Anger is a sign of weakness (it means you fear things going wrong and having no control )

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: mkpetrov

So in other words, you have no Faith and believe that darkness/anger is needed to fight against darkness? Darkness and darkness = darkness, not light.

As i said, anger can be a catalyst to a possitive change (Just like pain. It may be bad, yet it can be a good thing and without it you won't know you need to fix something in your body. Or mind), so i don't think it is darkness (But yes, very often you can only fight darkness with darkness.If someone is beating you and trying to kill you, what do you do? Say a few kind words to him, telling him how wrong he is and how he needs to "see the light" etc? Or fight back?)

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: BASSPLYR

And now in a familiar voice

A very true statement from Master Yoda.

Fear does lead to anger but not all anger begins with Fear.

a reply to: mkpetrov

If someone is beating you and trying to kill you, what do you do? Say a few kind words to him, telling him how wrong he is and how he needs to "see the light" etc?

Why would you stand there talking about Light instead of getting to a safe location if you're getting beat so bad you're about to get killed? The situation you gave as an example doesn't make sense.

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: mkpetrov

If someone is beating you and trying to kill you, what do you do? Say a few kind words to him, telling him how wrong he is and how he needs to "see the light" etc?

Why would you stand there talking about Light instead of getting to a safe location if you're getting beat so bad you're about to get killed? The situation you gave as an example doesn't make sense.

You can't always run to avoid all the evil, especially when it comes to life in general and not a specific situation like the one i mentioned (Plus, in this situation, let's say you manage to to escape and don't have to fight back and stop him. You know what that means, right? There will probably be another victim and when he/she gets hurt, it will be on you. So what's really the daekness in a case like this? Not harming someone or harming him/her to avoid maybe more than one, and less deserving people getting harmed?).

a reply to: mkpetrov

You know what that means, right? There will probably be another victim and when he/she gets hurt, it will be on you.

Not if you tell the cops. Then they can arrest the person and put them in jail for their violent behavior.

originally posted by: Aliensun
a reply to: arpgme

Your headline confused anger with fear. What's up with that?
And in the thread some of your statements are just plain false in a practical sense.

No - anger/aggression is a response to fear.

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: onequestion

Faith is Power. Faith is the wisdom that brings peace which anger lacks. Without that wish to harm/attack others (anger), love is present.

I agree with you (and a diety isn't required for faith) but caution that many confuse Power with force and the ability to use force in order to achieve their ends. Power, as I believe you mean it, doesn't force itself but attracts.

a reply to: FyreByrd

I get angry like everyone else, sometimes moreso, however I don't believe in fear, it's a wall, I have respect towards things not fear.
Video has some colorful language, viewer listening is advised.



I don't understand how anger is a response to fear?

If I order a meal at a cafe and the meal gets to me but is made on a dirty plate and there is mold on the bread, my anger to that piss poor meal is from fear?

Fear of what?

If my kids fail to clean their rooms after asking a few different times nicely and I get angry about that, what am I in fear of there? My anger isn't a direct result of my kids not listening?

If I wake up from outside construction earlier than I wanted and I become angry about that, am I fearful of construction workers?

I'm pretty sure anger is the emotional response towards being disappointed in what you perceive as the status quo, it's not a fear of things not being normal, it's the failed expectation of a plan you had in mind.

The meal not being made correctly, the kids not listening and the construction workers choosing 6am as a proper time to work.

Anyone else?

originally posted by: Isurrender73

originally posted by: arpgme
Anger panicks.
Power allows you to stay at Peace.

Anger is scared and doubtful.
Power keeps you confident.

Anger tries to control out of fear.
Power knows that all is well and allows freedom.

Anger justifies attacking others from fear of loss.
Power forgives knowing no harm is truly done.


Power = Peace, not anger

Not all anger is a response to fear.

This is not Lotus Land and many things make me angry.

I am angry that people are homeless and starving.
I am angry that Disability pays below the poverty line.
I am angry that our veterans are treated like Sh$t.

All of these things inspire Godly Anger. The problem is not anger but the way you choose to express it.

If you use controlled language anger can be a positive force. If you use aggressive words, fists, or guns anger has lost it's value.

Anger can motivate one to action but if it doesn't it just makes matters worse.

