ATS, a right wing propagation mill?

Lately, I have been surprised and alarmed at how many posts and replies are being made on ATS by people who are unabashedly right winged and conservative. Is there anyone else out there who feels the same way? This forum discusses many topics that are issues because of right wing politics in this country...such as 9/11, the war in iraq, government opacity etc... I wonder why people with right wing political leanings would be attracted to this site in the first place?
The very definition of the word liberal means freedom, so why is their so much hatred and fear directed towards liberals?

reply to post by 420prajna

isn't it funny? i was thinking this place is heavily leaning left, especially with the moderators. i haven't met a conservative moderator yet. in fact i think it is a perequisite to be very liberal to be a mod. just my opinion, please dont ban me again. thank you.

i guess things always seem greener on the other side of the fence.

Wrong wrong wrong.

We allow views and opinions from all sides. The only rule is our T&C. There are Moderators from all sides. There are Moderators that are anti-Bush, and there are Moderators that are pro-Bush. ATS is neutral. There are Moderators from all over the world. I.e. I am from Norway. We don't silence opinions. You can say whatever you want, as long as it complies with our T&C.

I recommend this thread:


Moderators Are People Too. (and they have opinions)

The very definition of the word liberal means freedom, so why is their so much hatred and fear directed towards liberals?

Well actually Liberal means..

1 a : of, relating to, or based on the liberal arts b archaic : of or befitting a man of free birth
2 a : marked by generosity : OPENHANDED b : given or provided in a generous and openhanded way c : AMPLE, FULL
3 obsolete : lacking moral restraint : LICENTIOUS
4 : not literal or strict : LOOSE
5 : BROAD-MINDED; especially : not bound by authoritarianism, orthodoxy, or traditional forms
6 a : of, favoring, or based upon the principles of liberalism b capitalized : of or constituting a political party advocating or associated with the principles of political liberalism; especially : of or constituting a political party in the United Kingdom associated with ideals of individual especially economic freedom, greater individual participation in government, and constitutional, political, and administrative reforms designed to secure these objectives

Merriam Webster

Being Liberal in and of itself is not "Bad" or detrimental in anyway.

It is what Liberals have become that is offensive.

Take a look at some of the recent Liberal quotes and directions..

1. Support of legislation to silence talk radio they do not agree with. In essence the destruction of the 1st Amendment

2. Hilary Clinton, "I want to take their profits"

3. "I would think that if you understood what Communism was, you would hope, you would pray on your knees, that we would someday become communists."
Jane Fonda

4. One could say that Osama bin Laden and these non-nation-state fighters with religious purpose are very similar to those kind of atypical revolutionaries that helped to cast off the British crown."
Marcy Kaptur- Democratic Representative Ohio

5. "I mean, I think, Iraqis, I think, feel that if we drove smaller cars, maybe we wouldn’t have to kill them for their oil.”
Bill Mahr - Larry King Live (November 1, 2002) (ahhh DUH)

6. "Globalization, as defined by rich people like us, is a very nice thing... you are talking about the Internet, you are talking about cell phones, you are talking about computers. This doesn't affect two-thirds of the people of the world."
Jimmy Carter (Rich like us)

7. "by just getting the SUVs to have the same fuel economy as autos."
Barbara Boxer Democratic Rep. CA. (HAHAHAHAHA)

8. "Their idea of equal rights is the American flag and Confederate swastika flying side by side."
Julian Bond - NAACP Chairman '

That is just a few quotes and policy blunders in the most recent history of what the Liberals have become ever since they adopted their obvious Socialist agenda.

Basically they want to raise taxes, limit free speech and destroy the conservative majority at all costs.

Semper

word liberal means freedom,

reply to post by 420prajna

Really, that's funny, when I hear liberal I think of a bunch of people who have banned together so either they can get something for nothing, taking it from rich people or they are trying to do something morally questionable and they want politicians to make it legal.
On a lighter note, however, when I first joined ATS I thought most of the posters were lefty liberals. Actually I still do but now I recognize a few more conservatives now and then.
And since we are talking definitions, my idea of a conservative is someone who has finally decided to clean up their act, take responsibility for their actions, live by the laws of the land and a moral code and not expect a free ride from someone else.
Of course I was a liberal once too. Been there, done that, reformed now.

reply to post by semperfortis

Oh, yes, and great post Semper... star for you!

From a third party perspective, I'd say both sides of your funny coin get equal airtime. If anything, it may be cyclic, with one week having one side extra loud, and the next week it'll be the other side.

But that's just me, my view.

The terms 'liberal' and 'conservative' (especially in the US) have largely ceased to be meaningful and are now just used as insults for people who's political ideologies bear few similarities to your own.

Trawl through posts here on ATS. You'll find most mentions of those two terms are used contemptuously. There isn't really a solid definition of either, as I've said - they're so broad and general that you could pretty much apply either one to whoever you wanted. They're useless terms for political discourse, at any rate.

I find the whole "left/right" dynamic rather stupid (or more commonly around here) lazy thinking/typing.

Using it in such terms generally takes 2 dimensions of political thought and makes them into just 1. That is not only untrue, but unreasonable and unfair.

I am socially liberal and fiscally conservative, making me hate both parties because they are socially different, but fiscally the same.

