FACT: Robot shills are taking over the internet

The Express just dropped this bombshell about the scale and interests behind the hate filled shill bots that are running amok in the name of companies, political parties and social engineers among others. I find it increasingly worrisome that information, the real power in this world is now so almost unrecognizable as truth or lie.


"So-called "social bots" have been discovered after research found numerous accounts that can post thousands of comments a day, every day, as well as send messages and links.

According to Professor Simon Hegelich, in Munich, these robots act like humans and the ordinary online user cannot tell the difference.

These differ from so-called "trolls" who are real people, invariably paid to spread comments and hate messages.

The trolls can also be paid by companies, political parties or even countries to spread a corporate message to give favourable opinions about them.

The German TV documentary 'ZDFzoom', on the public-service broadcaster ZDF featured one such businessman who operated such a company, Maik Satzer, who claimed to have a number of large customers, including political parties, using his services.

Mr Satzer said: "Political parties are trying to... imply, or pre-generate, some sort of opinion."



www.express.co.uk...

originally posted by: circuitsports


Mr Satzer said: "Political parties are trying to... imply, or pre-generate, some sort of opinion."

www.express.co.uk...

George Soros comes to mind....

Bots serve to push things to the "tipping point".

Remember Tay, the genocidal twitter bot?

qz.com...

Very interesting thread, OP.

a reply to: zosimov

Haha lol

a reply to: circuitsports

In an interested twist it's being revealed that Google and others are changing to ai centric models which will drive more advanced chat bots.

Bots have been used by political parties since at least 2010, I blogged about it back then, but I'm not identifying myself here so not linking my blog. One political party here was caught using them on twitter.

Was looking at setting up some reddit bots, start here if you are so incline:
pythonforengineers.com...

a reply to: circuitsports

Orwell predicted this very scenario....we are in trouble when the people cannot differentiate truth or fabrication....next thing you know the American flag will get banned in America....

Sock puppets have been used by those with the skills on every side you can imagine.

Script kiddies have been spamming comment sections of sites and email accounts for the last 20 years.

About ten years ago you started to see auto-generated sites, review sites, news sites, with ads all over them... they aren't being generated by people. Most looked like crappy copy + paste jobs. They are getting better in recent years to not be as noticeable.

I think the recent wave has been attaching primitive A.I. It's not too terribly difficult to fake. Look at the quality of posts from your average internet traveler today. The average IQ for someone online has dropped significantly in the last 20 years.

We have hardcore datamining intersecting with the emergence of A.I. run amok. It's pretty trippy!

I was a big fan of the Wild West, anything goes style of the Internet back in the 1990s. Back then, you never would have convinced me I would one day favor removing its cloak of anonymity, but we have reached a tipping point. We need more transparency on the internet. It has become a cesspool wherein it's increasingly difficult to differentiate truth from fiction.

Paid trolls need to be identified as such.
Bots need to be outlawed, or clearly identified.
Dark money needs to be removed (as in, anyone funding these shills needs to be identified.)
Media shills on the take from either party need to have their ulterior motives exposed.

originally posted by: Greggers

Paid trolls need to be identified as such.
Bots need to be outlawed, or clearly identified.
Dark money needs to be removed (as in, anyone funding these shills needs to be identified.)
Media shills on the take from either party need to have their ulterior motives exposed.

How do you see this taking shape? I'm genuinely curious. I think we could attempt to bring transparency, but this is more an ideal (for some) than something actually achievable.

You'd severely limit the capabilities of the internet in your attempt, if you kept to the ideal as actually being achievable. In reality, those most skilled would remain anonymous, and advance their art.

The way I see it, people will inform their selves as they see fit, and adapt to their terrain as they will. No different than any other time in our past. Then again, I do wish MSM was less biased and was held to a higher standard. I don't know... but I don't think it's only online where there's a problem. People in general have some serious issues.

Perhaps this is actually a cultural phenomena, and technology could be playing it's role in affecting it. I get the impression we could bypass the need for locking down internet freedom, if only we allowed our selves time to mature through the information age.

originally posted by: SignalMal

originally posted by: Greggers

Paid trolls need to be identified as such.
Bots need to be outlawed, or clearly identified.
Dark money needs to be removed (as in, anyone funding these shills needs to be identified.)
Media shills on the take from either party need to have their ulterior motives exposed.

How do you see this taking shape? I'm genuinely curious. I think we could attempt to bring transparency, but this is more an ideal (for some) than something actually achievable.

You'd severely limit the capabilities of the internet in your attempt, if you kept to the ideal as actually being achievable. In reality, those most skilled would remain anonymous, and advance their art.

