugly smerk that you know the secret answer which proves us wrong actually hit a few more keys and enlighten us?!? That's why we came here, i didn't bother writing a full and frank set of arguments just to have someone giggle and say, oh no actually i know better -just take my word for it because i'm telling you how great i am so i must be right.
Originally posted by NatureBoy
Ever here the words DENY IGNORANCE? it's sorta a motto around thsse parts, people flock to this sight to read and participate in the frank and open sharing, debating and contesting of ideas - just telling us you have the magicly correct answer but not sharing it is an insult to everyone here, including yourself.
Originally posted by NatureBoy
Had the headline been HOW MUCH ARE THE DEATH OF OVER A MILLION INNOCENT ARABS TO YOU?
Originally posted by sadchild01
6000 thieves,murderers,rapists etc. or should i say american soldiers dead ?
good good , the more american soldiers die the merrier it is . these murderers hopefully pay for their karma.
Also i'm not just talking about innocent people
you're claiming I'm scared to debate you on anything else? Hardly.
Originally posted by NatureBoy
nope i don't got it.
Originally posted by NatureBoy
The statement was made that this isn't an actual difference it's just a line drawn in your mind to justify and normalize the actions which without the rose tinted glasses you would view as abhorrant.
Originally posted by NatureBoy
it's the same split as freedom-fighter and terrorist or land of the free home of the brave and the great satan. in each case both of these refer to the exact same physical objet - One side would prefer to use one description while the other would prefer to use the other.
Originally posted by NatureBoy
I almost wish i had kept my deep understanding of geopolitical happenings underwraps then maybe you wouldn't be too scared to debate the real issues...
Originally posted by NatureBoy
when i say murder i mean what you think of as kill, ok? when i say innocent i mean somoene that hasn't left the country they live in to start or involve themselves in$ a war.
Now you've taken a few lines of mine which seem to say that i want everyone to die
What gets me is that to mine these quotes you actually had to read past countless times that i clarify that this war is an aggressive act and motivated by greed and the desire to steal oil wealth.
if they signed up to fight then i'm glad they're dead.
if i have to explain everything everytime my already verbose posts will turn into small novels
"Signing up to fight of your own freewill in the current conflict in iraq and afghanistan is in my opinion a valid reason for me not to care two hoot if for whatever reason that person should then be killed while invading said nations in a conflice which is nothing more than an attempt to secure oil trade routes.....etc etc etc.
ok i admit again you are sort of right
when i said i'm not just talking about innocent people i should have said 'and i'm not just talking about people who while i would consider them to be freedom fighters who have done no wrong, you would consider to be enemy combatants or terrorists or badguys'
I admit i could have been clearer in expressing my change of word useage
i stand by all the statements i made, that i don't think people who i consider innocent but under the defactolaw in place in occupied iraq are automatically guilty and in the eyes of many hawks are also seen to be 'guilty' (guilty of what i'm not entirely sure) should be being killed by our troops just because we want to control their nation.
Ok, so why then are you still running round and round in circles debating a stilly semantic point which hinges on nothing more than which synonym happens to be placed in a sentence when you could be providing valid and compelling reasons for us to be smashing our way though places which aren't really anything to do with us?
I said they're all murderers and theives meaning the collective army is killing without any justification (hence murder)
and they are doing this because they want to take something which they have no right to (hence theft)
how about in the name of good debate we accept that and move on?
did u listen to that universal soldier song someone posted a few posts ago, ita rather good and explains the point very well.
I almost wish i had kept my deep understanding of geopolitical happenings underwraps then maybe you wouldn't be too scared to debate the real issues...
Originally posted by Jenna
Originally posted by Amagnon
It would be nice if every single American soldier was killed off
Wishing death on people you don't even know? I can't imagine being so hateful and self-righteous as to wish death on a group of people simply because they belong to a certain group.
In the interest of not breaking the T&C's I'll keep the rest of my opinions to myself.
[edit on 26-9-2009 by Jenna]
Originally posted by jerico65
Killing in wartime isn't murder. Never has been, never will be. Killing in wartime is killing. It's not nice, but it sometimes has to be done.
Shooting a guy for taking your parking spot is murder.
Shooting the enemy in combat is killing.
Got it?
Originally posted by sadchild01
nah, I hate imperial US empire automatons i.e soldiers
Originally posted by sadchild01
don't worry, soon your gfs AND sisters will serving UN troops for passtime
when Obama brings in UN troops to stop american revolution
Originally posted by Amagnon
Doesn't it occur somewhere though, in your mind - that killing people just doesn't seem quite right?
Originally posted by Amagnon
Especially when you are killing them, not for a parking lot, but for some gas? Doesn't it seem that even if the soldier himself doesn't have to be accountable - that surely someone does? That human life and their freedom, and capacity to pursue happiness has more value than some gasoline for your boss?
Originally posted by Amagnon
Without the support of the American people Iraq and Afghanistan would never have been invaded - 1.5 million Iraqi's would not be dead.
So much for not imagining being so hateful and self righteous - look around you at your fellow Americans - they supported a criminal war. My feelings are not out of hate, but rather compassion for the victims - as I would wish that any murderer fall dead before killing again.
Originally posted by sadchild01
don't worry,UN forces will protect and take very nice care of your sisters/gfs...
Originally posted by sadchild01
... go serve blackwater ,Dynacorp and obamamessiah well , murderer .
obama loves automatons like you , who will enable him to crush the coming american revolution
don't worry , karma is going to bite your rear , whether today or tomorrow .
6000 murderers,rapists more kicked their buckets oi oi oi ....