Convince me of your faith

originally posted by: SourcePage
well the book of job explains that satan has total dominion over the earth with God's permission & causes all the horrors that occur here. The trick is to maintain your belief in God even though you are in a hell at the moment. God takes you to a better world after you leave this one. God watches to see how you will handle yourself in this evil world, & rewards you accordingly.

If there was proof of this afterlife I'd probably be on board. Also if I was a God, I'd save eons of arguments, doubts, wars and deaths and just set people straight and prove it from the get go, wouldn't you?

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: FinallyAwake

What do you want exactly?

If God got rid of evil, He would have to take control of all of us and do everything for us because we do as much to create evil as anything else.

Think about the times you were selfish and greedy, when your actions (actions you chose to take btw) inadvertantly hurt soemone else or plenty of others in some way. Understand that you would not have taken those actions, no matter how much you might have wanted at that point in time because God is preventing all evil now.

Yeah, so there you go ... you can either live your life as you please ... or you can not ever have evil in the world.

Either way, I predict you will end up hating God for it.

I don't want anything, I don't believe in God.

I just want religious people to stop saying God loves and cares for you, when there are a million kids a year dying unnecessarily. It pisses me off.

Than what should God do?

I already explained why God cannot stop human evil and many of those kids die from human evil. Look at all the kids shot in the streets of Chicago.

Do you think God ought to play puppet master? Sure. That stops a lot of evil, but it also stops you from doing what you want to.

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: SourcePage
well the book of job explains that satan has total dominion over the earth with God's permission & causes all the horrors that occur here. The trick is to maintain your belief in God even though you are in a hell at the moment. God takes you to a better world after you leave this one. God watches to see how you will handle yourself in this evil world, & rewards you accordingly.

If there was proof of this afterlife I'd probably be on board. Also if I was a God, I'd save eons of arguments, doubts, wars and deaths and just set people straight and prove it from the get go, wouldn't you?

Why?

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

If there was proof of this afterlife I'd probably be on board. Also if I was a God, I'd save eons of arguments, doubts, wars and deaths and just set people straight and prove it from the get go, wouldn't you?

Yes of course but God told me that the earth is where all souls are sent when they are young & they learn about good & evil here.

So if God was to get rid of all evil then the earth would lose all its purpose. The evil is in people & they need to see that evil to understand that it is in their own selves as well & needs to be fully controlled. They often need to learn these lessons the hard way so that they never forget. It's like when Jesus said that some people were made sick just so that He could heal them. Problems of the earth are there so that we can work at fixing them, & that lets us do good works instead of just enjoying ourselves as we would do in a paradise.

Oftentimes God incarnates me into one life after another repeatedly to show me that all lives are simply lessons for the soul. God has all lives in a library & places souls into various books to take part in the tragedies happening in those books. God watches as we go through those tragic lives & then removes our soul & places it into a different life. God is absolutely amazing & loves us 110%. These lives are for our benefit. It's like the future will be so much better due to us seeing what happens in a hell like earth. We learn what not to do & what to do etc. It's all just lessons for the soul. Every day we can do good deeds for our neighbour etc. We have to choose to be positive even when things look bad. It's the half glass of water analogy all over again.
Just keep a positive belief in God even though the devil ruins everything there is in your life. Things always get better sooner or later. God frequently takes me to the heavens & they are absolutely wonderful places. No one ever dies, they just get put into new lives.

a reply to: SourcePage

Oftentimes God incarnates me into one life after another repeatedly to show me that all lives are simply lessons for the soul. God has all lives in a library & places souls into various books to take part in the tragedies happening in those books.

Hebrews 9:27

27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

Psalm 16:11

11 Thou wilt shew me the path of life: in thy presence is fulness of joy; at thy right hand there are pleasures for evermore.

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: chr0naut
a reply to: Ghostsinthefog

1 God, the creator of the universe's actually loves and cares for you. That is why you exist.

Over l 40000 children and young people die from illness just in America each year. Imagine that across the world.
How many of those terrified children that are praying to God for the pain to stop, to pray that they will get better and go home with mummy and daddy, to just die. All day every day, not to mention natural disasters, rape, torture and murder that happens to them all day every day. EVERY DAY.

