ISIS are not Muslims, Zionist are not Jews, Westboro Baptist are not Christians.

I am tired of reading threads about ISIS where the responder slams the entire Muslim world.

There are 1.5 billion Muslims and approximately 30,000 are in ISIS. Most Muslims are peaceful, sitting in their homes living in the hell that the failed USA middle east policies have created.

There is no such thing as offensive, aggressive jihad just because people have different religions or opinions.
www.rt.com...

The truth is that the Jewish faith and Zionism are two very different philosophies. They are as opposite as day and night. The Jewish people have existed for thousands of years. In their two thousand years of Divinely decreed exile no Jew ever sought to end this exile and establish independent political sovereignty anywhere. The people's sole purpose was the study and fulfillment of the Divine commandments of the Torah.
www.nkusa.org...

1 Corinthians 5:12
What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?

Please I implore all of you to stop being Anti-Semitic, Anti-Islam, or Anti-Christ because bigots are using religion as a cover for hate, intolerance and aggressive wars.

When you condemn an entire religion for the actions of a few you become no better than the few bigots that you are speaking against.

ISIS is killing innocent people who are not at war with them. Zionist are calling for a preemptive strike on Iran, and Wetsboro Baptists are judging those who are obviously not of the same faith.

These are not the messages of Moses, Christ or Mohammed.

Next time you want to know about the Torah, the New Testament or the Quran try adding the word peaceful before the religion you are searching, only then will you find the true message of acceptance, peace and love found within all 3 texts.

The end to bigotry, hate, and war that comes from religious intolerance starts with you. There is no room for religious intolerance in a wold desperate for peace.

a reply to: Isurrender73

there seems to be a lot of intolerance on both sides

a reply to: Isurrender73

That won't happen.

You see the extremist anti-theists will always be there.
Fundamentalists will always be there.

And ultimately you can't tell fundamentalists how to interpret the Holy Texts.

originally posted by: Ozsheeple
a reply to: Isurrender73

there seems to be a lot of intolerance on both sides

Yes because there is the potential for large profit from that intolerance. Just look at all the wars that have been based on religion and nothing makes more profit than war.

originally posted by: Ozsheeple
a reply to: Isurrender73

there seems to be a lot of intolerance on both sides

I agree, but specifically on ATS I don't see the Muslim community and the Jewish community bashing Christians.

Some dispute the authenticity of bible and unfortunately some atheist have shown their self-righteousness proclaiming intellectual superiority. But for the most part Muslims get the worst of it.

In the bigger picture unfortunately there is hate everywhere. I was hoping to help the people on this forum. It's a small start but if we can't manage tolerance here on ATS how can we expect to ever find tolerance as a whole.

It's fine to be Anti-ISIS, Anti-Zionist and Anti-Christian bigots, or those of any religion who say my way or hell. But none of the texts tell the followers to do this. Only self-righteous bigots who want to claim they are god's choosen do this. And a few atheist who claim intellectual superiority.

I am asking the members on ATS to be specific and not condemn entire religions. Even the atheist would be better suited to either leave the religious topics alone, or at least stick to intellectually criticising the dogma they don't agree with.

I am unique because I believe most major religions teach the same message, so all religious intolerance bothers me to the same extent.

originally posted by: Isurrender73


There are 1.5 billion Muslims and approximately 30,000 are in ISIS. Most Muslims are peaceful, sitting in their homes living in the hell that the failed USA middle east policies have created.

I don't believe most Muslims are peaceful. Polls taken around the world show that even the so called "moderates" support radical stuff. The so called moderates in the US only protest to condemn freedom of speech and excuse those who would murder over cartoons.

www.pewforum.org...

a reply to: Isurrender73

I am intolerant of Christianity, Islam, and Judaism.

Guess why?

Because those written texts are violent, misogynistic, and hateful.

I have no reason to be tolerant of any religion that demeans me(woman, lesbian) or says it's okay to rape eight year old girls.

There are a lot of very nice people who are Christian, Jewish, and Islamic but it is because they ignore large parts of their own religions. I respect that decision in regard to them choosing the moral high ground and not following their own religions in a strict manner. Most probably haven't even read wholly the books their whole religions are based on.

However, there are many people who do follow those religions in a stricter manner or follow certain areas more than others(which is no more "incorrect" than following the "nice" verses instead).

Most religions have "nice verses" from time to time because the idiots writing them were human and even the most evil and hateful among us can say nice things from time to time.

Hitler also had some very inspirational speeches.

I do condemn entire religions because the overall message is violent, hateful, apocalyptic(instead of healing messages of self-control), homophobic(or the ancient version of that which is misogyny and forced gender roles).A Couple nice verses doesn't change the absolutely hateful vomit that exists in the chapters. No more than Hitler's inspirational speeches changes the holocaust.

The worst part of all these religions is that they absolutely violate the idea that a person controls themselves. The violation of the principle that relies on the idea that the absolute form of currency is the human body of which only the person it belongs to has the right to control.

Religion is a human construct that on all levels just tries to reinforce the idea that humans are to be owned and controlled.

Once an individual lives individually their body is theirs to control.

So no, I am not "tolerant". I have way too much self-respect to be tolerant of hate speech directed at me. I don't give a # if it was written thousands of years ago.

a reply to: Isurrender73

I've come to believe that we need intolerance.

We need to offend and be offended.

Just imagine the bland, boring, conformist world if everyone got along and everyone believed the same and no-one ever offended anyone.

a reply to: Isurrender73

Personally I feel Christians & Atheists get the brunt of the intolerance.

There is the odd Muslim bash, it's died down since I rejoined though.
Quite a bit.

