UK: Jail Time for Revving Engine in a Racist Manner

reply to post by jd140


From the original news story..

And when Jenkins, now retired, confronted Ronnie he was told to "f*** off".

-ChriS

Originally posted by stumason
He was charged though. Miss that bit, did we? If you're charged, you can be held in Police custody until such time as you appear in court.

No I didn't miss that bit at all, hence the rest of my post concerning bail.

I'm not disputing the use of section 5 (although I do think it is used a little to often for absurd or petty things), just confused why he was held for the weekend rather than being bailed pending a court date.

reply to post by tezzajw


Just look at the way your reacting to this thread. This is the same way the cops were reacting. In this case EVERYONE was wrong. ABSOLUTELY everyone involved was in the wrong.

If your a jerk to someone, don't expect them to be nice to you. How would you react to someone telling you to F off? Judging by the reaction your giving to this thread I would say you wouldn't react with restraint and composure. Even if you were a cop, your still human, and guess what humans have? Emotions, yes amazingly humans have emotions and don't react well to people telling them to F off.

It's called respect, the people involved in this case obviously had none for anyone. They all acted selfish and without regard to the others point of view.

reply to post by HunkaHunka


You're right. But I think this particular news story differs in this way..

In your case, the cop was probably just doing what any other cop would. He didn't necessarily assume wrongdoing. But it was safer for him to assume something was amiss than come in off-guard. That makes sense to me. Cop figures out it was all a misunderstanding, he left.

What doesn't make sense is when people assume something when they don't even really know what's taking place. This guy was revving the engine and his argument is sound.. Yet he was still put on trial when the cops (retired or not) didn't even consider the possibility of a giant misunderstanding. The racism charge was thrown out, but he was charged with disturbing the peace just because noone even thought to consider the possiblities. Witness testimony isn't exactly proof. It's only seen as supporting evidence and witness statements are only as accurate as their interpretations of said event.

They really assumed he had done something wrong. Even the muslim couple since they apparently gave their accounts of what happened at the trial. They both claimed that he was revving the engine in an intimidating manner. But there isn't any way for anyone to have determined whether or not it was intentionally being done regardless of whether or not they (the couple) thought they were being looked at the wrong way. And even if he did look at them wrong, why would the assumption then be made that it was racial in nature? It doesn't make any sense.

A revving Lotus is going to be loud. It seems everyone made their own assumptions about why he was doing it. He probably shouldn't have been cursing at people when he was challenged about it, but I probably would've done the same thing.

-ChriS

Originally posted by jkrog08
reply to post by Retseh

 

Can someone tell me how the hell you rev your engine in a "racist manner"????

Thank you, my thoughts exactly.

"Vroom vroom, those f-ing 'n-word's, vroom vroom"?

Originally posted by BlasteR
reply to post by jd140

 

From the original news story..

And when Jenkins, now retired, confronted Ronnie he was told to "f*** off".

-ChriS

Says he is retired now.

Doesn't say that he was retired at the time.

reply to post by AngelInterceptor


A judge has to set bail. If it is during the weekend then you spend the Saturday and Sunday in lock up.

reply to post by jd140


You are right. After reading it again the inspector was apparently off-duty at the time. He wasn't retired yet. I stand corrected.

-ChriS

Originally posted by whatukno
Judging by the reaction your giving to this thread I would say you wouldn't react with restraint and composure.

Save your superficial judgements about me for a thread that is about me. This thread isn't about me. Poor form, whatukno.

Originally posted by whatukno
Even if you were a cop, your still human, and guess what humans have? Emotions, yes amazingly humans have emotions and don't react well to people telling them to F off.

Then they shouldn't be police. They should have been weeded out at the academy.

A cop's job means that they're going to be told all sorts of things, by all sorts of people. If they can't handle that without turning a molehill into a mountain, then they shouldn't be cops.

reply to post by whatukno


Exactly!
It's always easier for people to claim their own interpretations are correct without really having the facts.