How is that caring?

God did not create such a world. It was corrupted by powerful spiritual forces who continue to persecute, entrap and kill mankind. Those evil spiritual forces are to blame for all suffering, and the people who serve only themselves, not God or others, are complicit in that blame.

Evil is not an object. It was not created by God. Evil is the consequence of supreme selfishness, with no love for God or others, except where it serves that selfishness.

But even a long life is incredibly fleeting in comparison to eternity.

From God's perspective, those oppressed innocents are lifted from fear and suffering to loving care and paradise where there is no fear or suffering. To take them to Himself, from such a life, is mercy.

Self sacrifice is the forge that creates a new creature with empathy for others. To have such a path of hope and spiritual ascension (which is promised by God to those who overcome), requires free will and consequence for evil.

a reply to: Ghostsinthefog


1. I believe in the Gods of Egypt, Norse Mythology, Greek Mythology, Roman Mythology, Christianity, Hindu, Judaism, Islam, Shinto, the Nigerian Gods and the Aztec Gods.

a reply to: chr0naut

I love the arguments that are basically "Reject God. Do it for the children!"

originally posted by: wylekat
a reply to: chr0naut

1 God, the creator of the universe's actually loves and cares for you. That is why you exist.

BWAHAHAHAHA

Oh, the things I have been through that'd convince you otherwise... If this is love and care- someone please hate my guts!

I swear that I exist just to provide cosmic entertainment at my expense.

You exist entirely for God's pleasure. The omniscience and omnipotence of God means that nothing that happens can possibly fall outside the boundaries of what He intends and that the many branches of possibility under our free will, always ultimately serve God's plans.

Doing what you were created to do, with all your built in abilities (and even what you might think are your faults and limitations), is the pinnacle of personal success and will give you your greatest happiness.

If you think your life is a disappointment, you are probably not fulfilling the purpose for which you were made. Change tack, you are an intelligent creature not a victim of the universe!

a reply to: chr0naut

But you said that god is all knowing and all powerful. Wouldn't they then be responsible for creating the evil spirits that are 'corrupting' this earthy realm? If they didn't create the evil or the spirits that partake in evil, who did? Is that entity outside of god?

If a person isn't happy with themselves or content with themselves, are they truly able to help others?

If god is the creator of all, everything and eternity, is it wrong to take pleasure in their creation?

Without evil, is there good?

originally posted by: SourcePage

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

If there was proof of this afterlife I'd probably be on board. Also if I was a God, I'd save eons of arguments, doubts, wars and deaths and just set people straight and prove it from the get go, wouldn't you?

Yes of course but God told me that the earth is where all souls are sent when they are young & they learn about good & evil here.

So if God was to get rid of all evil then the earth would lose all its purpose. The evil is in people & they need to see that evil to understand that it is in their own selves as well & needs to be fully controlled. They often need to learn these lessons the hard way so that they never forget. It's like when Jesus said that some people were made sick just so that He could heal them. Problems of the earth are there so that we can work at fixing them, & that lets us do good works instead of just enjoying ourselves as we would do in a paradise.

Oftentimes God incarnates me into one life after another repeatedly to show me that all lives are simply lessons for the soul. God has all lives in a library & places souls into various books to take part in the tragedies happening in those books. God watches as we go through those tragic lives & then removes our soul & places it into a different life. God is absolutely amazing & loves us 110%. These lives are for our benefit. It's like the future will be so much better due to us seeing what happens in a hell like earth. We learn what not to do & what to do etc. It's all just lessons for the soul. Every day we can do good deeds for our neighbour etc. We have to choose to be positive even when things look bad. It's the half glass of water analogy all over again.
Just keep a positive belief in God even though the devil ruins everything there is in your life. Things always get better sooner or later. God frequently takes me to the heavens & they are absolutely wonderful places. No one ever dies, they just get put into new lives.

Thank you for your explanation 👍🏻

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: FinallyAwake

What do you want exactly?

If God got rid of evil, He would have to take control of all of us and do everything for us because we do as much to create evil as anything else.

Think about the times you were selfish and greedy, when your actions (actions you chose to take btw) inadvertantly hurt soemone else or plenty of others in some way. Understand that you would not have taken those actions, no matter how much you might have wanted at that point in time because God is preventing all evil now.

