New Study - Transgender myth exposed - a mental disorder.

a reply to: sapien82

So you were born a male and you are certain that you are male. What if you were to wake up tomorrow in a completely different body - a totally female body, but your mind and self perception as a male hasn't changed at all.

Would you be okay with the change in your body? Would you just shrug and say "oh well, I have a woman's body so I just have to accept it"? Or would you be like "WTF! This is NOT me!", and would you want to have your body go back to what you know is your true body?

This is not exactly the same situation with gender dysphoric people, as they have felt this "WTF!" feeling ever since they can remember. But it can give you an idea of how upsetting it is to them every day. Not something they can just shrug off.

a reply to: Hecate666

Most trans people do NOT regret their choice after transitioning. The only thing they regret is that they didn't start sooner. And they regret that their family and society won't accept them, to the point that they are ostracized, marginalized and hated.

What are "we" supposed to do? Treat them the same as you would treat everyone else. That's it.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: Hecate666

Most trans people do NOT regret their choice after transitioning. The only thing they regret is that they didn't start sooner. And they regret that their family and society won't accept them, to the point that they are ostracized, marginalized and hated.

What are "we" supposed to do? Treat them the same as you would treat everyone else. That's it.

As nice as that would be if possible, people have a few different levels to them. There is how they act, and how they feel. How you act you can control and what you describe is possible. But if how you feel is uncomfortable...you can't change that and others can't blame you for that. It is human nature to feel uncomfortable with weird, strange, abnormal people and things. Maybe you simply get the creeps as some do with snakes or spiders. It isn't their fault...it is in their nature or genes.

That will never change because it is inbred. It is how we are put together. So if a trans person makes the decision to wear a disguise aided by surgery, they need to expect some level of this. As unfair as you feel it is for people to not like trans people, trans people also have to accept there are feelings the rest of us have little or no control over.

a reply to: kaylaluv

I honestly couldnt say how I'd feel or how my mind state would be if that happened but id try my hardest to deal with and accept it probably over a great deal of time.

Some things cant be fixed and are simply there to make us learn a difficult lesson
people have to go through suffering in order to grow and learn

when Im talking about acceptance im not saying "oh well , lets make the best of it" im talking about looking within yourself over many periods of self reflection to realise that you are not your body , you are the consciousness and awareness behind it and therefore you should be able to accept any body you land in but , it seems that it's only about what others think of you and how you are perceived by society and acceptance of that , but no one will accept you unless you accept yourself first
why does someone feel the need to have a specific set of genitalia to fit in ?
acceptance from everyone is what they are looking for , they just wanted to be treated the same as everyone else

Im pretty sure I am male as I was born with male genitalia and i was raised by my parents as a male
so I walk talk and act like a male .

ive no reason to doubt I am male.

But thats just the body i was given , it doesnt define me as a human being
what defines me is my actions and how I treat others.

a reply to: kaylaluv

no matter how you slice it...

sodomites are doomed...

not so much in society...

but definitely in the hereafter...

most people under the age of sixty don't seemed to have a problem with this delusional reality sexual deviants have created...

but sooner or latter we all face our own mortality...

recompense, an eternity of regret...

if mankind thinks they will get away with ignoring God your creator's wishes...

there will be HELL to pay...

literally!

yep and Amen.

a reply to: kaylaluv

Oh my one would hope but with money being a prime deciding factor with many doctors people are getting procedures when they should be in mental care. Unfortunately even youngsters whose parents can afford those procedures are falling victim. Just go to Youtube and search "man regrets sex assignments" . The medical industry is failing miserably the people they took oaths to help all for the sake of money.

I guess honestly, most of us should say;

Not my problem.

a reply to: Chai_An

Every trans person has to go through tons of therapy before being considered for sex reassignment surgery.

Here is a you tube video for you:



Regrets? Sure doesn't look like it.

a reply to: kaylaluv

Just reading through this post, and applying stars where appropriate. I wanted to thank kaylaluv, truebrit and a few others for informative and judicial reasoning, educating those with closed, uneducated, misinformed, and judgmental opinions. Acceptance and destigmitisation can heal all mariginalised communties.

This thread should be a standard ATS keeps too, informed polite debate, with a few funny piss takes hear or there (not eluding to previous toileting refrences).

Would also like to commend Astrocyte's, well writen/researched contribution to the debate.

