SURPRISE! Dems Break Promise: Stimulus Bill to Floor Friday

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


Oh yes, this is most assuredly a "emergency" act and it is bursting at the seams with fast-track no nonsense programs that will lead us to "The Promised Land". The Dems told us so and we have to believe them because they are our infallible truth-telling public officials!

I'm positive that the 15.6 BILLION for Pell grants shall provide an immediate jump start to the economy!

5 BILLION for "Weatherization Assistance" brilliant!

The 1 BILLION for that perennial moneymaker "Amtrack" makes perfect sense!

2 BILLION for Federally subsidized "Child Care" why not??? page 160 of stimulus bill

650 MILLION for "Digital T.V. Converters" Now there's a sure winner!

And of course who in their right mind could argue against the virtues of laying down 150 MILLION for "Honeybee Insurance" Gotta have Gainfully Employed BUSY WORKER BEES...Right???

Bend Over & Smile Please


!!!!!OH MY GOD THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!



[edit on 13-2-2009 by Snisha]

Originally posted by FlyersFan

500,000 other people who lost their job this month may not.

That's the point. Most of the money spent with this non-stimulating 'stimulus' won't help get jobs. And most of the money won't even be spent for at least two years. That's why this non-stimulating 'stimulus' isn't emergency legislature. That's why it can wait the FIVE DAYS that Obama promised during the campaigning.

To add to that point from the president himself...

Two more economic questions, from Julianna Goldman of Bloomberg News and Jake Tapper of ABC News, rounded out the questioning on the economy. Mr. Tapper asked how will Americans be able to tell if his economic program was working?

The president’s answer? If up to 4 million American jobs are created or saved.

That is how we Americans will be able to tell if it is working!



In other words maybe it will create some jobs, but likely it will end up saving government jobs.

I was an Obama supporter, and I still think he is a good person, but I will not support a continuation of failure... But ultimately all I, indeed any of us can do is bitch about it.

With that one *individual* from the Senate floor saying that "Americans don't care where the money goes" and now this, I say they can have their worthless money.
Hey *Senator*, you're right, I DON'T CARE WHERE IT GOES - it is worthless.

Their time is very near.

I have become completely disgruntled with Obama already. I supported him wholeheartedly, but he is not trying to fix anything. He is offering more of the same, and from all indications, it will remain that way.
HE WILL lead us to complete ruin.
Let the revolution begin.



Mod edits: *Profanity* The words aren't automatically filtered, but let's please try to keep it clean. --Majic

[edit on 2/13/2009 by Majic]

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


I know it's a talking point on talk radio. I hear it all the time how it won't come out until the recession is over already.

reply to post by Snisha


Can you find these provisions in the bill? I cannot. Where did you get this stuff?

Clearly none of you have read the bill and just want to complain. So, I'm done. Bathe in ignorance.

[edit on 13-2-2009 by Benevolent Heretic]

reply to post by sadisticwoman


sadisticwoman

Your name clearly explains your views.
You can jump for joy as we support your ass

Reminder: Topic Only, Please

Originally posted by dimensionaljumper
I am not hijacking this thread lernmore. I am merely commenting on the "revolution" talk that pervades THIS thread.

Your opinions of other members are not on topic. Cease and desist.

Your opinions on the topic, however, are welcome. Please stay on topic.

The topic:

SURPRISE! Dems Break Promise: Stimulus Bill to Floor Friday

Yeah, the last bailout was sooooooo much more transparent, and sooooo much more for helping the regular people of this country. We must be crazy to even THINK about trying to get something through that might help people.

I don't agree with any of it, but hay, lets keep bashing on each other, because that is really going to make the problem alllll better.

Together we stand and divided we fall and all that stupidity.



Peace

They got a copy of the bill at 11 pm last night. So even if they stayed up all night and were Tremendous speed readers, there is no way possible any of them could have read the entire bill.

I don't give a flying crap if it's a damn emergency. That is all the more reason to look at carefully.

This whole thing is a damn sham AND EVERYONE SHOULD KNOW IT.

