Iain Duncan Smith resigns!!

Even if they clawed back the money from the EU, closed tax loopholes and stopped overseas aid you would see no tangible difference in living standards.

It's not about what they can and can't afford; it's about acclimatising you to increasingly accept a lesser way of life while you pay out more and work harder. The only difference between a left and right leaning government is the speed and methods used to make it happen.

There will eventually be a time where it becomes so apparent on an individual level that your only option will be to fight it outside the parameters of the system. The success of that is entirely dependent on how long it takes for the realisation to reach critical mass and turn into an effective form of resistance. In all likelihood it's already too late. These are my happy thoughts for the day haha. Laters!

Iain Duncan Smith's resignation was really about the EU, pensions minister Baroness Ros Altmann has said.

On Friday, Mr Duncan Smith said he was quitting as work and pensions secretary in protest at disability benefits cuts.

But Lady Altmann, who described her ex-boss as "exceptionally difficult" to work for, accused him of wanting "to do maximum damage to the party leadership" to help his campaign to leave the EU.

www.bbc.co.uk...

a reply to: Scouse100

I wonder if it's more a case of him being forced out because of his stance on the EU

Non compliance on the whole EU situation so his overlords Osbourne and Cameron force him to make decisions he doesn't want to make and ultimately leave

I wonder how his replacement Crabb feels about EU, he is likely more compliant with wanting to remain in the EU which is why he's been given the position

Hopefully though with IDS resigning more cracks will appear in the scummiest party in the UK and eventually it wall all fall down like a house of cards

a reply to: Scouse100

I think it's the principle reason, but he has also accused Osborne of attacking a vulnerable element in society whilst giving to a more affluent element of society, thereby exposing the myth that we are all in this together.

I am sure IDS realises that if the U.K votes to remain in the E.U, his political career would probably be finished. Maybe this had actually been implied by someone in Government, so he decided to cut his losses at this particular time and hope for a Brexit and a leadership challenge from Boris.

Osborne has been quiet since IDS's shock resignation and has left his mate Dave and the rest of the remain campaign to try to discredit IDS's claims, that it was down to his principles regarding the latest proposed cuts to disability benefit.

Deep Sigh.

Reminder : Action speaks louder than words (ALWAYS!!!)

Look at the actions of IDS : Did not resign before the EU referendum campaign when similar oppressive cuts were made. He even punches the air in support.

Listening to him on the Andrew Marr show this morning and (if you are gullible) he is a man of great integrity, who cares passionately for the poor and the disabled. He only wants what is best for those in society less fortunate than the rest. He is passionate about ensuring those at the lower end of the social scale are helped to improve themselves. He has no political ambitions beyond his passion for helping the less fortunate......Hang on "no ambition" and yet was leader of the Tory party and thus potential Prime Minister......yeah right pull the other one.

This about Brexit. It is about conning people into seeing him as a very nice compassionate person who cares for the people of the UK and part of that caring is withdrawal from the EU. Some people will fall for this line and think Brexit is best.

Me, as far as Brexit is concerned? Simple I read what is actually happening. I read the background (actions!) to the UKIP moans (what a fricking eye opener that is). I discovered how the Commission works ....wow...people in this country have been lied to. I read about China's trade agreement and the laws they have to comply with (surprise surprise) as everyone does when trading with a.n.other country unless a.n.other country doesn't give a f. Knowledge is a dangerous thing. NB the knowledge is not clear cut and you have to mix in a dose of potential but at least I'm not deciding based on cherry picked BS.

a reply to: yorkshirelad

I dont know.

I lean pretty right and was in favour of cutting child tax credits (though only for future children born after say 2018).

I was in favour of a welfare cap.

Didnt have a problem with a bedroom tax (though think certain groups should of got exceptions).

But i was appalled at cutting disability.

To me that is way to far.

originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: yorkshirelad

I dont know.

I lean pretty right and was in favour of cutting child tax credits (though only for future children born after say 2018).

I was in favour of a welfare cap.

Didnt have a problem with a bedroom tax (though think certain groups should of got exceptions).