The cops that dragged him to the "klink", as you so aptly called it, probably knew that the racism charge wouldn't stick. But he did curse at the off-duty police officer (regardless of how whiny that makes the off-duty police officer look). Plus, they probably justified it a little more because they had the muslim couple claiming that it was being revved in a "threatening manner".

I guess we do live in very different worlds, but off-duty cops probably get cursed at all the time in the U.S.. Cops sometimes have their own racial viewpoints too. Racism is a serious problem. But for someone to assume racism being involved when they don't have any logical, fact-based reason to do so really irks me.

Why anyone would make the assumption of these events being "racial" is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. People have revved their engines loudly "at" me before. Why should that be considered racial? The only reason race was even brought into this is because of the muslim couple's interpretations of what happened. But they didn't know. If this was a Christian couple and not a Muslim couple, would any of this even happened?

The whole thing is just ridiculous.

-ChriS

I can't believe the cops had nothing better to do than go out to this guy's house to inteview him on suspicion of "racist engine revving." Also doubley bad they arrested the guy for disturbing the police. Wanker cops for dragging him out of the house for that, what a joke. I guess it's less dangerous than catching actual criminals. No wonder the UK is broke. What a waste of time and money.

someone got anal about this - section 5 usually gets a caution - in fact i have only ever seen 1 other case in the last 10 years where it was taken to court

reply to post by jd140


that is incorrect , the police custody sergeant has discressionary authroity to bail suspects pending thier court date

there are limits - he cannot offer bail to a suspect accused of a crime that carries a custodial sentence [ IIRC above 3 months ] or any violent offence .

but for minor offences - and a breach of the peace would certainly be a case where he could use his judgement , he can offer bail on the suspects own recogisance - IF he deems they are not likely to immediatly go out and re offend or pose a ` flight risk `

PS - if bailed by a custody sergeant - its a bloody good idea to attend the court hearing - because they have a habbit of sending an arrest team to kick your door down at 5 am if you breach thier bail conditions

just my humble opinion - but i suspect that the accused continued to be a asshole throughout his custody - and thats why he wasnt bailed

Has anyone else seen the date of this news story?

Sep 17 2006

So from this story we learn an important lesson

Don't mess with Scottish police officers

Hmm, are they gonna put me in Jail as well?

(Kriegsbeute-->War Trophy)

Oh for goodness sakes.
If a white anglo couple rang the police and said a Muslim man in a Lotus revved his engine in a racist manner .....they would be given a phone number to the nearest looney bin or would be told they are being paranoid at the very least in no uncertain terms.

There is no way the cops would even ring the man, let alone go around and see him.

TRUTH.

Originally posted by ohioriver
Sorry, But you still think that is OK? Since when is cussing a crime? I don't see anything about resisting arrest. Just Wow.
[edit on 27-6-2009 by ohioriver]

Quite right too. Anyone who uses bad language to police or (after being warned) should be arrested and fined. It is called being civil.

Regards

Originally posted by jkrog08
reply to post by Retseh

 

Can someone tell me how the hell you rev your engine in a "racist manner"????

It must have been a racsing car... *boom tish*

I actually misread the title when clicking on this link, I thought it was indeed about someone revving their car engine as if they were about to race someone... and then to see what it really is... I prefer my original thought, at least that makes sense to me. The real one is just absolute yarbles...

Woah, hold on. So the police received a call from a member of public and, wait for it....they did their job and responded to this call by paying the man a visit.

At this point the man then swore at them, which is a breach of the public order act and an arrestable offence...and he was arrested.


He was then held in a cell for 2 days before he could go to court.

Well what has the world come to where the police are actually doing their job...

/sarcasm


Fair enough, complain when the police go over the top...but try to let up when they do their job okay They didn't beat this man half to death for swearing at them, where is the huge probelm?

Originally posted by StevenDye
They didn't beat this man half to death for swearing at them, where is the huge probelm?

I guess you missed the part where a man spent nearly two days in a cell because he swore at police.