Where are AA77's wings?

I know that ATS frowns upon brief opening posts but this is a subject that really needs very few words. In all the bickering over 'evidence' at the pentagon attack, I still have not seen a decent explanation as to what happened to the wings of the plane. I have asked and seen it asked many many times on ATS but still have not seen it answered. I am hoping someone can help me out.

Airplanes are built to withstand extreme amounts of inertial forces, but when it comes to surviving collision with a solid object, planes will fold up into bit and pieces, usually there is very little left at all.

This is due to the structural design of the aircraft, intended to survive G-forces and wind resistance, turbulence, and associated environments airplanes deal with each time they fly.
But the same design that allows airplanes to overcome flight environments, are terrible when dealing with solid objects, about the same as you stepping on empty coke can. In fact, if we scale it up the skin on a airliner is far thinner than thickness of average coke can with far less support.

We are used to cars taking large amounts of abuse and we walk out of the car crash and it still looks like a car, albeit worse for wear.
A airliner will simply crumple like a paper cup and appear as if it went thru a shredder, it is simply not designed to survive an impact.
The walls and pillar supports of the Pentagon are reinforced concrete, hundreds of thousands of tons and built during WW2, it was most definitely overbuilt and designed to withstand various types of attack.

I am surprised the plane did as much damage as occurred, and as much was found afterwards

reply to post by Indigenous equity


You are basically saying that because an airplane would be smashed into bits and pieces, the wings evaporated? You are going to have to be specific. Maybe you need to look at pictures of the crash scene again. I already have all the mumbo jumbo about how planes just disappear these days when they crash so you can save that part. Just tell me where the wings went.





No need for multiple lengthy paragraphs about nothing. Keep it simple. Where did the wings go?


[edit on 13-9-2009 by Lillydale]

The wings folded back upon impact and mixed in with cement and construction materials. The building collapsed on top of the rubble that was the airplane.

There is not a lot to an airplane, its mostly sheet metal and wiring, upon an impact of this nature they would disintegrate and mix in with object they are hitting.

Sorry, but thats just the way it is. No magic missiles, no holograms...just some really crazy people that killed a lot of people and did a lot of damage.

The pentagon had a lot of cameras trained on path of the plane. The citgo station had a video of the crash. Until those videos are released; I cannot believe the official story. To many unanswered questions.

reply to post by Indigenous equity

Originally posted by Indigenous equity
The wings folded back upon impact and mixed in with cement and construction materials. The building collapsed on top of the rubble that was the airplane.

Do you have any evidence to support the above assertions? And if the building collapsed on top of the "rubble that was the airplane", why were bits of it allegedly found on the lawn? Moreover, the debris was eventually removed. I have not heard of anyone digging up airplane wings, or anything else for that matter. Do you have an explanation for this?

Originally posted by Indigenous equity
There is not a lot to an airplane, its mostly sheet metal and wiring, upon an impact of this nature they would disintegrate and mix in with object they are hitting.

Again, evidence for your assertion would be nice...

Originally posted by Indigenous equity
Sorry, but thats just the way it is. No magic missiles, no holograms...

I have found the strongest theory not to be missiles or holograms; just explosives planted within the building itself, much as I believe explosives were planted in the Twin Towers (where I do believe that planes hit the buildings) and WTC 7.

Originally posted by Indigenous equity
just some really crazy people that killed a lot of people and did a lot of damage.

I can agree on the crazy people and them doing a lot of damage, not just on that day, but in the years to come. The real question is, who, precisely, were those crazy people?

From the evidence I've gathered, it didn't only involve people from the middle east...

Originally posted by Indigenous equity


The wings folded back upon impact and mixed in with cement and construction materials. The building collapsed on top of the rubble that was the airplane.

There is not a lot to an airplane, its mostly sheet metal and wiring, upon an impact of this nature they would disintegrate and mix in with object they are hitting.

Sorry, but thats just the way it is. No magic missiles, no holograms...just some really crazy people that killed a lot of people and did a lot of damage.