Love, peace, and Amen. Awhatever you want to be, acceptance is key. Intoralence creates hatred and division.

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

well people need to suffer to develop

it's often a problem when a person wishes to help others and shows them compassion but has to stand aside and let them suffer because they wont learn without suffering.

Are we to sit idly by and watch others suffer because it was meant to happen

That which does not kill you makes you stronger. sure.

But that which does kill you just plain kills you.

I dont think there is anything to be gained by suffering just to suffer. for a transgender were talking about a lifelong discomfort thaat is (at least partially) correctible by surgery.

But you want them to forgo that just because it disagrees with your own sense of aesthetic propriety? (Or the sense of propriety that is perceived by an invisible man in the sky?)

originally posted by: bloodymarvelous

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

well people need to suffer to develop

it's often a problem when a person wishes to help others and shows them compassion but has to stand aside and let them suffer because they wont learn without suffering.

Are we to sit idly by and watch others suffer because it was meant to happen

That which does not kill you makes you stronger. sure.

But that which does kill you just plain kills you.

I dont think there is anything to be gained by suffering just to suffer. for a transgender were talking about a lifelong discomfort thaat is (at least partially) correctible by surgery.

But you want them to forgo that just because it disagrees with your own sense of aesthetic propriety? (Or the sense of propriety that is perceived by an invisible man in the sky?)

Well said. I've never heard somebody tell a person with a cleft palate that it'll build character or some other nonsense. No, we sew that # up and tell them to grow a mustache like Cheech Marin did.

originally posted by: GTBighair
a reply to: kaylaluv

no matter how you slice it...

sodomites are doomed...

not so much in society...

but definitely in the hereafter...

most people under the age of sixty don't seemed to have a problem with this delusional reality sexual deviants have created...

but sooner or latter we all face our own mortality...

recompense, an eternity of regret...

if mankind thinks they will get away with ignoring God your creator's wishes...

there will be HELL to pay...

literally!

yep and Amen.

Jimmy Baker called and wants his bs monologue back.

Good lord, grow up and realize that gender dysphoria has been around longer than the first book written about your sky daddy.

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

I dont really want them to do anything, well accept be happy , but it seems this is far more complex than one variable
and it seems there isnt really any easy solution .

I dont think suffering for the sake of suffering has any real value at all

I dont think it has anything to do with god as I dont believe in deities
so I dont believe they are being punished.

Are people being born in the wrong body ? are they being reincarnated into the wrong body ? are they suffering a mental condition , a genetic condition , something environmental ?

If anything it has just made me curious to find out what is going on so ill go and look at studies as to the origins

thanks

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: DeathSlayer

Do you understand that a psychologist has absolutely no business making a statement in a professional capacity about biology, don't you?

I mean, psychiatrists and psychologists practice soft science. They are simply not qualified to make such a judgement about biological matters, because most individuals in that field lack knowledge of biology, except as is specifically regards their work. You also understand, I assume, that where matters of identification of sexual or gender issues are concerned, a biologist, a geneticist, would be far better placed than any soft science, roll neck sweater type ever is, to comment from an informed position?

Uh yeah...you're completely talking out of your rear. You do realize that before gender reassignment surgery the patient is REQUIRED to undergo psychiatric evaluation first right? In some cases multiple times. This is to their benefit to ensure they are lucidly aware of the permanency of the operation and the psychological conditions that will accompany the choice.

So while you may think you are posing a valid argument you are in fact arguing against the benefit of the transgender patient that a psychiatrist has no place in this process. They actually have the most important role in gender reassignment surgery aside from the actual surgeon.

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

I dont really want them to do anything, well accept be happy , but it seems this is far more complex than one variable
and it seems there isnt really any easy solution .

I dont think suffering for the sake of suffering has any real value at all

The problem is that there is no perfect solution. Some people have a really hard time with that.


Just like with breast cancer, cutting off a woman's breasts is certainly not a perfect solution. If we would could, it would be better both to save her breasts AND cure the cancer. We just can't, so we choose to save her life at the cost of her breasts.

Gender reassignment surgery is also not a perfect solution. If a better one existed, it would be preferable. But people need to be able get on with their lives, and sometimes a distraction like gender identity discomfort gets in the way of that. If mutilating their genitals allows them to live an otherwise productive life, then when all is said and done I think it is a small price to pay.

