UEFA European Football Championship 2020 (21) , the Time has Come

Good game , Scotland deserved the draw hope the beat Croatia.

England need to get serious and stop using under performing players , loyalty is all well and good but it doesn't get you goals.

a reply to: gortex

England were terrible tonight.

Southgate doesn't know his best team, not putting out that side. Too safe. Too defensive.

Kane shouldnt be playing. Hardly any chances created by England, very tedious to watch. I thought it was a boring game to be honest.

Shaw bad, Phillips were was he. Mount, Foden, Kane. Nope.

There wont be any football going home with that team selection. Compare that to Italy, Belgium, Portugal.

a reply to: gortex

loyalty is all well and good but it doesn't get you goals.

Totally agree.

Saka, Sancho, Grealish. Start them. Calvert Lewis even, definitely not Kane.

All the attacking talent he has and Southgate is holding them back.

England were poor.
No great surprise there, as always they flatter to deceive.
Never thought Southgate was a good manager, he was awful at Boro.
Not being wise after the event, I've been very open about my criticism of him.
We are in danger of wasting yet another good crop of players because the F.A like Southgate's conservatism and view him as a safe pair of hands who ticks all the boxes and courts no controversy.

Still, no real damage done.
We should still qualify as group winners.....and then lose against either France, Germany or Portugal as on that performance and recent history we have no chance at all of breaking their defences down.

But let's not detract from what was a great effort by Scotland.
They played with passion, pride and were a threat throughout most of the game.

England could/should have been 2 or 3 up at half-time.
But Scotland were very good and I see no reason why they can't beat Croatia.

Steve Clarke got his tactics spot on and their players delivered on the big occasion.....something that can't be said for their English counterparts.

I hate all this building players up and English chances of winning the tournament and then delighting in knocking them when we fail, as we invariably do.
I have seen it so, so many times before.
I have come to have low expectations when it comes to England, I'm rarely disappointed.

If it was up to me I'd replace Southgate NOW.
He was an appalling selection as manager and WILL NOT deliver success.

I might be wrong, let's hope so.

I'd get Pochettino or Klopp in as manager - that'll shock the traditionalists, an Argey or a Kraut!

originally posted by: Freeborn

If it was up to me I'd replace Southgate NOW.
He was an appalling selection as manager and WILL NOT deliver success.

I might be wrong, let's hope so.

I'd get Pochettino or Klopp in as manager - that'll shock the traditionalists, an Argey or a Kraut!

I’d sack him too. But it wouldn’t happen, because he’s the kind of safe choice the FA always make. My inexplicable hunch is that they prefer to lose in the knockouts rather than hire someone they can’t micro manage.

When I say micro manage I’m starting to suspect that southgate’s team selection is being dictated based on an advertising criteria. I wonder how Grealish’s sponsorship value compares to Kane’s ?

I imagine Kane has massive sponsorship cash riding on him getting plenty of minutes on the pitch, so southgate’s being told to always start him and keep him on as long as possible. Just look at the Ronaldo Cola-gate with players now being threatened with repercussions if they move the cola bottles. The FA and EUFA are up to their necks in kickbacks and bribes - nothing’s changed since Sepp Blatter.

So, I agree that Southgate should never have gotten the job and should go immediately (though they’d need a great replacement ready to hit the ground running - one familiar with these players). But IMO the real problem the is ongoing venality at the FA. That compromised cabal needs to go and a new organisation built from the ground up by people that are proven to have a passion for the game…

…I’d like to see a board of ex-players such as Sheerer and Ian Wright chair our managerial selection. They’ve both shown great candour (Wright was magnificent on itv last night). Only a group like that will select a manager because he can win, rather than because he’ll submit to sponsorship demands.

Klopp would be the best possible choice, but I don’t see him wanting to leave Liverpool for England. Pochettino would be a good choice. Looking at managers who are more or less available, I’d suggest Eddie Howe, who’d get the best out of our attacking potential. And I’m a fan of Nuno Espirito who did great work at Watford. Likewise Sean Dyche!

