Tesla: The Forgotten Mysteries II [The UFO Connection]

reply to post by SOXMIS


Yes! Thats something very important i forgot to mention which is substantial. Its a fact that "UFO" craft has evolved in the last century, especially sightings from the 1950's onwards.

And yes Morgan did play a part, although im no expert on this area so i would wait for someone like TeslaandLyne to answer your question on this.

reply to post by serbsta



My question is, if the governments of the world are building and flying UFOs based on Tesla technology, and have been for the 50+ years, what reason would they have to keep it from us? I cannot foresee any reason why the government would keep more efficient flight and similar energy technology from common people.

Maybe before it's perfected, sure, but not for this long. There is more to the UFO story for sure.

reply to post by El Davicho


What reason should they have to hide anything they do with our money, tax payers money? We seem to think of no reasons why they shouldn't show us, yet they pour trillions into suppressing the information.

You only have to look at the trillions of dollars that go missing along with the billions already being funded to the Pentagon. With that kind of money who know what they could be doing?

Why should they tell the public? (from their view)

If its not profitable it wont happen.

As much as I may wish to believe UFO's are of extraterrestrial origin, I cannot get over the obvious fact, that from the earliest pictures of UFO's from the late 1940s, to today's craft, I can CLEARLY see advancements in design.

Quite simply 1940s UFOs look very much like 1940s design, materials and so forth. Yet we are to believe these "extraterrestrials" have traveled light years, with advanced technology, when I can clearly see this technology advancing over the last 60 - 70 years.

This alone supports the idea that UFOs are man made craft.

When I think of the industrial revolution, oil, roads, cars, factories and industry. And then think what Tesla's or anyone's revolutionary idea of radically changing how man uses energy and resources, whoever that may be, they are going to come up against some mammoth forces.
The first who would want their hands on such a technology would be the military establishment.
If Russia, China or even India where to get their hands on FREE energy, can you imagine how the world of today would look? If they had craft, like UFOs to construct and build their cities, their industry?

Where would America, and the west stand? A technology SO advanced, SO dangerous to the current powers that be, that could revolutionize mankind as a whole, is it any wonder the secrecy, the lies of "extraterrestrial" origin in order to keep the status quo.

I don't know if Tesla was the man to develop this technology for a fact. There is a lot of conjecture and false information about this man. (probably for obvious reasons if he indeed was) but the simple observation of UFO technology advancement over the last 60 - 70 years is proof enough for me, that these craft are indeed man made.
I can further understand the upheaval to the powers that be of the 1940s what such technology could do in terms of global balances of power, hence the secrecy of their development and the throw-off of "extraterrestrial" origin to keep the public ignorant to the truth.

reply to post by Burginthorn


Beautifully summed up!

Star for you.

Originally posted by serbsta
In summary i would like to pose some questions to those on here who believe that those obviously intelligent spacecraft we see in NASA footage are being flown by other intelligent beings.

Maybe you've seen some footage I haven't, but I have never seen any obviously intelligent spacecraft in any NASA footage. I have seen dust particles floating around. Now when I question the intelligence of people that look at dust particles and thing they are intelligently controlled craft, I do have to wonder which is more intelligent, the dust particles, or the people who think the dust particles are intelligently controlled spacecraft. Tough call. Maybe the dust particles ARE more intelligent than some people if you look at it that way.

Originally posted by serbsta
Would it not be more possible that it is in fact our own governments work? Flying ‘saucer’ technology first theorized and patented by Tesla, later expanded upon and developed by the Nazis. Could this have been the reason for Operation Paperclip?

Unquestionably some UFO sightings have been government black projects. We know of some declassified black projects such as F-117 and SR-71 that were sighted as UFOs before they were declassified. And we also know that those are not the last of the black projects in development, of course there are more such projects. Because of their very secret nature, we know little about them, though if you search other sections of the ATS forums you will find some very interesting posts on some technical details of projects that have had some details released, before going deep black. They would be capable of mach 6-8 flight.

As to whether any of these black projects are utilizing any "Tesla technology", I understand that is a matter of great debate and speculation, but I think that it is just speculation until we see any evidence that might be the case.

As another poster pointed out, the UFO sightings can't all be accounted for by black projects however. There are obviously other things being sighted in addition to black projects.

Originally posted by serbsta
If the US government did in fact gain Tesla’s and Nazi’s work regarding these machines then could they have not perfected them to the advanced state we see today? The Pentagon gets TRILLIONS of dollars (that we know off (Estimate $3.3 Trillion Missing From U.S. Treasury: www.rense.com...)) to continue funding Black Projects. Could you be certain that it isn’t simply going into research into developing more advanced spacecraft?

