Assassination attempt on former Russian spy in the UK , The Cold War Returns

The Government knows which nerve agent was used, we need to start clamping down on any Russians with any links to Mad Vlad putrid Putin who have dealings in the UK, seize their accounts and holdings and expel diplomats.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

VX or sarin doesn't scream Russian to me. They're a bit more creative.

Well they are known to just strait up shoot reporters they don't like in the head then again they are also known to use some exotic toxins, to me using a vaporised nerve agent is pretty darn creative.

Maybe an attempt to put a wedge in between UK and Russian relations.

They are already at their lowest point.

I think the RAF are escorting Russian planes on a weekly basis that stray too close to our airspace, there have been diplomatic spats, we have had our own issues with Russians apparently attempting to interfere in our democratic processes not to mention existing sanction.

So it would be a rather pointless motivation in my mind.

Earlier articles point out there would be no reason for Russians to do this, he'd already gone to jail and they released him eight years ago. He isn't like past hits.

Well there could be several reason, Russians could have got information he was going to divulge something publicly that could be damaging to the Russian government, it could be that it was done just for flat out revenge, it could be that it was done for internal reasons with in the Russian government, such as to demonstrate strength. Actually there could be any number of motivations for them wanting to do this, might be to warn off other would be defectors, its sends a message "even after years pass, no matter where you are, we can still get you". The list really does go on.

Also yes he is like past hits.

Just look at what happened to Gerogi Markov.

a reply to: Kurokage

I think it’s time to kick all their diplomats out, just heard one of the original policemen on the scene of this incident has taken a turn for the worse and is fighting for his life in hospital

perhaps MI6 needs it’s leash removed

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

I was just spit balling. But I do understand how it looks given the history of such things.

Hopefully the police officer who found then pulls through with a full recovery. God knows that could complicate things.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

Hopefully the police officer who found then pulls through with a full recovery. God knows that could complicate things.

Absolutely.

Think about just how bad it would be if the Russian state was proven to have been behind an assassination attempt on British soil that resulted in the death of a serving police officer.

I don't think it would be quite war, but I do think it would cause a diplomatic rift that would last years.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

I don't think it would be quite war, but I do think it would cause a diplomatic rift that would last years.

Not conventional war by historical means, but I'm sure it would add to the domino effect of proxy tit for tats... Make no mistake, more lives would be taken.

originally posted by: DJW001

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: CriticalStinker

Earlier articles point out there would be no reason for Russians to do this, he'd already gone to jail and they released him eight years ago. He isn't like past hits.

Putin wanted to send a message, so the MGB found a convenient soft target.

The guy was a traitor to his country, I imagine if I was in a similar position I'd be looking over my shoulder for the rest of my life in case the UK wanted me done in.
Putin is prime suspect, he said as much about traitors only days ago. Could easily be a warning to any potentially new spies thinking about it.

I'm thinking the message was directed to this side of the pond.

Message to the world I reckon, just an easy target in rural Wiltshire with it's under resourced and small constabulary.
Betray the motherland and you need to watch your back for the rest of your life.

If someone else mentioned this, I missed it.

Could this be a warning to someone?

The Russians have denied any involvement and I believe them.

"It was a nerve agent" suggests it must be a powerful nation - like Russia.

But why the Hell if they want to deny any involvement would they choose a nerve agent, over just having him "commit suicide" - like all of the alleged murders dressed up to look like suicides (in the UK) that the US believe were really "Russian assassinations".

I don't generally go in for false flag rubbish and wild conspiracies, but we're being played for fools here.

If anyone did it I'd bet it's the EU.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
a reply to: alldaylong


Yes, I am aware of him and the Bruges group and I did read it.

Did Mr Oulds carry out what is this speculated assassination, then? Was it the ghost of Thatcher?

Thank you for confirming that, as I suspected, you have no sense of humour.

Got anything of value to add to what this thread is about?

It's worth reading your posts just for the amusement value.

a reply to: Power_Semi

The Russians have denied any involvement and I believe them.

I am sorry but I must say this to me is a example of wilful blindness and cognitive dissonance.

A Russian double agent is the target of a assassination attempt in England, we know that the Russians have done this previously and so far they are the lead suspects. I am not saying that its 100% confirmed this was Russia but they are most definitely suspect number one and to say you believe them because they said so is highly nieve in my opinion. Of course they are going to deny it, they continue to deny any involvement in the Litvenenko case despite it being pretty obvious to every man and his dog that they were behind it.

"It was a nerve agent" suggests it must be a powerful nation - like Russia.

Not really, its not just because its a nerve agent its much more than that, its the fact that they guy had spied on the Russians, the Russians have previous for this and diplomatic relations between the uk and Russia.

But why the Hell if they want to deny any involvement would they choose a nerve agent, over just having him "commit suicide"

That is a good question.

I cannot answer it all I can say is that previously Russians have not been subtle about how they go about assassinations.

If anyone did it I'd bet it's the EU.

Based on what?