And it is always a sign of fear. I conjecture in the above examples are fear about lack of means - you see others suffering and don't want to suffer those things yourself. That those things could happen to you or those you love (very possible in todays world). But there are other ways to act without anger - fear can make you feel compassion for those others and take whatever action to can to lessen their suffering. Just being angry about it - hurts you and can attract the very things you are 'angry' (read fearful) about.

originally posted by: dffrntkndfnml
a reply to: arpgme

To follow along your op, it can be good to take a time out after getting caught off guard.Seeing red can be taken as a sign that personal boundaries have been crossed and the situation could use another look.Anger is often the result of dashed expectations, or a reminder of past experiences that one hasn't come to terms with.

After cooling down, it can be useful to reflect on exactly why one is upset.Understanding that, offers the opportunity to remember other occasions where this has been an issue.Much of the pain we carry is often the result of having to suffer experiences that were beyond our control.The chain usually goes back to one's more formative years.Working on healing that helps one own their anger and express it more maturely...

Very nicely put. Kudos.... Thanks for the heavy lifting...

originally posted by: Wookiep
a reply to: Bybyots

Anger in itself is not the the issue. It's when anger results in bad ACTIONS, that it becomes a problem. It's OK, for example, to be angry when your son/daughter rebels against you and chooses to lead a life of destuction. It's OK to be angry with a thug who just robbed your store.... What we DO with that anger is the question.

And both your examples show exactly how anger is a result of fear (real or imaginary). A clear head without anger can deal powerfully (not forcefull) with fear all all kinds. Give into the anger, wallow in it and you hurt yourself and others.

a reply to: arpgme

Overall I agree with you arpgme

However self defence can only truly be done with at least little bit of anger

Greg

originally posted by: Isurrender73

originally posted by: Bybyots
a reply to: arpgme

Anger is a sign of weakness (it means you fear things going wrong and having no control ) page: 1

Wow, that's funny, Zen Master Maezumi Roshi told a filled-to-capacity room full of people that included me that anger is a form of enlightenment.

Also, the only authentic Kung Fu Master that I have ever met has convinced me that anger is the only appropriate tool for exterminating the desires of those that wish to harm me or my loved ones.

I think that you have underestimated anger.

Even Jesus Christ demonstrated his anger towards the self-righteous religious leaders.

Sometimes amger brings awareness, control it and use it wisely and it can be a path to enlightenment.

Your Kung Fu Master was teaching Jihad. The controlled use of anger to combat opposing forces.

All those fighting words - all about force.

I think what the bible story is telling is the futility of anger - did Jesus' 'righteous' anger create any change? Did he, a popularly depicted, in fact cause harm by destroying property? Did he have to seek refuge in his father as a result of his anger.

And to say 'anger brings awareness' is a bit of a misnomer. When you feel it, you can use it towards furthering self-awareness true but anger by it's nature is out of control.

We know, or should know, that 'combating opposing forces' only escallates the hosilities and no one wins. You may 'crush' your opponent - but that is not winning. The war will start up again - with someone else at another time.

Anger needs to be replaced or transformed into patience and tolerance of self and others. It's a sign of an out-of-balance state as is any strong emotion - including the so called 'good' emotions.

The discussion seems to have drifted onto anger and away from fear so far but in a productive manner.
I expected a lot of 'I'm not afraid of anything' posturing and am delighted with the mostly thoughtful discussion. Granted I'm only on the second page....

originally posted by: TechniXcality
a reply to: arpgme

Sorry brother, but anger in of its self is not a negative psychological state. Do not be fooled or assume otherwise based on connotation. Anger is a driver motivating force a "peace movement" that was not angry would deflate there would be no "movement" the will to live is infact an anger driven motivation i would argue. As many hurtles and challenges stand in the way of our ends; we continue to press forward, in doing so our character is refined. This is not a hateful pursuit, in fact it can be an accepting one, but surely, what will is driving without anger?

I think you horribly mistaken about anger being a force for good. True it is used to build a sense of collective anger (fear is the primary motivator) but it in turn forces it's fear onto others.

Take for example the civil rights movement of the sixties. It was not the 'angry' black panthers (though they were far less angry then you would suppose - they tended to subdue their anger in conviction a very different thing) that acomplished the change it was the 'Hopeful' and 'Faithful' non-violent movement which attracted change to thier use of 'Power' moral and spiritual rather then any use of force.

Justifying anger is just a diversion from fear not a practical solution to it.

originally posted by: MyHappyDogShiner
What if.....?

One has a tendency to lean toward delusional thought processes as most humans do ?.....

The emotion is not important, what is important is what one does with it.

Control your environment, both internal and external,...

Or your environment, internal or external, will control you.

The nearly complete lack of the ability to achieve this by most people is the reason they will never be free.

I'm gonna stop now....

Oh, and research "Narcissism" just for fun....