As said above there can be no doubt that lots of money is being spent on advanced transportation technology by government black projects. We would all like to know more about it.

Originally posted by serbsta

- Would this not explain NASA’s / governments ignorance to the public regarding such matters? Why would they want to tell us?
- Would this explain if those really are alien spacecraft, why they wouldn’t have shown themselves publicly already if they were visiting?
-Could all those "UFO's" caught on tape by NASA simply be tests, that they themselves are running?

I guess one person's dust is another person's "UFO"? NASA may on occasion accidentally phptpgraph a secret satellite, they would edit that out of a photo so we can't see it. That would be our technology. You seem way too smart to be one of these people that believes a dust particle is an intelligently controlled spacecraft.

Originally posted by serbsta
All just questions for you ATS, i personally do not believe we are being visited by any aliens and am simply trying to make connections.

I agree, I think there probably are aliens like most people do, but I'm still searching for any evidence they have ever visited here, I haven't seen any.

It's fun to live in speculation land, and think the government has an operation just like the one shown in the movie "Fourth of July", and who knows what they really have? I like to speculate about that myself. As for Tesla's work, yes, electromagnetism is a lot more powerful than gravity but I can't say his craft makes any sense. Maybe it does and the secrets are locked away somewhere in a secret lab after the FBI carted off his records, or maybe not. I tend to think, probably not, having a significant understanding of physics and electromagnetism myself. But my knowledge is limited to what is publicly available, I don't have access to the secret lab stuff, so I wouldn't rule out secret technology exists we don't know about, I'm sure it does but I'm not sure any of it is based on any of Tesla's work.

But I have found it fascinating to get a glimpse into the real world of "black projects" in threads like this one: www.abovetopsecret.com... Thats the real thing! Projects that have gone black but we managed to find out some tidbits about them before they went black. And I have no doubt that some of those will from time to time be sighted and called "UFO's, because they are in fact UFO's, though not alien in nature as you suggested. So whether they use Tesla stuff or not (The projects in that thread don't, but others might), your premise is correct that some of the UFO's are government secret projects.

reply to post by Arbitrageur


Thanks for the extensive reply.

I have seen all released NASA STS footage, most of the oddities in the videos can be accounted for by dust particles or ice crystals, but i still can recall one or two instances where this premise does not justify what im seeing. I suppose it all comes down to perception, like you said, 'one man's dust particle is another man's spacecraft'.

I agree, it cant be proven (yet) whether spacecraft technologies have been utilized by US/German governments that were based on Tesla's work. I simply used Tesla to show that such technologies were being tried and tested back then, which could account for their advancement today and in the last 50 years with various black projects many have witnessed and labeled UFO's.

Cheers.

Tesla had his patent rejected in Europe, so he went to America
to build his airplane.
Some people think he did.


A pdf document download of Tesla quotes, dates and publication.

Nothing added, all Tesla.
This only mentions of his airplane.
Page 4 and 5 are enough to show the performance is UFO like.
A screen scan to a jpg might be a good post but not around to it yet.

Other quotes not given, in 1907 the "dirigible torpedo worked perfectly".

In the pdf, there is nothing about the parts or how they work
except in 1934 he gives the 4 parts, not naming them or how
they are used other than a beam is made.
Lyne and others say only the coil, item #3, is required, due to its
inherent beam formation, powered by #2 in a craft #4.

The beam focus is a half sphere electrical terminal. (#1)
Electrical force is from disruptive coils.(#2)
Amplify #2 with the patented flat coil.(#3)
(#1 would be attached to the center wire of #3 as the voltage
can be 1000 times stronger at the center wire.)
Create tremendous force by putting the above in or appended to a craft.(#4)


The whys and where for how Germany got the technology is
party of the conspiracy theories of Lyne.
We got it back and is most likely controlled by the Illuminati.

I believe Tesla understood that cosmically the Earth gets bombarded constantly with cosmic and solar radiation. Just look at the energy released and absorbed by our electro-magnetic shield in the last 10 days. Huge amounts! I'm thinking that if you created a magnetic field of a certain freq. it could attract certain kinds of cosmic energy that would get magnified when hitting the generated field and could be deflected causing friction around the field like "Star Trek" shield and directed towards current collectors that help stabalize the field. The amplified current from the friction of the cosmic energy rubbing against the created field could be collected and directed to storage or propulsion devices.

