Antibodies VS Vaccine

Hello ATS readers and contributers,

I would like more information on the case of antibodies vs vaccines. I would like to preface this conversation by saying if you were tested positive for Covid-19 you may or may not have the antibodies. The test used has a fail rate, some folks believe this fail rate is high and some don't. That aspect does not matter, there is a fail rate for all tests so if you have not tested positive for the antibodies directly, you may not have had Covid-19 and the subsequent antibodies.

Moving on, lets talk about mutations. We need a yearly flu shot as the virus has several variants and we try to predict the one that will be prominent. This will most likely be the case for Covid-19 as well. This being said, the Covid-19 shot will be a yearly or semi annual shot moving forward. I think everyone expects this to be true.

Main point. We have a very wide subset of society on this site. My one question is, if your body has created antibodies for this virus on it's own, which through that process tried several different approaches to defeat the virus, would antibodies be a more effective solution to the problem rather than a vaccine? Furthermore, if you have the antibodies what benefit does the vaccine provide? We know the virus is going to mutate and the vaccine is going to change year over year. The day before your vaccine is the most vulnerable you are going to be.

What say you ATS? If you have the antibodies, is there a reason to get the vaccine?

a reply to: litterbaux

I think that we are playing a dangerous game with indiscriminate use of vaccines and antibiotics.

The medical community has made some horrible mistakes when playing with people's lives for profit. I am not impressed with their track record.

It is not just the medications that have been recalled after years of supposedly safe use, let's look at opioids. I remember when they were handing them out like candy, and arming patient's with their bill of rights, to use to threaten their doctors, if they did not provide them with enough medications for them to be pain free.

Now these science geniuses are pushing vaccines for a novel virus, that they admit they are only learning about, while forcing people to be guinea pigs.

Sorry. I prefer to trust my chances with mother nature.

originally posted by: litterbaux
Hello ATS readers and contributers,

I would like more information on the case of antibodies vs vaccines. I would like to preface this conversation by saying if you were tested positive for Covid-19 you may or may not have the antibodies. The test used has a fail rate, some folks believe this fail rate is high and some don't. That aspect does not matter, there is a fail rate for all tests so if you have not tested positive for the antibodies directly, you may not have had Covid-19 and the subsequent antibodies.

Moving on, lets talk about mutations. We need a yearly flu shot as the virus has several variants and we try to predict the one that will be prominent. This will most likely be the case for Covid-19 as well. This being said, the Covid-19 shot will be a yearly or semi annual shot moving forward. I think everyone expects this to be true.

Main point. We have a very wide subset of society on this site. My one question is, if your body has created antibodies for this virus on it's own, which through that process tried several different approaches to defeat the virus, would antibodies be a more effective solution to the problem rather than a vaccine? Furthermore, if you have the antibodies what benefit does the vaccine provide? We know the virus is going to mutate and the vaccine is going to change year over year. The day before your vaccine is the most vulnerable you are going to be.

What say you ATS? If you have the antibodies, is there a reason to get the vaccine?

It's not clear from your statement whether or not you understand that a vaccine operates by creating antibodies. Getting infected by the virus creates antibodies and getting the vaccine creates antibodies. It's not one or the other.

So the question is, which route creates more and/or better antibodies?

Right now, there are basically 4 families of vaccines. The Chinese vaccine (Sinovax) uses the oldest and simplest approach. It takes whole COVID19 viruses and "kills" them with strong radiation or chemicals. When the killed viruses get into your cells, they cannot reproduce themselves, but basically all parts of the killed virus can create antibodies. The Chinese vaccine is closest to simply getting a virus infection, except that the viruses can't reproduce themselves once they're inside your cells.

The Russian vaccine (Sputnik V) uses a hollowed out adenovirus to deliver recombinant DNA (made from COVID19 virus RNA) into your cell's nucleus. That DNA creates spike protein RNA which migrates out to your cell's cytoplasm, creates spike proteins, which creates antibodies.

The European vaccines (plus Johnson & Johnson) uses a hollowed out adenovirus to deliver RNA to your cell's nucleus. That RNA migrates out to your cell's cytoplasm, creates spike proteins, which creates antibodies.

The Moderna and Pfizer vaccines don't use any viruses at all. They put RNA directly into your cell's cytoplasm, which creates spike proteins, which creates antibodies.

In terms of reducing your risk of getting a severe or fatal infection, the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines reduce your risk by about 95%. The European and J&J vaccines reduce your risk by about 90%. The Russian vaccine reduces your risk by about 80%, plus or minus. The Chinese vaccine is apparently the least effective (I'm not sure they've released accurate figures), but is still effective at reducing your risk.

