CIA Undermines North Korea Summit By Leaking Report To Media Asset

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Kharron

No the cia is not allowed to undermine the preisdents foriegn policy because they disagree with it.

Now perhaps if the president was actively sabotaging the country, then yes.

But that is no where near what is happening here.

You notice how I put, let's assume and IF, throughout my post -- that's because we just don't know. I am saying this just as a recommendation... but I think it would be prudent to do the same until we have more information - because we do not know what is happening here.

In fact we have no frickin' clue about the first thing that is happening here -- we're all just guessing, right?

I want to know more, but speculating isn't going to do any good apart from spread disinfo and get people mad.

a reply to: Kharron

I understand you were speaking hypothetically.

I was just answering that it would be wrong for the cia to do this 99.999999% of the time.

So although it fune to look at hypothetical situations, this is not one of them.

a reply to: Kharron

Besides, I did not say are they allowed to undermine the WH -- I said are they still obligated to protect lives, including the President's life, if he decides to ignore intel and puts lives in danger?

Well i do not think their bs leaks hold as much influence as they hoped.

These people are phonetically confused.

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Kharron

I understand you were speaking hypothetically.

I was just answering that it would be wrong for the cia to do this 99.999999% of the time.

So although it fune to look at hypothetical situations, this is not one of them.

Ok, that makes more sense, thanks. I still don't think this will turn out to be just undermining, I think as we find out more it will be a case of ignoring intel, and CIA breaking protocol in order to warn the delegates.

Now, the President can still decide to go ahead with the summit, although if what intel shows is true, I would warn against it until NK shows their true purpose.

There is no point negotiating with someone who already has a plan to lie to you, right?

I don't trust a lot of what CIA says, but as Americans, we have to trust NK less, don't we? But we'll see how it turns out, if we ever find out what really happened -- the only safe thing to say right now, with 100% certainty, is that all of us here are speculating and assuming things without having any information.

Having said all that, it's important to remind people not to trust anything they hear -- the White House or the CIA.

We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false.

-William J. Casey, CIA Director 1981-1987

Is this a joke or am i missing something.

Who cares if the cia leaked something that every single person involved has wondered all along.

This is just pathetic.

What is the worst that could happen?

I do not think people are being rational in their thoughts.

originally posted by: howtonhawky

What is the worst that could happen?

The absolute worst thing that can happen is the President ignores the intel, decides to go, he and the delegates get assassinated and we get the long anticipated WW3.

I see that as the worst scenario.

What do you think is the worst thing that can happen?


P.S. And remember, the other side of the negotiating table is a person who assassinated his own brother and his uncle.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: peter vlar

Unfortunately we're not the only country who has people willing to undermine peace efforts.

As it stands North Korea is a necessary evil.

If peace breaks out who assists North Korea? Who pays the bills? Should the borders open or dissolve, who takes the refugees who literally have no concept of a world outside of the one that has been constructed in their minds?

Those are all questions that scare the living # out of South Korea, Japan, and China.

Ummm...perhaps better questions might be...who gets to modernize North Korea...Who gets to invest in all of the many things the west takes for granted...yet the North Korean citizenry lacks...

Think big picture...a smart phone in every hand...two cars in every garage...housing and land ownership for all...

Once that country opens up...everything and I mean everything will flood that country...instead of fleeing...I think the population will be happily at work rebuilding their country...


JMO...





YouSir

a reply to: Grambler

I don't doubt that NK is probably not really all that interested in denuclearizing. After all, they've only been under sanctions forever while their nuclear program persisted. It seems to me that from their perspective, they're probably seeing that they're getting a seat at the big boy table as a result of their efforts — why would they give up their leverage now?

So in that regard, what the CIA assessment apparently says isn't exactly a profound new insight (it echoes what a lot of FP experts have been saying) but the timing and the fact that it's coming from the CIA is disturbing.

Is it an attempt to undermine negotiations? Maybe. If that's the intent, it's a very serious problem. Regardless of how anyone feels about Trump or whether or not he's bull#ting about reasonable expectations, he's the President and like any before him, he and his designated representatives are singularly empowered to officially negotiate deals. The CIA's only role in this instance is to provide information and analysis to the President and his team. Just as we should be concerned with the ways in which Trump transgresses against norms/protocol/law/etc and what it means for the future of the office of President, we should be just as concerned about the CIA running amok. The CIA has no authority to have its own agenda and if it does, it's a danger to our republic.