You can't control or for that matter truly effect/affect anything outside of yourself. Hence the amonation to keep to your own side of the street and keep out of other people's business.

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: MyHappyDogShiner

Balance with what? I refuse to "balance" the Holiness and Purity of My God of Joy and Abundance with the negativity and limiting beliefs others choose to have.

I refuse to balance between cleanliness and dirtiness when drinking water or eating food. I deserve The Best and so do you. People have forgotten about The God of Goodness, Joy, Perfection, Abundance.

The Buddists speak of two levels of understanding anything, the relative suitable for physical life and the ultimate which is only grasped by the holy ones.

You and I are in a relative frame and so require both sides of the coin to function. The ultimate understanding, which I don't have, can be talked about but without experience, personal experience it is nothing more then science fiction.

You cannot see light without darkness, nor good without bad. You are attracted to certain things and repeled by others - if you had ultimate understanding and experience and lived in an ultimate frame of reference (well you wouldn't need reference) a pile of fluffy pillows and and pile of poo would be equally attractive.

This discussion is about the relative world that we live and experience. Not about an imagined ultimate reality.

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: BlackmoonJester

Also, if you believe that God is the creator of all things, then surely he must have created the "negative" things you talk about. Why would he do that?

God didn't. Negativity is separation from God. Positivity is oneness with God.

I don't think you mean to be discussing 'god'. You anthromophrize god by assigned him emotions. Wouldn't a universal creator being be above such 'petty' things as emotions that you or I experienced.

The OP was that anger is a product of fear. I agree. But I do think attraction/repulsion are biological at base. And it was attraction (love if you will) that formed the first cell out of the primodial ooze. Emotions serve as cues to our well-being - some pleasant (for a time) and some not (also for a time) but all useful as guideposts along the path.

originally posted by: Tranceopticalinclined
a reply to: FyreByrd

I get angry like everyone else, sometimes moreso, however I don't believe in fear, it's a wall, I have respect towards things not fear.

I don't understand how anger is a response to fear?

If I order a meal at a cafe and the meal gets to me but is made on a dirty plate and there is mold on the bread, my anger to that piss poor meal is from fear?

Fear of what?

Fear of dirt, disease, fear of not getting what you want....

If my kids fail to clean their rooms after asking a few different times nicely and I get angry about that, what am I in fear of there? My anger isn't a direct result of my kids not listening?

Fear of appearing 'weak' - fear of not getting what you want --- fear of not being in control of others... fear of appearance to others who might see....

If I wake up from outside construction earlier than I wanted and I become angry about that, am I fearful of construction workers?

Fear of being out of control ... fear of not being forceful enought to make others do what you want....

I'm pretty sure anger is the emotional response towards being disappointed in what you perceive as the status quo, it's not a fear of things not being normal, it's the failed expectation of a plan you had in mind.

The meal not being made correctly, the kids not listening and the construction workers choosing 6am as a proper time to work.

Anyone else?

Disappointment is a form of fear.

Most of these daily fears, that we justify to ourselves and others, have to do with not being able to control others. And, I have found, when you respond to these 'disappointments' from a place of anger you get resistance. When you stop 'fighting' it - the kids, the diner, the construction - and act - act from a place of acceptance you are more likely to find a battle (particularly with young people) heating up. Go talk to the neighbor, with humility and understanding of their needs.

Let your children live with the consequences of their actions... Send the food back... All without anger or this intenal idea - actually it should be infernal - that other have to do things the way you want. Just stop fighting and learn to accept - it's not all about you. Nobody else really cares nor do (most of them) wish you harm.

a reply to: arpgme

What are you Vulcan

It depends anger has its purpose, it can enable better defence, otherwise it wouldn't be here

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: Ophiuchus 13




a reply to: HarryJoy

You're assuming that High-Frequency, Happy living is not reality. Your Beliefs/Faith create your reality. If you want to believe that The High Frequency/Joy is not reality, then your lack of faith will create a life without it.

I really don't want to argue the side of the discussion that I have taken anymore...only because so many in this thread are on that side. I don't like making people feel as though they are being ganged up on. But I do want to say that this is not an "either or" situation. I have experienced peace and I have experienced anger. I fully expect that I will experience each of them again. We must understand that mercy and justice are the foundations of God's throne. Yes it is true that mercy must triumph over justice yet until that has occurred justice will continue to seek it's rightful validation. God's mercy endures forever....but until an individual avails themselves of that mercy ( through repentance/turning away from the offending action ) they are subject to justice...and rightfully so. And justice is often accompanied by righteous indignation.