The way I see it, people will inform their selves as they see fit, and adapt to their terrain as they will. No different than any other time in our past. Then again, I do wish MSM was less biased and was held to a higher standard. I don't know... but I don't think it's only online where there's a problem. People in general have some serious issues. Perhaps this is actually a cultural phenomena, and technology could be playing it's role in affecting it. I get the impression we could bypass the need for locking down internet freedom, if only we allowed our selves time to mature through the information age.

I can't say I'm prepared to make a thesis on how to best achieve this, but one thought is that we'd have to pass laws making it illegal to pay people to shill, or to accept money to shill, without both sides clearly identifying themselves. Then, go for the dark money behind it all. Bust the ones at the top.

Of course, it would still go on, but it would provide legal recourse when people got caught.

originally posted by: Greggers

I can't say I'm prepared to make a thesis on how to best achieve this, but one thought is that we'd have to pass laws making it illegal to pay people to shill, or to accept money to shill, without both sides clearly identifying themselves. Then, go for the dark money behind it all. Bust the ones at the top.

Of course, it would still go on, but it would provide legal recourse when people got caught.

Right, I can see laws being passed that would intimidate some, but I was more concerned with the technology we would use to catch the shills and trollmasters. That's the pandora's box I'm not sure would be wise to open.

originally posted by: SignalMal

originally posted by: Greggers

I can't say I'm prepared to make a thesis on how to best achieve this, but one thought is that we'd have to pass laws making it illegal to pay people to shill, or to accept money to shill, without both sides clearly identifying themselves. Then, go for the dark money behind it all. Bust the ones at the top.

Of course, it would still go on, but it would provide legal recourse when people got caught.

Right, I can see laws being passed that would intimidate some, but I was more concerned with the technology we would use to catch the shills and trollmasters. That's the pandora's box I'm not sure would be wise to open.

You're right about that -- it's an area where we would want to proceed with extreme caution.

I'm fairly certain the NSA currently has at their disposal all the necessary tools to crack this nut wide open.

a reply to: Greggers

Yep.... but it's not wise to give them that role on policing.

originally posted by: SignalMal
a reply to: Greggers

Yep.... but it's not wise to give them that role on policing.

I can't say I disagree with that.

If anti-shilling laws existed, there'd be no need to employ the NSA juggernaut. The process of legal discovery could force ISPs and other online services to relinquish all manner of information.

a reply to: Greggers

but one thought is that we'd have to pass laws making it illegal to pay people to shill, or to accept money to shill, without both sides clearly identifying themselves. Then, go for the dark money behind it all. Bust the ones at the top.

I would think a law like this to be somewhat redundant,....drug dealing is illegal yet it stops only a small percentage of people from doing it, that's just illegal drugs ...prescription drugs are whole other can of worms

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: Greggers

but one thought is that we'd have to pass laws making it illegal to pay people to shill, or to accept money to shill, without both sides clearly identifying themselves. Then, go for the dark money behind it all. Bust the ones at the top.

I would think a law like this to be somewhat redundant,....drug dealing is illegal yet it stops only a small percentage of people from doing it, that's just illegal drugs ...prescription drugs are whole other can of worms

Maybe. But if we do nothing, I don't see the problem improving on its own.

a reply to: Greggers

I do. Fads die out, and the next generation adapts with a fresh start.

originally posted by: SignalMal
a reply to: Greggers

I do. Fads die out, and the next generation adapts with a fresh start.

I don't see this as a fad.

I see the increased consolidation of wealth and power, trends in globalization, media monopolies, and the selling-out of our elected officials conspiring to create an environment in which we are lied to and manipulated all the time by all forms of media, and no place is this more obvious than on the internet.

If you don't plunge a stake through it's heart, this sucker isn't going to die on its own.

originally posted by: burntheships

originally posted by: circuitsports


Mr Satzer said: "Political parties are trying to... imply, or pre-generate, some sort of opinion."

www.express.co.uk...

George Soros comes to mind....

Bots serve to push things to the "tipping point".

Russia comes to mind. Oh, wait, they actually hire real people...

Most of these "bots" are on Twitter, not in forums and on Facebook. It's a lot easier to program a bot to re-Tweet and throw a short sentence with it. Put those bots behind a VPN, and boom ... you have people thinking "CoalMiner47" is actually from Kentucky and not a server farm in St. Petersburg.

In any case, Twitter sucks. It's only relevant if you're a celebrity. Most people that see celeb tweets see them on other sites like Facebook...or on TV or screen caps on news websites.

There are people in 3rd world countries that have dozens of Twitter accounts that get paid to "follow" people. Combine that with the bots...If I had to guess, I'd say Twitter is about 60-70% fake traffic/advertising.

Young people use Snapchat. Older folks use Facebook...and I guess people who don't like to type use Instagram.