NY Terror Plot Foiled

reply to post by Crakeur


Alex Jones SUCKS!!!!
The guy is a complete idiot

by the way CNN is my internet explorer homepage at home and MSNBC is my homepage at work
if you look at my thread history a large majority of the sources come from MSNBC or CNN

My going into alternative sites is usually at a minimum
I've never once visited prison planet's site as of yet, only infowars at times

But logic remains logic, and I see very little of that on msm

But tell me Crakeur(I feel like i'm calling you by a derogatory word describe white people lol), don't you find it odd that the MSM never speaks of the cause of terroism?

They succeeded in making people think troops are abroad to fight for YOUR freedom, which is obviously a lie.

How come they never spoke of the cause of terroism. I've never heard the word blowback on MSM.
It's been a decade since they have been reporting on terroism and all these years no reporting on the cause of ittttt???????????

What is your opinion on that?

[edit on 21-5-2009 by ModernAcademia]

reply to post by Crakeur

the answer is no. an informant at a mosque heard that some members of the mosque were looking for explosives. He alerted the authorities and then, it seems, the feds stepped in. I might have read (pre-coffee so might be off here) that the informant sold them the inert explosives or the informant put them in touch with people who were posing as pakistani militants.

Thanks for that additional info. I still labor under the old premise that people are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law so it will be interesting to see if that ‘official’ version of events will hold up through a court process. I do sincerely appreciate you posting it, the messenger is never the problem!

the four accused terrorists were prison converts who felt that the US should get out of Afghanistan and they would blow up a military transport plane heading for the middle east simultandeously with the detonation of car bombs outside two synagogues in the Riverdale area.

That’s some pretty ambitious planning for felons who found Allah and a whole lot of confusion on Ham, Pork Chops and Bar-B-Que rib nights in the chow line! I wonder what led them to believe they could access a military base? Were they Federal Inmates housed on a military base? It would be a much more credible story if they were. They would have been exposed to the layout of the base and air crews and flights coming and going as they trimmed weeds and cleaned things and made minor repairs. If they were Federal Inmates housed in one of the Camps on a Military Base maybe the Bureau of Prisons and the Military need to rethink its inmate labor policy? Getting on a Military base is not easy it requires a Department of Defense Sticker on your car’s windshield, and your name being on some official roster as either serving on it or being a guest of someone who is. Shooting your way through a front gate to an air strip probably located at least a mile if not miles from the front gate would not be an easy task at all.

This still smells like entrapping a dissatisfied and small group to me, of prison converts likely looking to try to convince actual free Muslims with clean records and honest lives they were devoted to the cause, a cause that the next most devoted person too was obviously an FBI informant which is rather telling.

They had the stinger missile in the back of the car and the bombs were in the process of being put in place.

That process of being put in place would be interesting. I know that the local Temple where I live that on worship days they hire off duty uniformed police officers to visibly guard the entrances, in police uniform and the rest of the time they have video monitoring and private security. Frankly I think it’s overkill for a house of worship and creates a climate of fear and one that suggests discrimination that really is not evident in a community where a good portion of the Temple lives and walks to it for services as their scriptures command. In fact they have very limited parking for that reason and the closest a car could park to the structure would require a tremendous amount of explosives to damage the building.

For those that feel we should pull out of the middle east, we can't.

If we do, it gives the terrorists the appearance of victory. Back in the 80's, a military barracks bombing in Beirut resulted in a total withdrawal from the region. The result? More terror attacks. The appearance of victory makes people bold. When you push the giant and it steps back rather than fight, it shows weakness. This weakness gives the small warrior strength.

Russia had no problem. In 1984 the year the first and one and only Russian hostage was kidnapped in Beirut the KGB tracked down the faction responsible for the kidnapping within 24 hours, abducted the ring leaders wife, mother, and children, hacked them to pieces and stuffed them in garbage bags and left them on the front stoop of the factions leader with a note saying his fate would be far worse if they did not release the Russian hostage unharmed within 24 hours. They did release the Russian unharmed within 24 hours and never touched another one during the remainder of the civil war which lasted close to another decade.

We made this bed, we need to lie in it. A total isolation policy might work for the region but not in a manner that will work for anyone.