Can you back this up? Do you know how airplanes are actually constructed? The wings would shear off, not fold inward. You are going to have to provide something that helps me believe what you are saying. Do you have an example of that happening anywhere else? Do you have some proof that it happened here? The wings are static, not hinged. Why would they fold into the plane? Please give me a reason to believe you.

Originally posted by Indigenous equity


The wings folded back upon impact and mixed in with cement and construction materials. The building collapsed on top of the rubble that was the airplane.

There is not a lot to an airplane, its mostly sheet metal and wiring, upon an impact of this nature they would disintegrate and mix in with object they are hitting.

Well, look at the walls where the wings would have made impact. Do you see any wings combined with the wall or does the wally look pretty much untouched? Did they fold backward or disintegrate on impact? It could not be both.

Sorry, but thats just the way it is. No magic missiles, no holograms...just some really crazy people that killed a lot of people and did a lot of damage.

Sorry but I have never said anything about missiles, magic or otherwise, or holograms for that matter. You can type things. That is so good for you. Now, can you back any of it up? What crazy people again? How do you know about them?

Let me wrap that up for you. They identified the evildoers by DNA. They magically recovered DNA from crash scenes that they could not even recover a plane from and checked against family members of the terrorists. How they knew which families to get DNA from is a mystery all it's own. Later on, some of the men turned up alive and fighting to clear their name and we are told that is because the hijackers stole their id. Of course they had already been correctly ID'd by DNA match even though it turned out to be stolen IDs so they had to have stolen DNA to plant at the crash scene after they crashed the planes into the targets.

OK- BACK ON TOPIC.

Assertions are all find and dandy but they are not definitive and repetition will not make them true.

Everyone says "well the wings would disintegrate, there wouldn't be a cartoon cutout of a plane!" um... ok. what about the WTC? That's exactly what happened, the wings went right through.

The wings would only disintegrate if they were fake wings and the plane was more of a missile than a commercial airliner.

Originally posted by Indigenous equity


The wings folded back upon impact and mixed in with cement and construction materials. The building collapsed on top of the rubble that was the airplane.

There is not a lot to an airplane, its mostly sheet metal and wiring, upon an impact of this nature they would disintegrate and mix in with object they are hitting.

Sorry, but thats just the way it is. No magic missiles, no holograms...just some really crazy people that killed a lot of people and did a lot of damage.

*snip*

But why do you make assertions without any evidence to back up those assertions?

As lillydale says:
Well, look at the walls where the wings would have made impact. Do you see any wings combined with the wall or does the wally look pretty much untouched? Did they fold backward or disintegrate on impact? It could not be both.

So Why does all the video evidence show WING GASHES at the WTC but not at the Pentagon? At least the perps made an attempt to show an aircraft impact gash at the WTC as bad attempt at fakery and photoshopping it was.

Explain why there is NO damage consistent at the pentagon with a 757 Wing span?

How do wings from a fixed-wing aircraft FOLD inward and why don't you SEE this FOLDING going on with the second "airplane" at the WTC?

Oh, and are you friends with Mike Walter by any chance?

[edit on 13-9-2009 by Orion7911]

Mod Edit: Personal attacks are not on. Politeness is mandatory.

[edit on 9/14/2009 by seagull]

Originally posted by whaaa
The pentagon had a lot of cameras trained on path of the plane.

Says who?

reply to post by Lillydale


The outer skin of aircraft is light gauge aluminium panels rivets together

Like the saying goes - its whats underneath that counts

Keel Beam - this is the strongest part of the aircraft as provides main
structural support for the fuselage and cabin floors. Built from high
strenght aluminium alloy - very massive

Wing spars amd ribs - again built from high strenght aluminium to
support the wing structure . Need to be strong to accomadate weight
of fuel tanks

Jet engines - composed of titanium and "exotic" materials and alloys to
resist tremendous heat and stress. Engines weight over 6000 lbs each

Landing gear - built with massive struts to resist repeated landings of
250,000 aircraft at 180 mph

All these parts are designed to resist tremendous loads

Picture showing pieces of aircraft landing gear

reply to post by Orion7911


WTC exterior was made of lattice work of steel beams BOLTED togather

Pentagon exterior was cut stone (limestone) 11" thick backed by brick

The impact at the WTC sheared the bolts holding the exterior panels - the
aircraft did not pentrate so much as push it way in

The impact at the Pentagon - aircraft punched at hole estimated at 75-90ft
long. Exact measurements are difficult because of smoke and foam/water
spray from fire trucks. The diameter of the hole corresponds to the
strongest parts of the aircraft - area between engine pylons which has
wing spars and ribs, fuel tanks, landing gear and other massive parts

reply to post by thedman


Thanks so much for that, whatever that is. What does your list of airplane ingredients have to do with the question in the OP?