The current "conservatives" are really nothing more than old school Democrats who love socialism, and the current "liberals" are simply shills for special interest groups and are generally communist but will settle on socialism for now.

Both stink, and those two parties should burn from the ground up until they are no more. There is no fixing them, however we only need 1 to fail in order to kill them both, since they are flimsy cards resting on each other.

Ever notice how most discussions in the mainstream markets are NOT about economics? That's because they are simply shades of the same degree.

Politics is all social issues and nonsense issues (aside from the war, which could be ended or continued and still do end up good for us either way, with some rational minds around).

As for ATS, this forum fluctuates as the tide of the many who come here post.

Sometimes I'm surprised at how many progressives there are, and sometimes I'm surprised at how many are on my side.

It comes and goes, but either way it's not about that at all and should have no bearing on you.

Lastly, don't peg the hunt for truth as a liberal or conservative thing.

reply to post by KrazyJethro

The current "conservatives" are really nothing more than old school Democrats who love socialism,

Hi Jethro, Wow, you live up to your name here, where did you get that idea? Most old conservatives don't admit to having been Democrats (admit I do), and they certainly don't love socialism and never did. I would say there is a big distinction between to 2. Kind of tired so won't get into that but read my former post, pls.

I did read your former post, and I'm not speaking of normal joes, but rather the infrastructure of our political system.

It's rotten to the core, but when I said that new conservatives (also called neo-cons by some who like catchy crap) are old democrats I really don't see where one can disagree.

They were/are both socially conservative (pro marriage, anti gay, etc etc) and both are economically liberal. If they did NOT love socialism, why did they punch through the rotten and disgusting Medicare prescription drug bill? Why do they not cut spending but rather raise it to obscene levels? Why do they not curtail the size of the government, but rather increase it's size by a fairly large margin? Why do they not seek or promote the State's responsibility but rather seek to add more to the "purview" of the Federal government?

I could care less about conservative people or liberal people. To me most people are stupid, ignorant, apathetic, or lazy and will not be the first to do jack, so they are of no use or consideration to me really. They are foolishly being used and I see no real hope in sight when it comes to the American people unless we can cut the fat a lot.

I've heard it said that fire is good when it's in it's place, namely a fireplace. If the fire somehow gets out of it's place, most sane people would stomp it out.

The same is true for government, and it's close to the time that they need to be stomped out by any means.

Total rabbit trail, but hey, I tend to run along the lines of my thoughts.

Can I as a mod say that I agree with KrazyJethro here. Democrats (liberals) and Republicans (neo-conservates) are practically one and the same economically speaking, like mentioned above. Not much people may admit it, but the president of the U.S. is a liberal when you look at what his administration has been doing concerning "no child left behind", size of government, deficit spending.

The Bush administration is liberal.

reply to post by KrazyJethro

Hi again Jethro,
I see what you are saying now. If the former bunch of Republicans in power was so conservative why did they do a bunch of liberal, socialist things like you mentioned? I look at it this way. If liberals want to get their agenda passed just vote in conservatives because here's what happens: The conservatives are in total power so they eventually get feelings of guilt and compassion. So to prove that they are compassionate they start letting through legislation that they normally wouldn't consider just to satisfy their guilt. The liberals accuse them of being cruel and inconsiderate anyway so they keep on passing stupid liberal bills and they never get any credit for it, and they get voted out of office by their constituants. The liberals get back in power eventually and everyone hates them (like what is happening now) and the cycle repeats. That's why the liberal agendas are often enacted by conservatives.
Now the "Neocons" may be a little less conservative in a lot of respects but that just makes them more prone to the phenomenon. They probably thought about the prescription drug bill that what the heck it is going to be passed eventually anyway so we might as well get the credit and voila. Regarding the deficit, they thought Bush wants it and if the libs were in power they would run it up even more so what the heck, let the next generation deal with it! Thanks!

reply to post by 420prajna

I guess that makes me one of those 'Conservatives' your mother warned you about.
When I joined (very recently) I found plenty of view points different from my own. My guess is that you find there to be too many conservatives for your liking (ATS/PTS); and expressing your alarm over it is in a way showing some fear of your own.
There isn't much to fear, we just wont agree on some things. Well okay maybe a lot of things.
I'm kinda laid back and don't have the razor sharp debate skills of some of these members; but I'm at least willing to listen to an opposing view point.

Jules

reply to post by julesmac8

Welcome Jules! What I note most here politically is the venomous, vitriolic Bush hating that goes on. Blame the administration for everything, accuse them of genicide, profiteering, etc, compare the Bushes to Hitler, on an on.
I did a kind of tongue in cheek congratulations to GW recently on a thread and that really riled them up and brought them out! How dare I say something good about Bush!

ATS veers from the two political extremes depending on the amount members from both sides that are actively posting. The members determine the current view under the condition that they abide to the terms and conditions of the site.

While some members prefer political bickering, others prefer to research and discuss conspiracies.

I'm not sure I would call it "Bickering"

How about polite discussion of political issues... LOL



Semper

In my experience it's usually bickering about who is the lesser evil. IMHO they both are

And you know what?

Of late I could not even begin to argue that point...

Yet, where there is life, there is hope, so one continues on hoping sanity prevails...

Semper