Is There Evidence for Creationism? Show it to us.

Inspired by an identically titled thread of the opposite position.

Seriously, is there any non biblical evidence in support of creationism?

I've looked really, really hard, but found absolutely none..

Is it not fair to impose the same requirement of evidence to justify belief in creationism as they impose on us who understand scientific theory?

There is a mountain of evidence, including not only the fossil record, but also in the scientific fields of genetics, biology, microbiology, chemistry, biochemistry etc. Dog breeders understand evolution, colour blind people understand evolution, anyone with a hereditary trait etc.

Often I've seen the argument, "it's only a theory, like gravity".. Soooo, biblical literalists don't believe in gravity?

Strictly speaking, evolution is something that happens in the world of life, and should be distinguished from a theory of evolution, which is a model of how evolution occurs. Thus evolution bears the same relationship with a theory of evolution as flight with a theory of flight, or sound with a theory of sound, or planetary motion with a theory of planetary motion.

This is often expressed in the saying that "evolution is both a theory and a fact", that is to say, the word "evolution" can refer not only to the process by which it happens, but also to the fact that it is observed to happen, and to a theory that is involved with the process. I.e. "how it happens" vs. "what the consequences are of it happening" vs "it is happening whether we observe and record it or not".

Creationist and intelligent design arguments lump these definitions together, from what i've read, and blanket-deny evolution without realising it is as much an observed reality as gravity or electricity. The arguments also conveniently ignore the fact that evolution is essentially the bedrock of modern biology, and if they really want to commit to the premise, the majority of modern medical science is to be ignored, including immunisations and proven disease treatments.

So, I ask of the creationist population, where is your evidence in support of your belief, outside the bible? Is there any? Can you prove to us with evidence that you are simply not taking myth to be the absolute, literal truth?

Scientists rarely engage in the creationist/evolution debate, for fear of lending legitimacy to the opposing argument, because it is so unscientific. If you want to persuade us, here's a chance to present evidence; let's see what you've got besides a centuries' old book handed down through tradition from one generation to the next.

About as much as there is for evolution

a reply to: spygeek

They both got it wrong, life was brought here, imo.

originally posted by: Raggedyman
About as much as there is for evolution

Evolution is a fact. If you are unwilling to learn about it, thats fine. But dont spread lies.

Evolution is FACT.

web.maths.unsw.edu.au...


You might appreciate this effort.

Are advanced mathematical bases & principles proof of ID?
No, but a true scientist wouldn't scoff at such evidence without having a really good look at them.

originally posted by: Raggedyman
About as much as there is for evolution

Where? I would love to see it.. I asked for you to show it in the thread title..

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: spygeek

They both got it wrong, life was brought here, imo.

Evolution says nothing about the origin of life, crestionism says it was made here in its current form.. You can believe what you like, but please stay on topic, if you want to come along with the e.t. seeding us angle, please show us how..

a reply to: spygeek

I'm going to predict that you will get the same responses I did when I tried this very same thread. A bunch of Creationists from different religions getting mad at you for pigeonholing their beliefs into Young Earth Creationism beliefs, while maybe one or two Young Earth Creationists stops by for a drive by post or two. Good luck though.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: spygeek

I'm going to predict that you will get the same responses I did when I tried this very same thread. A bunch of Creationists from different religions getting mad at you for pigeonholing their beliefs into Young Earth Creationism beliefs, while maybe one or two Young Earth Creationists stops by for a drive by post or two. Good luck though.

Thanks, I kinda had a similar thought.. I just got mad that they won't answer the same questions they pose us, and still expect to be taken seriously..

So tired of hearing "God of the gaps or it didn't happen.."

a reply to: Krazysh0t

The same response to your same question will be offered so why is the op asking the same question, creationists won't accept evolution and evolutionists won't accept creation.

Troll thread, why bother.

Accept others opinion and get on with it.

a reply to: spygeek

I am so tired of these stupid threads

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

A true scientist wouldn't write papers about fields of study that are outside of their expertise. An actual biologist's takedown:

www.jackscanlan.com/2010/02/a-mathematicians-highly-flawed-view-of-evolution/

a reply to: Raggedyman

Yet here we are.

www.investigatemagazine.co.nz...

Let me breathe some life into this thread.

a reply to: spygeek

I believe in creationism... I also believe in evolution as in integral part of the Creator's creation. I don't have any evidence, just a basic understanding that everything comes from somewhere, and that there are too many "accidents" and/or "coincidences" involved for life to be just another happy biological "accident" or "coincidence." I don't have to completely understand it to know that it is. I don't know how electricity works, but I know that it is. I don't understand exactly how weather happens, but I know that it does. Much the same way no one really understands exactly how/why evolution occurs.

Here's my question: Why do you care what I believe? How is it any skin off your back if I believe in creationism? I don't care why you believe in evolution but not creationism. Neither one of us can unequivocally prove either creationism or evolution. So what's the point? (Other than to poke and provoke those who do believe of course).

I am seriously asking. Why do you care? Should I just dismiss such questions as an effort to poke and provoke those who dare to believe differently than you? Or is there a practical purpose for your question?

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: spygeek
Here's my question: Why do you care what I believe? How is it any skin off your back if I believe in creationism? I don't care why you believe in evolution but not creationism. Neither one of us can unequivocally prove either creationism or evolution. So what's the point? (Other than to poke and provoke those who do believe of course).

I am seriously asking. Why do you care? Should I just dismiss such questions as an effort to poke and provoke those who dare to believe differently than you? Or is there a practical purpose for your question?

Because religious fundamentalists can't keep their noses out of other people's business. Trying to bam the teaching of evolution, trying to ban gay marriage and so on.

THAT'S why.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

It would be better if you breathed some scientific evidence into this thread instead.

originally posted by: Raggedyman
About as much as there is for evolution

Your appendix
Wisdom teeth
Tonsils

You have evolved to not need them any more.

Add to that antibiotic resistant strains of diseases and you have proof of evolution.

a reply to: GetHyped

No the OP asked for non-biblical evidence and I'm pointing towards mathematics and DNA coding...

How is a DNA coding study not scientific?
How is mathematics not scientific when most scientific principles are secured via mathematics?


Moving the goalposts will kill the thread, not give it life.

originally posted by: GetHyped

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: spygeek
Here's my question: Why do you care what I believe? How is it any skin off your back if I believe in creationism? I don't care why you believe in evolution but not creationism. Neither one of us can unequivocally prove either creationism or evolution. So what's the point? (Other than to poke and provoke those who do believe of course).

I am seriously asking. Why do you care? Should I just dismiss such questions as an effort to poke and provoke those who dare to believe differently than you? Or is there a practical purpose for your question?

Because religious fundamentalists can't keep their noses out of other people's business. Trying to bam the teaching of evolution, trying to ban gay marriage and so on.

THAT'S why.

Soooooo... secular fundamentalists have to return the favor and stick their noses in other people's business? That fixes everything???

I haven't heard of anyone trying to ban the teaching of evolution since last century (Scopes Monkey Trial), but I will take your word for it... I have however heard of many trying to ban the teaching of creationism this century. Who is actually bullying who here???

As for gay marriage, what does that have to do with evolution and creationism?

If religious fundamentalists are wrong for sticking their noses in other people's business, how is it okay for other people to stick their noses in religious fundementalists' business?

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Crappy study debunked here: freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2013/03/15/the-genetic-code-is-not-a-synonym-for-the-bible-code/

Why is it that creationists leap on crappy studies to show how "scientific" their absurd beliefs are yet CONSISTENTLY reject the mountains of SOLID scientific evidence for evolution?

I think we all know why.