Originally posted by thedman
reply to post by Orion7911

 

WTC exterior was made of lattice work of steel beams BOLTED togather

Pentagon exterior was cut stone (limestone) 11" thick backed by brick

The impact at the WTC sheared the bolts holding the exterior panels - the
aircraft did not pentrate so much as push it way in

Please go get yourself a dictionary and look up the word "penetrate." Maybe then I can take your responses seriously. Do not look up "pentrate." You will not find that one.

The impact at the Pentagon - aircraft punched at hole estimated at 75-90ft
long. Exact measurements are difficult because of smoke and foam/water
spray from fire trucks. The diameter of the hole corresponds to the
strongest parts of the aircraft - area between engine pylons which has
wing spars and ribs, fuel tanks, landing gear and other massive parts

Yeah, gosh thanks for that too. Why are you people posting these diatribes about how an airplane is made? It does nothing to explain the wings. Neither one of those posts explains what happened to the wings.

[edit on 13-9-2009 by Lillydale]

Originally posted by Lillydale
reply to post by thedman

 

Thanks so much for that, whatever that is. What does your list of airplane ingredients have to do with the question in the OP?

It might be more helpful if you were to describe what you personally expect to see.

The whole intact wing laying outside the walls?

Large peices lying outside the walls?

Aluminum confetti?

Some aluminum confetti inside the building and some large pieces lying outside?

What exactly?

Originally posted by Indigenous equity

Sorry, but thats just the way it is. No magic missiles, no holograms...just some really crazy people that killed a lot of people and did a lot of damage.

The crazies: Bush, Cheney, Ashcroft, Rice and a group of like minded neo-nazis. The magic: thermal expansion, molten iron, air defense completely stood down.

9/11 was a false flag. Either you have the intellect necessary to understand that our country is run by criminals ...... or you don't.

FYI: Google "Sibel Edmonds" for more info on massive government drug smuggling, state-sponsored terror and high-level US government participation in the nuclear black market (among other things).

Originally posted by Joey Canoli

Originally posted by Lillydale
reply to post by thedman

 

Thanks so much for that, whatever that is. What does your list of airplane ingredients have to do with the question in the OP?

It might be more helpful if you were to describe what you personally expect to see.

How would that help? So you could gear your answer toward what I expect to see? What I expect has nothing to do with anything.

The whole intact wing laying outside the walls?

Large peices lying outside the walls?

Aluminum confetti?

Some aluminum confetti inside the building and some large pieces lying outside?

What exactly?

The question in the OP is quite clear. If you do not understand it, chances are you are not the person I would like to gain any knowledge from. Either you understood what I asked and have an answer or you are just here to make the thread messy and long and full of crap no one wants to read about. Canoli, I already know how you work. If you plan on being here just to be insulting and rude, then you will be ignored right quick.

Have an answer for the question or do you really need me to ask it more slowly?

The reason neither side can explain what happened the aircraft wings is because; there was no plane crash at the pentagon. If a Boeing 767 plowed into the pentagon we would have found the aircraft wings or what left of them on the outside of the pentagon, and we would have found BOTH engines. As in all airplane crashes investigators never had problem locating all the parts to airplanes crash debris unless it has crashed in the ocean. You OS believers want everyone to believe this airplane wings folded back and flew in a tiny hole.
That is not possible Boeing commercial airlines are not design that way. Those wings would have torn off on impact and we would be looking at TWO airplane engines on the ground. Some of you OS believers think the Boeing is design the same way as an F16.