A EU state might be behind it (although I can't see why they would) but as far as I am aware the EU as a governing body does not have any motivation for this nor am I confident that they have the capability to do this. Actually to argue it was the EU is to demonstrate a lack of understanding as to how the EU operates and what it is.

a reply to: Power_Semi

The Russians have denied any involvement and I believe them.

They denied any involvement in the litvinenko murder too but the evidence eventually led back to Russia , there's a lot more to learn about this story and it will probably be a slow boiler but suspicion does have to be placed on Russia because it's what they've done for years.
If there's a pyromaniac in your neighborhood you look to them if a string of fires have been set , No ?

If anyone did it I'd bet it's the EU

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Well, if it is Russia... And somehow it gets proven... Someone needs to put Putin in check.

He's gotten way to brazen over the years, my guess is because of a lack of ramifications.

Sanctions aren't going to bother a billionaire to much.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Well, if it is Russia... And somehow it gets proven... Someone needs to put Putin in check.

He's gotten way to brazen over the years, my guess is because of a lack of ramifications.

Sanctions aren't going to bother a billionaire to much.

I find Putin and modern Russia very interesting.

I have come to conclude that Putin in now the most powerful man in the world and could possibly be one of the most powerful people in history. He is also possibly the richest person in the world however he likes to play down his actual wealth.

As a result I think that the time to put him in check has passed.

Nothing meaningful will actually happen if those affected by this die, it will just be all talk.

Putin is simply just too powerful, the Russian state has the ability to assassinate anyone without ramifications, they have been proven to have the ability to influence the democratic processes of foreign states, they have went to war with their neighbours with out any consequences and at the head of all of this is Vlad. He is like the ultimate bond villain come to life.

His power will only grow and it will only come to a end with his death.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Unfortunately the US didn't help by disregarding the international community and showing it carried no weight.

With the international community showing sanctions are the "ultimate punishment", it didn't offer to much of a deterrent.

Combine that with what I have to admit is his uncanny foresight to enact his agenda.... You may be right, it may be to late.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

What makes you think Putin is the most powerful and or most wealthy man in the world?

It’s not only the Russian state that carries out assassinations and gets away with it. This could be retaliation for something mi6 has done that we otherwise don’t know about or as has already been speculated to send a message. Russia never forgets. That exact theme was brought up in the TV series McMafia. For those Not familiar with it I highly recommend watching it or getting the book.

As far as Russia being proven to influence elections, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if they tried, but having any real influence how so? I’ve heard it claimed they are responsible for both Trump becoming president and Britain leaving the EU. What did they do MKultra a large percentage of both populations somehow?

Unless they messed with the voting counts in some way I don’t see how its possible. Or is their propaganda so much more advanced than ours?

a reply to: surfer_soul

What makes you think Putin is the most powerful and or most wealthy man in the world?

I have done quite a bit of reading about him recently.

if you just google Putin wealth you get hit with loads of different sources that all talk about his hidden wealth, I believe that as the now almost permanent president of Russia he holds more power than any other world leader and that the Russian state is building power and alliances. in my option therefore he is probably the most powerful and most wealthy man in the world. Trump for example is weak in comparison to Putin just due to the nature of American democracy, at the very most he will have another 6 years (realistically 2) and he is very much limited in what he can do thanks to the check of balances of power in American government. Putin has no such problems.

It’s not only the Russian state that carries out assassinations and gets away with it.

Agreed.

This could be retaliation for something mi6 has done that we otherwise don’t know about or as has already been speculated to send a message

yeah COULD be.

That is just pure speculation just like me saying it COULD also have been part of a plot by et to destabilise planet earth.

As far as Russia being proven to influence elections

I am not just talking about America in that claim.

.........

when you want to talk about the assassination attempt however feel free to let me know and we can discuss.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

I would agree that Putin is likely the most powerful president or official figure in the world, but I would suggest it is the players behind the scenes who hold the real power in world affairs.

There is no record of his true wealth and his official wealth doesn’t make him the richest so that’s speculation on your part. Besides not everyone is motivated by obscene wealth and I suspect Putin is such a person. He seems motivated by power though definitely.

You brought up the matter of Russia interfering in elections I was just addressing this claim, and besides propaganda I don’t see how that can be done. I am discussing the assassination but looking at the bigger picture just as you and others have done.

It is my opinion that the powers in the world don’t so much represent their sovereign nations anymore but their own interests. Think globalisation, think international crime syndicates and secret society’s. Big multinational corporate business’s all vying to be top dog. Individual nations are just for us plebs.

I don’t think this assassination was necessarily carried out by a nation state as such, but by powers international in their scope.

a reply to: surfer_soul

ok whatever....

anything to comment on the issue of the attempted assignation because that is why I came to this thread, to discuss that not really interested in a prolonged discussion on our differing views on Russian power.

originally posted by: surfer_soul
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin


I don’t think this assassination was necessarily carried out by a nation state as such, but by powers international in their scope.