I don't care what ideology you have...THIS IS RIDICULOUS.

This is NOT of the people, by the people. for the people.

This is BY THE GOVERNMENT that we no longer have any control over as they do WHATEVER THE HELL THEY WANT ANYWAY.

They can take that 13 dollars OF MY MONEY and shove it up their asses!

I hope Pelosi has a fun trip to Europe on her DAMN JET!



DAMNIT!

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Well, I guess you know better than those who wrote it...

Obviously.

And the confidence provided by the passing of this bill constitutes it as an emergency.

Confidence? Are you kidding? The people of this country aren't gaining any 'confidence' by the passing of this bill. The people dont' want it. Last poll I saw had 35% of the people approving of it.

'Confidence'. Nubulous political rhetoric like 'hope' and 'change'.

Deal with it. Or not. It doesn't matter to me.

I'm 'dealing with' this just fine. However, perhaps YOU are the one not dealing with the reality that Obama is breaking his campaign promises .. again.

They waived the 48-hour rule. They don't even have to have it up there for 48 hours, much less 5 days.

I'm talking about OBAMA'S CAMPAIGN PROMISE. You know.. that alleged transparency thing. He promised FIVE DAYS for these things. That was his promise. And he's breaking his promise. Again.

And as far as this money not being spent for two years .. You've been told all this information before. I guess you forgot.

Washington Post

Less than half the money dedicated to highways, school construction and other infrastructure projects in a massive economic stimulus package unveiled by House Democrats is likely to be spent within the next two years, according to congressional budget analysts, meaning most of the spending would come too late to lift the nation out of recession.

A report by the Congressional Budget Office found that only about $136 billion of the $355 billion that House leaders want to allocate to infrastructure and other so-called discretionary programs would be spent by Oct. 1, 2010. The rest would come in future years, long after the CBO and other economists predict the recession will have ended

Articles on the Congressional Budget Office

Capolitical News from the Congressional Budget Office -

Although the argument for quickly passing the $800-billion-plus stimulus bill now before Congress is that pumping money into the economy immediately will spur economic growth and create jobs, almost half of the new spending—as opposed to tax cuts—being proposed in the bill would not be spent until at least two years from now, according to an analysis published by the Congressional Budget Office.

In fact, CBO found that the types of spending favored by Congressional Democrats, such as road construction, IT, and unemployment spending, wouldn’t be spent as quickly because the money would be tied up in the state and federal bureaucracies

CNS News

For nearly a week, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has said that 75 percent of the $815.8 billion stimulus spending proposal currently before Congress would be doled out in the first 18 months after it becomes law. But a CBO analysis says only about 64 percent of the money in the bill will be spent by the end of fiscal year 2010, which comes 20 months from now.

This can wait five days

BH,

Come on, you are a level-headed person, I know it.
I'm not trying to bash anyone here, but I would like you to think about this for a second.
Do you notice what everyone is fighting over? It isn't the merit of the issue. Everyone is fighting over what he said, or didn't say, and whether this is an "emergency" or not.
Lets face it, folks, we ARE in an emergency situation. But at the same time, this money is NOT going to solve this emergency. Everyone here KNOWS this, whether they admit it or not. Some still like to have some hope. But I am being totally realistic here. We are doomed. Even if, by some miracle, all of this turns around tomorrow, the amount of debt we have taken on over the last 4 months alone is more than we have seen accumulate in our entire lives, many times over. America is lost and it will never gain its former status.
At this point, to put the final nail in the coffin, all that needs to be done is for China to drop US securities.
Then it is over. Roll Credits.

Obama isn't trying to fix anything, he is continuing the business as usual of trying to give all of our money to the corporate masters that run this country. Problem is, it isn't going to do them any good unless they are getting that money in tangible assets. Our currency is all but worthless now and it is going to get even worse. Same for most countries on the planet, right now.
I want to see someone ADDRESS THE UNDERLYING ISSUES HERE, and Obama simply isn't doing it. He's not even trying. In fact, he is forcefeeding us more of the same!