I think most who used to be involved in the vitriol have come to realise what's portrayed has been falsified division.


It's better to rise above faith bashing, I don't partake whether Christian, Jew or Muslim before my conversion.


Zionism is a political ideology, and is therefore a justified target as much as rep, dem, con, labour or commie.
In my opinion.

a reply to: TheBulk

Most Muslims support Anti-USA demonstrations.

Spend a day in their shoes and let me know if they have a point or not.

Maybe Saddam and Gaddafi were not saints but they were not ISIS. Do you blame the Muslims for being Anti-American? I don't as I personally haven't supported any of my governments actions in the Middle East since Saddam invaded Kuwait.

If you were constantly being bombed by another country I don't suppose you would be pleased with them either.

a reply to: Isurrender73

This is nothing more than the "no true scottsman fallacy". Which seems to be one of your fave fallacies.

These groups all get their cues from these same religious books. An argument could be made that they are the true face of these particular religions, because they don't cherry pick the verses that they like. They take these books as a whole and do what the books say to do.

It is more proper to say that those who cherry pick the parts they like are not the true followers of these barbaric religions. The books obviously call for barbaric practices. How are those who follow these books word for word somehow not the true believers?

a reply to: Isurrender73

Beautifully said -- and I thank you for making this very important and very timely point.

There are good and bad in every group. There are exploiters and users and cheaters in every group. It's not fair to blame all for the bad acts of a few; and neither is it practical or effective to give cover to the few by blaming all.

Most of all, it only serves the agenda of those who benefit from dividing and conquering the rest of us.

All I know, religion overall is responsible for a lot of maiming, torture, killings, wars, division, hate, exclusions, accusations, condemnations, cults, fear, deceiving, and above all CONTROL.

I think I pretty much covered it all.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Christians get the most from the Atheist and those who don't agree with the dogma. That has more to do with the percentage of Christans and those raised in Christian households that don't believe the dogma who are active on ATS.

If ATS was a Muslim website I would imagine you would find the same messages regarding the Muslim dogma.

Most of those posts are not bashing the teaching of Jesus Christ. Only the dogma they don't agree with. Even the atheist who bash God very seldom have anything negative to say about the words attributed to Christ.

But the Muslim bashing comes from all sides and all faiths. And most people are bashing the entire religion without any consideration for the fact that 1.5 billion people follow Mohammed as their prophet.

originally posted by: TheBulk

originally posted by: Isurrender73


There are 1.5 billion Muslims and approximately 30,000 are in ISIS. Most Muslims are peaceful, sitting in their homes living in the hell that the failed USA middle east policies have created.

I don't believe most Muslims are peaceful. Polls taken around the world show that even the so called "moderates" support radical stuff. The so called moderates in the US only protest to condemn freedom of speech and excuse those who would murder over cartoons.

www.pewforum.org...

Using these polls to support your statement is a joke. These polls generally ask between 1000 to 1500 people so do you really think that accurately represents almost 2 billion people?

a reply to: Isurrender73

Muhammad (pbuh) said (paraphrasing) if you debate with someone and they become derogatory about your Faith, bid them Salam and move on unless they can debate properly.

If someone wants to bash Islam, let them.

If your Faith is strong, it means nothing.

I agree, we tend to lump groups of people together to classify them but we shouldn't really be doing that unless it is evident that the small group or group is united in their beliefs which leads to a threat. Also, the people who run the religions should not be compared to many of the members. I am not a big fan of organized religions but I am a fan of a lot of good people within these religions. The extremists in these religions are not what we should judge them by.

My 2 cents....

Who is anyone to tell anyone else what religion they are or aren't? I'm something of a practicing Catholic, but since I don't necessarily buy everything the church is selling, can I be told I'm not Catholic?

Beyond that, I'm struggling to come up with a single person that I know that has told me they believe ALL people of the fill-in-the-blank faith are bad, evil, inherently violent. The vast majority of people know (especially those of us living in larger, diverse cities and deal with people from across the spectrum) that regardless of category, most people are just trying to live their lives.

That being said, if your talking about specific groups of trouble-makers (ISIS for example), it's important to know what you are dealing with. It's important to know (as best you can) and understand your enemy.

a reply to: Woodcarver

If a book is from God it can't contradict itself.

Quran

[2:190] You may fight in the cause of GOD against those who attack you, but do not aggress. GOD does not love the aggressors.

[2:191] You may kill those who wage war against you, and you may evict them whence they evicted you. Oppression is worse than murder. Do not fight them at the Sacred Masjid, unless they attack you therein. If they attack you, you may kill them. This is the just retribution for those disbelievers.

[2:192] If they refrain, then GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful.

[2:193] You may also fight them to eliminate oppression, and to worship GOD freely. If they refrain, you shall not aggress; aggression is permitted only against the aggressors.

Torah

Leviticus 19:33
33 “‘When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. 34 The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the Lord your God.

New Testament

1 Corinthians 5:12-13 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside.

Those who teach hate, intolerance and aggression are teaching a message that contradicts the messages in the texts as I have clearly shown.

Only those who preach peace are taking everything in context without cherry-picking.

originally posted by: Isurrender73
a reply to: TheBulk

Most Muslims support Anti-USA demonstrations.

Spend a day in there shoes and let me know if they have a point or not.

Maybe Saddam and Gaddafi were not saints but they were not ISIS. Do you blame the Muslims for being Anti-American? I don't as I personally haven't supported any of my governments actions in the Middle East since Saddam invaded Kuwait.

If you were constantly being bombed by another country I don't suppose you would be pleased with them either.

Muslims are constantly being bombed by other muslims. Not us.