Who benefits the Most from 911?

Originally posted by Amorymeltzer
"upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
"all the government has to do is establish that the information they are seeking is relevant to an on going investigation."
same thing dude. and it alwasy was that way. if u want to bust into a place, and u get a reliable tip, thats enough for a warrant. this bitch list doesnt point out any difference.
show me the section in the patriot act where it changes the law, and ill agree. until then, im for it.

Maybe you should let the ACLU know they can drop the lawsuit.

Has anyone read the ideological and political differences of Thomas Jefferson and Alexander Hamilton or Andrew Jackson and Henry Clay?

This is 1700's to 1800's material. The reason I mentio it is because these gentlemen influenced our government extensively. In such, their effects are still felt today.
Jefferson and Clay believed that the power and rights of the people should remain separate from government and state over national government. Hamilton and Jackson believed that the power and rights of the people would be better maintained by a strong, centralized, national government.

Looking back to comparative history, this current administration would fall under which political belief?
"Right to Privacy"...is that necessarily a "freedom" and one that is guaranteed?
"�The Right to Privacy�
www.lawrence.edu...



"What freedoms have I personally lost? The freedom of knowledge."

Thats can be argued either way oconnection. Seems that technology is a wonderful thing but also a terrible thing also. This "freedom of knowledge" is not just hampered by TV news media but also the internet. But if you flip the coin, the internet has allowed for greater access to up-to-date information....TV has now gone major cable and presently, you can watch how many channels of news? Seems "knowledge" is not the freedom lost.....perhaps with so much information that is currently around or gotten to, that discerning which is more to the truth is the real issue?



regards
seekerof

Originally posted by Seekerof
Has anyone read the ideological and political differences of Thomas Jefferson and Alexander Hamilton or Andrew Jackson and Henry Clay?

yes, actually, i have. ive read and studied them all extensively this past year, and agree. jefferson was a major advocate of states rights, especially with his kentucky and virgina resolves, but hamilton really believed in a rule of the few, a plutocracy.
its interesting to note that, idealistically, we are a jeffersonian nation, but in practice are hamiltonian. the federal govt is superior to the states, and we even have the bank, something jefferson was against (yet didnt veto when in office...)

Thats can be argued either way oconnection. Seems that technology is a wonderful thing but also a terrible thing also. This "freedom of knowledge" is not just hampered by TV news media but also the internet. But if you flip the coin, the internet has allowed for greater access to up-to-date information....TV has now gone major cable and presently, you can watch how many channels of news? Seems "knowledge" is not the freedom lost.....perhaps with so much information that is currently around or gotten to, that discerning which is more to the truth is the real issue?

Originally posted by Tamahu
Towards what? More white supremacy and KKKorporate control?

No, towards me being able to tell my personal robot to make me a Hot Pocket without having to get up

Bull-s*it. 'Nuff said.

Quite, it demonstrates clearly you can't actually reply to what I said.

The real criminals are usually the ones with power like government officials and such; not the guy who makes $6.50 an hour trying to write fraudulent checks for groceries or beer.

Which one is more likely to buy a Porsche with my credit card number?

You're right. Mr. Bush, Dick, Dumbsfeld, AshKKKroft and that uncle Tom Colin Powell achieved mad ends with that little stunt they pulled.

Oh, you're one of those people. Since I can't change your mind by arguing with you, I'll leave this one as it lays.

I really hope you're joking with all this non-sense. Especially with a name like "Esoterica"

I belive the word 'nonsense' could be more aptly applied to those who think the gubberment is behind every evil deed committed on Earth since 1946.

EDITED for spelling







[Edited on 15-2-2004 by Esoterica]

[
Thats can be argued either way oconnection. Seems that technology is a wonderful thing but also a terrible thing also. This "freedom of knowledge" is not just hampered by TV news media but also the internet. But if you flip the coin, the internet has allowed for greater access to up-to-date information....TV has now gone major cable and presently, you can watch how many channels of news? Seems "knowledge" is not the freedom lost.....perhaps with so much information that is currently around or gotten to, that discerning which is more to the truth is the real issue?

.Your arguing that I am ignorant, that I have a lack of knowledge in the given subject. This hints slight arrogance. Yes there is more "sources" for information. Have you ever read any European sources of news? Much of the articles on topics dealing with 9/11 or politics it has a completely different viewpoint. You might say they are alien in comparison to each other. One might ask which is the truth. It's interesting that the mainstream media is so quick to believe whatever the government says. Like giving out those terror alerts really helped. All it created was a paranoid public. It helped the gov position more security at the price of freedom. I find the news mostly slanted as far as foreign policy issue go How many of you saw this >> 64.70.191.168... on there late night news program?


[Edited on 15-2-2004 by oconnection]

What about that Jewish guy that owns the new lease on the World Trade Centre? doesn't he benefit from 911?

