Boy 'killed father after 1,000 smacks'

Originally posted by Sonya610

Originally posted by RogerTThis lady found a way to deal with the issue without resorting to stunting violence, which both respected the child and taught him that biting was something that hurt others, not that biting was something that would get himself hurt by others. Big difference.

Oh I am quite sure the kid knew biting was an aggressive act and the person being bitten did NOT LIKE IT. That is why he kept doing it! Especially after it happened more than once! Once “might” be a mistake, when it happens so often other people are advising acting to curb the issue that is a problem. I am guessing the kid was not in daycare because a lot of care providers will bounce a kid pretty quick if he starts biting others.

I think the suggestion to “bite back” is ridiculous. In my mind it is very very simple, they are small, if they choose to be physically aggressive towards others when they KNOW it is not appropriate it is easy for an adult to scare the crap out of them without causing any real physical pain. Grabbing them and screaming NOOOOO! In a very LOUD and DEEP voice should get the point across.

Scaring the crap out of a brat when it is called for does not lead to “child abuse charges.” If it is done right it will be plenty effective for most children and instill a natural sense of respect for the adults.

Again sweetie, I will assume from what you are posting that you just will refuse to understand for what ever reason. It feels to me from reading your postings as if you are a very aggressive person who does not like children.

ahh, both of my little ones went to school by the time they were two, both of them were very young, my daughter was ?10 months old the first and last time she bit anyone(me), my son was maybe 8 months old (he was walking at 7 months old). So, you are telling me you know what they were thinking at that age when they bit me?

Are you telling me that a 10 month old or an 8 month old child understands that biting someone is aggressive? If you believe that, then I hope you never ever have children, at that age children bite and chew on anything and everything, and it has nothing to do with aggression. It is just their way of "checking out" the world.

I really feel for you, and sincerely hope that you can work past what ever it is that has harmed you so much that you feel such anger and ?? hate? towards children.

Originally posted by amazed
Are you telling me that a 10 month old or an 8 month old child understands that biting someone is aggressive? If you believe that, then I hope you never ever have children, at that age children bite and chew on anything and everything, and it has nothing to do with aggression. It is just their way of "checking out" the world.

First of all, please do not use pet names or terms of endearment when addressing me.

Secondly this is how YOU describe the biting incidents:

Originally posted by amazed
When my son was little, he went through a biting phase, many people would tell me "bite him back and he will learn not to bite". WOW I always thought, so when he bites me if I bite him that teaches him not to bite?

You did NOT say “when my BABY was TEETHING…” you said “When my son was little, he went through a biting phase”. “Little” typically does not refer to babies, but small children. The term “phase” is not typically used to refer to a specific physical condition, but to an attitude. I have never heard anyone say “they went through a phase” meaning the individual was wounded, pregnant, sick, or any other condition of a physical nature.

And you are right, I am not fond of children, however I do like dogs. I have been around many teething puppies that chew on everything including people, and I never referred to those incidents as “my dog biting me” or “my dog going through a biting phase”. If I went around telling people that my dog used to bite me, well gosh, it might make them sound pretty unruly and possibly mean-spirited while making me sound like someone that has no control over them!


[edit on 2-12-2008 by Sonya610]

reply to post by Sonya610


Errm, where does she say 'teething' in any post?

Take a moment to read the posts Sonja, there's wisdom there worth looking for.

Dogs eh? Yes, your fear tactic works much better on dogs, as that's the instinctual way the pack socialises puppies when they step out of line.

As a dog lover, I'm sure you'll be aware that treating a dog like a human doesn't really work. Likewise, treating a human like a dog doesn't either.

Most often infants of such a young age as 7-10 months and sometimes earlier age bite becasue they are in the early stages of teething.

Its not an aggressive act by any means, merely an act of comforting the gums.

I suggest finding a "Infants for dummies" book somewhere.

As to the boy who killed his father...well I dont quite agree with the act of killing for the discipline put upon the kid, but I can see how the boy would become violent and react in the only manner available to him due to the upbringing.

Kids do tend to mimick their parents. Violent parents, violent kids.

If there were others around who could see the problems, they should have intervened..grandparents, school teachers...friends, anyone.

So the problem wasnt just what was going on in the home, part of the problem was the lack of someone taking action to do something about it before it got out of hand.

The case needs to be thoroughly investigated and all aspects considered before tagging this boy for life as a cold blooded murderer.



Cheers!!!!

reply to post by stumason


4 kids die in England every week from abuse, shocking stats, just as shocking are the tens of thousands who suffer and live through this constant abuse, raised by selfish mothers on benefits with a plethora of "uncles" who frequent the house and abuse the kids.......

Originally posted by RogerT
Errm, where does she say 'teething' in any post?

That is my point, she originally said "little" and a "phase". Then LATER she comes back to justify the comment and says he was only 8 months old. BIG difference.

I would consider an 8 month old to be a "baby" and at that age they are teething and bite/chew because their mouth hurts. That is WAY different than implying it was a rambunctious 2 or 3 year old that went through a "biting phase".

reply to post by Sonya610


nah come on now. she didn't infer anything of the sort. you made assumptions which turned out to be inaccurate - twice.
no shame in that. admit it, let it go, move on

Originally posted by blueorder
reply to post by stumason

 

4 kids die in England every week from abuse, shocking stats, just as shocking are the tens of thousands who suffer and live through this constant abuse, raised by selfish mothers on benefits with a plethora of "uncles" who frequent the house and abuse the kids.......