But they are paying a price. I mean: a man who becomes a woman, does so knowing they won't be a very attractive woman. Any men they meet in the future who find out will probably not want to be with them. It's a very lonely future.

I dont think it has anything to do with god as I dont believe in deities
so I dont believe they are being punished.

Are people being born in the wrong body ? are they being reincarnated into the wrong body ? are they suffering a mental condition , a genetic condition , something environmental ?

If anything it has just made me curious to find out what is going on so ill go and look at studies as to the origins

thanks

Your body actually has no gender until your hormones kick in. Male fetuses have female bodies until testosterone gets introduced into their system.

In very rare cases, a person's body might be immune to testosterone and a person with XY chromosome (who should be male) can develope in a way where their body is completely female.

en.wikipedia.org...

I don't think there is a consensus in science on the question of whether something like that can happen to your brain but not your body. "Brain stuff" is still really mysterious in biology. It is hard to conduct experiments without doing something unethical, so not much real experimental hard science does (or can be) done.

a reply to: DeathSlayer

I saw that study! Common sense, and proof that it's far more than just a chromosome that makes us male or female!! Excellent work, for both these studies. Time to bring common sense back to the table.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: DeathSlayer

Do you understand that a psychologist has absolutely no business making a statement in a professional capacity about biology, don't you?

I mean, psychiatrists and psychologists practice soft science. They are simply not qualified to make such a judgement about biological matters, ...*snip*

I guess you forgot that a psychiatrist is also a medical doctor.....

Second line.

originally posted by: SaturnFX

originally posted by: DeathSlayer
a reply to: SaturnFX

I have used two different sources....

You sound like a Democrat..... running your mouth hoping no one catches your agenda.

Better to sound like a democrat than a fanatical religious I guess

I am not saying your rediculous sources you used, I am discussing how you are using non physical science morons to make the case...which has to ignore the physical evidence that completely and utterly dismisses their flat earth because it feels like it pseudoscience.

aka, your religion doesn't match up with the science

my agenda is to smash religions when they enter into the public space
Because whenever religion enters public space, the first thing they try to do is force people to do things based on their morality
the religious in this case don't believe in gender dysphoria (ignoring the physical evidence) therefore are no doubt wanting to stop the process of transitioning in others, convincing to teach people to belittle them (oh, we should fix their hard wired brain with what...psychologists?) Same bs as when they figured gay people were insane.

These people you quote, these psychologist religious nuts, are to be mocked out of relevance.

That is what some Democrats are...and some Republicans..basically the ones grounded in scientific exploration and understanding.

and again
F88k your feels.

Funny how you talk about religious nuts but yet talk about them like a loony toon yourself. And your the one talking about "smash crush" em" .

So when did you go from one more atheist as ignorant as the people you claim to fight and turn into a foamy mouthed wild eyed tin hat that totally sidetracks a conversation to do this loon anti Semite diatribe?

You sound like the very thing you are accusing the other side of. Its funny in a sad ironic kinda way.
You talk just like those " god hates fags" sign toters in Texas.

If I want to hear about religion I goto a damn church.
But insert ignorant atheist into a public space and all you want to talk about is something you don't believe or understand.

Your worse than a preacher at my grandparents dinner table. He at least talked about something else.

You have more in common with a cult fanatic than Wesboro
Take a look in the mirror and get a girlfriend yo.

Or a life.
Maybe read Darwin's book.
I did.
Cambrian Explosion

Where's the "study" as the title suggests?

The OP link is to an article which is nothing more than an opinion piece by a psychiatrist, and the only reference to a "study" is the one that says suicides are higher among reassigned transgenders (likely due to the stigma attached), not that it is a "mental disorder."

The second link is freakin' christian website, and the study that cites seems to only look at gene expression and is relates to biological gender, which does not show that transgenderism is a "mental disorder."

Still waiting for the study that says it's a mental disorder.

ETA:

29 pages already? Whoa. Guess I got some reading to do. Or not.

originally posted by: AutisticEvo
Funny how you talk about religious nuts but yet talk about them like a loony toon yourself. And your the one talking about "smash crush" em" .

My post was mocking religious ideology pushing science away

Your comeback was to mock a person

When you cannot attack an idea (in this case, my viewpoint), then you attack a person.

You have lost the debate when you are forced to attack a individual verses the subject. Have a nice day