Originally posted by THENEO
What about that Jewish guy that owns the new lease on the World Trade Centre? doesn't he benefit from 911?

i think so. and, in a certain way, so does the city? have u seen the plans? the new building, the memorial, and the new PATH station are gorgeous, theyre really nice. check it out
i live here, so maybe its just me, but i love the new designs

[Edited on 2/15/2004 by Amorymeltzer]

oconnection:

".Your arguing that I am ignorant, that I have a lack of knowledge in the given subject. This hints slight arrogance."

Personally, and IMHO, I think people have a hard time dealing with someone who disagrees with someon else here? I, in NO way, made or implied that you were ignorant....that you lacked knowledge in a given subject....and in NO way presented it in an arrogant way! If this is what you 'felt'...then I will humbly apologize oconnection, but being none of this was implied or intended, you felt this on your own accord and not of my doing?



regards
seekerof

Originally posted by Esoterica

Originally posted by Tamahu
Towards what? More white supremacy and KKKorporate control?

No, towards me being able to tell my personal robot to make me a Hot Pocket without having to get up

Well whatever; when AmeriKKKa finally reaps what it has sown; it aint gonna be pretty.

Bull-s*it. 'Nuff said.

Quite, it demonstrates clearly you can't actually reply to what I said.

No, it just shows how obvious it is that the technologies you speak of(and most technologies period); are far from "necessary".

The real criminals are usually the ones with power like government officials and such; not the guy who makes $6.50 an hour trying to write fraudulent checks for groceries or beer.

Which one is more likely to buy a Porsche with my credit card number?

Now you're just being a smartass. The people who suffer because of Bush's military campaigns are more important than anyone's got-damn Porsche.

And screw the damn credit system anyway .

You're right. Mr. Bush, Dick, Dumbsfeld, AshKKKroft and that uncle Tom Colin Powell achieved mad ends with that little stunt they pulled.

Oh, you're one of those people

. Since I can't change your mind by arguing with you, I'll leave this one as it lays.

Yep. I'm one of those wacked out "conspiracy theorists". The "funny" thing about that whole mess; is how OBVIOUS it is who was really responsible for it.

Change my mind by arguing? Probably not. Bringing evidence and/or intellectual debate? Maybe.

I really hope you're joking with all this non-sense. Especially with a name like "Esoterica"

I belive the word 'nonsense' could be more aptly applied to those who think the gubberment is behind every evil deed committed on Earth since 1946.

The evils such as colonialism and genocide by European, and American governments(basically the governments that house the 'global elite'), go back alot farther than 1946. Your referring to those idiots who think that AmeriKKKa was all peaches and cream until some secret cabal "infiltrated the government in the 40's or 50's". They're just mad because sh*t started to suck for EVERYONE, as opposed to just non-whites. I mean yeah, some big steps were taken for the NWO during that time period but it's been the same men in control since the beginning.

And almost everyone is responsible for "every evil deed" EVER; because most of us have EGO. It's just that the average man/woman is a sheep(eighty five percenter) and the global elite are the shephards(ten percenters).

Like they say; the devil only has the power that you allow him.....




ONE



[Edited on 16-2-2004 by Tamahu]

Seekerof,

I guess we had a misunderstanding of some sort. Can we still be friends?

Originally posted by Tamahu

Well whatever; when AmeriKKKa finally reaps what it has sown; it aint gonna be pretty.

I like how you just add random groups to America just so you cna villify it even more.
Al-Quedaustralia.
Great BritaiNazi.

This is fun

No, it just shows how obvious it is that the technologies you speak of(and most technologies period); are far from "necessary".

Well, sure, a computer isn't necessary. A car isn't necessary. However, that isn't evidence of a conspiracy, it's evidence of people wanted to have easier lives.

Now you're just being a smartass.

That's what I was going for.

The people who suffer because of Bush's military campaigns are more important than anyone's got-damn Porsche.

Yeah, cuz you know, the Iraqis that are going to finally be in charge of their own government for once really hate us.

screw the damn credit system anyway.

It's fien if you don't liek it. But try getting a house loan without credit history. It's here, deal with it, bitching about it doesn't change a thing.

Yep. I'm one of those wacked out "conspiracy theorists". The "funny" thing about that whole mess; is how OBVIOUS it is who was really responsible for it.

Read the first line of my sig.

Change my mind by arguing? Probably not. Bringing evidence and/or intellectual debate? Maybe.

Neither of which you have done.

The evils such as colonialism and genocide by European, and American governments(basically the governments that house the 'global elite'), go back alot farther than 1946. Your referring to those idiots who think that AmeriKKKa was all peaches and cream until some secret cabal "infiltrated the government in the 40's or 50's". They're just mad because sh*t started to suck for EVERYONE, as opposed to just non-whites. I mean yeah, some big steps were taken for the NWO during that time period but it's been the same men in control since the beginning.

Men are evil, Okay, no argument there. But bring me evidence that there actually is an NWO, and I'll listen. Blaming everything you don't like on something that does not exist fixes nothing.

And almost everyone is responsible for "every evil deed" EVER; because most of us have EGO. It's just that the average man/woman is a sheep(eighty five percenter) and the global elite are the shephards(ten percenters).