But i was appalled at cutting disability.

To me that is way to far.

So would you then say that your sentiments sum up the average man on the streets in that you do not really mind what happens to society as a whole but only become involved when it affects you personally?

a reply to: nonspecific

No.

It sums up my personal sentiments and political leaning that welfare should not be a life style or career choice for able bodied people of working age, nor should I have to fund other peoples children.

But for those who are not able bodied and have no choice in the matter we must do whats needed to protect them.

Plus who gives a # what my motivation is?

People on the right are allying with you liberals to block this abomination.

So instead of criticizing us a d insulting us how about we put ideological diffrences aside and WORK TOGETHER to block this.

Come on we are British not American we are better than this partasian nonsense.

a reply to: yorkshirelad

I hear what you are saying, but the footage of IDS punching the air was actually him punching the air When the announcement was made that a living wage was to be introduced, not because benefits were being cut. It has been manipulated by a number of sources to drive their own agenda.

Don't get me wrong, I am no supporter of IDS or the Tories, but I think we need to keep it real.

No doubt Brexit is the principle reason, but these latest proposed cuts are an attack on some of their own voters. I say some because we don't know the actual figures, but taking from the vulnerable in order to make their mates richer exposes the B.S of ever being in it together.

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
...the footage of IDS punching the air was actually him punching the air When the announcement was made that a living wage was to be introduced, not because benefits were being cut.

That's how I remembered it as well.
I can't say I particularly like the chap, but I don't agree with propagating lies about anyone.
It damages debate to do so.

I see the Conservatives splitting into two parties and I think they should.

You have two types in the party.

1) Etonite Oxbridge royalist snobs who are born with a silver spoon and want to protect there banker buddies and who have connections to aristocracy

2) Honest Centre right people like me who want smaller more efficient government. Less funding other people’s poor life choices and more vibrant yet stable economy.

I want a party that ditches the 1st category.

a reply to: crazyewok

I can't ever see that happening, as they have always had similar types in their party.

The thing with the Tories is that they have been split on Europe for decades and we are now seeing the fall out of Cameron giving the electorate a referendum.

I am thankful that he has, because we need to get out, but I feel it will ultimately be the death knell for a number of high profile Tories.

originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: nonspecific

No.

It sums up my personal sentiments and political leaning that welfare should not be a life style or career choice for able bodied people of working age, nor should I have to fund other peoples children.

Have you ever been on welfare?

If so, was it your experience that being a claimant is a potential "lifestyle choice", or is that just something which you've deduced from watching a constant flow of TV documentaries and mainstream media reports portraying it as such?

a reply to: Motorhead

Behave, I know plenty of folk who choose to do # all except lie to the DWP every fortnight lol.
I take the piss out of the lazy bastards but they are mates so I'm not grassing them up any time soon.
If you think the number of people making a lifestyle choice out of benefits is tiny or insignificant then you clearly aren't friends with many folk on benefits.

I know folk faking a bad back, faking depression and anxiety, popping out another child when their eldest child reaches the age when they are required to start looking for work, all the rest of it.
You sound naive lol

Benefit fraud is rife in the UK, I just don't give a # about it as it pales to insignificance when compared to corporate tax evasion and avoidance.

originally posted by: Motorhead

originally posted by: crazyewok
a reply to: nonspecific

No.

It sums up my personal sentiments and political leaning that welfare should not be a life style or career choice for able bodied people of working age, nor should I have to fund other peoples children.

Have you ever been on welfare?

If so, was it your experience that being a claimant is a potential "lifestyle choice", or is that just something which you've deduced from watching a constant flow of TV documentaries and mainstream media reports portraying it as such?

Yes I was on disability for 18 months due to very ill health.
That help was vital for me while I got my health back together.


As for JSA?

It should be as a shot term stop gap between jobs.

At most a claimant should not be on it for more than 3 months.