[edit on 13-2-2009 by Jay-in-AR]

Fox News
CNN News
MSNBC

Headlines - House approves stimulus. Dow and S&P500 both DOWN.
The markets react. That's NOT confidence.

edited to add -

Originally posted by Jay-in-AR
we ARE in an emergency situation. But at the same time, this money is NOT going to solve this emergency.

Exactly.



[edit on 2/13/2009 by FlyersFan]

Originally posted by David9176
They can take that 13 dollars OF MY MONEY and shove it up their asses!

They can have mine too, but I'd rather see them have to cram it down their throats just like they have done to us with this crap legislation.

Growing government and government spending in a time of job losses and economic collapse kinda puts the position of the people into clear perspective in this Obama administration.. Don't you think?

[edit on 13-2-2009 by Walkswithfish]

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by FlyersFan
But when the fact of the matter is that a majority of the $$$ won't be spent until after the first two years ... then this is NOT an emergency.

Don't suppose you have a source on that?

The money starts flowing in just a few months.

Q&A How the Stimulus will Unfold

and this source says differently

as does this source

and while $15 more per bi-weekly paycheck may appear to help people the rest of the immediate stimulus is for people who are already on the .gov dole, welfare, food stamps, EITC, unemployed, Pell Grants.

Yes, we are all looking very forward to seeing those on the .gov teat get more right now, aren't we?

I don't think either of you are economists. The fact that you both believe definitively that they won't help, allows me to infer exactly what news sources you listen to. You listen to one, they says the stimulus won't help, listen to the other, they says it will.

Pick and choose which economist/news source you want, and then bolster your views off of it.

I don't know whether the stimulus bill will help, or even if it is necessary. Economists can't agree, liberals and conservatives can't agree, and news agencies definitely can't agree. What I do know is that tax cuts have failed (as always), and I am more than willing to try something else.

Honestly, neither of you knows as much as you'd like to believe about this. Personally, I think the stimulus would be better spent going directly to the people, but that's not the decision that was made.


[edit on 2/13/2009 by Irish M1ck]

Originally posted by Irish M1ck
I don't think either of you are economists.

I'm not. That's why I listen to the Congressional Budget Office.
They themselves said half of it wouldn't be spent for the first two years.
And it doesnt' take an economist to figure out that the $30 million for
Nancy Pelosi's mice isn't exactly going to stimulate the economy.

Irish M1ck ... Obama PROMISED a five day period for transparency.
He's claiming this is emergency legislation that can't wait five days.
That's obviuosly crap. Considering that half of this won't get spent for two years and considering that the MICE can wait a few more days ...
I don't think it's too much to ask for Obama to actually keep his
promise of waiting five days for transparency reasons.

reply to post by redhatty


That's what Rangel meant a few weeks back about "not just giving the money to white construction workers."

Which was followed up ONCE AGAIN with sentiments to the fact that Americans don't even realize what is going on, so they can get away with it.

What I find ENCOURAGING is that these Senators are having to reaffirm eachother that we aren't paying attention. They are going to screw up very soon. And they may have just done it. When people actually REALIZE what they are getting out of this TRILLION dollars, they may just in fact get really, really mad.
Tax revolt. Just like that trend forecaster said.

They should have given the money in a lump sum. Giving it in allotments of 13 bucks a week is going to be viewed as a slap in the face...
Maybe this was the desired effect. In any event, it is clear that they have a complete disdain for the American People. They are beginning to make that abundantly clear.



[edit on 13-2-2009 by Jay-in-AR]

reply to post by Irish M1ck


I'll add 100 dollars to your paypal account if this stimulus works. Let me put it that way.
It WON'T WORK - period.

reply to post by Irish M1ck


Tax cuts don't work? Flying in the face of history I see. Just by this statement we can tell where you get your news from.

Just look at history that is all you have to do.

I still maintain my sentiment that they put a lot of bs in this bill and this is nothing more than a "pay your base" bill for my reelection campaign in 2010.

So much for transparency. We're getting our change right now and your aren't going to like it very much.


edit - spelling

[edit on 13-2-2009 by Hastobemoretolife]