Let's say we pull out entirely. No troops, no bases, no business dealings whatsoever with any of the nations in the middle east. Then what?

The people of the region are forced to live within their own capabilities, budgets and ideals that we won’t bankroll, enhance, prop up or destabilize for special interest or corporate benefit. Sounds just like what our forefathers wanted if you ask me.

Israel will wind up fighting with the surrounding nations. Nukes will, inevitably, be used in the region and whole nations might disappear.

If anyone were to win, my money would be on Israel but what, exactly, will they win? Radiation wasted strips of sand?

President Roosevelt was clearly waned by the Saudi Monarch on the way back from the Post War conference in Malta that this would likely occur if an Israeli state were reintroduced into the region. Roosevelt listened and was opposed and Truman did was too initially. This is the people of Israel’s fight and Zionists and Hebrews who identify with it, we are founded on separation of Church and State though and choosing sides in this struggle has been a costly one for us. Ultimately they are the ones that have to live there and I have to believe that since a real sizeable community of Hebrews never went in to Diaspora and lived peacefully in Palestine with the Palestinians for centuries that it is possible for all people to get along over there when the onus is on them to do so!

Originally posted by Crakeur

For those that feel we should pull out of the middle east, we can't.

If we do, it gives the terrorists the appearance of victory. Back in the 80's, a military barracks bombing in Beirut resulted in a total withdrawal from the region. The result? More terror attacks. The appearance of victory makes people bold. When you push the giant and it steps back rather than fight, it shows weakness. This weakness gives the small warrior strength.

We made this bed, we need to lie in it. A total isolation policy might work for the region but not in a manner that will work for anyone.

Let's say we pull out entirely. No troops, no bases, no business dealings whatsoever with any of the nations in the middle east. Then what?

Israel will wind up fighting with the surrounding nations. Nukes will, inevitably, be used in the region and whole nations might disappear.

If anyone were to win, my money would be on Israel but what, exactly, will they win? Radiation wasted strips of sand?

Unfortunately there has been such a strong overreaction to Bush declaring a War on Terror. In a wish to damn that administration many are unwilling to concede that he may have been right.

One may not approve of the way it has been handled, and that has been terrible, but the first blow was the destruction of the WTC and attack on the Pentagon. The collective Muslim world is not analogous to the Japanese of 1941, but for Americans and the West, an attack of this magnitude was the equivalent of Pearl Harbour.

The need by some to criticize the US and it's foreign policy has resulted in a lot of bending over backwards to justify overt acts of terrorism by Muslim factions throughout the world.

An attempt has been made, and successfully, to use the Israeli-Palestinian conflict as a role model for the large scale conflict. People who should be considered as terrorists are perceived of and justify their actions as freedom fighters.

When Shiites in Irag attempt mass murders of Sunnis, sometimes in places of worship, it's not freedom fighting. Nor are hostilities with the Kurds.

The Middle East, tragically, still operates on a tribal warfare model of disputes. Israel represents an incursion by an enemy tribe that must be destroyed because of it's majority ethnicity. No middle ground is considered possible by some Middle East leaders.

And in the end, it is these leaders who facilitate and encourage much of the
hostility emanating from the region. Iran's imams and their 30 year Islamic Revolution have actively financed a war on the West particularly focusing on Israel. Their own statements make this unambiguous.

The region is wealthy beyond belief in oil resources. But in many sectors the choice is to resist a modernization which includes coming to terms with cultures and religion that have had a historical antipathy with the Muslim world.

Just as Japan and Germany have come to terms admirably by co-operation and integration with a progressive Western world, leaders in the Muslim world have to reconsider it's hostile stance. That no single government represents all Muslims worldwide produces a fragmented war, akin to guerilla warfare.

I's sure many will consider this conservative or neocon speak. But I think it's evident that the adversarial approach many Muslims take to the West along with Israel neither benefits them or the billion plus Muslim citizens of the world.


Mike

I am just glad that they caught the terrorists before we were attacked again. Thanks FBI and great job. What does it matter if it took a year? They have to build a case that can stand up in court against these guys. I am sure they were monitoring them the whole time and if they looked like they were going to attack sooner, they would have brought them down earlier.