You may have noticed that the effectiveness of the vaccines improves as the technology moves from the oldest technology to the newest. There are good scientific reasons to expect that (which I won't go into here) and is one of the reasons why the RNA vaccines were invented in the first place.

Bottom line: if you have access to one of the modern vaccines, that will probably reduce your risk of getting a serious or fatal reaction to an infection, if that should occur. The immunity will probably last longer, as well. In no case will either getting the infection or getting a good vaccine reduce your risk to zero, forever. Having an infection or a vaccination simply reduces your risk of dying from an infection in the future.

If this so called virus is in fact a creation made out of the lust of the supernatural in the labs of superman, then really what recourse do we have but to watch the reruns of Superman and hopefully find out the truth and that is maybe Superman was defeated by a very big con job by all govt. leading bodies that they are superior and we all are modern day morons.

Antibodies Vs. Experimental Biological Agent

Fixed your Title
it gets a lot clearer
when said like it is.

a reply to: 1947boomer

Great explanation of the various vaccines.


Now we just need for someone to give a rational, scientific reason to vaccinate people who have already had the disease.
And a sane and logical, and scientific reason not to ask or test for antibodies before subjecting humans to this, as yet, experimental vaccine.

a reply to: litterbaux

I don't understand if your own body has had covid and used its own immune system to fight it and beat it, why would you get a vaccine. It makes no sense at all.

a reply to: 1947boomer

Thank you for your detailed response. This is exactly what I was looking for.

originally posted by: DontTreadOnMe
a reply to: 1947boomer

Great explanation of the various vaccines.

Now we just need for someone to give a rational, scientific reason to vaccinate people who have already had the disease.
And a sane and logical, and scientific reason not to ask or test for antibodies before subjecting humans to this, as yet, experimental vaccine.

I don't believe the US or other nation news about the vaccine.
The vaccine now is being rolled out here in the country I live in.
Will I go for the shot... of the unknown concequences , #.. no, not not NOW

The virus is less than 1% fatal, probably even half of that. I think my wife and I had it for a week maybe, runny nose and were tired for a day or two then it went away, that was I believe over a year ago? I think the human immune system is where it's at on this man-manipulated virus and cure.

If this were the bubonic plague vaccine after a pandemic for that...well... I'd most certainly take that that one haha!

Labcorp test verified that I have the antibodies generated by Covid-19 recovery.

Since Covid-19 is not very lethal, getting a non-approved vaccine isn't worth the long-term risk.

a reply to: litterbaux

No, there is very little need for the vaccine if you have already had confirmed COVID-19.

The thing is, people might think they have had COVID-19, but may not have. These people who therefore think they don't need the vaccine, are still able to host and spread the virus.

So it is easier and safer to recommend vaccinating everyone, even if the vaccine is unnecessary in some.

If people already have antibodies, then their immune system will treat the vaccination as just another sign of the virus and will invalidate it and destroy the spike protein where encountered (at the injection site).

originally posted by: RussianSpy
The virus is less than 1% fatal, probably even half of that. I think my wife and I had it for a week maybe, runny nose and were tired for a day or two then it went away, that was I believe over a year ago? I think the human immune system is where it's at on this man-manipulated virus and cure.

If this were the bubonic plague vaccine after a pandemic for that...well... I'd most certainly take that that one haha!

My wife and I had quite bad cough, sore throat, runny nose, headaches and body aches, so we took ourselves off to get tested for COVID-19. We just had a cold.

Also, the case-fatality ratio of COVID-19 worldwide is 2.15%, but individual countries have higher or lower ratios.

You do t get immunity from the vaccine lol

If you did people wouldn’t be dying after the vaccine

All you get is added risk from both the vaccine & 99.997% survivable covid

originally posted by: litterbaux
Hello ATS readers and contributers,

What say you ATS? If you have the antibodies, is there a reason to get the vaccine?

I think the Vaccines create antibodies.

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: litterbaux
Hello ATS readers and contributers,

What say you ATS? If you have the antibodies, is there a reason to get the vaccine?

I think the Vaccines create antibodies.

Only antibodies for spike protein, not for the virus as a whole.

a reply to: litterbaux

The risks being unknown, still...I would not mess with my immune system. It's not worth the speck of benefit it might or might not offer someone with natural immunity.

a reply to: litterbaux

This boils down to nature vs man-made.

I prefer nature. I have no reason to trust "man."

originally posted by: litterbaux We need a yearly flu shot

what's this 'we' ? i don't need a yearly flu shot, nor have i ever.