The need for a gyro makes sense for the liveability factor for occupants at high speed to stabilize the G loads and make them minimal. The gyro could also be used to create the above needed field. Once jump started it's good to go forever.

I think it was Hawking that said we wouldn't actually travel the distance to a far off place at faster than the speed of light. We would fold space and time and bring that place closer to us and cross the "Divide" and unfold space and time behind us. Think about that one! Maybe it was Tesla that said that. I can't remember?

That's something that always troubled me about the early UFO sightings: They are obviously of primitive (1950's earth) construction.

Perhaps a few breakthroughs on gyro-magnetic propulsion. And I disagree about the electropropulsive force theorized here. Some levitation has been accomplished -- but it takes a LOT of electricity and plasma to lift a weight, and this mainly due to laminar flow of air as the negative plasma is drawn to the positive charge at the base -- it's very inefficient.

I'd had a lot of dreams of gyroscopic propulsion when I was ten. I made dozens of diagrams that look a lot like that first one. The propulsion can even be achieved almost mechanically. Superconductors would surely help to make it actually work however for anything practical. If the Nazis had developed something -- it probably couldn't move faster than a conventional prop plane, it would be like a moving target. For instance; they didn't win the war.

If the Nazis had a "free energy device" and a super fast flying saucer, we'd all be speaking German folks.

I don't rule out, however they might have built a rudimentary saucer. But it really demands superconducting magnets and a good power source -- which weren't around then.

I have a steamer trunk of ideas I jotted down from 10 to age 17. Laser disks to store data, but I used interferometry, sound cancellation that I correctly guessed could be made with an inverse sound wave at a right angle -- but I realized that we didn't have the sound processors to record the sound and create the inverse yet. Also using fiber optics inside the body for surgery. And a lot of weapons -- ways to "beam" a nuclear blast and have it detonate at the target as an energy/plasma shaped charge.

Hundreds of ideas. I've even playing around with a super-simple idea to turn heat into light. I could even do it without added power using a trick I learned from old Crystal Radios.

Some mundane, some amazing. I constantly see connections and then "know" the truth as I just try and think of as many explanations as I can. I use logic, and practical knowledge of science, but in the end, i seem to have an intuition. I was OK for a while but then I kept seeing more and more of my inventions coming to be "invented" by others. I might not be the person to engineer, know the right capacitance, or the materials chemistry -- but I've been uncannily on track with the future and technology.

Anyway -- I kind of gave up any hope of doing anything with the inventions in my head. I had to stop thinking in these ways, because I do not have the discipline to do anything with it, nor the people to believe in me. It's too damn frustrating to say; "I told you so" to people, who you damn well told in detail about an idea -- but they weren't paying attention in the first place.

Well, this is the first I've seen of these drawings, and they look so much like what I doodled as a kid. However that second set with the horse-shoe magnets -- parts of that seem like the design was reversed.

I still hope to do something with this idea one day. But I'll just say it isn't electricity that is important, except to power gyros and magnets.

The principle is incredibly simple: If you take a weight on the end of a string and spin it around your head very fast, you get some sense of a gyro, because the outward force is equal around you, you are stable and not moving in any one direction. However, if you let out the string consistently in one direction and pull it in -- the forces are unbalanced. Now, under Newton's law, all force has equal and opposite reactions. But all those forces do NOT have to be Kinetic or inertia. You can increase kinetic force in a vector by repulsing it with another type of force -- but you have to do it in a way that does not create drag -- requires timing like on a car spark plug.

So the flying saucer moves with pure kinetic force.

Those other electrical force powers -- well, I'd just say that's an exaggeration of what can be achieved with anything we could have developed. And electricity doesn't create much propulsion unless it's moving in a plasma. The flying saucer concept, doesn't create thrust by expelling matter.

>> If we had some advanced aliens visiting earth, they'd probably be over a few thousand years more advanced -- just by the odds. Likely, there are many over hundred's of thousands of years more advanced (still bothering with this form of existence). I theorize about things that could be done with coherent matter, and quantum holes to "resonate" space around an object and render it transparent. Humans should figure this out in a hundred years.

I don't think that there is much chance that any advanced alien race we are likely to come across, is going to be detected by us, or have anything to worry about us with a missile. So I believe, 99% that advanced aliens are aware of us -- may have visited us, but there is ZERO chance that the flying saucers and conspiracy theories we have so far have anything to do with them. 100 years from now, we will be able to do amazing things -- and that's about the limit of advancements that seem represented by the UFO conspiracy.