Yuh-huh. Come back when you can back it up.

Like they say; the devil only has the power that you allow him.....

Like they also say, what's good for the goose is good for the gander.








[Edited on 16-2-2004 by Tamahu]

Originally posted by Esoterica

Originally posted by Tamahu
Change my mind by arguing? Probably not. Bringing evidence and/or intellectual debate? Maybe.

Neither of which you have done.

Well by reading your first reply to my first reply to you; I could see that it wasn't your intention to carry on an intellectual debate. I responded the way I did the first time because I was astonished by your remarks. The above quote is me simply agreeing with you that arguing won't change my mind.

Well whatever; when AmeriKKKa finally reaps what it has sown; it aint gonna be pretty.

I like how you just add random groups to America just so you cna villify it even more.
Al-Quedaustralia.
Great BritaiNazi.

This is fun

Obviously you don't understand that many people use the term "AmeriKKKa" because it's a white supremacist country and always has been(even though it trys to hide it).

No, it just shows how obvious it is that the technologies you speak of(and most technologies period); are far from "necessary".

Well, sure, a computer isn't necessary. A car isn't necessary. However, that isn't evidence of a conspiracy, it's evidence of people wanted to have easier lives.

The government wanting to track everyones every move, creating implantable microchips and creating scenarios which will persuade the masses to give up their freedoms isn't a conspiracy? ?

The people who suffer because of Bush's military campaigns are more important than anyone's got-damn Porsche.

Yeah, cuz you know, the Iraqis that are going to finally be in charge of their own government for once really hate us.

Ooookaaayyy. In charge of their own government; right .
More like another installed puppet regime like the Saddam Hussein one.

screw the damn credit system anyway.

It's fien if you don't liek it. But try getting a house loan without credit history. It's here, deal with it, bitching about it doesn't change a thing.

Your right. And I don't go around bitching about it. But if someone tells me that there's nothing wrong with a system that enslaves them, I might have a thang or two to say. But these days I might opt to not "toss my pearls to the swine" like I used to do on the regular.

Yep. I'm one of those wacked out "conspiracy theorists". The "funny" thing about that whole mess; is how OBVIOUS it is who was really responsible for it.

Read the first line of my sig.

This has not much to do with opinion.

Peep my analogy:
If there were peach jam all over the walls of your kitchen and an empty bottle of peach jam on the floor; and your kid was chillin' there with peach jam on his face; would you believe him if he told you that he didn't even touch that particular bottle of jam? You didn't see him do it, so there's very small chance that he didn't(maybe the kid happened to be eating a peach jam sandwich, right before he was the first one to come home and see the after math of what the now gone culprit had really done lol!).
That's how see-through the whole "9-11" incident is. It was an inside job.

Men are evil, Okay, no argument there. But bring me evidence that there actually is an NWO, and I'll listen. Blaming everything you don't like on something that does not exist fixes nothing.

Where have I "blamed everything I don't like" on anything?

As far as the existence of the NWO; that's an arguement that has taken place 1,000,037 times on this forum. I don't wish to start another one.

And almost everyone is responsible for "every evil deed" EVER; because most of us have EGO. It's just that the average man/woman is a sheep(eighty five percenter) and the global elite are the shephards(ten percenters).

Yuh-huh. Come back when you can back it up.

"The proof is in the puddin'" as they say.

Like they say; the devil only has the power that you allow him.....

Like they also say, what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

I don't understand exactly what you're implying here.


And why is your name "Esoterica"?

You seem like the type of person who's prone to swallowing the exoteric, face-value interpretations that a Baptist preacher might feed you .




ONE




[Edited on 16-2-2004 by Tamahu]

Who benefits the Most from 911?

Quite Simply: The Global Military-Industrial-Corporate-Complex!!!!

We (The USA) make Guns & Missles & Jets Fighters & Tanks & Smart-Bombs & Anthrax & Nukes & a whole other Bunch of crap!! On sale now - to the Highest Bidder - heck we will even sell it to each other!!!

-"Won't you please Buy my Product"?

Please note that I posted the above BEFORE checking this out:

Hey check this out - the Voice acting is BAD - but the conclusions are frighteningly plausible:

www.prisonplanet.com...

The thing that really got me is This -> the "U.S." declared a "War on Terror" yet the Government has not officially defined "Terrorism". The Patriot Act says that the Police can Raid my home WITHOUT a Search Warrant now - I better not be smoking a joint - they would probably send be to Prison because of their "War on Drugs". I live in a Police State!!!!

Last time I checked isn't CONGRESS supposed to have the Power to Declare War NOT the President. We have been to "Hot" Wars SEVEN TIMES since the Congress last declared War = WW2. So apparently I also live in a Corporate backed Dictatorship!!!

Also people like "FoxNews" are still reporting that a PLANE hit the Pentagon
oh really:

thewebfairy.com...

"I wish my Lawn looked this Good"!!