It’d never happen, but I’d be good with Big Sam being rehired. If they sacked Southgate right now (again, never happen), Sam’s the best caretaker manager to get them through the euros. He’s already managed England and has arguably the best track record ever of rescuing teams as a caretaker manager (despite West Brom going down he made vast improvements in those final games).

Sack Southgate and bring in Sam. Directly after the Euros, disband the FA - sack the the lot of them - and rebuild from the ground up. If Sam did well keep him on. Otherwise go for Eddie Howe, an attack minded manager who’ll no doubt be committed to winning. If not Howe, then Dyche (latter’s a better all round manager, but I prefer Howe as England’s strengths are their forwards, something Howe has shown passion and aptitude for with Bournemouth).

Under the current FA perhaps a big name such as Pochettino would be better, since I don’t see the FA twats strong arming him into playing a weaker team to keep big brand sponsors happy… but that’s why they’d never hire Pochettino, or anyone in his league.

Looking back on last night's match, England were lucky to get a draw imo.
Yes they hit the post early on but that was it.
Billy Gilmour, the scottish Pirlo, man of the match. Every Scottish player put in a monster performance. Cant say the same for the English.
Scotland carried a massive threat. Their problem is scoring goals. They were unlucky on a couple of occasions. But England played so slowly. They didn't have any ideas and Scotland just ran them.

If i was English i'd be fuming at Southgates selection. Seven defensive players? So he's playing not to get beaten. He's not playing to win. With that amount of attacking talent? Send him home now. Sure he selected 4 right backs. That sums him up.

He's gonna change it up for the next match coz yizzar already through, make about 5/6 changes. And they are gonna win about 3-0. Which will mess his head up even more. The country will be screaming for certain players to start in the last 16 match after watching the next game. The players he brings in will play big games.
I called it with the 0-0 and i called it with Grealish coming on after an hour.

I really hope Scotland make it through because in a one off match, knockout football, they can go far. Like Wales did 5 years ago. After watching that last night i think its the English team who's going home. Early.

So bloody frustrating seeing Grealish finally come on, but then getting shoved out on the left. He’s more than capable in that position, but for him to effect that game at that stage he needed to be in the middle.

Can’t help wondering if Southgit did that on purpose to justify his apparent desire, or FA directive, to play Grealish as little as possible.

We're second in our group only due to goal difference , we beat the Czech Republic on Tuesday we progress top of our group if we draw we still progress , I see no reason to panic.

We were unlucky not to win yesterday given the opportunities we had but I find it curious that only two games in some are calling for Southgate to be sacked , Scotland were fighting for survival and put up a good fight yesterday so TBH I was happy with the draw as Scotland earned it.

England are usually slow starters in tournaments and it seems this tournament is no different , we have the quality all we need is some luck , Wales beat the Czech's in their World Cup qualifier in March I see no reason why England won't on Tuesday.

Keep the faith guys.

a reply to: gortex

I agree, no need to panic....but no reason to be positive too.
Of course we'll qualify from the group, probably even win it.
But then we play France, Germany or Portugal.....can you see this team beating any of them given the performances so far and the tactics Southgate tends to use?

I never wanted Southgate as manager in the first place.
My calls to sack him are hardly new.

Keep the faith?
Seen far too many false dawns, England always disappoint.

I sincerely hope your optimism is proven correct and I'm just a miserable, grumpy old man.

a reply to: Freeborn

But then we play France, Germany or Portugal.....can you see this team beating any of them given the performances so far and the tactics Southgate tends to use?

From what I've seen I'd fancy us against Germany but France or Portugal would be a tougher ask but think we have the quality to give them a run.

For me Southgate needs to start Grealish on Tuesday and rest Kane in favour of Calvert-Lewin or preferably Ollie Watkins to link up with team mate Grealish.

Villa boys doing it for England !

a reply to: gortex

I think Ian Wright nailed it when last night he said,

“What is he [Southgate] taking Foden off for?” Wright said after the game on ITV. “There’s no way Phil Foden should be leaving the pitch today, for me. It’s very disappointing to see.