Yeah, so there you go ... you can either live your life as you please ... or you can not ever have evil in the world.

Either way, I predict you will end up hating God for it.

I don't want anything, I don't believe in God.

I just want religious people to stop saying God loves and cares for you, when there are a million kids a year dying unnecessarily. It pisses me off.

Than what should God do?

I already explained why God cannot stop human evil and many of those kids die from human evil. Look at all the kids shot in the streets of Chicago.

Do you think God ought to play puppet master? Sure. That stops a lot of evil, but it also stops you from doing what you want to.

I don't want God to do anything because I am a non believer. But thank you far sharing your thoughts with me. 👍🏻

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: chr0naut
a reply to: Ghostsinthefog

1 God, the creator of the universe's actually loves and cares for you. That is why you exist.

Over l 40000 children and young people die from illness just in America each year. Imagine that across the world.
How many of those terrified children that are praying to God for the pain to stop, to pray that they will get better and go home with mummy and daddy, to just die. All day every day, not to mention natural disasters, rape, torture and murder that happens to them all day every day. EVERY DAY.

How is that caring?

God did not create such a world. It was corrupted by powerful spiritual forces who continue to persecute, entrap and kill mankind. Those evil spiritual forces are to blame for all suffering, and the people who serve only themselves, not God or others, are complicit in that blame.

Evil is not an object. It was not created by God. Evil is the consequence of supreme selfishness, with no love for God or others, except where it serves that selfishness.

But even a long life is incredibly fleeting in comparison to eternity.

From God's perspective, those oppressed innocents are lifted from fear and suffering to loving care and paradise where there is no fear or suffering. To take them to Himself, from such a life, is mercy.

Self sacrifice is the forge that creates a new creature with empathy for others. To have such a path of hope and spiritual ascension (which is promised by God to those who overcome), requires free will and consequence for evil.

Thank you for the explanation. 👍🏻

a reply to: ClovenSky

But you said that god is all knowing and all powerful. Wouldn't they then be responsible for creating the evil spirits that are 'corrupting' this earthy realm? If they didn't create the evil or the spirits that partake in evil, who did? Is that entity outside of god?

God did create Satan, as he used to be an angel of God before he decided to rebel and was cast out of heaven because of his own free will. The angels all have free will just like we do. Unfortunately, the Bible tells us that a third of God's angels will/did choose to follow Satan and were cast to earth along with him.

originally posted by: ClovenSky
a reply to: chr0naut

But you said that god is all knowing and all powerful. Wouldn't they then be responsible for creating the evil spirits that are 'corrupting' this earthy realm? If they didn't create the evil or the spirits that partake in evil, who did? Is that entity outside of god?

If a person isn't happy with themselves or content with themselves, are they truly able to help others?

If god is the creator of all, everything and eternity, is it wrong to take pleasure in their creation?

Without evil, is there good?

God is the single source for everything. That sort of make God the supreme concept and all things are defined in Him, but He is not fully defined by anything. He is outside the data set that we use for definition.

This makes God the ultimate definer of what is good and what is evil. Jesus (re)stated that "no-one is good but God". This suggests that God is only good which means 'not good' definitions (such as evil) are not applicable to God. In a rational sense, then, God is not evil and one might also define evil as 'against or opposed to God'.

The thing is that God, if he wanted, could have created a universe consisting of an infinity of virtual up quarks. God obviously didn't, and it is plain that humans seem to dominate wherever they go. So the assumption would be that because of the apparent anthropocentric leanings of the structure of this part of the universe and out predominance here, that we have some sort of primacy in His plans.

Can 'good' exist without 'evil'? The question really depends upon objectifying 'good' and 'evil' as if they were actual objects rather than a direction of willfulness.

Can people choose to do things that are 'good' without them having to do things which are 'evil'? Absolutely. If someone never does anything 'evil', then they are only 'good'.

So good and evil are not dependent upon each other, but they both require 'intelligent actors' to choose the actions.

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: FinallyAwake

What do you want exactly?

If God got rid of evil, He would have to take control of all of us and do everything for us because we do as much to create evil as anything else.