Yay, yet another stupid terrorist plot. *less than impressed* I just don't get it. I can get the recipie for a simple explosive off the internet in moments. In fact I just did it to make sure I wouldn't look like a fool by typing it. *smirk*

These people either aren't after "terrorizing" people or the average angry bad guy is just not that smart. To add to that, why synagogues? Why not a shopping mall or a children's playground. Not that I am wanting to give them any ideas, but I just cannot take these terrorists seriously.

[edit on 5-21-2009 by rogerstigers]

reply to post by TXRabbit

Is it just me or is it that anytime something is planned, plotted or discussed which goes against Israel/Jews it's considered "terrorism".

Well, that's one problem with that term. We never draw a defining line and it becomes repetitively used during similar circumstances.

We call things "terrorism" when we feel like it.

In this case I think the term is agreeable though. A hate crime is more specific to committing a crime because of ones prejudice views about sexuality, race, gender, or religion. These guys planned this attack because they were angry about a war and the government.




[edit on 21-5-2009 by rapinbatsisaltherage]

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
That’s some pretty ambitious planning for felons who found Allah and a whole lot of confusion on Ham, Pork Chops and Bar-B-Que rib nights in the chow line! I wonder what led them to believe they could access a military base? Were they Federal Inmates housed on a military base? It would be a much more credible story if they were. They would have been exposed to the layout of the base and air crews and flights coming and going as they trimmed weeds and cleaned things and made minor repairs. If they were Federal Inmates housed in one of the Camps on a Military Base maybe the Bureau of Prisons and the Military need to rethink its inmate labor policy? Getting on a Military base is not easy it requires a Department of Defense Sticker on your car’s windshield, and your name being on some official roster as either serving on it or being a guest of someone who is. Shooting your way through a front gate to an air strip probably located at least a mile if not miles from the front gate would not be an easy task at all.

If you have a MANPAD, you don't have to be on the base. You really don't have to be near it. If it were a regular scheduled flight, they could just wait for it to fly over and try to schwack it then.

My first reaction was, wow this is right on time to bolster support for bill H.R.2159. They could have been setting the hook on these misguided passionate souls for a while. Patsies for the NWO.
Here is the link to the thread on the Bill
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Maybe it's because I'm spending too much time on a conspiracy site.

Anything reported in the press is automatically a lie. Some government created manipulation of your awareness.

If they say thunderstorms this weekend, it's a trick of some kind.

Isn't it just possible these really are bad guys who were hoping to kill innocent people and got caught.

Sometimes it really does rain when they say it will.


Mike

They knew how to construct a bomb, but did not know the difference between real and fake explosives?? That's like knowing how to cook and not knowing the difference between salt and sugar.

reply to post by mmiichael


Oh they most likely are bad people wanting to kill innocent people no doubt. The difference between them and the US Gov is they were retaliating for thousands of innocent souls. Where the Gov just made an intelligence mistake and a corperate profit.

I'm surprised by the "terrorist win" argument emerging in this thread. Does that imply that the terrorist haven't won already? That the terrorist somehow are incapable of winning if we are in Iraq and Afghanistan? Why while our military people are exhausted and our money is running out are terrorist groups expanding in the middle east, becoming more powerful since our arrival? I think that the American government is corrupt, and I find some of it's actions deplorable, but if someone invaded my country because of false intelligence I'd probably be siding with corrupt radicals in America before people who came in and decided they were going to single out and police my country when there is corruption and terrorism all over the world. You can't reason with these people because what we've done is not reasonable. You can't force a successful government that cares about the rights of it's people on others when you yourself do not have one.



[edit on 21-5-2009 by rapinbatsisaltherage]

reply to post by rapinbatsisaltherage

I'm not sure what you are refering to in this line.
"I'm surprised by the "terrorist win" argument emerging in this thread". My point is that nobody is winning in this debockle only the ones connected to the profits generated. Its like an evil Clint E with a thousand snipers covering him has thrown a gun at our feet and said "pick it up" I dare you.

reply to post by MacroVisio


I wasn't referring to your comment. Someone in the beginning of this thread actually said "if we leave the terrorist win".

Originally posted by MacroVisio

Oh they most likely are bad people wanting to kill innocent people no doubt. The difference between them and the US Gov is they were retaliating for thousands of innocent souls. Where the Gov just made an intelligence mistake and a corperate profit.