For able bodied work able people welfare goal to be to keep a roof over there head and food in there belly’s. THAT IS IT.

a reply to: crazyewok

I agree about the basic roof over head and food thing, way too many lazy bastards in the UK getting a lifestyle choice out of benefits, even my EU national friends take the piss out of our lazy British friends that they should get a #ing job just as they have.
It is funny when the lazy bastard mates have no argument to it, but a little cringe-worthy that it takes EU nationals moving here to prove there is plenty of work about.

...again though, they're my mates in part of my social circles, I ain't grassing anyone up, but I reserve the right to call them lazy bastards lol

a reply to: grainofsand
Being from Chatham I know a few single mums that game the system by breeding.

And yes there are a look of welfare gamers round here in the pub.

There needs to be a serious look at able bodied welfare and our attitudes toward working.

Personally I would up JSA allowance slightly but only allow it for 3 months (6 in time of economic recession). After that its CUT, gone. poof.

I would set up government funded bunk houses that provide very basic shelter and food for those who are homeless, that will give them a address and communal access to internet so they can look for work plus possible councillors.

And I would cut child tax credits. But not for current family’s. Only for children born after 2018. If you want kids PLAN FOR THEM. If you can’t afford to raise Children DON’T HAVE THEM.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: Motorhead

Behave, I know plenty of folk who choose to do # all except lie to the DWP every fortnight lol.
I take the piss out of the lazy bastards but they are mates so I'm not grassing them up any time soon.
If you think the number of people making a lifestyle choice out of benefits is tiny or insignificant then you clearly aren't friends with many folk on benefits.

I know folk faking a bad back, faking depression and anxiety, popping out another child when their eldest child reaches the age when they are required to start looking for work, all the rest of it.
You sound naive lol

Benefit fraud is rife in the UK, I just don't give a # about it as it pales to insignificance when compared to corporate tax evasion and avoidance.

Seriously? You know plenty of folk who play the system? Official fraud figures contradict your claims, but keep on believing the hype.

I worked for the DWP for many years dealing with tens of thousands of claimants and whilst fraud was undoubtedly being carried out, it was not that significant and official figures backed that up.

I haven't worked there for over 10 years now, but still have many friends who do. I can also confirm that sanctions are applied to lots of claimants and it all about doing all they can to ensure claimants benefit is either reduced or stopped.

During my time working for DWP I met a number of people who chose to remain on benefits as a life choice, but all in all it would have been less than 1 percent. I guess it depends on where you live, but it certainly was the case here in Bristol.

a reply to: Cobaltic1978

Lol, I started my civil service career in the DWP then got my degree and fast-tracked to the senior civil service.
I've done face to face decisions on the front line turning down crisis loans getting threatened with a stabbing and I've made and signed decisions on behalf of Secretary of States in Whitehall with other departments.
Don't have any preconceptions about my experiences fella, I've got heroin addict mates and millionaire mates lol.

There are many lazy bastards out there spilling coffee stains on job application forms, not offering or accepting a handshake at job interviews, etc, doing everything legal to negotiate the rules and not get the job as a result, but doing enough so they don't get sanctioned.
That is not recorded as fraud, it is the grey area of staying on benefits while avoiding having to work.
If you aren't aware of that then, lol, not much I can say to help.

*Edit*
I actually started with the Dept of Health and Social Security, then it changed to the Department of Social Security, then the Benefits Agency, and finally DWP which I transferred from shortly after it's creation.


*Edit again*
After resigning from the service I worked in local authority Social services as a 'welfare officer' helping council service users get the maximum they could from central government to mitigate the cost to the council. After that I worked for CAB as a welfare/debt advisor/advocate.
Lots and lots of lazy bastards in the UK, and lots of people who make stupid choices like £100 per month on the iphone contract instead of buying food and having a £10 a month pre-pay phone.
Bleat and break your heart as much as you like but the fraud/scam/game is deeply ingrained in UK society...you just don't see it lol

No matter what section of society, everyone is guilty of scamming the system from benefit claimants to MPs and expenses, to the royal family using chinooks as taxis to corporations dodging tax. So let's stop highlighting the most vulnerable and causing resentment between different sections of the poor.