Ian Wright ‘embarrassed’ by Gareth Southgate’s substitutions…

I don’t think it’s an accurate portrayal to say England were unlucky not to win and fairer that Scotland were unlucky not to win.

Scotland completely outplayed us - they passed better, they moved the ball forward (England spent most of the night going sideways and backwards) and they had the better chances (if not for Pickford’s great save, we’d have lost).

A team ranked 40 places below England came closer to winning it that’s England did... Why is that?

You look at Southgate’s sometimes inexplicable selections, just like the one pointed out above by Wright, or trying his hardest not to play arguably this year’s best premiere league player, Grealish, whilst persevering with an obviously knackered Kane and I think there’s more than enough reason to question Southgate’s chops in his role. It’s not panic, in fact I’d call it denial not to question the mis-management. But looking at the Covid mis-management, along with this, someone could be forgiven for thinking that it’s simply the English way to not question the orthodoxy, regardless of what of what’s unfolding, until it’s too late.

But whether it be panic, or analysis, it’s obvious something’s eschew. Surely it’s fair to ask why?

Is Southgoat making these selections that none of the pundits seem at peace with because he’s got a magical secret plan up his wizard’s sleeve?

Or because he wants to be a ‘special one’ - an egomaical authoritarian convinced that his authorship his paramont and seems threatened by individual stars taking the kudos if they’re too autonomous and do well?

Or because he’s taking orders from the FA/EUFA to appease sponsors?

Or is he trying his best for all the right reasons, but despite being apt at know how not to lose, he’s lost at sea when it comes to knowing how to win?

Probably the latter, with a dash sponsor demands. But when looking at the full 90 minutes of the games he’s managed I’d call him a very mediocre yes-man, which is in line with many of the managers the FAs seen fit to foist on the English players and fans.

originally posted by: gortex

For me Southgate needs to start Grealish on Tuesday and rest Kane in favour of Calvert-Lewin or preferably Ollie Watkins to link up with team mate Grealish.

Villa boys doing it for England !

I’d be happy with that. The Villa link up makes sense.

But I’d prefer Calvert-Lewin up front instead, based on his recent form and the added bonus giving England an excellent target in the air.

For me, Grealish and Foden have to both start. Right now I feel like Southgate’s fear of attacking makes him see these two as one or the other - together they’d be very formidable and nightmare to defend against both.

Foden on the right causing mayhem with his speed. Grealish in the middle, behind Calvert-Lewin, turning and driving forward, which he’s so bloody great at, and Mount on the left switching play and crossing in assists to Calvert-Lewin’s head to keep the opponents guessing.

Sterling, Rashford and Kane as impact subs if needed.

a reply to: McGinty

This is the game I watched , England clearly had the chances and were unlucky not to bag one of them , granted if it weren't for Pickford it would have been a different story but that's why he's in the England goal.


Harry Maguire and Jack Grealish are both coming back from injury , I can see the sense of not rushing them back into the team at this point.

a reply to: Freeborn

I never wanted Southgate as manager in the first place.

I don't know anything about his credentials. But he is infamous for fluffing the penalty at Euro 96.

Seems a strange choice for England manager. But at least he's English, eh?

Should be thankful for God's little mercies, I suppose.

a reply to: gortex

Watching highlights often gives an inaccurate impression of the game and who looked more likely over the 90. Even so, in those highlights Scotland had the best chances with 2 on target (not including Reece james’ clearance which was never going in), while England had only one on target with mount’s desperate bash from distance. Stones came close, but again, not on target.

Having suffered the full game it was clear that despite England having a few good spells, in general they struggled, with constant side and back passing and no pressing whatsoever. I’m not alone in that - just turn on the telly, the radio, look at the papers - the consensus is 100% ‘what the frak was up with England last night!’ I certainly don’t hear anyone saying England were unlucky not to win. What I am hearing across the sporting media is:

Why is Kane playing when he’s obviously unfit?
Why was the brightest spark Foden taken off?
Why did southgate persevere with 2 in midfield when it obviously wasn’t working?