To travel from another solar system to earth -- would still be a dang long trip in a flying saucer until you learn the secret of FTL drives. I have about 3 or 4 ideas in mind on how you could do that -- but the Tesla plans and the UFO's we see, are not showing enough advances for interstellar travel without a LONG time invested.

So yes, this theory that these are earth-made craft seems to fit better than others.

There is ample evidence that these things work - you can make the actual propulsion system without much difficulty. The trick is uncovering the Tesla power source - I do think it is simply created by lowering the energy density of the vacuum - this causes an influx of all types of energy from the surrounding higher energy vacuum.

When I say vacuum - I am talking about a super fluid, composed of polar particles of the Plank length. I am fairly confident that this is what the vacuum is constructed from, and it is under incredible pressure - I think a black hole is the absence of vacuum, so you can understand the energy differential.

The only thing that stops us being crushed to dust by this fluid is that the particles are so small, they infiltrate matter - and so abide in equilibrium. I think that the motion of electrons and positions create atoms, and that the energy field created by this motion prevents the entry of the vacuum - in other words, atoms are mini black holes. The 'nucleus' of an atom is simply the border of the highest energy region that prohibits the entry of the vacuum.

This makes mass equal to buoyancy, and inertia becomes drag.

I think it should be possible to lower the vacuum density using centripetal force - or by aligning the vacuums polar particles and using an electric charge to do it. You could combine the methods to get the best effect.

Tesla was such a source of ground-braking inventions that he could rule the world. No wonder the power-hungry rulers would want to rob this power. It is highly probable that’s what happened, knowing now about the Haarp experiments that serves as a reminder of one of the motives.

And then, there’s this, according to one of the selling biographies:

There were other things about him that made some of the science establishment shun him. He once heard a regular pattern of signals coming over his receiving equipment and said he was hearing a message from Mars. This produced its share of ridicule until the famous Lord Kelvin publicly stated that he agreed with Tesla, that the messages were from Mars. Tesla believed there was plenty of other life in the universe and talked often about communicating with other life in the solar system. Throughout his life he disagreed with Einstein’s idea that nothing went faster than light and he never bought into relativity. Tesla believed the universe was filled with “ether” that was the source of matter. He said that matter had no energy within it that it did not get from the ether. It is undoubtedly these ideas that has endeared him to more recent proponents of non-Einsteinian ideas. There are still modern believers in the ether and debunkers of relativity.

Source:www.theseekerbooks.com...

I remember also seeing one or two tv docus referring to this.

Regardless how Tesla got his genius from will it suffice to explain away all the Ufo sightings around the world? Perhaps. There are geniuses among us who can invent about anything but I still feel like man-made inventions are independent of the extraterrestrial probability.

Very plausible well put-together hypothesis nonetheless.

reply to post by AgentX09


Anytime AgentX09

I am always happy to loan support to people who examine the material with a critical eye

reply to post by VitriolAndAngst


Thanks for the very interesting post, you seem to be very knowledgable in the field. I would love to hear about some of your ideas, in a theoretical application ofcourse.

So scientifcally, propulsion would not be possible via an electromagnetic field unless theres a plasma? Im no science buff, so i would honestly love to hear more about this in regards to what Tesla had planned.

Cheers.

Originally posted by Larryman
I am happy to see a thread about Tesla's flying saucer. Your linkage of his vision with the German flying saucer work is interesting.

I dont know about the NASA-video ufo's. But if NASA wants to re-invigorate public interest in manned space exploration... then they should use the flying saucers, if they (or Area 51/S-4) have them - and forget continued reliance on their inept rockets. Or if not NASA... then anyone else with the money to take Tesla's concept to development and useage state. I'll bet a lot of unemployed auto-workers would not mind mass-producing flying saucers, as opposed to automobiles now.

Why would NASA want to re-invigorate public interest in manned space exploration?
We are talking about a group of interests that its sole purpose of existence is to make peoples eyes turn away from manned space exploration. Would they send 10 people hurtling towards a disaster that is waiting to happen every time every now and then in a questionable contraption named "space shuttle" if they really cared about pioneering for the manned space exploration of the human race?
As long as there are people who will be fooled, contractors to line their pockets with money NASA will be there. When there will be a real public pressure for a REAL manned space exploration program obviously NASA will be dissolved and its resources redistributed across more capable and sane ventures.
I personally hope it happens soon.

One thing more.