Think about the times you were selfish and greedy, when your actions (actions you chose to take btw) inadvertantly hurt soemone else or plenty of others in some way. Understand that you would not have taken those actions, no matter how much you might have wanted at that point in time because God is preventing all evil now.

Yeah, so there you go ... you can either live your life as you please ... or you can not ever have evil in the world.

Either way, I predict you will end up hating God for it.

I don't want anything, I don't believe in God.

I just want religious people to stop saying God loves and cares for you, when there are a million kids a year dying unnecessarily. It pisses me off.

Than what should God do?

I already explained why God cannot stop human evil and many of those kids die from human evil. Look at all the kids shot in the streets of Chicago.

Do you think God ought to play puppet master? Sure. That stops a lot of evil, but it also stops you from doing what you want to.

I don't want God to do anything because I am a non believer. But thank you far sharing your thoughts with me. 👍🏻

Pretty weird then to get angry over something you claim you don't believe in.

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: FinallyAwake

What do you want exactly?

If God got rid of evil, He would have to take control of all of us and do everything for us because we do as much to create evil as anything else.

Think about the times you were selfish and greedy, when your actions (actions you chose to take btw) inadvertantly hurt soemone else or plenty of others in some way. Understand that you would not have taken those actions, no matter how much you might have wanted at that point in time because God is preventing all evil now.

Yeah, so there you go ... you can either live your life as you please ... or you can not ever have evil in the world.

Either way, I predict you will end up hating God for it.

I don't want anything, I don't believe in God.

I just want religious people to stop saying God loves and cares for you, when there are a million kids a year dying unnecessarily. It pisses me off.

Than what should God do?

I already explained why God cannot stop human evil and many of those kids die from human evil. Look at all the kids shot in the streets of Chicago.

Do you think God ought to play puppet master? Sure. That stops a lot of evil, but it also stops you from doing what you want to.

I don't want God to do anything because I am a non believer. But thank you far sharing your thoughts with me. 👍🏻

Pretty weird then to get angry over something you claim you don't believe in.

It's certain types of religious people that make me angry. Not something I don't believe in, now that would be weird.

originally posted by: Ghostsinthefog
Regardless of your religion. Try to Convince me, or why you believe your god/religion is the right one. Make 5 points in bullet form.

I don't know if what I believe is the "right one". I just believe. As for your 5 bullet points:

- None of your business
- None of your business
- None of your business
- None of your business
- and finally... None of your business

I wasn't created to convince you. I was created for another purpose.

a reply to: Ghostsinthefog

Yeah here is the thing. Speaking as a Pagan (a celtic Reconstructionist to be exact). I know my faith is the right one for ME. I don't give a rats fat rear if it is the right one for anyone else. As a Polytheist. There are many paths, their are many Gods, they are not the same, nor are they going to the same place. Find the right one for you, even if that is no deity, and keep out of my business, or it will be messy.

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: FinallyAwake

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: FinallyAwake

What do you want exactly?

If God got rid of evil, He would have to take control of all of us and do everything for us because we do as much to create evil as anything else.

Think about the times you were selfish and greedy, when your actions (actions you chose to take btw) inadvertantly hurt soemone else or plenty of others in some way. Understand that you would not have taken those actions, no matter how much you might have wanted at that point in time because God is preventing all evil now.

Yeah, so there you go ... you can either live your life as you please ... or you can not ever have evil in the world.

Either way, I predict you will end up hating God for it.

I don't want anything, I don't believe in God.

I just want religious people to stop saying God loves and cares for you, when there are a million kids a year dying unnecessarily. It pisses me off.

Than what should God do?

I already explained why God cannot stop human evil and many of those kids die from human evil. Look at all the kids shot in the streets of Chicago.

Do you think God ought to play puppet master? Sure. That stops a lot of evil, but it also stops you from doing what you want to.

I don't want God to do anything because I am a non believer. But thank you far sharing your thoughts with me. 👍🏻

Pretty weird then to get angry over something you claim you don't believe in.

It's certain types of religious people that make me angry. Not something I don't believe in, now that would be weird.

Ah, I see. So you're made that other people believe differently than you do. Gotcha. That's a wonderful way to go through life.