Wow.. with such a high number of child abuse stats, it's no wonder the kids in the UK are as violent as they are.

Point in fact, when I was in London recently I was at a train stop... I forget where now, but there were no seats to sit on. I asked an attendent "What happened to the seats?"

She said "They've been removed because the kids keep vandalizing them"


They had to remove the SEATS because of the KIDS!?

I knew it had to come from someplace

Originally posted by Sonya610

And you are right, I am not fond of children, however I do like dogs.
[edit on 2-12-2008 by Sonya610]

Go get some counseling, you cannot use the same techniques on a child that you use on a dog, they are different. Nor can you lump a child into the same category as a dog.

You insult humanity by using that as an example.

And yes, I did say "little", and did not add his age which I probably should have done, but I am human. So I do apologize for not adding his age. To me little is little, no matter if you are 7 months old or 12 years old, the child is still a child who deserves respect as a human being and not violence.

As I said before the brain is not fully developed until the mid 20's, so I kinda view anyone below the age of 25 as still maturing, but yes each age group deserves their own responsibilities and respect for their abilities.

He was little, he was also walking at 7 months old, and he was talking not much after that. He is and has always been highly intelligent. I am not sure how to explain, yes he was little, yes I had to teach him not to bite. No matter what age he was, I had to find a loving way to teach him that biting was wrong.

Others would tell me to "bite him back" which you seemed to agree is an appropriate violent reaction to being bitten by a child. Biting a child back or being violent towards them no matter if they are 7 days old or 17 years old is not appropriate in my view.

Violence is violence, no matter at what age. Personally I view this as a problem with society, that we still view violence towards those in our society that are little and need our protection the most perpetuates violence in adulthood. IE: it is appropriate to use violence towards children so therefor violence towards adults must be even more acceptable.

I do not view children who act out as "brats", they learn what they are taught, when children act up I view the ACTION as inappropriate, I do not view the whole child as a "brat" as many people seem to do.

I would guess it is hard for many people to sort out an action from the person.

[edit on 3-12-2008 by amazed]

Originally posted by HunkaHunka

Wow.. with such a high number of child abuse stats, it's no wonder the kids in the UK are as violent as they are.

It's nothing new. Youth violence has been a cultural norm in the UK for at least a few generations.

I've travelled a lot of places, and personal attacks are common place in many countries but usually in the less affluent areas and usually for money, but the UK is the only place I've been people are routinely mugged for fun in the suburbs. No theft, just a bit of sport.

"But nothing a good thrashing won't cure eh? Stiff upper lip, what!"



[edit on 3/12/08 by RogerT]

Is it not frightening that in a country awash with weapons that the child felt he had the right to kill someone because he was disciplined, rather than call the Authorities like a civilised person?


Same authorities that visited Jeffrey Dahmer a dozen times because neighbors reported screaming naked black boys running out of his house with blood leaking from ass ?

Authorities carry guns to protect and serve themselves, that has been clear for some time now.

If this guy had beat his dog 1,000 times and the dog retaliated and mauled him, most of you guys would be saying the guy got his just desserts. Attack most living creatures and they will defend, that's why some of you physical disciplinarians of children have such a hard time supporting the kid, his retaliation is an affront to how you rear and maintain your parental dominance.

When I was 9 years old, I nearly a killed a classmate who kept bullying me. I grabbed a stone, held it in my hand, and smacked him unconscious in the head.

But you guys haven't seen the worse yet. A lot of things happen in poor countries get unnoticed, unreported, obviously. Young children, ganging on an innocent passerby, stealing, gang raping, killing (gang wars or they simply didn't like the way you looked).

They commit crime because they like it or they don't like you as simple as that. You don't have to abuse them to do it. Kids these days

I don'believe in killing anyone. That being said, I wish the child would have shot the abuser in the right knee first. Then the left knee. Then he could have taken out each shoulder. It is very hard for someone to catch you and hit you when none of their limbs are able to move. This child was being systematically abused and lived in fear everyday. I dare any one on here to live under the control of any person who has hit you a thousand times and not try to fight back and escape. I hope this child is given the best care and services and finds enough love to heal him.

reply to post by ahnggk


*If you had your gun with you, you wouldn't have gotten bullied in the first place - and thus would not have had to resort to violence.

Just saying, cause your a gun-grabber and all....

Originally posted by Canadianduder

 

*If you had your gun with you, you wouldn't have gotten bullied in the first place - and thus would not have had to resort to violence.

I didn't understand your second statement, not a native speaker but the first I did understand. So I'm quoting only the first one

Even that I still can't bear to justify. Bullying is abuse, a bully is an abuser, therefore must be punished. Sometimes you really need to take harsh actions if you want change. But as a kid, you wouldn't know so many things, so what came to my mind is a stone. It went good in the end, we became friends and he stopped bullying me and other kids. Then I have much respect for him because he changed for the good!

And anyone condoning abuse needs a serious sanity check.

[edit on 5-12-2008 by ahnggk]