Oh well, if the reason the were trying to kill innocent people was that they retaliating for thousands of innocent souls then it's OK.

Maybe the governments and corporations are really doing what they do to retaliate for thousands of innocent souls, too.




Mike







[edit on 21-5-2009 by mmiichael]

Originally posted by mmiichael
Maybe the governments and corporations are really doing what they do to retaliate for thousands of innocent souls, too.
[edit on 21-5-2009 by mmiichael]

Are you refering to 9?11 . To the scolarly minded that case is far from closed. Besides those suicide pilots sounded a little Mossadish to me.

reply to post by rapinbatsisaltherage


Thanks for the clarification I get a little testy at times
I think it's due to my powerless feelings

Originally posted by MacroVisio

Originally posted by mmiichael
Maybe the governments and corporations are really doing what they do to retaliate for thousands of innocent souls, too.
[edit on 21-5-2009 by mmiichael]

Are you refering to 9?11 . To the scolarly minded that case is far from closed. Besides those suicide pilots sounded a little Mossadish to me.

You may be right.

I've heard that the US, for an excuse to get into war mode were originally planning on blowing up gambling casinos in New Jersey but decided to go for broke and had passenger filled planes fly into their most valuable real estate and the Pentagon for a chaser.

What's a good movie without a big explosion at the end?


Mike

FBI Agent on Synagogue Case Has Questionable Record

The FBI agent with a high-profile role in yesterday's arrests of four men for plotting a terror attack in New York has a pretty interesting -- and controversial -- track record.

Special Agent Robert Fuller, whose name appears at the top of the federal criminal complaint in the case, had a hand in the FBI's failure to nab two of the 9/11 hijackers, had one of his informants set himself on fire in front of the White House, and was involved in misidentifying a Canadian man as a terrorist leading to his secret arrest and torture -- a case that is now the subject of a major lawsuit.

Fuller is listed as the lead agent in the arrests of four men yesterday who officials say were trying to blow up a couple of synagogues and shoot a military jet from the sky. But as in other cases of seemingly inept homegrown terrorists, the four suspects were supplied (inert) weapons from an FBI informant, and in coming weeks we'll learn more about how much that informant goaded the four suspects into carrying out the supposed acts of terrorism. The case is being prosecuted in the Southern District of New York. (James Margolin, an FBI spokesman said the agency declines to comment for this story, because Fuller is a potential witness in an ongoing prosecution.)

Fuller was involved in the earlier Canadian case as the man who interrogated a wounded Afghani teenager named Omar Khadr. (We've written extensively about Khadr's bizarre case here.) Under Fuller's interrogation, Khadr dubiously identified a Canadian citizen named Maher Arar as someone he had seen in Afghanistan. Arar was then shipped to Syria where he was imprisoned and tortured for a year. It's now been proven that Arar could not have been in Afghanistan when Khadr, under intense pressure from Fuller, said he saw him there.

In January, Fuller took the witness stand in Khadr's trial at Guantanamo Bay. He testified that during the interrogation at Bagram Air Base in Afghanistan, Khadr identified Arar from a photo and said he had seen him in Afghanistan.

Under cross examination, though, Fuller disclosed that Khadr didn't actually identify Arar. Instead, he first said Arar "looked familiar," and then "in time" he felt he recognized the man in the photo, according to Fuller's testimony.

"We don't know what was happening, whether that was hours or days later," Kerry Pither, a Canadian journalist whose book Dark Days: The story of four Canadians tortured in the name of fighting terror focuses on the Arar case.

According to Steven Watt, one of Arar's lawyers now with the ACLU, Khadr's identification should have been treated as highly suspect...

"Khadr would have been about 14, blind in one eye and suffering from serious wounds," Watt says. "It was totally ridiculous."

blacklistednews.com...

reply to post by mmiichael


You need to do your homework on who got richer when those towers fell? They were worth more as dust than an aging reno property.

Besides this isn't the topic. This New York terrorist threat 2.0 has shown to be a little problematic. Reports are surfacing describing them as a group of loosers that had a rocket plopped on there laps. Doesn't seem like we were in much danger without the help of undercover feds.

www.alternet.org...

edit for syntax

[edit on 23-5-2009 by MacroVisio]

[edit on 23-5-2009 by MacroVisio]