Even a hybrid technology with Tesla's saucers and the alleged top secret Nazi flying technology would too seem like "contraptions" at first, but at least these would not be an insult towards the methodology of required simplicity and effectiveness that seems essential for a honest and true manned space exploration initiative, because technology covers only one part of the huge chapter of manned exploration. We should be acquiring equal amount of time resources and solutions to actually explore all the other required parts to make this venture successful. Though we are still at part 0. We haven't even started reading this book yet.

[edit on 12-7-2009 by spacebot]

excellent topic, serbsta. Really.
Those UFOs we see out there definitely are human-made, why would they crash then ?
An alien civilization capable of crossing the universe and check us out definitely has the know-how to prevent crashes, don't you think ?

the real case, now, would be to study the research on invisibility, which is possible ( i remember having read a topic about a team of "something university" putting together means of making a "stealth coat" ... )

Maybe the UFOs we captuire on pics/video are failing UFOs, which "stealth" function has been disabled due to some technical problem?
I've got some serious thinking ahead.
Thanks again Serbsta !

Originally posted by MattMulder

i remember having read a topic about a team of "something university" putting together means of making a "stealth coat" ...

Did you mean this?
www.youtube.com...

An excellent follow on thread about THE greatest inventor scientist engineer and visionary, Nicola Tesla!

The whole Nazi UFO thing is somewhat of an enigma, i put myself on the fence on this topic BUT this thread does swing me in the direction that not all UFO sightings are alien, the time frame plus design characteristics just fit to neatly and maybe make this possible.

the reason this technology will n ever be let out of the government's grip is because of greed and enslavement of mankind with company's making the powers that be billions what with oil and all the other fossil fuels that pollute the earth just so the elite get to sit on top of the pile.

One day another Tesla will emerge and wont be held ransom to governments and he/she will put that clean free energy out there for all to benefit from,well my dream! great thread.

reply to post by Burginthorn


You raise a good point and I tend to agree.
However, are we to believe that any extraterrestrials that may exist would not advance their tech as well?

Or another question... perhaps there are several types visiting. Like say, from several different civs. I think that all three are likely true. Our Governments are building them and advancing over time, ETs technology is always advancing AND we are being visited by multiple civs.

It is a matter of simple probability that the later is true. Given we have an infinite "playground" with an apparent infinite amount of time it is simply a matter of time before each species that can survive long enough learns to traverse the heavens. Which means that it most likely has happened, is happening and will happen.

reply to post by serbsta


Yes, it is more than possible that part of the flying saucers are government sanctioned, but you failed to mention that such sightings did not start in the 1900s.

There have been sightings of such aircraft for millenium.

Even ancient cultures had accounts of encountering such aircraft.

In the Vedas they are called Vimanas.

Ramayana

Rama being welcomed back to Ayodhya, also shown him flying in the Pushpaka Vimana, which here is depicted as a boatIn the Ramayana, the pushpaka ("flowery") vimana of Ravana is described as follows:

"The Pushpaka chariot that resembles the Sun and belongs to my brother was brought by the powerful Ravana; that aerial and excellent chariot going everywhere at will .... that chariot resembling a bright cloud in the sky ... and the King [Rama] got in, and the excellent chariot at the command of the Raghira, rose up into the higher atmosphere.'

en.wikipedia.org...

That's from wikipedia.

Here is another link which describes the Vimanas, or flying machines described in the Vedas.

www.scribd.com...

Every culture on Earth has such accounts, so there is no way that all flying saucers are man-made.

This is an old Chinese illustration from a fictional book entitled "Illustrated Survey of Weird Countries" (c.1400 A.D.) and had the following original caption: "Ji Gung Land: The people could make flying cars that travelled far with a suitable wind. In Tarng's day (c.1700 B.C.), Ji Gung people flying a car on a westerley reached Yew Jo. Tarng dismantled their car so it could not be demonstrated to the people ... Later an east wind came on which he had them fly the car back to their own country [5,000 km] west pf our gateway."

www.ufoartwork.com...

www.ufoartwork.com...

There is also the fact that there are paintings from the 13th century onwards, and other depictions before that also show such flying machines.

Such as.
www.youtube.com...

There are also accounts. and even sightings of aircraft which are too small to have a human size man inside.

Even the bible has Ezekiel's wheel within a wheel which came down from the sky and from which a strange creature came out of.

All of this points to the fact that many UFO sightings cannot be man-made.

You also have to wonder how this information about Tesla became public since supposedly his writtings were confiscated after his death.