Most of all, why didn’t Grealish start and was then played on the left?

I don’t think we can put that last one down to Grealish recovering from injury, since he played the full 90 in the friendlies and was acknowledged as outstanding. Grealish’s absence is being called out as inexplicable by pundits all over the place.

A more viable reason is southgate’s determination to be a ‘special one’; his way or the highway and Grealish, though the best player in the premiere league, doesn’t fit in with his stragergies and formations. Is Gareth too stubborn, or too thick to adapt to Grealish with Kane not performing?

Put that together with probable sponsorship pressure from venal FA/UEFA twats and a more plausible explanation for the weird selections is surely apparent.

I think Southgate has begun to believe his own PR.
He thinks he's some sort of tactical genius whereas the opposite would probably be more accurate.
As I said earlier; he set's his teams up not to lose rather to win and that quite often puts England on the back foot from the start.
His substitutions have quite often defied logic and show an inability to be flexible and to react to how a game progresses and develops.
I suspect most of his substitutions are thought out and decided before the game even starts.

There are games where I absolutely agree that two holding/defensive midfielders may be the best option.

A manager needs to be fluid, able to think on his feet and plan to win.
Southgate seems incapable of doing any of these.

I'd stick with Shaw at left-back, that's about the only thing I can take out of last nights game.
Kane looks woeful.
Sterling at least tried to be positive and move the ball forwards.

All this possession based, tippy-tap, sideways, crab-like football is killing the game as a spectacle.
Its boring and it takes us an eternity, if ever, to break teams down.

We have an incredibly talented bunch of players but tactically we are years behind some other countries.

Half Time ... Hungary 1 France 0


No doubt the French will overturn the deficit in the second half but as it stands ....

The French have overturned the deficit , Hungary 1 France 1

Looking like we could have another draw.

Full time , draw.

Germany have to beat Portugal tonight or at least draw to stand any chance of progressing.

Theres no way a manager is listening to sponsors as to who they want in the team. Even if he did, which i really really doubt, he's not taking bribes to select a player. Thats just an excuse to justify the managers selections. Southgate picked 7 defensive players because he plays not to lose. He doesn't have a winners mentality. Its like he's standing on the reins of a thoroughbred when the horse is steaming to sprint.

a reply to: SecretKnowledge

I don't want to think badly of anyone, but this is still a conspiracy site, and football has never been immune from shady tactics.

I know the permutations are endless, but could Southgate, directed by the FAPTB, be aiming for second place in the group?

From Sky Sports: www.skysports.com...

Last-16 knockout stage
This is where England's gameplan becomes a lot more interesting.

Gareth Southgate might even prefer to avoid a potential last-16 meeting with one of Portugal, Germany, France or Hungary; the second-place side in that group lie in wait if England win Group D.

If England finish second in their group, they will likely face an on-paper easier opponent in the next round - the runner-up from Group E, meaning one of Spain, Sweden, Poland or Slovakia.

The permutations are endless and probably impossible to predict, but weird things have happened in football over the decades.

In the end, the ball is round ⚽... anything can happen!

a reply to: Encia22

Oh, and I forgot to add fixed matches...

www.goal.com...

Italy and Cagliari legend Gigi Riva says that the controversial 2-2 draw between Denmark and Sweden that knocked Italy out of Euro 2004 was fixed.

Riva says that in Euro 2004 the match between Denmark and Sweden was a definite fix. The Nordic neighbours went into their last group game knowing that a draw of 2-2 or higher would see both teams through to the quarter-final at the expense of Italy.
The game finished 2-2, meaning that the Azzurri were sent packing in hugely controversial circumstances.

This one still hurts... I watched the Denmark - Sweden game and I believe they "made it so", as Picard would say.

Luckily, the utter joy of lifting the World Cup two years later, was such a sweet revenge.