There was no plane crash at the Pentagon period. As far as I am concern those photos of airplane scraps came from some bone yard that is why the FBI and FAA had no interest in doing a real airplane crash investigation like they ALWAYS do when planes crash in the United States. The main reason why they did not investigate all four planes crashes is because the FBI and the FAA would have to match the crash debris parts and record the serial numbers as they always do, and that would have properly identified the aircraft.

But for the first time in America history we have four commercial aircraft hijacked and crash in one day and our government walks away from all four events as if nothing happened. That is not how things work in America when a commercial aircraft crashes and kills all on board. Anyone can clearly see proper protocol was NOT followed on these plane crashes

American Airlines Flight 77
This was reported to be a Boeing 757, registration number N644AA, carrying 64 people, including the flight crew and five hijackers. This aircraft, with a 125-foot wingspan, was reported to have crashed into the Pentagon, leaving an entry hole no more than 16 feet wide.
Following a cool-down of the resulting fire, this crash site would have been very easy to collect enough time-change equipment within 15 minutes to positively identify the aircraft registry. There was apparently some aerospace type of equipment found at the site but no attempt was made to produce serial numbers or to identify the specific parts found. Some of the equipment removed from the building was actually hidden from public view.
Conclusion
The government alleges that four wide-body airliners crashed on the morning of September 11 2001 , resulting in the deaths of more than 3,000 human beings, yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. The hard evidence would have included hundreds of critical time-change aircraft items, plus security videotapes that were confiscated by the FBI immediately following each tragic episode.
With all the evidence readily available at the Pentagon crash site, any unbiased, rational investigator could only conclude that a Boeing 757 did not fly into the Pentagon as alleged. Similarly, with all the evidence available at the Shanksville, Pennsylvania crash site, it was most doubtful that a passenger airliner caused the obvious hole in the ground and certainly not the Boeing 757 as alleged. Regarding the planes that allegedly flew into the two WTC towers, it appears that heavy aircraft were involved in each case, but no evidence has been produced that would support the government's version of what actually caused the total destruction of the buildings, let alone proving the identity of the aircraft. That is the central problem with the government's 911 story.
As painful and heartbreaking as was the loss of innocent lives and the lingering health problems of thousands more, a most troublesome and nightmarish probability remains that so many Americans appear to have been involved in the most heinous conspiracy in our country's history.
Footnote: It has now been more than five years since the tragic events of 9/11/01 , and still the general public has seen no physical evidence that should have been collected at each of the four crash sites, (a routine requirement during mandatory investigations of each and every major aircraft crash.) The National Transportation Safety Board has announced on its website that responsibility for the investigations and reports have been assigned to the Federal Bureau of Investigation, but the FBI has refused to publicly release any copies of their mandatory investigations. The FBI response to a request for copies of their reports under the Freedom of Information Act was a refusal. The agency claimed that their investigation reports were "in a file", and that the FBI was exempt from FOIA release, "due to the sensibilities of surviving families of the crash victims".

pilotsfor911truth.org...
This is one of my favorite articles and I think this sum up what really happened. You don’t have to be pilot, or an investigator to know the WOOL has been pulled over your eyes. The government is playing on your intelligent and yes, millions of you bought into the lies, but not me, they did not fool me. Not everyone is brain washed from watching disinformation television. Those of you that are, need to turn that garbage off and stop depending on it for truthful information. Can you all say PROPERGANDA!



[edit on 13-9-2009 by impressme]

Why post questions if you refuse to acknowledge the responses. Its not brain surgery, its basic principles of logic and simple physics. People have explained pretty well why wings will never be found, educate yourself a bit and do some of your own research.

Sheet metal disintegrates when its flying several hundred miles an hour into reinforced concrete. If you cannot understand this, then there is no sense continuing to explain what happens when things go boom.

If you have never been close to explosions, or large scale crashes, you don't know what to expect to find as rubble. People really think you will find large pieces of wing, fuselage, engines in the aftermath of high speed impact and explosions..?

Get yourself reference materials regarding behavior of materials in extreme conditions, there are some great publications regarding material stress points and physics of high speed impacts. read them. Understand them. Then come back