On the other hand, I wouldn't discount the possibility that it's something else entirely. Let's not forget that the guy leading the negotiations just transitioned to Secretary of State from being Director of the CIA. It could be a directed leak intended to lower expectations. It could be a seed planted in the event that the negotiations go bust. It could also be a signal to the NK that we suspect they're not acting in good faith.

a reply to: theantediluvian

Good post

Yeah I also bet, although I can’t think of it off the top of my head, that the cia has done this to other presidents

It would have been wrong then as well

a reply to: theantediluvian

Agreed, at this point it can be any of a dozen different scenarios. It is very important not to speculate and fight with each other until we know more.

I say we wait, and I think the President should proceed with caution, perhaps shake up the proposed plans for the summit -- change of venue, something, if he keeps the summit as planned.

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: theantediluvian

Good post

Yeah I also bet, although I can’t think of it off the top of my head, that the cia has done this to other presidents

It would have been wrong then as well

The CIA has been doing this for decades, leaking information under every single President, and especially leaking it to the journalists that work with them.

Operation Mockingbird

We know Mockingbird started in the 50s, no reason to think it ever stopped.

originally posted by: RadioRobert
a reply to: nwtrucker

I've held the suspicion that SK didn't want unification/reconciliation as it would have been a financial setback of near biblical proportions. 

I think you (and everyone else in the West) does not understand how badly SK wants reunification.

That is a great reason (and there are many more) why you would not want a NK collapse/reunification if you are China and share a border, though.

If it happens it will probably be through a slow, federalized process. With lots of international aid. If it comes to a collapse, you're juwt as likely to see another war break out than peaceful assimilation.

I believe that at the grass-roots level in SK. At least, media-wise, I've seen NK use reunification rhetoric far more than SK.

I don't have the communication lines you do. I still suspect, like so many vested interests around the world, status quo is the least 'fearful' option. Ditto that in SK's elite...at least until recently, that is.

The 'Trump Effect' again.....

a reply to: Kharron

Yeah, I was just going to say the same thing; the cia has been out of control for a very long time. Really since the JFK days and even before that. It's an institution made up of elites from Ivy league schools with no oversight and plenty of ill-gotten money to go play out their childhood foreign policy experiments and fantasies...except that they play with real people's lives.

They're out of control and they need to be exposed for what they are, a bunch of kids playing with big boy toys. If the cia and nsa couldn't see 9-11 coming then there is no reason for them to exist any longer.

This mantra of "I could tell ya, but then I gots to kill ya" is really tired and old.

originally posted by: Kharron

originally posted by: howtonhawky

What is the worst that could happen?

The absolute worst thing that can happen is the President ignores the intel, decides to go, he and the delegates get assassinated and we get the long anticipated WW3.

I see that as the worst scenario.

What do you think is the worst thing that can happen?


P.S. And remember, the other side of the negotiating table is a person who assassinated his own brother and his uncle.

LOL
All in Singapore!

The worst thing imo is that we could let some phonetical masterminds try to run our lives unchecked.

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
a reply to: Kharron

Yeah, I was just going to say the same thing; the cia has been out of control for a very long time. Really since the JFK days and even before that. It's an institution made up of elites from Ivy league schools with no oversight and plenty of ill-gotten money to go play out their childhood foreign policy experiments and fantasies...except that they play with real people's lives.

They're out of control and they need to be exposed for what they are, a bunch of kids playing with big boy toys. If the cia and nsa couldn't see 9-11 coming then there is no reason for them to exist any longer.

This mantra of "I could tell ya, but then I gots to kill ya" is really tired and old.

I think many of our agencies need a complete overhaul, term limits need to be imposed on elected reps and so on, but I don't want to derail this thread -- this stuff is a big deal.

We also need to be honest with ourselves when we say things like that... if CIA is the deep state and they act on their own, then what do we make of the President's guy Chris Wray being in charge of the CIA? Is he deep state? If he is ineffective against the deep state, is he the right pick for the job? If he is not deep state then this leak is an act of an individual, and not the CIA as a whole? Is that individual deep state? Is that individual a patriot, working against the deep state?

I agree the CIA is bad as a whole and a part of the deep state, but then again I also think the White House is, and anyone who is allowed to hold a position of power.

Therefore, if I'm going to assume, the safest thing to assume is that they are ALL deep state and take everything anyone says with a grain of salt, until I can come across verifiable information.

It is election tampering 24/7/365. Anything to stop Trump from accomplishing anything so that it helps the opposition Party.

a reply to: Kharron

I think many of our agencies need a complete overhaul, term limits need to be imposed on elected reps and so on, ...

I'm 100% with you on that!!!

AND, in many cases not just overhauled, but ELIMINATED altogether!

originally posted by: nwtrucker


I now believe Japan, SK and China support Trump in varying degrees in his actions with NK. Just speculation on my part, though.

Big deal....those are just small regional players. The Deep State doesn't like peace and nor the Progressives.

Imagine that, Peace and Denuclearization aren't Progressive ideals. My how times have changed.